Biden Warns of Uganda Sanctions for Anti-gay Law, Death Penalty

[StewardoftheMystery]

https://www.newsmax.com/us/uganda-sanctions-gay/2023/05/29/id/1121577/

Well, well. It seems old Catholic Joe wants to protect the Sodomites instead of protecting the innocent children from the Sodomites.

Very telling.

 

[Andyindauk]

https://www.newsmax.com/us/uganda-sanctions-gay/2023/05/29/id/1121577/

Well, well. It seems old Catholic Joe wants to protect the Sodomites instead of protecting the innocent children from the Sodomites.

Very telling.

Steward, your post is hate filled and homophobic and is so offensive to most right thinking people, both Christian and non-Christian. There can no place for that sort of sentiment in a Christian forum. You appear to be actually supportive of the Ugandan President's law which can pass a death sentence on somebody just for participating in gay sex. I'm assuming you were equally supportive of Islamic State's punishment of gays by throwing them off tall buildings. That's the sort of company you're aligning yourself with.

We as Christians are called to love our neighbours not judge them. We're not equipped to judge anyone; we need to leave that to the one who is. Rather we are called to reach out to the lost with the Gospel and share Jesus's love. Look at His great commission. Jesus tells us to preach repentance and remission of sins in His name to all nations ie: everyone Luke 24:47. Jesus rebuked the Disciples when they judged a Samaritan village and wanted to pass a death sentence upon it Luke 9:54.

I know that Jesus takes a very dim view of your post and your hateful attitude towards sinners. Please repent.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

Steward, your post is hate filled and homophobic and is so offensive to most right thinking people, both Christian and non-Christian. There can no place for that sort of sentiment in a Christian forum. You appear to be actually supportive of the Ugandan President's law which can pass a death sentence on somebody just for participating in gay sex. I'm assuming you were equally supportive of Islamic State's punishment of gays by throwing them off tall buildings. That's the sort of company you're aligning yourself with.

We as Christians are called to love our neighbours not judge them. We're not equipped to judge anyone; we need to leave that to the one who is. Rather we are called to reach out to the lost with the Gospel and share Jesus's love. Look at His great commission. Jesus tells us to preach repentance and remission of sins in His name to all nations ie: everyone Luke 24:47. Jesus rebuked the Disciples when they judged a Samaritan village and wanted to pass a death sentence upon it Luke 9:54.

I know that Jesus takes a very dim view of your post and your hateful attitude towards sinners. Please repent.

Homosexuality is not only illegal in Uganda, but it is illegal according to God’s law. It used to be illegal in the U.S. and other God fearing countries, but they have given in and caved to the doctrines of devils.

Those who defend Sodomy like Catholic Joe, also defend the practicing of sinful behavior. And the death penalty they proposed was not to those who are just practicing gay sex, but to those who Sodomize and rape innocent children. The death penalty is a harsh judgment, but to God the wages of sin is still death.

But I leave that God, for vengeance belongs to the Lord, He will repay.

 

[Andyindauk]

Steward, I have some good news for you. Sin does not have dominion (or rule) over us, rather we are under grace Romans 6:14. The rest of the world (unbelievers) are under God's law and will be judged accordingly by .... the Ugandan President - no. Joe Biden, no - Stewardofthemystery? Definitely not! One final guess ...............

What I'm trying to get across is that there only two categories of people, believers and non-believers. Jesus puts it, sheep and goats. In the latter category there's a broad spectrum of people, some really nice through to others that are downright revolting and despicable, but all will ultimately share the same fate unless they come to believe and follow Jesus. That's where you and I come in. We're to reach out and invite them in Luke 14:23. Did the servants in that parable refuse to obey the master's command because they judged them unwashed? No; so why are you refusing to obey your master's command?

Homophobia, racism and misogyny are hateful prejudices propagated by Satan. If he can pollute the church with these ideologies he will do. If the church excludes and spurns groups of people and pushes them away from salvation, the devil's going **** a hoots, you're doing his job for him. There's no place for hatred in the believer, if we are Christ like we are to show God's love to ALL sinners.

That's what Jesus did in Luke 7:37-43, John 8:1-7 and John 4.5-30 much to ]p]]the disapproval of the Pharisees and the Disciples. In your OP I can see a lot of Pharisee in you. Please obey your father and repent and ask God to replace the hate that's in your life with His love.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

Steward, your post is hate filled and homophobic and is so offensive to most right thinking people, both Christian and non-Christian. There can no place for that sort of sentiment in a Christian forum. You appear to be actually supportive of the Ugandan President's law which can pass a death sentence on somebody just for participating in gay sex. I'm assuming you were equally supportive of Islamic State's punishment of gays by throwing them off tall buildings. That's the sort of company you're aligning yourself with.

