Confused

[jonoman]

As a recovering person, I see God's work every day. It is no mystery as to whether or not God exists to me, I see Him in my life and the life of those around me everyday. My question comes from the observation that I see God helping, even saving (keeping/bringing them back to life and turning their lives COMPLETELY around, nobody knows who is truely "saved" from Hell until we either reach Heaven or Hell) the lives of former theives, prostitutes, liars, adulterers and addicts/alcoholics, including myself. While this is explained as being saved by Christ when people come to Jesus, which is true, I see it happen to people who openly denounce and reject the Bible and Jesus. Many do accept that their is a God, but admit that their idea of God does not include the Bible or Jesus. I know this is God's work. It is a part of the AA/NA programs, indeed step 2, that only God can restore us to sanity, and 3 that we turn our wills and lives over to the care of God as we understood him, meaning we as people cannot do it, only God can. As an addict, I have tried every way imaginable to turn my life around on my own, and it wasn't until I turned it over to God that I was able to do so. Same with most every other addict I know. I don't know how exactly to state my question, but why, if someone openly denounces the Bible and Jesus, would God work such miracles in these peoples lives, even though many Christians say that faith in the Bible and Jesus are necessary to have a relationship with God? If one most accept, follow, love, and worship Jesus and the Bible, why is God helping these make such dramatic improvements in their lives while they openly say that they do not believe in either? I have no interest in debating the fate of their souls and the afterlife, as I firmly believe it is not the place for any human to decide, only God's, and because I do not know what will become of them after they die, again only God does, but I do know what God has done in their lives while alive, and this is what I'm curious about. I've read that if you're not with Jesus, you're against him. This doesn't make sense to me. If this were true, then God shouldn't be helping these people as he does. And yet, I see it every day. What I'm trying to say is must someone believe in the Bible and Jesus to have a relationship with God and for God to work in their lives to such an extent? And if so, why is God doing this for them? I'm really fairly confused and stuck on this.

 

[AbbysAunt]

Knowing God Means Knowing Jesus

Jonoman,

I read your post and wanted to help you as best I could to find the answers you are seeking.

John 8:19 Jesus answered. You know neither Me nor my Father. If you had known Me, you would have known my Father also.

John14:6 Jesus said to him, I am the way, the truth and the life. Noone comes to the Father except through Me.

John15:1-4 I am the true vine and my Father is the vine dresser. Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit He takes away and every branch that bares fruit He prunes, that it may bear more fruit. You are already clean because of the word which I have spoken to you. Abide in Me and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you unless you abide in me.

must someone believe in the Bible and Jesus to have a relationship with God...in answer to this question you asked..Yes a person must know and have a relationship with Jesus if they want to have a relationship with God. The above verses in the bible show Jesus talking and He Himself says " If you do not know the Father(God) then you do not know me not only that Jesus also states that He is the way to God that noone comes to the father(God) but by Him. Jesus came to this earth not only as remission for our sin but to reveal the Father(God) How can we know God if we don't know Jesus...it is impossible because Jesus is of God...He is the son of God and God gave up His only son so we might be free...It was in this sacrifice that Jesus became the way for us...We cannot get to God if we do not acknowledge Jesus as His son and accept the gift that was given to us when Jesus Himself took our punishment on the cross. He became and bore our sin so we could have eternal life in heaven.

Exodus 12:13 Now the blood shall be a sign for you on the houses where you are and when I see the blood I will Passover you and the plague shall not be on you to destroy you when I strike the land of egypt.

This verse talkes about putting the blood on the doorstop of the houses and God saying to the people when I see the blood I will passover and death will not touch you...Just as when Jesus died on that cross and His precious blood was shed it covers us and the plague(or death) will pass us by because Jesus is our passover lamb...with His blood covering us and our sin we are born again and death passes us by...meaning have gained eternal life through this sacrifice..When God sees the blood covering us He knows we know His son, have taken Him as Lord and savior and have a personal relationship with Him then and only then can we ever come to God and have a relationship with Him. There is no other way only by the name of Jesus Christ can we know or have a relationship with God. To know God you must know, accept, have a relationship with and abide in His son Jesus...there are no other ways to get to God or into Heaven there is " Only Jesus"

As far as not knowing if we are going to heaven or hell...Yes we can know for certian jonoman...If a man is saved by the blood of Jesus and has accepted this gift and Jesus as Lord and Savior then Yes we are garaunteed life in heaven with Him...I myself know I am going to heaven when I pass away from this earth because through Jesus I am saved and redeemed.

I hope you find these of some help to you. God bless you now and always jonoman.

