Attack

[Dave M]

When you here people say they are under attack what does that mean?

Can satan put thoughts in our head, and then we think they are our own thoughts and start hating ourselves.?

Recently I have had terrible terrible thoughts that I would never think pop in my head, is this being under attack?

Any help on this would be appreciated

thanks

 

[Brad Huber]

Anyone who is a threat to the prince of darkness is regularly attacked in some form. Demons can indeed whisper things into your mind, and try and make you think those thoughts were your own. If you refuse to put any focus on those thoughts and consider them to be evil whispers from the evil one, you can laugh at satan and let him know that you know its him and that you refute him and those thoughts for the failed attacks of the evil one.

 

[Julie.S]

Well to be honest I have ADD and sometimes I do get random thoughts and my mind wanders. Its not the Devil its just how my brain is.

I think we blame the Devil for a lot of things that just happen for no reason.

 

[HAllyson]

Can satan put thoughts in our head, and then we think they are our own thoughts and start hating ourselves.?

Yes. Yes. Yes. I personally tell the Devil to get behind me; get thee hence when I am feeling the way I believe you have been.

I would suggest reading these verses:

Matthew 4: 8 Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them; 9 And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me.10 Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.

Matthew 16:21 ¶ From that time forth began Jesus to shew unto his disciples, how that he must go unto Jerusalem, and suffer many things of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and be raised again the third day. 22 Then Peter took him, and began to rebuke him, saying, Be it far from thee, Lord: this shall not be unto thee. 23 But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.

Mark 8:31 And he began to teach them, that the Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected of the elders, and of the chief priests, and scribes, and be killed, and after three days rise again. 32 And he spake that saying openly. And Peter took him, and began to rebuke him.33 But when he had turned about and looked on his disciples, he rebuked Peter, saying, Get thee behind me, Satan: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but the things that be of men.

Luke 4:6 And the devil said unto him, All this power will I give thee, and the glory of them: for that is delivered unto me; and to whomsoever I will I give it. 7 If thou therefore wilt worship me, all shall be thine.8 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Get thee behind me, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.


Satan told the first and greatest lie ever: He told Eve she would not die if she ate fruit from the tree which God had forbidden. He is the father of all lies.

Genesis 3:1 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden? 2 And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden: 3 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die. 4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die: 5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

• Revelation 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,

From Genesis 3 we and Revelation 20 we can conclude that the serpent was in fact the Devil, and connivingly, he convinced Eve to believe a very dangerous lie. We can imagine that the serpent was a cunning, and intelligent creature (who could somehow speak) before he was down cast upon his belly.

(Subtile | Definition of Subtile by Merriam-Webster

We can also conclude that God loved sinners enough to curse the liar who deceived them.

Genesis 3: 14 And the LORD God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life: 15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

(There is much more gather from Genesis 3, but I am hoping this helps with what you are going through).

Not everyone enjoys a good bible preacher, but it is healthy to hear the truth from time to time. If you are interested, below is a fantastic sermon that I think would answer your question directly. In this service you hear the lies that are being told to the members of this particular church. It is quite moving, and sincerely touched my heart. Glory be to God!

The Devil's Lies | SermonAudio.com (God bless pastor Reg Kelly)

Our bibles tell us to take on the armour of Light.

Romans 13: 10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law. 11 And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed. 12 The night is far spent, the day is at hand: let us therefore cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armour of light. 13 Let us walk honestly, as in the day; not in rioting and drunkenness, not in chambering and wantonness, not in strife and envying. 14 But put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make not provision for the flesh, to fulfil the lusts thereof.

Also to take unto ourselves the whole armour of God: truth, righteousness, preparation, peace, faith, the helmet, and the sword..."which is the word of God."

Ephesians 6: 13 Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand. 14 Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness; 15 And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace; 16 Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked. 17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God: 18 Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;


It is possible to withstand in the evil day. Our weapon is our sword, "which is the word of God."
Faith comes by the hearing of the word.

Romans 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

John 8: 43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word. 44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. 45 And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not. 46 Which of you convinceth me of sin? And if I say the truth, why do ye not believe me? 47 He that is of God heareth God’s words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.


Interestingly enough, this passages encourages us to ponder the idea that the Spirit is received by the hearing of faith, and not by works:

2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh? 4 Have ye suffered so many things in vain? if it be yet in vain. 5 He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness. 7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham. 8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed. 9 So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham.