We as Christians are called to love our neighbours not judge them. We're not equipped to judge anyone; we need to leave that to the one who is. Rather we are called to reach out to the lost with the Gospel and share Jesus's love. Look at His great commission. Jesus tells us to preach repentance and remission of sins in His name to all nations ie: everyone Luke 24:47. Jesus rebuked the Disciples when they judged a Samaritan village and wanted to pass a death sentence upon it Luke 9:54.

I know that Jesus takes a very dim view of your post and your hateful attitude towards sinners. Please repent.

Do you think God is homophobic, and should repent for saying these words?

Leviticus 20:13
If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

Steward, I have some good news for you. Sin does not have dominion (or rule) over us, rather we are under grace Romans 6:14. The rest of the world (unbelievers) are under God's law and will be judged accordingly by .... the Ugandan President - no. Joe Biden, no - Stewardofthemystery? Definitely not! One final guess ...............

What I'm trying to get across is that there only two categories of people, believers and non-believers. Jesus puts it, sheep and goats. In the latter category there's a broad spectrum of people, some really nice through to others that are downright revolting and despicable, but all will ultimately share the same fate unless they come to believe and follow Jesus. That's where you and I come in. We're to reach out and invite them in Luke 14:23. Did the servants in that parable refuse to obey the master's command because they judged them unwashed? No; so why are you refusing to obey your master's command?

Homophobia, racism and misogyny are hateful prejudices propagated by Satan. If he can pollute the church with these ideologies he will do. If the church excludes and spurns groups of people and pushes them away from salvation, the devil's going **** a hoots, you're doing his job for him. There's no place for hatred in the believer, if we are Christ like we are to show God's love to ALL sinners.

That's what Jesus did in Luke 7:37-43, John 8:1-7 and John 4.5-30 much to ]p]]the disapproval of the Pharisees and the Disciples. In your OP I can see a lot of Pharisee in you. Please obey your father and repent and ask God to replace the hate that's in your life with His love.

God hates sinful behavior, so do I.

Psalm 97:10
Ye that love the Lord, hate evil: he preserveth the souls of his saints; he delivereth them out of the hand of the wicked.

Proverbs 8:13
The fear of the Lord is to hate evil: pride, and arrogancy, and the evil way, and the froward mouth, do I hate.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

Steward, your post is hate filled and homophobic and is so offensive to most right thinking people, both Christian and non-Christian. There can no place for that sort of sentiment in a Christian forum. You appear to be actually supportive of the Ugandan President's law which can pass a death sentence on somebody just for participating in gay sex. I'm assuming you were equally supportive of Islamic State's punishment of gays by throwing them off tall buildings. That's the sort of company you're aligning yourself with.

We as Christians are called to love our neighbours not judge them. We're not equipped to judge anyone; we need to leave that to the one who is. Rather we are called to reach out to the lost with the Gospel and share Jesus's love. Look at His great commission. Jesus tells us to preach repentance and remission of sins in His name to all nations ie: everyone Luke 24:47. Jesus rebuked the Disciples when they judged a Samaritan village and wanted to pass a death sentence upon it Luke 9:54.

I know that Jesus takes a very dim view of your post and your hateful attitude towards sinners. Please repent.

You must mean left thinking people, because the liberal left are the ones that use the term “homophobic” against those who call homosexuality a sin.

If you judge me as being homophobic for believing the words of God, then you also judge God as being homophobic for speaking those words.

Therefore it is you who should repent for judging Gods words as homophobic.

 

[Andyindauk]

Why do some Christians want to do away with grace and go back to God's law? Reminds me of Israel on the cusp of invading the promised land and deciding to knock it on the head and go back to slavery in Egypt. Numbers 14:4.

You might think, well I'm not gay so I can safely look down on and treat gays badly, give them lots of unpleasant bigotry and wish they'd be executed by the State.

Problem is pal, that as far as God's law is concerned, you are gay! Read -

For whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all. James 2:10 NKJV

It was not only gays that had a problem with God's law, ordinary people could find themselves facing capital punishment; say if you had a barney with your parents. Exodus 22:19.

So Steward, be careful what you wish for. Rather, let's thank the Saviour for His death and resurrection that's freed us from the prospect of harsh punishment even before we go before God for His verdict and sentence.

This is how Apostle Paul puts it -

For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death. For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh, Romans 8:2-3 NKJV

So really there's no need to be prejudicial and obnoxious to gays. We can freely reach out and welcome them into the church and a 121 close and personal relationship with our father God.

That is, if we don't want to use God and our faith as justification for our homophobia. If you do, please don't make the mistake of thinking you've got God's approval. Jesus reached out to all shunned minorities including the promiscuous, the disabled and diseased and social outcasts aka tax collectors.

That said, repentance was still expected. God's message to all sinners is to seek righteousness. To the gay He asks for celibacy which is a big price to pay but what's that compared to the price he paid for our salvation? I suspect if a gay does forgo his/her sexuality in obedience to God, the crown they will be awarded will require us to wear shades just to look at it !!!

