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Death Penalty

Is the Death Penalty Right or Wrong?

  • Right

    Votes: 3 27.3%
  • Wrong

    Votes: 5 45.5%
  • Exceptional in Some Cases

    Votes: 2 18.2%
  • Not Sure / Undecided

    Votes: 1 9.1%

  • Total voters
    11

Chad

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What do you all think of capital punishment? Do you think it's right, wrong or exceptional in some cases?

I personally think it all depends on what the government (state) decides on as stated in Romans.

Romans 13:1-4
"Let every person be in subjection to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those which exist are established by God. 2 Therefore he who resists authority has opposed the ordinance of God; and they who have opposed will receive condemnation upon themselves. 3 For rulers are not a cause of fear for good behavior, but for evil. Do you want to have no fear of authority? Do what is good, and you will have praise from the same; 4 for it is a minister of God to you for good. But if you do what is evil, be afraid; for it does not bear the sword for nothing; for it is a minister of God, an avenger who brings wrath upon the one who practices evil."

Here's a good short article to read on this as well: What does the New Testament say about capital punishment?
 
I'm viewing the question as a personal one more in tune with Jesus and his dealing with the pharisees in John 8:3-11 and not Romans 13:1-4 which allows by the authority of God for the state to exact punishment for laws established, for which we as Christians should abide by. That is why I answered "Exceptional in Some Cases". (Maybe should have been Except instead of Exceptional brother Chad :) I work in the Department of Corrections for a state that does have the death penalty, and can see the affect it has on people even when they are minimally involved with the execution.

That is why I am most amazed at the compassion and hope that believers (and more amazed when non-believers at times) have when in court they are able to forgive the individual that has taken a loved one from them, be it by accident or on purpose by the perpetrator of the crime.

Taking the life of someone even for the warrior in time of war is no easy thing, and carries a burden that is rarely lifted from them. That is why doing executions done using firing squads (No longer done in the USA I believe.), there was one bullet that was a blank. This way the person could find refuge in the possibility that there's was the blank bullet (conscience round is what I believe some called it). Even those who agree with the death penalty can and do have a hard time carrying it out.

Heinous nature of the crime, no remorse, could just as easily have one agreeing with the state to execute the individual.

I just pray to never having to be in a position to decide either way.
 
This is a topic I am passionate about. I agree that we are to be subject to the governing authorities. However there is one exception. When obedience to the civil authority would require disobedience to God's Word. (See Ex.1:17;Dan. 3:16-18;6:7,10,Acts4:19).
In those verses, we can see that the midwives were told to kill the male babies, and in Daniel, to worship idols . In Acts, Peter and John were not to evangelize about Jesus.
Then we can go to the OT and see laws concerning the death penalty in Deut. 21:21,22; or Num. 35:16-34 for a couple of examples.
For me personally, I can't be a part of condoning a death penalty. I believe in turning the other cheek. I believe in allowing The Lord to repay . I believe The Lord can change even the most wicked of hearts.
Tough subject.
 
I don't support the death penalty anymore. Not because I find it wrong, but because we're basically letting the person who did something very bad get off easily. Are they going to feel remorse when they're dead? I don't think so. Its better if we let them live with what they did. Or we could bring back torture devices because that will make them feel remorse if you ask me.
 
As Christians I believe there should be no death penalty so that sinners may be given an opportunity to repent and be saved. Having no death penalty, will also guarantee that no one is killed for crimes they did not commit. Studies show that 4% of all death row inmates are innocent. Whether it's 1% or 0.01%, there will always be some people killed who are innocent because you can't have a perfect system.

There are a number of retired chief prosecutors who are against the death penalty as they know from first hand experience that it is a waste of money and doesn't act as a deterrent. It is more expensive for a state to have a death penalty, because of all the legal processes required, and those on death row spend extensive time in jail anyway which all adds to the cost. In Texas a death penalty case costs $2.3 million, which is 3 times the cost of keeping someone in maximum security for 40 years. If you want to save money, lower taxes etc, then abolish the death penalty, and if more prisons need to be built, then that is more jobs for the economy.

I don't believe a government can truly be Christian and yet uphold the death penalty. The Christian is a sheep. The Christian does not believe in eye for an eye, and does not repay evil with evil, nor conquer sin by violence. That is Judaism, Islam, etc. A country which says "if you kill you will be killed" as a punishment, especially for "minor" offenses such as drugs (eg Singapore) is not a Christian example.

Many scholars believe that the early Christians were pacifist, and more violent aspects were incorporated when Christianity became the state religion of the Roman Empire. Up until that time, innocent Christians were the ones being killed by violence by the state. Early Christians also refused combat military service. Early church scholars such as Tertullian, Origen, Clement of Alexandria, were opposed to opposing sin by forms of violence.