I believe we can all search God in the scriptures for wisdom and instruction. I pray the scripture be your help. God bless.



Proverbs

Category: Wisdom

Chapter 1
1 The proverbs of Solomon the son of David, king of Israel; 2 To know wisdom and instruction; to perceive the words of understanding; 3 To receive the instruction of wisdom, justice, and judgment, and equity; 4 To give subtilty to the simple, to the young man knowledge and discretion. 5 A wise man will hear, and will increase learning; and a man of understanding shall attain unto wise counsels: 6 To understand a proverb, and the interpretation; the words of the wise, and their dark sayings.
7 ¶ The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction. 8 My son, hear the instruction of thy father, and forsake not the law of thy mother: 9 For they shall be an ornament of grace unto thy head, and chains about thy neck.
10 ¶ My son, if sinners entice thee, consent thou not. 11 If they say, Come with us, let us lay wait for blood, let us lurk privily for the innocent without cause: 12 Let us swallow them up alive as the grave; and whole, as those that go down into the pit: 13 We shall find all precious substance, we shall fill our houses with spoil: 14 Cast in thy lot among us; let us all have one purse: 15 My son, walk not thou in the way with them; refrain thy foot from their path: 16 For their feet run to evil, and make haste to shed blood. 17 Surely in vain the net is spread in the sight of any bird. 18 And they lay wait for their own blood; they lurk privily for their own lives. 19 So are the ways of every one that is greedy of gain; which taketh away the life of the owners thereof.
20 ¶ Wisdom crieth without; she uttereth her voice in the streets: 21 She crieth in the chief place of concourse, in the openings of the gates: in the city she uttereth her words, saying, 22 How long, ye simple ones, will ye love simplicity? and the scorners delight in their scorning, and fools hate knowledge? 23 Turn you at my reproof: behold, I will pour out my spirit unto you, I will make known my words unto you.
24 ¶ Because I have called, and ye refused; I have stretched out my hand, and no man regarded; 25 But ye have set at nought all my counsel, and would none of my reproof: 26 I also will laugh at your calamity; I will mock when your fear cometh; 27 When your fear cometh as desolation, and your destruction cometh as a whirlwind; when distress and anguish cometh upon you. 28 Then shall they call upon me, but I will not answer; they shall seek me early, but they shall not find me: 29 For that they hated knowledge, and did not choose the fear of the LORD: 30 They would none of my counsel: they despised all my reproof. 31 Therefore shall they eat of the fruit of their own way, and be filled with their own devices. 32 For the turning away of the simple shall slay them, and the prosperity of fools shall destroy them. 33 But whoso hearkeneth unto me shall dwell safely, and shall be quiet from fear of evil.

(that last bit of the previous passage has been a great comfort and blessing for me personally. For years, I struggled with fear and anxiety and dealt with more tragedy than I like to remember. Having God's word in my heart has helped to mend the broken pieces back together).

 

[HAllyson]

@Brad Huber

I have not found the word "demon" in the bible, but interestingly I did find mentions of evil angels, evil spirits, and unclean spirits.

"evil angels"

Psalms 78:49 He cast upon them the fierceness of his anger, wrath, and indignation, and trouble, by sending evil angels among them.

"evil spirit(s)"

Judges 9:23 Then God sent an evil spirit between Abimelech and the men of Shechem; and the men of Shechem dealt treacherously with Abimelech:
1 Samuel 16:14 ¶ But the Spirit of the LORD departed from Saul, and an evil spirit from the LORD troubled him.
1 Samuel 16:15 And Saul’s servants said unto him, Behold now, an evil spirit from God troubleth thee.
1 Samuel 16:16 Let our lord now command thy servants, which are before thee, to seek out a man, who is a cunning player on an harp: and it shall come to pass, when the evil spirit from God is upon thee, that he shall play with his hand, and thou shalt be well.
1 Samuel 16:23 And it came to pass, when the evil spirit from God was upon Saul, that David took an harp, and played with his hand: so Saul was refreshed, and was well, and the evil spirit departed from him.
1 Samuel 18:10 ¶ And it came to pass on the morrow, that the evil spirit from God came upon Saul, and he prophesied in the midst of the house: and David played with his hand, as at other times: and there was a javelin in Saul’s hand.
1 Samuel 19:9 And the evil spirit from the LORD was upon Saul, as he sat in his house with his javelin in his hand: and David played with his hand.
Luke 7:21 And in that same hour he cured many of their infirmities and plagues, and of evil spirits; and unto many that were blind he gave sight.
Luke 8:2 And certain women, which had been healed of evil spirits and infirmities, Mary called Magdalene, out of whom went seven devils,
Acts 19:12 So that from his body were brought unto the sick handkerchiefs or aprons, and the diseases departed from them, and the evil spirits went out of them.
Acts 19:13 ¶ Then certain of the vagabond Jews, exorcists, took upon them to call over them which had evil spirits the name of the Lord Jesus, saying, We adjure you by Jesus whom Paul preacheth.
Acts 19:15 And the evil spirit answered and said, Jesus I know, and Paul I know; but who are ye?
Acts 19:16 And the man in whom the evil spirit was leaped on them, and overcame them, and prevailed against them, so that they fled out of that house naked and wounded.

