Creed

[B-A-C]

What is a creed?

noun

1. 
   
   a system of Christian or other religious belief; a faith:
   "people of many creeds and cultures"
   Similar:
   faith religion church persuasion affiliation
   • (Creed)
     a formal statement of Christian beliefs, especially the Apostles' Creed or the Nicene Creed:
     "the godparents will then swear that they believe in the Creed and the Commandments"
     Similar:
     doctrine teaching ideology ethic dogma
   • a set of beliefs or aims which guide someone's actions:
     "not everyone follows a creed of acceptance and understanding"
   
   In the simplest terms, a creed is simply a statement of what you believe.
   In Christianity there are two creeds that stand out. The Nicene Creed and The Apostle's Creed.
   
   
   

   Nicene Creed - Wikipedia

   en.wikipedia.org

 

[B-A-C]

The Nicene Creed.

We believe in one God,
the Father almighty,
maker of heaven and earth,
of all things visible and invisible.

And in one Lord Jesus Christ,
the only Son of God,
begotten from the Father before all ages,
God from God,
Light from Light,
true God from true God,
begotten, not made;
of the same essence as the Father.
Through him all things were made.
For us and for our salvation
he came down from heaven;
he became incarnate by the Holy Spirit and the virgin Mary,
and was made human.
He was crucified for us under Pontius Pilate;
he suffered and was buried.
The third day he rose again, according to the Scriptures.
He ascended to heaven
and is seated at the right hand of the Father.
He will come again with glory
to judge the living and the dead.
His kingdom will never end.

And we believe in the Holy Spirit,
the Lord, the giver of life.
He proceeds from the Father and the Son,
and with the Father and the Son is worshiped and glorified.
He spoke through the prophets.
We believe in one holy catholic and apostolic church.
We affirm one baptism for the forgiveness of sins.
We look forward to the resurrection of the dead,
and to life in the world to come. Amen.

This was adopted as the Christian Statement of Faith in 325ad by the Council of Nicea.

First Council of Nicaea - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The Council of Nicea lasted about 7 years, and had as many as 300 members, and 2,000 attendees during that time.
Representing as many as 150 churches from over 35 countries.

I have high-lighted a couple of areas above. These people believe that Jesus was God. "true God from true God", and that he always existed, he was not created "begotten, not made".
The phrase "holy catholic".. church causes some to give pause, but in this case, it doesn't mean the Roman Catholic church, it simply means the "global" church. The body of Christ.

 

[B-A-C]

The Other common Creed used by churches is called the Apostle's Creed. It is very similar to the Nicene Creed.

The Apostles’ Creed​

I believe in God, the Father almighty,
creator of heaven and earth.

I believe in Jesus Christ, his only Son, our Lord,
who was conceived by the Holy Spirit
and born of the virgin Mary.
He suffered under Pontius Pilate,
was crucified, died, and was buried;
he descended to hell.
The third day he rose again from the dead.
He ascended to heaven
and is seated at the right hand of God the Father almighty.
From there he will come to judge the living and the dead.

I believe in the Holy Spirit,
the holy catholic* church,
the communion of saints,
the forgiveness of sins,
the resurrection of the body,
and the life everlasting. Amen.

*that is, the true Christian church of all times and all places

Apostles' Creed - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

One notable difference between the Apostles Creed and Nicene Creed, is that one doesn't specifically say Jesus is God.
But again, they use the phrase "holy catholic church" to mean all denominations of the true faith, not just the Roman Catholic Church.
It is believed this creed was adopted about 200 years after the Nicene Creed.

 

[B-A-C]

For the last nearly 2,000 years, or so, these have been the standard that judge Christian orthodoxy.

If a specific denomination could not agree to the Nicene Creed they were considered a Cult.
Examples would be the Jehovah's Witnesses, The Church of Latter Day Saints ( Mormons ), and Pentecostal Oneness Churches.

In many liturgical churches, these creeds are recited almost every Sunday. Evangelical churches, not so much.
But all mainstream churches do accept the Nicene Creed.

The Methodist Church, The Baptist Church, The Southern Baptists, The Foursquare Church, The Church of Christ, The Apostolic Church, The Assemblies of God, The Episcopalian Church, Anglican, Church of England, Roman Catholic, Lutheran
Wesleyan, and Apostolic churches all adhere to the Nicene Creed. ( There are other denominations as well, but I can't remember them all )

I have gone over the TalkJesus Statement of Faith many times. - Statement of Faith

It also would seem that it accepts the Nicene Creed.

There is nothing in these Creeds that attempts to cover things like OSAS, Predestination, Spiritual Gifts ( Speaking in Tongues ), Divine Healing, etc...
In my personal opinion, it would have been nice to know what the early church thought about these things.

 

[B-A-C]

The Church of Scientology does not accept the Nicene Creed, however the Seventh Day Adventist church, and Calvary Chapel do.

 

[B-A-C]

The concept of the Trinity and Deity of Jesus has been around as long as the church.

