Churches cancelling Sunday School

[Sosthenes]

I am not sure why its called some churches because the number is high.. it is happening all over and its a thing.

Some churches cancel children's Sunday school
Some churches cancel children's Sunday school

I hope this doesn't happen to your church and you need to prepare to protect your church.

It happened to my church. They told us how wonderful it would be and then replaced everybody.

2 Timothy 4:3 For the time will come when men will not tolerate sound doctrine, but with itching ears they will gather around themselves teachers to suit their own desires.
2 Timothy 4:3 For the time will come when men will not tolerate sound doctrine, but with itching ears they will gather around themselves teachers to suit their own desires.

 

[Hekuran]

I'm in favour of all-age and family worship and teaching. There are times when youth and children need to be with just their peers (same us true of adults). But the norm should be the whole body of Christ worshipping together.

 

[Christ4Ever]

I am not sure why its called some churches because the number is high.. it is happening all over and its a thing.

Some churches cancel children's Sunday school
Some churches cancel children's Sunday school

I hope this doesn't happen to your church and you need to prepare to protect your church.

It happened to my church. They told us how wonderful it would be and then replaced everybody.

2 Timothy 4:3 For the time will come when men will not tolerate sound doctrine, but with itching ears they will gather around themselves teachers to suit their own desires.
2 Timothy 4:3 For the time will come when men will not tolerate sound doctrine, but with itching ears they will gather around themselves teachers to suit their own desires.

Dear Sosthenes,
I don't think you understood what was being discussed in this article. At least not in the way it was intended.
I do believe that the concept in a nut shell, is doing Sunday School differently. Putting the onus on the parents. Be it at home or at the Church. Which is something I do believe is something that should be considered, since apparently its falling short. The concept of Sunday school, as this article implies, is that a certain number/percentage of children who are growing up, are no longer continuing to attend church.

The article also doesn't touch on the message of the churches in question. There is no way of knowing if its the message, or even if the Sunday Schools are not communicating/teaching Scriptural Foundational Doctrine that children attending these Sunday Schools can carry into adulthood. Which might actually be the problem or at least one of the causes. It appears that according to this article just the general concept of Sunday School as its being done (?) was being looked at as being the culprit for this failure.

Oh, by the way, I do not believe 2 Timothy 4:3, was talking about Sunday School being abolished, and moving the responsibility to the Parents, or as I stated before, including them in the teaching. I believe it's a good idea to have parents involved, as one was shown as an example, by having the parents read the Scripture at a table, and then discussing with the children what was read as part of the Sunday School.

However, what I believe is a greater problem for children growing up and not continuing in church, is the world itself. Also, when they leave home to go to school, the churches do little to no follow-up i.e. finding a local church for the young person to attend to that is close to the school they may be attending. Providing even a letter of introduction to the Pastor of the church for the young adult so that they would look, invite, bring into fellowship with. The church I attend has a fluctuation of members because some are in the military from a close by base, and they do get reassigned. The church ministry will help them find a church at the new base of assignment, or wherever they happen to relocate to. I don't know if the onus is on the individual, or if the church assists them when they find out about the reassignment of the family/individual.

Still, its good that the churches are noticing that there is a disconnect between Sunday School children, and continuing attendance in church upon reaching young adulthood, and are trying to find a solution to a problem.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
\o/
<><

 

[Sosthenes]

"Pastor Scott Brown, director of the North Carolina-based National Center for Family-Integrated Churches and author of the book, said many of its close to 800 affiliated churches have either stopped or reduced traditional Sunday school classes.

 

[Christ4Ever]

"Pastor Scott Brown, director of the North Carolina-based National Center for Family-Integrated Churches and author of the book, said many of its close to 800 affiliated churches have either stopped or reduced traditional Sunday school classes.

Since you've read the book, can you say what conclusions he came from in his research on why this has happened, and/or what the alternatives being looked at are?

 

[Sosthenes]

Since you've read the book, can you say what conclusions he came from in his research on why this has happened, and/or what the alternatives being looked at are?

Why don't you read the reviews that say its propaganda and the book is not flying off the shelves?


'Divided' The Documentary - Scott Brown & NCFIC - Free Jinger

'Divided' The Documentary

You can't make this stuff up and apparently you can't give it away. razoo.com/story/Divided "Divided" is a movie/documentary that warns Christians: Your family are in deep trouble if your kids go to Sunday School or children's church, and you should all retool your congregations into family-integ...

www.freejinger.org

 

[Christ4Ever]

Why don't you read the reviews that say its propaganda and the book is not flying off the shelves?


'Divided' The Documentary - Scott Brown & NCFIC - Free Jinger

'Divided' The Documentary

You can't make this stuff up and apparently you can't give it away. razoo.com/story/Divided "Divided" is a movie/documentary that warns Christians: Your family are in deep trouble if your kids go to Sunday School or children's church, and you should all retool your congregations into family-integ...

www.freejinger.org

I figured since you brought the subject of the book up......