Either way, this is an issue between the believer and God. God does not want you to be His appointed judge and executioner.

 

[B-A-C]

Why do some Christians want to do away with grace and go back to God's law?

We aren't under the ceremonial law ( circumcision, sacrifices, confession to priests, stoning, etc... )
But the Bible makes it clear we are still under moral law.

Matt 5:19; "Whoever then annuls one of the least of these commandments, and teaches others to do the same, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever keeps and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Matt 19:17; And He said to him, "Why are you asking Me about what is good? There is only One who is good; but if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments."
Matt 22:40; "On these two commandments depend the whole Law and the Prophets."
Mark 10:19; "You know the commandments, 'DO NOT MURDER, DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, DO NOT STEAL, DO NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS, Do not defraud, HONOR YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER.'"
Luke 1:6; They were both righteous in the sight of God, walking blamelessly in all the commandments and requirements of the Lord.
Luke 18:20; "You know the commandments, 'DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, DO NOT MURDER, DO NOT STEAL, DO NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS, HONOR YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER.'"
John 14:15; "If you love Me, you will keep My commandments.
John 14:21; "He who has My commandments and keeps them is the one who loves Me; and he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and will disclose Myself to him."
John 15:10; "If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love; just as I have kept My Father's commandments and abide in His love.
1Cor 7:19; Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but what matters is the keeping of the commandments of God.
Eph 2:15; by abolishing in His flesh the enmity, which is the Law of commandments contained in ordinances, so that in Himself He might make the two into one new man, thus establishing peace,
Col 2:22; (which all refer to things destined to perish with use)—in accordance with the commandments and teachings of men?
1Thes 4:2; For you know what commandments we gave you by the authority of the Lord Jesus.
Tit 1:14; not paying attention to Jewish myths and commandments of men who turn away from the truth.
1Jn 2:3; By this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments.
1Jn 2:4; The one who says, "I have come to know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him;
1Jn 3:22; and whatever we ask we receive from Him, because we keep His commandments and do the things that are pleasing in His sight.
1Jn 3:24; The one who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. We know by this that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.
1Jn 5:2; By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and observe His commandments.
1Jn 5:3; For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments; and His commandments are not burdensome.
2Jn 1:6; And this is love, that we walk according to His commandments. This is the commandment, just as you have heard from the beginning, that you should walk in it.
Rev 12:17; So the dragon was enraged with the woman, and went off to make war with the rest of her children, who keep the commandments of God and hold to the testimony of Jesus.
Rev 14:12; Here is the perseverance of the saints who keep the commandments of God and their faith in Jesus.

You might think, well I'm not gay so I can safely look down on and treat gays badly, give them lots of unpleasant bigotry and wish they'd be executed by the State.

I don't think anyone here thinks that, but we do believe the LGBT agenda is being shoved down our throats from every angle.

Problem is pal, that as far as God's law is concerned, you are gay! Read -

For whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all. James 2:10 NKJV

Yes all have sinned... but we don't have to continue living in it. That verse doesn't say to keep living in sin, it says you have sinned in the past.
It says no one was ever perfect enough to get into heaven on their own.

For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death. For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh, Romans 8:2-3 NKJV

Which law? I will continue with the verse you gave here.

Rom 8:4; so that the requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.
Rom 8:5; For those who are according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who are according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit.
Rom 8:6; For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace,
Rom 8:7; because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so,
Rom 8:8; and those who are in the flesh cannot please God.
Rom 8:9; However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him.
Rom 8:10; If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness.
Rom 8:11; But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.
Heirs with Christ
Rom 8:12; So then, brethren, we are under obligation, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh—
Rom 8:13; for if you are living according to the flesh, you must die; but if by the Spirit you are putting to death the deeds of the body, you will live.
Rom 8:14; For all who are being led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God.

Either way, this is an issue between the believer and God. God does not want you to be His appointed judge and executioner.

Executioner, no. Judge yes.

1Cor 5:11; But actually, I wrote to you not to associate with any so-called brother if he is an immoral person, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or a swindler—not even to eat with such a one.
1Cor 5:12; For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Do you not judge those who are within the church?
1Cor 5:13; But those who are outside, God judges. REMOVE THE WICKED MAN FROM AMONG YOURSELVES.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

Why do some Christians want to do away with grace and go back to God's law?

That’s a strawman arguement. No body is promoting doing away with grace. But if one is truly under grace then sin shall not have rule over their lives, which means they will not go on living in sin.

Reminds me of Israel on the cusp of invading the promised land and deciding to knock it on the head and go back to slavery in Egypt. Numbers 14:4.

The bondage they were under was a similitude of being in bondage to sin. When we are called out of the world by God we are not to return to our old sinful ways.