Scientists are trying to find a way to kill people humanely with drugs, but there is nothing humane about killing. Lethal injection is not more humane than a bullet to the head or a noose.

 
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I am for the death penalty for several reasons. One reason is capital punishment has always exsisted even in the bible. Another reason if you look into crime rates and prison populations of different countries and compare them you will find crime is much lower where punishments are more harsh. If we dont have laws that will cost a criminal crime will spread and grow like wildfire. In america we have exceptinal crime rates and we have weak punishments compared to other places. Jesus was crucified and was innocent are we better than the Lord. Oh yeah and He was innocent. Also not everyone will feel remorse for their actions. But the main reason is Gods arm is not shortened so He cant save. I got saved while locked up and also take for imstamce carla faye tucker. She killed her own kids with a pick axe but I saw videos of her while on death row confessing and prasing God saying that she was saved. Them high walls and razor wire dont keep God out. If anything we need more prison ministers. I have heard many prison ministers stories that brought me to tears. It is a real ministry that needs more people. I have spent many years of my life behind bars and I know first hand of how the system works and I am for the death penalty. Just ask yourself this, would you want someone who killed her own kids around your kids or your neighbors kids? Would you be at ease?
 
I am so glad the UK got rid of the death penalty in the 60s. No civilised country should kills its citizen however nasty they are. Having said that life in prison should mean life in prison for the worst of crimes.
 
Romans 13:1-4
"Let every person be in subjection to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those which exist are established by God. 2 Therefore he who resists authority has opposed the ordinance of God; and they who have opposed will receive condemnation upon themselves. 3 For rulers are not a cause of fear for good behavior, but for evil. Do you want to have no fear of authority? Do what is good, and you will have praise from the same; 4 for it is a minister of God to you for good. But if you do what is evil, be afraid; for it does not bear the sword for nothing; for it is a minister of God, an avenger who brings wrath upon the one who practices evil."

This is about Godly authority versus ungodly authority; righteous government versus unrighteous government.

In Romans 13:1-4 KJV we read: "Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God. Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation. For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same: For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil."

These words have been widely interpreted to simply mean all believers should obey the government because government has been ordained of God. This particular view is a gross distortion of the truth. In this context, I've found that when a superficial reading of a certain text somehow doesn't seem logical, it's useful to look at the actions of the writer to see if his life and actions are consistent with your interpretation of his teaching. In short, when Paul writes that "they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation," but the book of Acts shows Paul repeatedly doing just that, there must be something wrong with our understanding of the text. And that's precisely what we see throughout the New Testament.

It is noteworthy that modern copyrighted “versions” of The Holy Bible have changed the phrase “higher powers” to merely “governing authorities,” thereby obscuring the necessary distinction between Godly authority and ungodly authority, between God’s kingdom and Satan’s kingdom.

When Paul writes in the opening statement of Romans chapter 13, "Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers," the obvious question is who or what are the higher powers? This phrase would have to apply to any higher powers, be they spiritual or earthly. Obviously, in the spiritual realm, there are good and bad powers. On one side we have the Lord and his great angelic host. In the other group, we find Lucifer and "the angels which kept not their first estate" (Jude 1:6). This fallen host most certainly qualifies as a "higher power," for Satan is referred to as the "prince of the power of the air" (Ephesians 2:2). Later in that same book, Paul tells us "We wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places" (Ephesians 6:12).

Common sense tells you that Paul is not telling us to be "subject to" the Satanic higher powers in the spiritual realm, so why do we assume he is telling us to be subject to evil earthly powers? How could it be scriptural for us to cooperate with the earthly agency of that spiritual wickedness? The next verse says "Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation." If we resist the evil in the spiritual realm, it's clear we don't receive damnation as a result! How then, could this verse mean if we resist evil in the earthly realm we receive damnation? In other words, in cases where the evil is vested in government, the idea that we are no longer to resist this evil is ludicrous.

Paul is telling us we must not resist the righteous power of God - whether it is manifested in the heavenlies or in various earthly sectors - including righteous government.

When Pilate and Herod give Jesus an order to speak, Christ resists their orders and remains silent (Matthew 27:13, Luke 23:7). When Paul has been beaten illegally by evil men within the Roman government, he refuses their command to come out of the jail and defiantly says "...let them come themselves and fetch us out." (Acts 16:37). That's not resisting?

When Peter is assisted in a jail-break by an angel, how is that obeying the government? (Acts 12:7). Did the Apostle "receive damnation" because he didn't ask the evil rulers 'Can I go now?' The writer of Hebrews tells his readers "ye have not yet resisted unto blood, striving against sin" (Hebrews 12:4). That firmly implies the Christians were appropriately resisting the evil, but every instance of that resistance ending in bloodshed occurs at the hands of the authorities. Whom were they resisting? The Evil Authority.

