144,000

[lentz]

Greetings, Brother Chad, in the precious name of Jesus.

I have read your opening post with very much interest. I am sure you realise some other Christians would not go along with how you understand 144,000 and the tribulation.

First, we must be careful when we speak catagorically of the Tribulation as something in the future. Scripture does not use the words 'The Tribulation' (Please, no-one come back with the old chestnut that the word 'Trinity' is not in the Bible; there are different criterium applying.)

Secondly, I believe that The Book of Revelation, must be seen for what it is; not what it is not. It is not recording events sequentially within our human sequential time frame mindset.

Once we try to understand that Almighty God sees everything in a kind of eternally panoramic view i.e., 'all peoples, all things, all ages, all events - past present and future -all at the same time and eternally' then we will grasp a better understanding of what God is saying to us in the Book of Revelation, especially concerning what the 'last days' are and what 'tribulation' is.

Your brother in Jesus.
David

Tribulation is mentioned in scripture.
As far as the book of Revelation is concerned. Christ told John to write the book in 3 categories. The things that were,the things that are present,and things to come.
As for the 144,000 they will indeed be witnesses during the tribulation,day of the lord,days of Jacobs troubke,etc.

 

[lentz]

As a footnote....the new heaven and the new earth will be after the millennium.

 

[NoHype]

Who are the 144,000 in Book of Revelation?

Like in the Books of God's prophet Isaiah, the seed of Israel and Gentiles are often mentioned separately in God's Salvation Plan (like Isaiah 54:3). Likewise in Revelation 7 with the 144,000 literal Israelites that are 'sealed', and then the "great multitude" representing Gentiles that are 'sealed'.

That idea of being 'sealed' is about being sealed by The Holy Spirit (Ephesians 4:30; Ephesians 1:12-13; 2 Corinthians 1:21-22).

The purpose for God's seal at the end of this world is revealed in Revelation 9, in contrast with those who are 'not'... sealed allowed to be stung for five months. That stinging by the metaphorical scorpions is about deception to lies. Christ's elect are 'sealed' against that for the tribulation.

Therefore, all... of these of Revelation 7, both the 144,000 Israelites that are 'sealed', and the "great multitude" of Gentiles that are also 'sealed', represent Christ's Church for the end.

And that sealing happens PRIOR to the "great tribulation". So men's doctrine often taught by the Pre-trib Rapture doctors that the 144,000 only convert to Jesus sometime 'during' the great tribulation, is a false idea.

When the time of "great tribulation" starts, everyone will be divided into either a believer or a non-believer, and will remain that way all the way up until Christ's return at the end of the tribulation. The conversion of some Jews to Jesus during the tribulation is not Biblical, but is only supposition mainly by the Pre-trib Rapture school.

 

[The Gospel of Christ]

Who are the 144,000 in Book of Revelation?

The 144,000 Jews / Israelites who are sealed in Revelation 7:4-8 are sealed for the specific purpose of being “evangelists” during the Tribulation period. The sealing provides protection from the plagues and devastation brought on by the trumpet and bowl judgments, as well as from the wrath of the Antichrist. The 144,000 is not a limit to how many people will be saved, but rather is just a select group of Jewish believers called to proclaim God’s message during the end times. There will be perhaps millions of other converts during the Tribulation, most of them a result of the 144,000’s ministry.

Revelation 7:4-8

And I heard the number of the sealed, 144,000, sealed from every tribe of the sons of Israel:

12,000 from the tribe of Judah were sealed,
12,000 from the tribe of Reuben,
12,000 from the tribe of Gad,
12,000 from the tribe of Asher,
12,000 from the tribe of Naphtali,
12,000 from the tribe of Manasseh,
12,000 from the tribe of Simeon,
12,000 from the tribe of Levi,
12,000 from the tribe of Issachar,
12,000 from the tribe of Zebulun,
12,000 from the tribe of Joseph,
12,000 from the tribe of Benjamin were sealed.

IPV Commentary

The Reward of the 144,000

Respectfully, the idea that the 144,000 are a special force of ethnic Jewish evangelists during a future tribulation doesn’t come from Scripture — it comes from Scofield’s notes and Dispensational heresy.

Let’s look at the text:

Revelation 7:4–8 lists 12 tribes of Israel — not “Jews.”
This includes Ephraim, Manasseh, Issachar, Zebulun — tribes long considered “lost” by mainstream tradition.

But lost to who?

They didn’t vanish — they migrated. They were scattered among the nations, just as prophecy foretold (Genesis 28:14, Hosea 1:10).
Some settled in Europe.
God never lost track of them — man did.

So unless God’s planning on handing out DNA test kits in the last days, it’s safe to say Revelation is speaking symbolically — pointing to the fullness of God’s covenant people, not a racial remnant.

And nowhere does the Bible say these 144,000 evangelize the world. That’s pure speculation.
Revelation 14 says they sing a song no one else can learn, that they are undefiled, and that they follow the Lamb wherever He goes — not knocking on doors handing out tracts during a seven-year time slot.

And Revelation 7 doesn’t separate them from the Church — it connects them directly to the great multitude in the very next verse (7:9), made up of every tribe, tongue, and nation.
The redeemed. The Body of Christ. One people.

“If you are in Christ, then you are Abraham’s offspring, heirs according to the promise.” – Galatians 3:29

That includes the 144,000.
That includes the great multitude.
That includes Jew and Gentile — sealed in the blood of Christ, not through a last-minute tribal assignment.

The idea that God removes the Church, then turns to save Jews through a rebuilt temple or elite evangelism squad is not found in Scripture. It’s not found in the Bible at all — it’s found in the 1909 margin notes of Cyrus Scofield, a disbarred lawyer, conman, and pawn of Zionist interests who rewrote Christian theology with a pen soaked in heresy.

Let’s stop dividing God’s plan into two peoples.
There is one body, one Shepherd, and one Name under heaven by which we must be saved — Jesus Christ.