You might think, well I'm not gay so I can safely look down on and treat gays badly, give them lots of unpleasant bigotry and wish they'd be executed by the State.

Another straw man. I never said I wish they were executed. But truth is, the wage of sin is death. So warn them of the dangers of sin and tell them to repent.

Problem is pal, that as far as God's law is concerned, you are gay! Read -

False accusation, I’m not a Sodomite.

For whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all. James 2:10 NKJV

That’s why we need to have faith in Jesus Christ and be made free from sin. Practicing homosexuals are practicing sinners, so we know they are not under grace, nor do they love God. Those who truly love God will keep His commandments and not keep on sinning.

It was not only gays that had a problem with God's law, ordinary people could find themselves facing capital punishment; say if you had a barney with your parents. Exodus 22:19.

Those who hate Gods law also hate Gods Word Jesus Christ.

So Steward, be careful what you wish for. Rather, let's thank the Saviour for His death and resurrection that's freed us from the prospect of harsh punishment even before we go before God for His verdict and sentence.

Jesus Christ didn’t come and be crucified so we could keep on sinning. Jesus came to be a sacrifice for our past sins, and make us free from committing future sin by giving us His Holy Spirit. Those who are living in sin do not belong to Christ, they are of the Devil.

This is how Apostle Paul puts it -

For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death.

You like many others do not understand what Paul is talking about when he refers to the law of sin and death. He is not talking about God’s holy law. Gods Holy law is not sin, nor is it death. Paul is talking about being made free from SIN.

For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh, Romans 8:2-3 NKJV

That’s right, and if anyone is still in the flesh, then they are still under the condemnation of sin. One way to tell if someone is still in the flesh, is that they will be living a lifestyle of sin, like homosexuality.

So really there's no need to be prejudicial and obnoxious to gays.

I’m not, I hate all sin, so does God.

We can freely reach out and welcome them into the church and a 121 close and personal relationship with our father God.

We are warned by God not to have fellowship with sinners. That is why many churches are in the sad state we see today. They are full of reprobates and sinners, not saints.

That is, if we don't want to use God and our faith as justification for our homophobia.

Again, if you accuse me of homophobia for believing the words of God about homosexuality being an abomination and sinful, then you also judge God as being homophobic.

If you do, please don't make the mistake of thinking you've got God's approval.

I do have Gods seal of approval, it is you that does not.

Jesus reached out to all shunned minorities including the promiscuous, the disabled and diseased and social outcasts aka tax collectors.

Yes, and he told them to repent of their sins, and go and sin no more.

God's message to all sinners is to seek righteousness. To the gay He asks for celibacy which is a big price to pay but what's that compared to the price he paid for our salvation?

Where did God say he asks for celibacy from gays? If they are gay in their heart, then they are still committing sin in their heart.

I suspect if a gay does forgo his/her sexuality in obedience to God, the crown they will be awarded will require us to wear shades just to look at it !!!

The reason they are given over to homosexuality is because they have already rejected the saving Grace found in Jesus Christ.

Either way, this is an issue between the believer and God. God does not want you to be His appointed judge and executioner.

God wants me to warn the wicked and to reprove the sinner.

Leviticus 19:17
Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him.

 

[lentz]

Steward, your post is hate filled and homophobic and is so offensive to most right thinking people, both Christian and non-Christian. There can no place for that sort of sentiment in a Christian forum. You appear to be actually supportive of the Ugandan President's law which can pass a death sentence on somebody just for participating in gay sex. I'm assuming you were equally supportive of Islamic State's punishment of gays by throwing them off tall buildings. That's the sort of company you're aligning yourself with.

We as Christians are called to love our neighbours not judge them. We're not equipped to judge anyone; we need to leave that to the one who is. Rather we are called to reach out to the lost with the Gospel and share Jesus's love. Look at His great commission. Jesus tells us to preach repentance and remission of sins in His name to all nations ie: everyone Luke 24:47. Jesus rebuked the Disciples when they judged a Samaritan village and wanted to pass a death sentence upon it Luke 9:54.

I know that Jesus takes a very dim view of your post and your hateful attitude towards sinners. Please repent.

Liberal thinkers and ideoologists have twisted and shaped the scriptures to your way of thinking.
It is you thinking that is out of step

 

[Andyindauk]

What everyone seems to be missing in here is a basic grasp of the principle of grace.

God created man. Man slipped up and fell into sin. so irreparably damaging the 121 relationship he had with God.

God's relationship with Abraham was so special He created a state from Abraham's off-spring that later became Israel aka the Jews.

God allowed the state to incubate for 450 years in Egypt, though under slavery.

God rescued Israel, brought them out of Egypt and they journeyed towards a land called Canaan that He had promised to give them because the Canaanites were so wicked, the land was ready to spew them out.

