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Why is this not being taught in Church?

If were gonna have a discussion then your gonna have to answer my questions too.
I'm not gonna write paragraphs for you to feed on then you throw back a scrap of dispute without answers to the questions I ask you.

If predestination does not exist then explain Jesus, Moses knew because God told him, David Knew because God showed him.
So how is there no predestination if god can tell Moses 1000 years in advance and show David 500 years in advance?
And add to that the fact that Jesus was Foreordained before the foundation of the world....... sounds like God had his life set up before he created the world so
argue all you want but in saying no predestination you call the scriptures in Ephesians a LIE. And last I looked the scripture said "God forbid: yea, let God be true, and every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged."

If we agree on the sovereignty of God then why is it so hard to accept that he is carrying out his plan and not running around fixing all our problems or mistakes?
Indeed he is the cause of all your problems for your benefit. Carnal minds always have it backwards.
 
Samson2020 said:
If were gonna have a discussion then your gonna have to answer my questions too.
I'm not gonna write paragraphs for you to feed on then you throw back a scrap of dispute without answers to the questions I ask you.

If predestination does not exist then explain Jesus, Moses knew because God told him, David Knew because God showed him.
So how is there no predestination if god can tell Moses 1000 years in advance and show David 500 years in advance?
And add to that the fact that Jesus was Foreordained before the foundation of the world....... sounds like God had his life set up before he created the world so
argue all you want but in saying no predestination you call the scriptures in Ephesians a LIE. And last I looked the scripture said "God forbid: yea, let God be true, and every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged."

If we agree on the sovereignty of God then why is it so hard to accept that he is carrying out his plan and not running around fixing all our problems or mistakes?
Indeed he is the cause of all your problems for your benefit. Carnal minds always have it backwards.
Click to expand...
you and i will simply have to disagree . You talk about me not answering questions , i have yet to hear any of mine answered .

Plain and simply . I know God . Its a given i dont know everything . But i know God . We each make choices , ever minute , every day . We can choose to do Gods will or not . John the Baptist had the Holy Spirit in him in the womb .

Now we can get into a big Theological discusion on that , as Jesus states the Pariclete had not come yet. But it is obvious that Elijah and Elisha and many others had the Spirit in the Old Testiment.

John the Baptist grew up as a baby , child teen youngman . I guarentee he struggled and he made choices along the way . Finally becoming the Baptist .

Did God know all along . Yes . But John still chose on his own free will to become the Baptist .

The Witnesses of the Most High , both born , have mothers and fathers . Both have a close relationship with God . Both have gone from baby to child to teen to youngmen and now mature . I know the path has been a struggle . But the burning love of God has never left .

Predestined, No . There have been many times choices came . But now the Path is clear .

Love is the Key .
 
Bill said:
What do you mean what verse ? You think God has shared all His sercrets . What did the Thunders say ? The Bible is the Word of God .
Go and read it
Click to expand...

the guess the verse is a secret

I have been searching for many verses and my eyes are tired

I'll wait till you park your bus and blow the dust off your bible .. don't ripe the pages they are probably stuck together...:rolleyes:
 
Bill,
Even though John , Elisha, and Elijah had a ministry guided by the Holy Spirit, and by the way so did balaams donkey. Jesus tells us that John was the greatest man to ever live, but that the LEAST IN THE KINGDOM is GREATER THAN HE. These folks had a ministry but were not born again. They couldn't because the NEW COVENANT had not yet been ratified by the spilling of the blood of Jesus. So whatever choices you think they made did not get them into the KIngdom.
That won't happen until after the second resurrection.
 
I thought I did a pretty good job answering almost all of your questions except one.
How can God create EVIL?
I think all we have to do is look at the world and what do we see? Perfection or Evil? If those who are not born again look in the mirror what they see is evil.
Why? Because God cursed every living human (except Jesus) from Adam until this very second with a carnal mind. He "Concluded them all in unbelief so that he might have MERCY on them ALL." Romans 11:32 So man who is separated from God in his mind and overrun by Satan and his minions are at the mercy of what God allows Satan to do, like Job. But as a whole it is God that decides what EVIL befalls every man or woman.

Lets take a look at the words krisis and gnome, both greek and both translated as judgement in the Bible. Krisis means a time of separation, a time of great trouble, a turning point. Gnome means a way of knowing. Therefore Gods judgement is a time of separation and great trouble which is a way of knowing.

Can we say that without troubles in our lives that we could ever understand what pain, confusion, suffering etc.. are? And once we experience these we avoid them and do our best to try and not cause others these troubles. A way of GROWING. Compassion??? Mercy???? Sounds like maturing to me. And all because he sent EVIL into our lives.
And don't misunderstand i am not saying evil is good but I am saying when God uses it it is for our own good.
 
Is not our God, “Sovereign”?
The Sovereignty God. Rules all. If anything happens, He lets it happens, for HIS Glory, is HE not The Potter and everything is the clay. Did not HE raise Pharaoh for HIS Own glory. Was Jesus a after thought or “predestine” for a particular purpose. Was Pharaoh “predestine” for a particular fate? Was “Judas” predestine for a particular fate? Were you “predestine” for a particular purpose? Was not all of this done before the “foundations of the cosmos”? If so, then whatsoever comes to pass, God has so ordained it to be. Just how He plan it to be. From Genesis, all roads leads to “Calvary”. True children of God, all roads for you before the “Foundations” of the cosmos leads to Eternal Life. It was PAID for Before the foundations of the cosmos. Bought with A price. You are Own. Your salvation is paid for! Understand! It is paid for! You cannot do anything to earn your salvation. You have been “PREDESTINATED” into Eternal life. “Paid for” NO REFUNDS! The blood has been spilt. Right now, you should be crying. And speaking in unknown tongues!
And your spouse, or your parents or friend should be calling 911. I just describe unto you “predestination” Top off with “Full Blowed GRACE”
Believeth thou this?