"unclean spirit(s)"

Zechariah 13:2 ¶ And it shall come to pass in that day, saith the LORD of hosts, that I will cut off the names of the idols out of the land, and they shall no more be remembered: and also I will cause the prophets and the unclean spirit to pass out of the land.
Matthew 10:1 And when he had called unto him his twelve disciples, he gave them power against unclean spirits, to cast them out, and to heal all manner of sickness and all manner of disease.
Matthew 12:43 When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest, and findeth none.
Mark 1:23 And there was in their synagogue a man with an unclean spirit; and he cried out,
Mark 1:26 And when the unclean spirit had torn him, and cried with a loud voice, he came out of him.
Mark 1:27 And they were all amazed, insomuch that they questioned among themselves, saying, What thing is this? what new doctrine is this? for with authority commandeth he even the unclean spirits, and they do obey him.
Mark 3:11 And unclean spirits, when they saw him, fell down before him, and cried, saying, Thou art the Son of God.
Mark 3:30 Because they said, He hath an unclean spirit.
Mark 5:2 And when he was come out of the ship, immediately there met him out of the tombs a man with an unclean spirit,
Mark 5:8 For he said unto him, Come out of the man, thou unclean spirit.
Mark 5:13 And forthwith Jesus gave them leave. And the unclean spirits went out, and entered into the swine: and the herd ran violently down a steep place into the sea, (they were about two thousand and were choked in the sea.
Mark 6:7 ¶ And he called unto him the twelve, and began to send them forth by two and two; and gave them power over unclean spirits;
Mark 7:25 For a certain woman, whose young daughter had an unclean spirit, heard of him, and came and fell at his feet:
Luke 4:36 And they were all amazed, and spake among themselves, saying, What a word is this! for with authority and power he commandeth the unclean spirits, and they come out.
Luke 6:18 And they that were vexed with unclean spirits: and they were healed.
Luke 8:29 (For he had commanded the unclean spirit to come out of the man. For oftentimes it had caught him: and he was kept bound with chains and in fetters; and he brake the bands, and was driven of the devil into the wilderness.)
Luke 9:42 And as he was yet a coming, the devil threw him down, and tare him. And Jesus rebuked the unclean spirit, and healed the child, and delivered him again to his father.
Luke 11:24 When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest; and finding none, he saith, I will return unto my house whence I came out.
Acts 5:16 There came also a multitude out of the cities round about unto Jerusalem, bringing sick folks, and them which were vexed with unclean spirits: and they were healed every one.
Acts 8:7 For unclean spirits, crying with loud voice, came out of many that were possessed with them: and many taken with palsies, and that were lame, were healed.
Revelation 16:13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.


Many might wonder: why would God send evil angels, and evil spirits?

This reminds me of the thorn in Paul's side; God sent the messenger of Satan to buffet him:

2 Corinthians 12: 6 For though I would desire to glory, I shall not be a fool; for I will say the truth: but now I forbear, lest any man should think of me above that which he seeth me to be, or that he heareth of me. 7 And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure. 8 For this thing I besought the Lord thrice, that it might depart from me. 9 And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me. 10 Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ’s sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong.

 

[HAllyson]

Ecclesiastes 3:10 I have seen the travail, which God hath given to the sons of men to be exercised in it. 11 He hath made every thing beautiful in his time: also he hath set the world in their heart, so that no man can find out the work that God maketh from the beginning to the end.

 

[Brad Huber]

Demons are the spirits of the giants that lived before the great flood. When thier bodies died, their spirits stayed on the earth as they had no holding place that the rest of our spirits go to prior to the great judgement. They are simply evil spirits, the ones Jesus and the disciples cast out, but they were not destroyed, just cast out of the people.