En route God gave Israel the 10 commandments and a few hundred other laws. These were God's passport to Heaven; don't break any of these laws from conception to death and you'll be sin free and will qualify for Heaven. Problem - no one was able to even come close.

Israel took over Canaan and was ruled by appointed leaders with mixed results. The people of Israel decided they would prefer to be ruled by a royal dynasty and God acceded to their demand. The first king was not up to the job and so was replaced by David who overall did a really good job but his descendants were a mixed bunch, some good but mostly pretty awful.

Eventually God had enough and so He allowed / organised for firstly the Assyrians and then the Babylonians to invade and remove vast swaths of the population back to their respective countries. This lasted appx. 70 years whereupon the displaced were returned back to Israel.

450 years later God began implementing His plan of rescue and redemption, firstly for Israel and then for that to be rolled out to the whole world. He sent His son, Jesus to demonstrate that it is possible to live a life in perfection and without sin. In so doing Jesus showed up the ruling priests and Pharisees for what they were, self-seeking, righteous in their own minds buy hypocrites, filled with hate and disgust for those they were supposed serve and with twisted heretical interpretations of God's law that were burdensome but more profitable to the Temple and in addition they'd created other burdensome traditions and rituals. This didn't go well with the religious elite and so they plotted to have Jesus crucified, not realising that that was an integral part of God's plan. God was able to take Jesus's death as the punishment for all sin so opening up the gates of Heaven to everyone who believes and follows Jesus. 3 days later Jesus was resurrected and 40 days later He ascended to Heaven to sit at the right hand side of God. A few days later God sent His Holy Spirit.

The words in red above is grace. Did Jesus's death mean there was no sin? No, of course not. Did Jesus's death give the sinner a means to obtain God's forgiveness? Yes, all he/she needs to do is believe and follow Jesus. Do you need to do anything else like good deeds, follow rituals or follow codes of conduct and behaviour? No. Are there any sins not covered by Jesus's death and resurrection? Just one, unbelief. Does that cover all sins and no sin is bigger than Jesus's death and resurrection? Yes, all sins, past, present and future, sexual sins are included.

So can we can sin freely and there's no consequences? In theory, yes, but anyone who does that isn't following Jesus is he? A true born again believer and disciple of Jesus follows God's law as well as Jesus's and the epistle writers advice as closely as possible because that pleases the God who he/she adores. They want to curry God's favour and the idea of stressing and upsetting God makes them feel really bad. In addition Jesus promises us treasure in Heaven.

So there's no punishment for sin if you follow and believe in Jesus and you don't get your name Tippexed out of the Lamb's Book of Life? Absolutely not.

That guys is grace. It's like this. Imagine, the state changes all the traffic laws, removing all penalties for infringement. The laws are still there but there's no punishment. There'd be traffic chaos, speeding, jumping lights, parking dangerously - carnage. But imagine, if the state could inject a spirit in every driver that makes them really want to obey all the traffic laws. Now that might just work. That's the Holy Spirit. We want to obey God out of love and adoration of Him, not out of fear of retribution and anger.

Pharisaical preachers, preaching that there are exceptions and limits to the power of Jesus's victory over sin is heresy. Yes, there's lots of advice in the New Testament for the believer and disciple to follow and anyone who wantonly disregards that advice might make you wonder if they really do love God, but that's not your call to make. Leave it to the ultimate judge, God.

To those who are not believers, the Bible has just one message; repent and believe. Nowhere does it exhort the sinner to tone down his / her sin levels to acceptable levels or improve their moral conduct.

Nor does it give Christians the green light to persecute those who they judge to have crossed over some red line of sin. We are to love our enemies and pray for them. Better still, reach out to them with the gospel. If they respond, repent and believe, there'll be a party in Heaven! Christians are being persecuted for their faith so, for so-called Christians to call for the persecution and 'martyrdom' of gays can to outside observers, cancel out the cries and tears of our persecuted brothers and sisters.

In the words of the hymn, Grace is really amazing.

 

[lentz]

What everyone seems to be missing in here is a basic grasp of the principle of grace.

God created man. Man slipped up and fell into sin. so irreparably damaging the 121 relationship he had with God.

God's relationship with Abraham was so special He created a state from Abraham's off-spring that later became Israel aka the Jews.

God allowed the state to incubate for 450 years in Egypt, though under slavery.

God rescued Israel, brought them out of Egypt and they journeyed towards a land called Canaan that He had promised to give them because the Canaanites were so wicked, the land was ready to spew them out.

En route God gave Israel the 10 commandments and a few hundred other laws. These were God's passport to Heaven; don't break any of these laws from conception to death and you'll be sin free and will qualify for Heaven. Problem - no one was able to even come close.

Israel took over Canaan and was ruled by appointed leaders with mixed results. The people of Israel decided they would prefer to be ruled by a royal dynasty and God acceded to their demand. The first king was not up to the job and so was replaced by David who overall did a really good job but his descendants were a mixed bunch, some good but mostly pretty awful.