 

[Sosthenes]

This is not how you teach. My wife is a teacher and teaching is not about giving people a bunch of facts and hoping they will listen. The integrated approach will not work.

There are parents screaming for schools to reopen because they cannot help teach their kids virtually. To expect the parents to be able to do that is ridiculous. They will introduce heresies and divide the church. They haven't got their theology straight. There are reasons even why kid's public school teacher will not allow parents to be in the classroom if the chemistry is not right.

Even our church would not allow it because you have to come from a respected college.

World Team requires you to take courses or you are not going to be a missionary. The days of Christians going to the mission field without education is not going to happen in this day and age.

You have to be trained by someone who is trained by someone who is trained because if they are not, the average person would not know if it was the word of God or the pastor's own ideas.

I argued for Church people to have more of an education and it is not going to happen for many many reasons.

He wants to sell a book. It's his prerogative but its not going to work. The reality is most Sunday school teachers I've seen have more ability to teach from being to Seminary / Bible College and it's easier for them to teach than a parent.

Most parents cannot put a bible study together. I sat in my house and wrote for ten years before I got better at teaching.

It's not going to work.

 

[Sosthenes]

I figured since you brought the subject of the book up......

You have to understand what the problem is before you buy someone else's version of what is wrong.

Some kids cut themselves or self harm because of the way their parents talk to their kids. Putting them in charge at church is not going to work.

I know an Episcopal Church that tried this approach and they had to remove the children because the parents were cursing.

Pastor Dr. Martyn Lloyd Jones said the world is the way it is because the church is the way it is. You think the cause of the problem is just going to fix the next generation when it is not but nice try.

 

[Sosthenes]

I have another story but I can't repeat half of the stuff. Four elders of another church split another church for reasons I would not publically say on this forum because it is bad. They started their own church.
They wear t-shirts in front of their congregation and teach. I went there once and never went back. They were a mess.

There are adults who I tried to teach Bible studies to and they just talked the whole time. They don't want to listen and you can't do anything with them because they don't want to learn.
Someone who doesn't want to learn is going to say, "I don't understand" the whole time even if they can understand.
You won't be able to get anything done and it will be a disaster.

 

[Christ4Ever]

Its not how you teach. My wife is a teacher and teaching is not about giving people a bunch of facts and hoping they will listen. The integrated approach will not work.

There are parents screaming for schools to reopen because they cannot help teach their kids virtually. To expect the parents to be able to do that is rediculous. They will introduce heresies and divide the church. They haven't got their theology straight. There are reasons even why kid's public school teacher will not allow parents to be in the classroom if the chemistry is not right.

Even our church would not allow it because you have to come from a respected college.

World Team requires you to take courses or you are not going to be a missionary. The days of Christians going to the mission field without education is not going to happen in this day and age.

You have to be trained by someone who is trained by someone who is trained because if they are not, the average person would not know if it was the word of God or the pastor's own ideas.

I argued for Church people to have more of an education and it is not going to happen for many many reasons.

He wants to sell a book. Its his prerogative but its not going to work. The reality is most Sunday school teachers I've seen have more ability to teach from being to Seminary / Bible College and its easier for them to teach than a parent.

Most parents cannot put a bible study together. I sat in my house and wrote for ten years before I got better at teaching.

It's not going to work.

Dear Brother,
Not at all. If the parents are taught properly the word of God, they should be able to rear their children in the Word of God as well. None of the Apostles were formally trained, but by the Holy Spirit completely blew away the Pharisees' & Sadducees when communicating the Gospel, who saw them as uneducated men, which to the World they were! The responsibility falls not upon the church, but upon the parents to ensure that they are trained right.

Pro 22:6 NKJV - Train up a child in the way he should go, And when he is old he will not depart from it.

We are blessed to have educated men & women of God in churches who are willing to teach other children the Word of God, and have the skills to do so. Lord willing they also have the calling to do so. However, if its not working, then getting parents involved, which they should be anyway, to help isn't something I would dismiss, just because I know the difficulties/training needed for a systematic approach in learning to exist. There are plenty of resources out there for parents to utilize which the churches themselves can provide, to help them grow their children in the things they should know. Because as churches move away from teaching correct doctrine, who will take up the slack? Parents/Grandparents, Godly men & women of God! It doesn't have to be the church, at least not the formal church, because we as believers regardless of location, denomination are the church! Plus, as a believer, having the Holy Spirit as a guide, is second to none in getting this accomplished! You think if a parent has a sincere desire to teach their children that God won't help them?

There in is the greater problem. Parents who don't care, or who are non-believers, and don't attend church. Sunday School has also been a vehicle by which these parents have been reached! Still, I know know this is going further a field then what the article you brought up was covering. Still, I can agree that it is something that should be addressed, if not by the church then by the parents themselves! Ultimately these treasures given to us by God, are our responsibility to rear up in the ways of Praying, Worship, Study, and being Godly men & women. So, that they'll be prepared when they go out into the World that will have no love for them, nor for what they believe, and yet hopefully won't be obstacles to living a life that is representative of our Lord & Savior Jesus.