When Stephen was murdered, it was the religious leadership of the Jews that "set up false witnesses" to justify their unlawful crime. They even brought him before the high priest who was in agreement with the heinous killing of the young Christian (Acts 6:13, 7:1, 15). When criminal elements have a position of control and authority within the government, believers have an obligation to resist them--not to twist the scriptures into justification for compliance with an ungodly government. In Damascus, the Jews that had authority under the governmental edict establishing their position (John 11:48) sought to murder Saul (Acts 9:23). Saul escaped over the wall as he left Damascus. That sounds like resistance to me.

[ -- with thanks to Brother James.]

I personally think [the issue of capital punishment] depends on what the government (state) decides on as stated in Romans.

Rather, it depends on which authority you have chosen to submit to. Are we to obey the state, or are we to obey God?

Godly government's purpose is to reward good and punish evil, period. When it fails in meeting that obligation, the born again believer has no duty to it.

Satan is a merchandiser (Ezekiel 28:16), a trafficker (Ezekiel 28:18). Satan offered all the kingdoms of the world to Jesus in the wilderness:

“Again, the devil taketh [Jesus] up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them; And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me” (Matthew 4:8, 9).

The merchants, the kings of the earth, sell souls of men (Revelation 18:11-13). They also sell the persons of men (Ezekiel 27:8); person = Latin persona = status; reputation; an actor’s mask. These rich men are deceitful; they buy the poor and needy and they use false balances, balances of deceit (Amos 8:4-6; Micah 6:10-12; Hosea 12:7). They love to oppress (Amos 2:6). Merchants and sellers violate the sabbath (Nehemiah 13:15-20). The deeds of the rich are wicked (Micah 2:1-9).

Anyone who engages in commerce (profiteering; pursuit of mammon) comes under Caesar's jurisdiction (“Caesar” = ungodly government). The merchants, the rich men of the earth, the great men of the earth, are identified with the ungodly authority:

“The kings set themselves, and the rulers take counsel against the Lord and his anointed, saying, Let us break their bands asunder, and cast away their cords from us” (Psalm 2:2, 3).

“Why did the heathen rage, and the people imagine vain things? The kings of the earth stood up, and the rulers were gathered together against the Lord, and against his Christ.... Lord, behold their threatenings...” (Acts 4:25, 26, 29).

“Israel hath cast off the thing that is good: the enemy shall pursue him. They have set up kings, but not by me: they have made princes, and I knew it not: of their silver and their gold have they made them idols, that they may be cut off” (Hosea 8:3, 4).

This is where many stumble with the reality that there is a counterfeit “authority” seeking our obeisance! Satan said, “I will be like the most High” (Isaiah 14:14).

It is Satan’s “higher power” which is behind the merchants, the rich men of the earth, the present temporal “governing authorities.”

Satan is “the god of this world” (II Corinthians 4:4), “this present evil world” (Galatians 1:4); there is no Godly ordination there.

We have a choice as to which purported authority we submit to and therefore “serve.” God’s authority is above all the “government institutions” of men.

Why does God “allow” ungodly “governments?” What is the purpose of man's law? It is God's rod of correction. God uses man's law to chasten His people. God uses heathens to chasten His people.

We are to place ourselves under God’s jurisdiction, living in God’s kingdom. And we're not going to be perfect, we may fall and do wrong, but we are to check everything that we're doing. And if we do something that's against God's Word, we repent immediately to renew our mind. That's how we renew our mind, by repenting to the King and saying, "I'm sorry. I did not want to do that. It's a habit, it's the way that I learned in the world. Help break me of that." And He does help us if our heart is truly after Him. And if you don't repent, he has the natural man right there as a rod of correction for you, and that's what man's codes, rules and regulations are all about.

If we be without chastisement, we would not be his sons. But he loves us, so God uses a rod of correction to wake the sleeping disciple and get him back on course.

Proverbs 22:15, "Foolishness is bound in the heart of a child; but the rod of correction shall drive it far from him."

Proverbs 23:13, "Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die."

We've been talking about the idolatry of man's law, but now we'll talk about the purpose of it. As we know, everything the Lord allows to exist is for His purposes. Why does man's law exist? Why do people look to it for truth? It's simply because they've turned their backs on the Lord and His Law.

In the plan of God, the humanist has always been God's rod to wake the sleeping disciple and get him back on course. If man is the center of 'the world,' and he created all these legal personalities, then the police power is God's rod of correction to get you out of the world, to make things a hotbed of coals to where it is uncomfortable for you to stay there. So, if you're going to come out of the world, then you shed, what is called, all those legal personalities that the world has placed upon you, and you do not answer to them anymore, because your mind has been renewed in the mind of Christ (Ephesians 4:23, Colossians 3:10).

An officer does need a warrant in law to do what he is doing. However, if you're in the wrong place, doing the wrong thing, and partaking of the unclean things, then that man (who you say is ungodly, doing ungodly things against you) is actually God's rod of correction to drive you back to where you should be. If you're not chastened by our Father, then you're a *******, meaning you're a son of the world, and you will not share the privileges of God's children.