Eventually God had enough and so He allowed / organised for firstly the Assyrians and then the Babylonians to invade and remove vast swaths of the population back to their respective countries. This lasted appx. 70 years whereupon the displaced were returned back to Israel.

450 years later God began implementing His plan of rescue and redemption, firstly for Israel and then for that to be rolled out to the whole world. He sent His son, Jesus to demonstrate that it is possible to live a life in perfection and without sin. In so doing Jesus showed up the ruling priests and Pharisees for what they were, self-seeking, righteous in their own minds buy hypocrites, filled with hate and disgust for those they were supposed serve and with twisted heretical interpretations of God's law that were burdensome but more profitable to the Temple and in addition they'd created other burdensome traditions and rituals. This didn't go well with the religious elite and so they plotted to have Jesus crucified, not realising that that was an integral part of God's plan. God was able to take Jesus's death as the punishment for all sin so opening up the gates of Heaven to everyone who believes and follows Jesus. 3 days later Jesus was resurrected and 40 days later He ascended to Heaven to sit at the right hand side of God. A few days later God sent His Holy Spirit.

The words in red above is grace. Did Jesus's death mean there was no sin? No, of course not. Did Jesus's death give the sinner a means to obtain God's forgiveness? Yes, all he/she needs to do is believe and follow Jesus. Do you need to do anything else like good deeds, follow rituals or follow codes of conduct and behaviour? No. Are there any sins not covered by Jesus's death and resurrection? Just one, unbelief. Does that cover all sins and no sin is bigger than Jesus's death and resurrection? Yes, all sins, past, present and future, sexual sins are included.

So can we can sin freely and there's no consequences? In theory, yes, but anyone who does that isn't following Jesus is he? A true born again believer and disciple of Jesus follows God's law as well as Jesus's and the epistle writers advice as closely as possible because that pleases the God who he/she adores. They want to curry God's favour and the idea of stressing and upsetting God makes them feel really bad. In addition Jesus promises us treasure in Heaven.

So there's no punishment for sin if you follow and believe in Jesus and you don't get your name Tippexed out of the Lamb's Book of Life? Absolutely not.

That guys is grace. It's like this. Imagine, the state changes all the traffic laws, removing all penalties for infringement. The laws are still there but there's no punishment. There'd be traffic chaos, speeding, jumping lights, parking dangerously - carnage. But imagine, if the state could inject a spirit in every driver that makes them really want to obey all the traffic laws. Now that might just work. That's the Holy Spirit. We want to obey God out of love and adoration of Him, not out of fear of retribution and anger.

Pharisaical preachers, preaching that there are exceptions and limits to the power of Jesus's victory over sin is heresy. Yes, there's lots of advice in the New Testament for the believer and disciple to follow and anyone who wantonly disregards that advice might make you wonder if they really do love God, but that's not your call to make. Leave it to the ultimate judge, God.

To those who are not believers, the Bible has just one message; repent and believe. Nowhere does it exhort the sinner to tone down his / her sin levels to acceptable levels or improve their moral conduct.

Nor does it give Christians the green light to persecute those who they judge to have crossed over some red line of sin. We are to love our enemies and pray for them. Better still, reach out to them with the gospel. If they respond, repent and believe, there'll be a party in Heaven! Christians are being persecuted for their faith so, for so-called Christians to call for the persecution and 'martyrdom' of gays can to outside observers, cancel out the cries and tears of our persecuted brothers and sisters.

In the words of the hymn, Grace is really amazing.

Those are fine words. Some i agree with. However,we are to judge those who call themselves christian. Paul said he could not judge the lost. They have judged themselves already. But we are to judge those of the faith. Whether the homosexual claims to be christian ot not is irrelevant,it is sin and if he continues in it,he can not remain christian. If youre one who believes in once saved always saved,then he was never saved and is still lost.
So grace only occurs when he repents(turns from it). We all fall down and get dirty from time to time. But a true christian will feel sorrow and get up. Not lay and wallow in it. I am of theopinion that all homosexuals are child molesters. That makes the sin even worse. To homosexual men or women,are allowed to adopt kids,it is pretty obvious how those kids will grow up with the same beliefs.
It is an abomination. And should not be allowed in any realm of society. Only a bleeding heart liberal would think otherwise.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

What everyone seems to be missing in here is a basic grasp of the principle of grace.

It is you who have a misunderstanding of Gods grace. Gods grace is not a license to sin.

Romans 6:1-2

King James Version

​

6 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

God created man. Man slipped up and fell into sin. so irreparably damaging the 121 relationship he had with God.

God's relationship with Abraham was so special He created a state from Abraham's off-spring that later became Israel aka the Jews.

God allowed the state to incubate for 450 years in Egypt, though under slavery.