 

[HAllyson]

Demons are the spirits of the giants that lived before the great flood. When thier bodies died, their spirits stayed on the earth as they had no holding place that the rest of our spirits go to prior to the great judgement.

Thank you for sharing, this is very interesting! I would love to read about this: could you point me to the scripture that explains this?
It has been my understanding (from the scripture provided) that unless souls were specifically chosen to not see death, when people died throughout the old testament, their souls descended "into the pit."

Numbers 16:30 But if the LORD make a new thing, and the earth open her mouth, and swallow them up, with all that appertain unto them, and they go down quick into the pit; then ye shall understand that these men have provoked the LORD.
Numbers 16:33 They, and all that appertained to them, went down alive into the pit, and the earth closed upon them: and they perished from among the congregation.
Job 33:28 He will deliver his soul from going into the pit, and his life shall see the light.
Psalms 28:1 Unto thee will I cry, O LORD my rock; be not silent to me: lest, if thou be silent to me, I become like them that go down into the pit.
Psalms 55:23 But thou, O God, shalt bring them down into the pit of destruction: bloody and deceitful men shall not live out half their days; but I will trust in thee.
Psalms 88:4 I am counted with them that go down into the pit: I am as a man that hath no strength:
Psalms 143:7 Hear me speedily, O LORD: my spirit faileth: hide not thy face from me, lest I be like unto them that go down into the pit.
Proverbs 1:12 Let us swallow them up alive as the grave; and whole, as those that go down into the pit:
Isaiah 24:18 And it shall come to pass, that he who fleeth from the noise of the fear shall fall into the pit; and he that cometh up out of the midst of the pit shall be taken in the snare: for the windows from on high are open, and the foundations of the earth do shake.
Isaiah 38:18 For the grave cannot praise thee, death can not celebrate thee: they that go down into the pit cannot hope for thy truth.
Jeremiah 48:44 He that fleeth from the fear shall fall into the pit; and he that getteth up out of the pit shall be taken in the snare: for I will bring upon it, even upon Moab, the year of their visitation, saith the LORD.
Ezekiel 26:20 When I shall bring thee down with them that descend into the pit, with the people of old time, and shall set thee in the low parts of the earth, in places desolate of old, with them that go down to the pit, that thou be not inhabited; and I shall set glory in the land of the living;
Ezekiel 31:16 I made the nations to shake at the sound of his fall, when I cast him down to hell with them that descend into the pit: and all the trees of Eden, the choice and best of Lebanon, all that drink water, shall be comforted in the nether parts of the earth.
Ezekiel 32:18 Son of man, wail for the multitude of Egypt, and cast them down, even her, and the daughters of the famous nations, unto the nether parts of the earth, with them that go down into the pit.

"to hell"

Proverbs 7:27 Her house is the way to hell, going down to the chambers of death.
Isaiah 14:15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.
Ezekiel 31:16 I made the nations to shake at the sound of his fall, when I cast him down to hell with them that descend into the pit: and all the trees of Eden, the choice and best of Lebanon, all that drink water, shall be comforted in the nether parts of the earth.
Ezekiel 32:27 And they shall not lie with the mighty that are fallen of the uncircumcised, which are gone down to hell with their weapons of war: and they have laid their swords under their heads, but their iniquities shall be upon their bones, though they were the terror of the mighty in the land of the living.
Matthew 11:23 And thou, Capernaum, which art exalted unto heaven, shalt be brought down to hell: for if the mighty works, which have been done in thee, had been done in Sodom, it would have remained until this day.
Luke 10:15 And thou, Capernaum, which art exalted to heaven, shalt be thrust down to hell.


2 Peter 2:4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;


It seems Jesus went to hell to save the faithful:

Matthew 12:40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale’s belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

Psalms 16:10 For thou wilt not leave my soul in hell; neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.
Psalms 86:13 For great is thy mercy toward me: and thou hast delivered my soul from the lowest hell.
Matthew 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
Acts 2:27 Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.
Acts 2:29 Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day. 30 Therefore being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him, that of the fruit of his loins, according to the flesh, he would raise up Christ to sit on his throne; 31 He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption. 32 This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses.


Thanks again @Brad Huber, and God bless!

 

[Knights Templar]

Rev. 9
Verses 1-2
"Then the fifth angel blew his trumpet, and I saw a star that had fallen from heaven onto the earth, and the angel was given the key to the shaft leading down to the Abyss. When he unlocked the shaft of the Abyss, smoke rose out of the Abyss like the smoke from a huge furnace so that the sun and the sky were darkened by the smoke from the Abyss,..."