There are several early Christian writings that discuss concepts related to the Trinity before the Council of Nicea in 325 AD. Here are a few notable examples:

The Didache (circa 50-120 AD): This early Christian treatise includes a Trinitarian formula in its baptismal instructions: "baptize in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit".
Ignatius of Antioch (circa 35-108 AD): In his letters, Ignatius often refers to the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit in a way that suggests a triune understanding of God. For instance, in his letter to the Ephesians, he writes about “the Spirit who is from God” and "Jesus Christ our Lord".
Justin Martyr (circa 100-165 AD): In his writings, Justin Martyr speaks of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, and he describes the Son and the Spirit as distinct persons who are also divine.
Irenaeus of Lyons (circa 130-202 AD): In his work “Against Heresies,” Irenaeus discusses the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, emphasizing their unity and distinct roles in the economy of salvation.

These documents and letters show that early Christians were already engaging with and developing the concept of the Trinity well before the formal definitions established at the Council of Nicea.

John 10:36; do you say of Him, whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, 'You are blaspheming,' because I said, 'I am the Son of God'?
John 5:18; For this reason therefore the Jews were seeking all the more to kill Him, because He not only was breaking the Sabbath, but also was calling God His own Father, making Himself equal with God.

Jesus was in a debate with the Pharisees about working on the Sabbath, and why it didn't apply to Him in John 5. He made Himself equal with God. Why did Jesus them this?

John 5:34; "But the testimony which I receive is not from man, but I say these things so that you may be saved.

He told them this... "so that you may be saved". It seems this is a required belief for Christians.

 

[Rhema]

The Church of Scientology does not accept the Nicene Creed, ...

Scientology isn't even Christian. Never was.

Perhaps you are thinking of Christian Science?

Rhema

 

[Rhema]

... does not accept the Nicene Creed, however the Seventh Day Adventist church, and Calvary Chapel do.

The early Seventh-day Adventist leaders rejected creeds not only because they could be misused, but also because they were fallible human documents that could lead to affirm things that were contrary to Scripture and thus could even lead to infidelity or apostasy. This understanding was summarized by J. N. Loughborough (1832-1924) at the 1861 organization of the Michigan Conference. He stated: “We call the churches Babylon, not because they covenant together to obey God. . . . The first step in apostasy is to get up a creed, telling us what we shall believe. The second is to make that creed a test of fellowship. The third is to try members by that creed. The fourth is to denounce as heretics those who do not believe that creed. And, fifth, to commence persecution against such.”45 Here, Loughborough linked creeds clearly with the test of fellowship in a church organization and the persecution of those who were opposed to creeds. In the minds of many founders of the Seventh-day Adventist Church, creeds, church organization, and ecclesiastical hierarchy were linked with the system of Babylon and thus needed to be opposed, rather than approved.​

https://encyclopedia.adventist.org/article?id=8FRF

 

[Rhema]

In many liturgical churches, these creeds are recited almost every Sunday.

Yes, in quite a number of our local Evangelical Lutheran Church in America congregations, all recited by pastors who are lesbian.

(Just sayin')

 

[Rhema]

The concept of the Trinity and Deity of Jesus has been around as long as the church.

There are several early Christian writings that discuss concepts related to the Trinity before the Council of Nicea in 325 AD. Here are a few notable examples:

Yeah... as if I'll be tricked into posting about the Trinity.

 

[B-A-C]

Scientology isn't even Christian. Never was.

I would say the same for Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses, and Oneness Churches. But you are right, as they don't believe in a Supreme being God per se.

Yes, in quite a number of our local Evangelical Lutheran Church in America congregations, all recited by pastors who are lesbian.

Regrettable but true. Anglicans/Episopalians, and United Methodists as well. However there are splits in some of these churches, not all members agree with these "acceptances".
I myself do not belong to any of those denominations. Many years ago, I dated the piano player at a ELCA church. Once we had the "beliefs" talk, our relationship didn't last long after that.

Perhaps you are thinking of Christian Science?

They could definitely be included in that group.

The early Seventh-day Adventist leaders rejected creeds not only because they could be misused,

so they say, and yet they do have a creed, whether they call it that or not.

Official Beliefs of the Seventh-day Adventist Church

What We Believe Seventh-day Adventists accept the Bible as their only creed and hold certain fundamental beliefs to be the teaching of the Holy Scriptures. These beliefs, as set forth below, constitute the church's understanding and expression of the teaching of Scripture.

spucadventist.org

The closest church to my house is an SDA church. I am not a member there, and I don't normally attend there, but I have attended a service or two there.
The back-story here is that I invited my neighbors across the street to my church, they said they would go, if I attended their church once. So I did. But true to their word, they attended mine, and as of last Sunday,
they have been routinely going to my church for about 6 months. Are they still going to the other church? I don't know, I haven't asked. But they invited to play pickleball with them this weekend. Perhaps I will ask.
I was told by the pastor there, that there is nothing in the Nicene creed that they disagree with. Indeed, after reading the beliefs posted above, I tend to agree.