God rescued Israel, brought them out of Egypt and they journeyed towards a land called Canaan that He had promised to give them because the Canaanites were so wicked, the land was ready to spew them out.

En route God gave Israel the 10 commandments and a few hundred other laws. These were God's passport to Heaven; don't break any of these laws from conception to death and you'll be sin free and will qualify for Heaven. Problem - no one was able to even come close.

Israel took over Canaan and was ruled by appointed leaders with mixed results. The people of Israel decided they would prefer to be ruled by a royal dynasty and God acceded to their demand. The first king was not up to the job and so was replaced by David who overall did a really good job but his descendants were a mixed bunch, some good but mostly pretty awful.

Eventually God had enough and so He allowed / organised for firstly the Assyrians and then the Babylonians to invade and remove vast swaths of the population back to their respective countries. This lasted appx. 70 years whereupon the displaced were returned back to Israel.

450 years later God began implementing His plan of rescue and redemption, firstly for Israel and then for that to be rolled out to the whole world. He sent His son, Jesus to demonstrate that it is possible to live a life in perfection and without sin. In so doing Jesus showed up the ruling priests and Pharisees for what they were, self-seeking, righteous in their own minds buy hypocrites, filled with hate and disgust for those they were supposed serve and with twisted heretical interpretations of God's law that were burdensome but more profitable to the Temple and in addition they'd created other burdensome traditions and rituals. This didn't go well with the religious elite and so they plotted to have Jesus crucified, not realising that that was an integral part of God's plan. God was able to take Jesus's death as the punishment for all sin so opening up the gates of Heaven to everyone who believes and follows Jesus. 3 days later Jesus was resurrected and 40 days later He ascended to Heaven to sit at the right hand side of God. A few days later God sent His Holy Spirit.

The words in red above is grace. Did Jesus's death mean there was no sin? No, of course not. Did Jesus's death give the sinner a means to obtain God's forgiveness? Yes, all he/she needs to do is believe and follow Jesus. Do you need to do anything else like good deeds, follow rituals or follow codes of conduct and behaviour? No. Are there any sins not covered by Jesus's death and resurrection? Just one, unbelief. Does that cover all sins and no sin is bigger than Jesus's death and resurrection? Yes, all sins, past, present and future, sexual sins are included.

Wrong, again grace is not a license to sin.
Hebrews 10:26
For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

So can we can sin freely and there's no consequences? In theory, yes,

Again, you are perverting the message of Grace.
Jude 1:4
For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

but anyone who does that isn't following Jesus is he? A true born again believer and disciple of Jesus follows God's law as well as Jesus's and the epistle writers advice as closely as possible because that pleases the God who he/she adores. They want to curry God's favour and the idea of stressing and upsetting God makes them feel really bad. In addition Jesus promises us treasure in Heaven.

So there's no punishment for sin if you follow and believe in Jesus and you don't get your name Tippexed out of the Lamb's Book of Life? Absolutely not.

Sin is what gets your name blotted out of Gods book of life.
Exodus 32:33
And the Lord said unto Moses, Whosoever hath sinned against me, him will I blot out of my book.

That guys is grace. It's like this. Imagine, the state changes all the traffic laws, removing all penalties for infringement. The laws are still there but there's no punishment.

There is punishment, it is called hell and the lake of fire.

There'd be traffic chaos, speeding, jumping lights, parking dangerously - carnage. But imagine, if the state could inject a spirit in every driver that makes them really want to obey all the traffic laws. Now that might just work. That's the Holy Spirit. We want to obey God out of love and adoration of Him, not out of fear of retribution and anger.

Pharisaical preachers, preaching that there are exceptions and limits to the power of Jesus's victory over sin is heresy. Yes, there's lots of advice in the New Testament for the believer and disciple to follow and anyone who wantonly disregards that advice might make you wonder if they really do love God, but that's not your call to make. Leave it to the ultimate judge, God.

To those who are not believers, the Bible has just one message; repent and believe. Nowhere does it exhort the sinner to tone down his / her sin levels to acceptable levels or improve their moral conduct.

Again, if one is truly born again they will no longer continue in sin.

1 John 3:9
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

1 John 5:18
We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

Nor does it give Christians the green light to persecute those who they judge to have crossed over some red line of sin. We are to love our enemies and pray for them. Better still, reach out to them with the gospel. If they respond, repent and believe, there'll be a party in Heaven! Christians are being persecuted for their faith so, for so-called Christians to call for the persecution and 'martyrdom' of gays can to outside observers, cancel out the cries and tears of our persecuted brothers and sisters.

If they are living in sin then they are not my brothers and sisters.

1 Corinthians 5:11
But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolator, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.

Matthew 12:50
For whosoever shall do the will of my Fatherwhich is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.”

Living in sin is not doing the will of my Father.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

The grace of God reigns through Righteousness.