You have been “Predestined “. “Elected” “Chosen” to, for “Eternal Life” , “Adoption” into the True Family of God! And you will Exist, forever and ever, and ever, you will never die❤️For you are The Elect of GOD!
 
Samson2020 said:
Bill,
Even though John , Elisha, and Elijah had a ministry guided by the Holy Spirit, and by the way so did balaams donkey. Jesus tells us that John was the greatest man to ever live, but that the LEAST IN THE KINGDOM is GREATER THAN HE. These folks had a ministry but were not born again. They couldn't because the NEW COVENANT had not yet been ratified by the spilling of the blood of Jesus. So whatever choices you think they made did not get them into the KIngdom.
That won't happen until after the second resurrection.
Click to expand...
So you say , yet i have seen Elijah in Heaven. To be born again isnt something of the mind but of the Heart . It is the Circumcision of your heart .

If love dwells within you , there God is too. The scripture tells us Strive to be Holy for your Father in Heaven is Holy.

If the Father is Holy , how can evil exist in Him . It can not .

Jesus said a house divided against itself can not stand . So either there is an error in the translation of your Bible , or you are calling God a lier
 
PloughBoy said:
Is not our God, “Sovereign”?
The Sovereignty God. Rules all. If anything happens, He lets it happens, for HIS Glory, is HE not The Potter and everything is the clay. Did not HE raise Pharaoh for HIS Own glory. Was Jesus a after thought or “predestine” for a particular purpose. Was Pharaoh “predestine” for a particular fate? Was “Judas” predestine for a particular fate? Were you “predestine” for a particular purpose? Was not all of this done before the “foundations of the cosmos”? If so, then whatsoever comes to pass, God has so ordained it to be. Just how He plan it to be. From Genesis, all roads leads to “Calvary”. True children of God, all roads for you before the “Foundations” of the cosmos leads to Eternal Life. It was PAID for Before the foundations of the cosmos. Bought with A price. You are Own. Your salvation is paid for! Understand! It is paid for! You cannot do anything to earn your salvation. You have been “PREDESTINATED” into Eternal life. “Paid for” NO REFUNDS! The blood has been spilt. Right now, you should be crying. And speaking in unknown tongues!
And your spouse, or your parents or friend should be calling 911. I just describe unto you “predestination” Top off with “Full Blowed GRACE”
Believeth thou this?

You have been “Predestined “. “Elected” “Chosen” to, for “Eternal Life” , “Adoption” into the True Family of God! And you will Exist, forever and ever, and ever, you will never die❤For you are The Elect of GOD!
Click to expand...
I tell you as i sit here . You are wrong . There is no predestination.

Are you familiar with the teaching of the Rapture . That is a false teaching as well . There are many here that will fight tooth and nail believing in such garbage . They have been taught this for generations .

How can anyone expect to learn the truth when such wide spred false teachings are continually hammered into everyones minds .

Love is the Key .
 
NKJV- Calamity-An event often causing great and often sudden damage or distress; a disaster.
KJV -Evil
NLT - Bad times
NIV - Disaster
ESV -Great calamity

Do these translations not have the same underlying meaning?

Are you saying that you personally have seen Elijah in heaven?
 
The biggest untruth espoused on this site is a TRINITY doctrine denying that Jesus is, was, and always will be the only begotten SON of God.
 
Ploughboy,

Let you in on a big secret, but don't tell anybody they'll get mad. Jesus died for everyones sins and since God considered everyone in unbelief so that he might have mercy on them ALL, ALL are chosen but "EVERY MAN IN HIS OWN ORDER" only the Father knows the order because its his plan. In the end, after I see
3 death periods myself, everyone comes into eternal life. Hard to swallow for most because they still wanna make it about their choice( free will and self righteousness) and everybody else deserves to be burned forever. Sounds more like being controlled by a carnal mind than understanding Gods Love. Sin is Sin so no matter what sin you committed your guilty under the Law. But since the punishment for violating the Law was nailed to his cross!!! Who in the end can be accused of anything?
Most can't even forgive themselves much less anybody else, that carnal mind is a task master like no other. Understanding this end game is what makes one truly free. For whom the Son sets free is free indeed. And this understanding is what will allow one to treat every man as his neighbor (brother) because in the end thats exactly what they will be, you just see it before it comes to fruition.
 
PloughBoy said:
2nd Adam,
Click to expand...
18Therefore as by the offense of one judgment came on all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came on all men to justification of life. 19For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous
 
PloughBoy said:
18Therefore as by the offense of one judgment came on all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came on all men to justification of life. 19For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous
Click to expand...
1Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy. 32For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all. “Snap shots”
 
You can't write stuff like that cause they gotta accept the gift making it self righteousness, something they did instead of just saying thank you Lord! LOL
 
Samson2020 said:
NKJV- Calamity-An event often causing great and often sudden damage or distress; a disaster.
KJV -Evil
NLT - Bad times
NIV - Disaster
ESV -Great calamity

Do these translations not have the same underlying meaning?

Are you saying that you personally have seen Elijah in heaven?
Click to expand...
Yes i have seen Elijah in Heaven . We have talked some. I have seen Paul there too . The fire of preaching is still in him .
 
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