You and your wife I'm sure are a blessing to others in learning the Word of God. That you have the training/education to structure lessons to make it easier for others to learn is truly a blessing. However, I don't think there is anyone here that would say that they'd have a problem learning from Peter, who was just a Fisherman, or should I say Fisher of men!

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
Off to bed brother!
YBIC
Nick
\o/
<><

 

[Sosthenes]

Proverbs 22:6 really means the teaching will haunt your kids for the rest of their lives. Not that they won't depart from it.

I can name the church that has home fellowships. Some have cults inside the church that they listen to. Some are self made men . My mother in law got her Masters degree from a biblical college and the college professors are very discriminatory against self made people and she talks against churches that have self made pastors.. They say its not education and I can't understand all the reasons and I argued a lot.

Most people are not going to understand Greek and Hebrew unless you goto college. Those books that are titled "Learn Hebrew in X amount of days" is not how it works. It takes a lifetime in trying to understand some things. I have the Key Word Study Bible by Spires Zahodiates and you cannot understand Hebrew by using his dictionary. It's not going to happen.

I took a non accredited bible course. The pastor tried to make us hate the word and gave me 5+ hour homework assignments for two verses of the bible. How many observations can you make about two verses? Can you make 300 or more? 400 or more? I am not kidding you.

I've studied some things for 40 years and I just learned something a few weeks ago that I could never figure out.

And I had a University teacher who would always explain something a different way if you had questions or didn't understand something.

But there was a family talking to the pastor in church and the father was just condemning his family and making the children cry. You tell me what will come of it.

On the college level, you have to write papers on the Bible and they take a lot of hours. Its not going to happen with parents that work.

I have 80+ feet of academic reference books that help me. Most people do not. I have more reference books than my wife who graduated Bible college and her room mate. And her room mate was like "Ewe" when she heard I had the Dallas Seminary Commentary in my possession and I read it and they hated it.

Most churches do not teach. For people to learn the Bible, they learn two verses in Sunday. Divide the number of verses in the Bible by 52 Sundays and with a little math, it will take the church 300 years to teach the average church goer the bible. They don't understand because its the illiterate teaching the illiterate.

The church is teaching arguments that are 60 years old. Most churches do not have a library and I know several churches that decimated their church libraries. Someone just decided to take the books. They throw their taped sermons away.

I write Bible studies and people read it and say it looks easy but its not. There are pastors who work the whole weekend or 26 hours on a sermon. It looks easy because we try to make things easy to understand.

 

[Sosthenes]

A page of my internet postings can take two hours or more. Parents don't have the time to do that.

 

[Sosthenes]

I was also having a discussion with my pastor about word meanings. He said the translation was incorrect. I asked him if the dictionary was wrong. He said word meanings change all the time and that made me really disturbed. You can have parents teach error and it will take a long time to correct. I just corrected my sister who learned something in Sunday school and it floored her. I said nothing for the longest time. And she didn't talk to me for a while trying to get rid of humiliation I guess. I made sure not to double down on the error.

Some of these professors sell their own books in college. They goto the printing press and the professor gives out the corrections in class. You won't get that from a publisher. You have to be very careful teaching.

 

[Christ4Ever]

A page of my internet postings can take two hours or more. Parents don't have the time to do that.

And Sunday School does?
You're a smart man. Segment the postings into manageable parts that Parents could use!

 

[Christ4Ever]

I was also having a discussion with my pastor about word meanings. He said the translation was incorrect. I asked him if the dictionary was wrong. He said word meanings change all the time and that made me really disturbed. You can have parents teach error and it will take a long time to correct. I just corrected my sister who learned something in Sunday school and it floored her. I said nothing for the longest time. And she didn't talk to me for a while trying to get rid of humiliation I guess. I made sure not to double down on the error.

Some of these professors sell their own books in college. They goto the printing press and the professor gives out the corrections in class. You won't get that from a publisher. You have to be very careful teaching.

As far as you Sister, you think maybe it was the manner you used in correcting what she had learned in Sunday School, and not the actual topic that caused her silence? I mean you stated "I just corrected my sister who learned something in Sunday school...." So, you were correcting not her, but rather the Sunday School teacher? Also, out of curiosity, did you go talk with the Sunday School teacher about what was taught to your sister?

I understand what you are saying, but not every one is a Paul, or a Spurgeon, Moody, etc. Yet, none of those spoken of or ones that you can bring up, could have done anything without the Holy Spirit. He is the one who illuminates our understanding, and can do the same with the Parents who are seeking to teach their children the Word of God. Our God does not leave us without the resources to have His will accomplished, be you Pastor, Teacher, Parent etc.

Do you think your Pastor was saying that historically the meaning of words could have changed, and so context with this historical understanding needed to be considered?