The grace and the righteousness of God in Jesus Christ is a gift as is shown here….

Romans 5:17 “For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.”

Romans 5:21 “That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.”

Galatians 2:21 “I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.”

But if we are to reign with Christ by the grace of God, and if we are to abide in His righteousness, do we then walk in unrighteousness? For all unrighteousness is sin. (1 John 5:17)

Romans 6:13 “Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.

2 Corinthians 5:21 “For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Again if we are truly made a new man in Christ, and Christ is truly in us, do we continue to walk in unrighteousness?

1 Peter 2:24 “Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.”

So truly you will know who is, or who is not, in Christ by their fruits.( Matthew 7:20)

1 John 2:29 “If ye know that he is righteous, ye know that every one that doeth righteousness is born of him.

1 John 3:7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.

1 John 3:10 “In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.”

1 John 2:6 “He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.

Righteous is as righteous does.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

Only righteous sons inherit the Kingdom of God, not servants of sin

Jesus said whoever commits sin is a servant of sin, and a servant does not abide in the house forever: but the Son abides forever. It is also written that the unrighteous shall not inherit the Kingdom of God; but he that overcomes shall inherit all things, and God shall call them my son. Think...

www.talkjesus.com

 

[Andyindauk]

Maybe I'm not explaining myself very clearly here. I'm Not advocating that disciples and followers of Jesus are OK to live lives of sin and debauchery with impunity. I'm not sure how you came by that notion. What I have said is that pre Jesus's death and resurrection, man was subject to God's law. Righteous people followed God's law out of fear of His anger and punishment and when they slipped up they would take an animal to be slaughtered and offered to God as a sacrifice for their sin. Post Jesus's death and resurrection, righteous people follow God's law out of obedience and love for God and when they slip, they confess their sins to God and He will forgive them. No punishment, that was dealt with at the cross. This was widely prophesied by Jeremiah in Jeremiah 31:33 and again by Ezekiel. Paul refers to these prophecies in Hebrews 10:16-17.

I read posts in this thread in which the contributors claim never to have sinned saying if anyone does he/she has a one way ticket to Hell. But wait, the Apostle Paul admits to having a sinful nature that he's constantly at war with in Romans 7:24-25. The reason he's at battle is not out of fear of God's punishment but because he loves God. In the next chapter he clearly states :

What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who can be against us? He who did not spare His own Son, but delivered Him up for us all, how shall He not with Him also freely give us all things? Who shall bring a charge against God’s elect? It is God who justifies. Who is he who condemns? It is Christ who died, and furthermore is also risen, who is even at the right hand of God, who also makes intercession for us. Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? As it is written: “For Your sake we are killed all day long; We are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.” Yet in all these things we are more than conquerors through Him who loved us. For I am persuaded that neither death nor life, nor angels nor principalities nor powers, nor things present nor things to come, nor height nor depth, nor any other created thing, shall be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. Romans 8:31‭-39 NKJV

Later in the same book, Paul writes-
And if by grace, then it is no longer of works; otherwise grace is no longer grace. But if it is of works, it is no longer grace; otherwise work is no longer work. Romans 11:6 NKJV.

This is repeated in Hebrews-
Therefore He is also able to save to the uttermost those who come to God through Him, since He always lives to make intercession for them. Hebrews 7:25 NKJV ie, our forgiveness for our sins is an ongoing process rather than a once and for all.

Back to Romans. Paul writes -

For sin shall no longer be your master, because you are not under the law, but under grace. What then? Shall we sin because we are not under the law but under grace? By no means! Don’t you know that when you offer yourselves to someone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one you obey—whether you are slaves to sin, which leads to death, or to obedience, which leads to righteousness? But thanks be to God that, though you used to be slaves to sin, you have come to obey from your heart the pattern of teaching that has now claimed your allegiance. You have been set free from sin and have become slaves to righteousness. Romans 6:14‭-‬18 NIV

Are the verses I've quoted contradictory to those quoted by BAC and Steward? Absolutely not. All these verses say that we should seek righteousness, but out of love and gratitude rather than fear of retribution.

As I said earlier, some in this thread claim to no longer sin. If anyone is of that view, I'd refer them to John's epistle - If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word is not in us. 1 John 1:8-10 NIV I admit I have sinned since coming to know Jesus, prolifically and shamefully and for which I have repented and asked for forgiveness and healing. I believe that God has forgiven me and that my name is still in the Lamb's Book of Life.

Some say we should judge our brothers and sisters. These verses suggest otherwise-

Matthew 7:1-5
Luke 6:37
Romans 2:1
Romans 14:10
James 4:11-12

Back to OP. The news article he was talking about had nothing to do with Christians compromising their lives with sin. It was about supporting Uganda's laws giving life sentences and even death sentences for gays. I fail to understand how any believer could possibly think that's a good idea.