 

[Brighthouse]

Brother Jonoman.My brother to goes to these A.A.meeting,and is like you a recovering achoholic.As you know most A.A meeting are conducted in a Church!!The question I would like to ask those who do not believe,is how long have they been free from there addiction? Freedom and truth are both words used by many, but they have no idea what each means. Freedom can be free to do certain things,as we have here in the United States,Truth is freedom in all things,for my knowing Jesus not only do we learn what truth really is as you well know,but we find that this very truth sets us free!!( John 14:6 Jesus said I am the way,and the truth!!AND!! the life! NO ONE comes to the Father but by ME! And so brother IF we abide in HIS Word!! Meaning we strive as best as we can in it,we find out something they do not!! This truth that you, and I, and now my brother holds to,why Brother!! we are set FREE!! ( john 8:31-32) To those who do not, and get along,they are those who fulfil this prophecy of Isaiah.( Matt 13:14-17) Only Truth can bring us true freedom,ask you!! Ask my brother now!! ask us here! You can ask us,because we know the truth,and the truth which is Jesus loves us,and to them that are in him,have no condemnation!( rom 8:1)Like you said only Jesus can save us,our job is to show him in us,for by doing this, we show what truth and freedom really are in our Jesus!! blessing to you! AbbysAunt spoke the truth! and how do we know what is truth? First because truth is always spoken in love,not anger,and 2.Real truth comes only through living by God's Word!! and by seeing it written here,so we can look and see for ourselves! Then we know,for the Holy Spirit in us teaches us all things concerning our Jesus!( 1 John 2:27)

 

[cman77]

we cannot equate breaking an addiction and Salvation. God may be kind to the goats of this world and make their lives better because this is all they will ever have. If you look at the rich and powerful of this world, they are not Christians. It is the same principle. God has been kind to them by worldly standards because it is all they will ever have. But above all God does what he does, not for our happiness or the happiness of others, but for His own purposes and for His own glory.

 

[The Robster]

As a recovering person, I see God's work every day. It is no mystery as to whether or not God exists to me, I see Him in my life and the life of those around me everyday. My question comes from the observation that I see God helping, even saving (keeping/bringing them back to life and turning their lives COMPLETELY around, nobody knows who is truely "saved" from Hell until we either reach Heaven or Hell) the lives of former theives, prostitutes, liars, adulterers and addicts/alcoholics, including myself. While this is explained as being saved by Christ when people come to Jesus, which is true, I see it happen to people who openly denounce and reject the Bible and Jesus. Many do accept that their is a God, but admit that their idea of God does not include the Bible or Jesus. I know this is God's work. It is a part of the AA/NA programs, indeed step 2, that only God can restore us to sanity, and 3 that we turn our wills and lives over to the care of God as we understood him, meaning we as people cannot do it, only God can. As an addict, I have tried every way imaginable to turn my life around on my own, and it wasn't until I turned it over to God that I was able to do so. Same with most every other addict I know. I don't know how exactly to state my question, but why, if someone openly denounces the Bible and Jesus, would God work such miracles in these peoples lives, even though many Christians say that faith in the Bible and Jesus are necessary to have a relationship with God? If one most accept, follow, love, and worship Jesus and the Bible, why is God helping these make such dramatic improvements in their lives while they openly say that they do not believe in either? I have no interest in debating the fate of their souls and the afterlife, as I firmly believe it is not the place for any human to decide, only God's, and because I do not know what will become of them after they die, again only God does, but I do know what God has done in their lives while alive, and this is what I'm curious about. I've read that if you're not with Jesus, you're against him. This doesn't make sense to me. If this were true, then God shouldn't be helping these people as he does. And yet, I see it every day. What I'm trying to say is must someone believe in the Bible and Jesus to have a relationship with God and for God to work in their lives to such an extent? And if so, why is God doing this for them? I'm really fairly confused and stuck on this.

God the Father is so rich in mercy and grace. He's helping plenty of people who never once acknowledge what He's done for them. Trust me there are Christians who don't even acknowledge God moving in their lives. Its the way God is. He's trying to bring everyone into the kingdom and some answer the call and others never will.

 

[The Robster]

we cannot equate breaking an addiction and Salvation. God may be kind to the goats of this world and make their lives better because this is all they will ever have. If you look at the rich and powerful of this world, they are not Christians. It is the same principle. God has been kind to them by worldly standards because it is all they will ever have. But above all God does what he does, not for our happiness or the happiness of others, but for His own purposes and for His own glory.

Trust me we have many RICH and POWERFUL Christians on this planet. This idea that the rich and powerful are all godless folks is a myth. Many godless folks may control the institutions of this world at the moment, but that's because the little god right now is the devil. Its his world system we live within in. Any Christian that understands the power of his prayers and that knows how to enforce Jesus' victory at the Cross is far more powerful than the wealthiest power broher on this planet. This kind of Christian will outlast the wealthiest godless folks of the world if they want to. That's the power we have in Christ and Jesus put mortal death under our feet. Don't believe that is true? Study John 6:48-62 to see what Jesus says we have in the Lord's Supper.