The "star that had fallen from heaven" is in the past perfect tense. John did not see a star falling from heaven to earth but a star had already fallen. This is probably a reference to the fall of Satan from his place as an angel in Paradise in Isaiah 14:12-15: "How did you come to fall from the heavens, Daystar, son of Dawn? How did you come to be thrown to the ground, conqueror of nations? You who used to think to yourself: 'I shall scale the heavens; higher than the stars of God I shall set my throne. I shall sit on the Mount of Assembly far away to the north. I shall climb high above the clouds, I shall rival the Most High.' Now you have been flung down to sheol, into the depths of the Abyss!" Jewish tradition identified the fall of the Dawnstar with the fall of the prince of demons, Satan. The early Church also taught that the 5 "I shalls" or "I wills" of Satan were answered in the 5 wounds of Christ on the Cross. Jesus also spoke of Satan's fall from heaven in Luke 10:18 when He said: "I watched Satan fall like lightning from heaven." This fallen star will also be identified as Satan in Rev. 9:11 "As their leader they had their emperor, the angel of the Abyss, whose name in Hebrew is Abaddon, and in Greek Apollyon." Just so we don't miss the identity of the personage John gives us both his Hebrew and Greek names. "Abaddon" in Hebrew means "destruction" and "Apollyon" in the Greek is translated "destroyer."

In the Isaiah passage that Satan will be confined in the depths of the Abyss. This is the same Abyss which is mentioned in Rev.9:2. The Abyss, (in Greek abussou = unfathomably deep) according to Hebrew tradition, is the shaft that leads to the bottomless pit where Satan and his other fallen angels are imprisoned until their final punishment. It is not Hell nor is it sheol (Hebrew), the grave or Hades (in Greek). It is the abode of demons. The word in Hebrew for Abyss is Tehom.


According to tradition, the entrance to the Tehom or Abyss is a hole in the great rock that was under the Temple and is now under the Moslem shrine, the Dome of the Rock in Jerusalem. Tradition (both Hebrew and now Moslem) says that as long as the Temple (or the Dome of the Rock according to the Moslems) is on top of the Abyss, Satan, and his demons are imprisoned. There is a hole in the rock, just wide enough for a man to squeeze into; it leads down into the passages under the Dome of the Rock. This Moslem shrine stands where the Holy of Holies of the Temple probably once stood before the Jerusalem Temple was destroyed.

In the Old Testament there are more than 20 references to the "Tehom", which is usually translated as "the Deep." And there are 9 New Testament references to the Abyss. Once each in Luke and Romans and 7 times in Revelations.

 

[Brad Huber]

The book of Enoch tells about the giants. The book was considered inspired by the first century church and is quoted from in scripture. Only later was it considered not inspired, mainly due to how it judges both the ruling body of the jews and the christians as bad shepards. Individuals can see the truth therein of the Holy Spirit's influence. But religious leaders much like at the time of Jesus dislike anything that makes them look bad.

 

[HAllyson]

Thank you for this post! I like the way your mind works @Knights Templar , and the attention you pay to the language of the bible you are reading. I also find the language of the bible to be beautiful, perfect, and pure. I agree that this reference to a star which John saw fall is representative of the fall of Satan. I do however, respectfully disagree with your premise that "a star had fallen." I am not arguing that I know exactly whether the star fell, is falling, or had fallen, but I do believe exactly what the word of God tells us:


Revelation 9:1 And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit. 2 And he opened the bottomless pit; and there arose a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit.

Isaiah 14:11 Thy pomp is brought down to the grave, and the noise of thy viols: the worm is spread under thee, and the worms cover thee. 12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! 13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: 14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. 15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.

Revelation 9:11 And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.



I believe this is a great example of how changing just one or a few aspects of a bible verse through what are believed to be "better" translations can completely change the ideas God presents in His word.

Take for instance John 1:

John
(The Gospel According to Saint John)
Category: NT Narrative
Chapter 1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. 4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men. 5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
6 ¶ There was a man sent from God, whose name was John. 7 The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe. 8 He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light. 9 That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.


The new world translation (which is used by Jehovah witnesses) begins John 1 with almost the same sentence as the authorized version, but by changing one letter, the entire idea about the word of God changes. Instead of the Word being equated with God, the Word becomes inferior to God by being referred to as "a god."