Hebrews 12:8, "But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons."

Job 5:17, "Behold, happy is the man whom God correcteth: therefore despise not thou the chastening of the Almighty:"

Again, what is the purpose of man's law? It is God's rod of correction. God uses man's law to chasten His people. God uses heathens to chasten His people.

Psalms 125:3, "For the rod of the wicked shall not rest upon the lot of the righteous; lest the righteous put forth their hands unto iniquity."

Psalms 106:39-48, "Thus were they defiled with their own works, and went a ******* with their own inventions. Therefore was the wrath of the LORD kindled against his people, insomuch that he abhorred his own inheritance. And he gave them into the hand of the heathen; and they that hated them ruled over them. Their enemies also oppressed them, and they were brought into subjection under their hand. Many times did he deliver them; but they provoked him with their counsel, and were brought low for their iniquity. Nevertheless he regarded their affliction, when he heard their cry: And he remembered for them his covenant, and repented according to the multitude of his mercies. He made them also to be pitied of all those that carried them captives. Save us, O LORD our God, and gather us from among the heathen, to give thanks unto thy holy name, and to triumph in thy praise. Blessed be the LORD God of Israel from everlasting to everlasting: and let all the people say, Amen. Praise ye the LORD."

Ezekiel 31:11, "I have therefore delivered him into the hand of the mighty one of the heathen; he shall surely deal with him: I have driven him out for his wickedness."

Ezekiel 39:27-28, "When I have brought them again from the people, and gathered them out of their enemies' lands, and am sanctified in them in the sight of many nations; Then shall they know that I am the LORD their God, which caused them to be led into captivity among the heathen..."

So, even though you may be righteous and you're following His ways, as soon as you put your hands into iniquity, "the rod of the wicked" (that's His rod) will be there to drive you back to Him.

2 Samuel 7:14, "I will be to him a father, and he shall be to me a son. And when he happens to transgress, then will I will chasten him with the rod of men, and with the stripes of the sons of men:"

Even though we're His son, if we walk away from His Law, He will use "the rod of men" to chasten us and drive us back to Him. Gentile and Pagan armies may be God's armies. For example, the Chaldeans who destroyed Zion are called "His army" (Joel 2:11); the Assyrians are called "the rod of mine anger" (Isaiah 10:5); and the Medes under Cyrus are termed God's "sanctified ones" and "mighty ones" for His anger (Isaiah 13:3, 17). Likewise, Jacob (i.e. the nation of Israel) is the Lord's "battle ax" and "weapons of war" that He uses to chastise other nations (Jeremiah 51:20).

Proverbs 22:15, "Foolishness is bound in the heart of a child; but the rod of correction shall drive it far from him."

It is foolish to partake of the ways of the world, and "the rod of correction" will drive that from us. What's interesting is that scripture shows us how God will use the ungodly as a rod of correction, but the natural man doesn't realize that they're there for His purpose. Isaiah 10:5-15 shows that even though God will use the king of Assyria to drive His people back to Him, the king doesn't know it. He boasts about how powerful he is and attributes everything to himself, but he's actually God's rod of correction, just like all governments are.

What is the purpose of God's rod of correction?

Jeremiah 5:3, "O LORD, are not thine eyes upon the truth? thou hast stricken them, but they have not grieved; thou hast consumed them, but they have refused to receive correction: they have made their faces harder than a rock; they have refused to return."

So, we see His rod of correction is to return us to Him. And we also see from this passage that there are many who will not be driven back to Him by it. But don't despise His chastening.

Proverbs 3:11-12, "My son, despise not the chastening of the LORD; neither be weary of his correction: For whom the LORD loveth he correcteth; even as a father the son in whom he delighteth."

It is important to understand that the purpose of God allowing "Caesar" (i.e. ungodly government) to be in power is to test and prove His children, to see if they will keep the Laws of God or the laws of the heathen (Judges 2:21; 3:4).
 
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Greetings in the Lord Jesus;
Not a one of us gave the breath of life to anyone; so why do we think it is ok to take that breath away?
He, who is without sin, let Him cast the first stone.
I was dead; and God had mercy on me. Are we not to follow the examples in which He walked out before us.
God is quite able to snuff the breath from a person, just a quick as He gave it to them.
I believe man oversteps their authority in this.
Vengeance belongs to the Lord; He will repay.

When man takes another man's life; have we not become just a guilty as they.
But, we can justify ourselves; they were the bad guy.
Not according to the Word of God; He is the only one that can justify what a man does.
And that justification is according to His Will; not that of our own.
One being obedient to His commands; not man.
How many more must die at the hands of self righteous sinners?
All praise, honor, and glory be to God. Amen.
 
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