 

[B-A-C]

Yeah... as if I'll be tricked into posting about the Trinity.

This thread wasn't really about denominational differences for the most part. It was about common ground that the mainstream denominations have.
We can all argue about the major things that separate denominations... that's pretty easy to do. Charismatic Spiritual gifts, Calvinism, predestination and OSAS.
Works vs grace, annihilation of the unsaved, pre-trib vs post-trib, ... etc... all these things have been debated numerous times here on TalkJesus, and I suspect they will continue to be.

But in my mind, we have more to hold us together, than we do to separate us.

 

[Rhema]

I would say the same for Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses, and Oneness Churches. But you are right, as they don't believe in a Supreme being God per se.

But unlike Mormons, JWs, and Oneness, Scientology has never proclaimed anything about Christ or based any of their beliefs upon Christ.

so they say, and yet they do have a creed, whether they call it that or not.

Thank you for the link. I was trying to find any substantive support that SDA would endorse the Nicene Creed since you had said this:

... does not accept the Nicene Creed, however the Seventh Day Adventist church, and Calvary Chapel do.

Might you have a source directly stating that the SDA accepts the Nicene Creed? (I'm not sure a non-rejection counts as an acceptance.)

I note they now do express a belief in the Trinity, but I'm not sure that was always the case. (Not that I'm an expert in Sabbatarian denominations.)

so they say, and yet they do have a creed, whether they call it that or not.

I'm not sure I can agree (and would likely argue with your dictionary ). A creed was developed to be recited during a church service as a repetitive learning tool. I have never once heard of a church that recited their statement of faith during a service.

But in my mind, we have more to hold us together, than we do to separate us.

I assume by "we" you mean the various Catholics faiths and their illegitimate(?) Protestant offspring, rather than you and I.

Rhema
BTW, a number of ELCA churches recite the Athanasius Creed on occasion, and of course one shouldn't forget the Chalcedonian Creed. One would think that none of these would be necessary if Scripture was so "plainly understood."

 

[B-A-C]

never proclaimed anything about Christ or based any of their beliefs upon Christ.

"a" Christ... a false one.

Might you have a source directly stating that the SDA accepts the Nicene Creed? (I'm not sure a non-rejection counts as an acceptance.)

I do not have an official one.

I'm not sure I can agree (and would likely argue with your dictionary

It's not "my" dictionary. But I gfot the same results from the first six google links. If you have another definition and source, you are certainly welcome to share.

I assume by "we" you mean the various Catholics faiths and their illegitimate(?) Protestant offspring, rather than you and I.

You seem bound and determined to find some divisions between the denominations. I assure you there are many. However, the Nicene creed isn't one of the differences between most of them.
I am happy to recant my statement of the SDA since I don't have an authentic source.

 

[Rhema]

You seem bound and determined to find some divisions between the denominations. I assure you there are many.

?

The three main branches of Christianity are divided along the two most fundamental doctrines, that of Soteriology and Ecclesiastical Authority.

I don't need to "find" nuthin. Doctrinal divisions have been overtly present since Paul and James.

Rhema

 

[Rhema]

If you have another definition and source, you are certainly welcome to share.

I already did.

A creed was intended to be recited during a church service. A Statement of Faith was not.

Now if you know of a church (any church) that reads their Statement of Faith as part of their service, please let me know.

I like visiting.

Rhema

 

[Rhema]

I typically don't post YouTube videos, and don't support this one 100%,
but he does have a point that the Nicene Creed isn't in the Bible.
Face it, most of the assertions in the Nicene Creed are merely viewpoints (i.e. beliefs) of the prevailing Bishops at the time.
(Meaning they're just made up.)

 

[Br. Bear]

Greetings Brother,

But in my mind, we have more to hold us together, than we do to separate us.

O yes.
That we might rejoice more in that which is good that we have received...
and yet, sadly, many can't refrain from disputing those things that divide, and of them, all too many falling out with/against each other over worldly matters, like politics.
So very sad.

The patience and longsuffering of God.

Let us (all) determine to know Christ and Him crucified and be joined together in thanksgiving and praise.
Let God sort out the rest.

The rest....
a play on words?

We are to enter in....

and remain.

We love Him because He first loved us.


Bless you and yours ....><>

 

[Rhema]

@Br. Bear

There's not much of a discussion if everyone is in agreement.

and yet, sadly, many can't refrain from disputing those things that divide,

Yet I don't think that clarification is dispute.

falling out with/against each other over worldly matters, like politics.

Not sure how to reply here, given that it would seem both our countries have slipped off the edge of Socialism into an odd form of Communism. (Actually, more like Bread and Circuses.)

You are in my prayers,
Rhema

 

[Br. Bear]

@Rhema

There's not much of a discussion if everyone is in agreement

Agreed