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god.

This is only one example of how changing a verse, even just by one letter, can cause a great difference in the understanding of the Word among believers.
That being said: I understand there are many Christians who do not share my own passion for the Authorized bible, but this is not to say that they do not know Christ, or are not saved. It is just my personal opinion that in order for all English-speaking Christians to have the same understanding of God, and his Word, it would be best, and most profitable if we recognized the same scripture as the true and pure words of God. (It has been a great blessing for me personally after studying the NIV bible for years). Otherwise, I fear people will spend more time arguing about concepts and ideas than actually meditating on the pure words of God.


(I think you would enjoy the study I did on "stars" in the holy bible. I found it to be quite beautiful. This study can be found under the Bible Chat forum).

God bless and keep thinking bible!

 

[HAllyson]

The book of Enoch tells about the giants.

Ah, thank you! I have not read this book. I have, however, found several mentions of giants in the Holy Bible:

Genesis 6:4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
Numbers 13:33 And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.
Deuteronomy 2:11 Which also were accounted giants, as the Anakims; but the Moabites call them Emims.
Deuteronomy 2:20 (That also was accounted a land of giants: giants dwelt therein in old time; and the Ammonites call them Zamzummims;
Deuteronomy 3:11 For only Og king of Bashan remained of the remnant of giants; behold, his bedstead was a bedstead of iron; is it not in Rabbath of the children of Ammon? nine cubits was the length thereof, and four cubits the breadth of it, after the cubit of a man.
Deuteronomy 3:13 And the rest of Gilead, and all Bashan, being the kingdom of Og, gave I unto the half tribe of Manasseh; all the region of Argob, with all Bashan, which was called the land of giants.
Joshua 12:4 ¶ And the coast of Og king of Bashan, which was of the remnant of the giants, that dwelt at Ashtaroth and at Edrei,
Joshua 13:12 All the kingdom of Og in Bashan, which reigned in Ashtaroth and in Edrei, who remained of the remnant of the giants: for these did Moses smite, and cast them out.
Joshua 15:8 And the border went up by the valley of the son of Hinnom unto the south side of the Jebusite; the same is Jerusalem: and the border went up to the top of the mountain that lieth before the valley of Hinnom westward, which is at the end of the valley of the giants northward:
Joshua 17:15 And Joshua answered them, If thou be a great people, then get thee up to the wood country, and cut down for thyself there in the land of the Perizzites and of the giants, if mount Ephraim be too narrow for thee.
Joshua 18:16 And the border came down to the end of the mountain that lieth before the valley of the son of Hinnom, and which is in the valley of the giants on the north, and descended to the valley of Hinnom, to the side of Jebusi on the south, and descended to En–rogel,
2 Samuel 21:16 And Ishbi–benob, which was of the sons of the giant, the weight of whose spear weighed three hundred shekels of brass in weight, he being girded with a new sword, thought to have slain David.
2 Samuel 21:18 And it came to pass after this, that there was again a battle with the Philistines at Gob: then Sibbechai the Hushathite slew Saph, which was of the sons of the giant.
2 Samuel 21:20 And there was yet a battle in Gath, where was a man of great stature, that had on every hand six fingers, and on every foot six toes, four and twenty in number; and he also was born to the giant.
2 Samuel 21:22 These four were born to the giant in Gath, and fell by the hand of David, and by the hand of his servants.
1 Chronicles 20:4 ¶ And it came to pass after this, that there arose war at Gezer with the Philistines; at which time Sibbechai the Hushathite slew Sippai, that was of the children of the giant: and they were subdued.
1 Chronicles 20:6 And yet again there was war at Gath, where was a man of great stature, whose fingers and toes were four and twenty, six on each hand, and six on each foot: and he also was the son of the giant.
1 Chronicles 20:8 These were born unto the giant in Gath; and they fell by the hand of David, and by the hand of his servants.
Job 16:14 He breaketh me with breach upon breach, he runneth upon me like a giant.



Numbers 13:32 And they brought up an evil report of the land which they had searched unto the children of Israel, saying, The land, through which we have gone to search it, is a land that eateth up the inhabitants thereof; and all the people that we saw in it are men of a great stature.
1 Chronicles 11:23 And he slew an Egyptian, a man of great stature, five cubits high; and in the Egyptian’s hand was a spear like a weaver’s beam; and he went down to him with a staff, and plucked the spear out of the Egyptian’s hand, and slew him with his own spear.