Flesh vs Satan

[Turbopun]

I debated about putting this in the Bible Study section, but I got real personal so I decided to put it here. Thank you for your help TJ people


Hello,

Something that has really been on my heart/mind for sometime now are these questions:

1) How can we tell if we have tempted ourselves to sin, been tempted by another person or tempted by Satan ?

I find scripture that supports that we tempt ourselves by the lust of the flesh in Romans. Then I find scriptures that Satan prowls around to seek, kill and destroy as well as Paul writing that we do not fight against flesh and blood but against dark spiritual forces.

2) Would Man have sinned if Satan did not first tempt Eve?

I know man is responsible regardless of who tempted who, but I think it is intriguing because if Satan and his demons are at work (as the bible makes clear), then why are there two camps of thought so stronlgy opposed to each other?

You have the Charismatic system of thought on one side regarding the origination of common sin and you have the Traditional system of thought on the origination of common sin. Common sin being the daily battle for holiness.

The Charismatic camp seems to want to target Satan as the source for our problems while the Traditional camp says its the old Adamic flesh nature.

3) Well, which is it? Is it both? Is it somewhere in between? Is one really right?

I grew up in what you would call a Traditional system of thought regarding Satan and his demons. You just didn't really talk about it, but if you did it was in fairly vague terms as to not sound crazy. It's really all I've known. To be honest I have a problem with both because I think the Bible preaches that Satan is out there. His demons are out there. They want to see us worship ourselves or Satan. BUT, I also believe we have an old sin nature that entices itself to evil works.


My motive for writing this is in part to my battle. I for about 15 years have battled with depression. I have lacked drive to move forward and life since late elementary school. I have had this intense fear in my chest since elementary school but didn't really pay attention to it until recently when I determined that it wasn't probably normal. This fear in my chest is what I can only describe as paralyzing. It is the source to many many things. I have been addicted to video games, sex and food since elementary school as well. I have done many things I am not comfortable sharing here, but can assure the reader that they are not normal "sin" behaviors. I for a few weeks now lay in my bed most nights grabbing my hair, curling up and having mini 1-3 second convulsions as for the lack of a better phrase can say I am truly losing my mind to where I can not form conscious thoughts.

Needless to say. The normal "just seek Jesus" answers have failed me since becoming a true believer in August of 2004. They just don't. Is that my Adamic nature? Is that Satan? I am not sure.

I have been reading up on Deliverance ministries for casting out demons, but am hesitant for several reasons.

I know that turning to Jesus is the answer. I want to so badly and for so long. I have had brief stints of doing so, but never last for more than a few weeks and it is udder agony to stay focused on Him. This has been going on for 6 years now. I have got to be missing something.

 

[Boanerges]

Does it really matter what the source of the temptation? The answer is still the same- Jesus.
Our soul, it's good as well as it's bad are to be consigned daily to death.
It was the tree of the knowledge of good and evil ;not just evil but any choices made independent of the leading of God is a work of the flesh. But sadly the flesh genuinely loves to be religious so that it can feel good about itself.
When we come to the place where we realize that there is no work this old man can do that is acceptable to a Holy God; when we choose to die to self and be led of the Holy Spirit the devil will have no place in us and the flesh no dominion.
It is no wonder that Jesus was crucified at Golgotha (the place of the skull) for we must die to our old way of thinking and be renewed in our minds.
No flesh (bodily or soulish) no place for lust.
Gal 5:16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.

 

[Turbopun]

Does it really matter what the source of the temptation?

Actually, yes it does. The reason why I am asking is because there are two systems of thought on the matter. I see verses that support "the flesh" and verses that support "dark spiritual forces". If by chance one is truly possessed OR influenced by demons... what does one do?

There are people in the Traditional camp of thought that say man is responsible for all actions and self inflict sin upon himself. There is another camp of thought that states Satan is the one that inflicts sin upon man.

Given those two popular camps of thought, I at this time do not believe that either one is particularly correct in and of itself. If all sin that man commits is self-inflicted, than what purpose does Satan have? If all sin is demoniacally inflicted, then why does Paul talk about a thorn in his flesh as well as preach about walk according to the Spirit as to not give way to the desires of the flesh? Then on the other side you have Satan trying to steal, kill and destroy? The reason I say it matters is if in some cases of people, a demon is influencing OR possessing a person, then is there need for casting out demons as was practiced in the ministry of Jesus as well as the starting of the church?



*Edited for emphasis*

 

[Boanerges]

That my friend must be approached differently.

First- I would say that one does not have to be possessed of a devil to be tempted of the devil. Jesus was walking as a man (though God) and the devil tried to tempt His flesh (Mat 4:1).


Second- Not every thought that comes your way is yours. You may not be able to keep a bird from landing on your head but you sure can keep it from building a nest there. When you receive a thought that does not line up with the Word of God then refuse and reject it.
2Co 10:3 For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war after the flesh:
2Co 10:4 (For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds
2Co 10:5 Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;

Third- if one does have a demonic power then Jesus has indeed given us the power to cast out demons in His name.
This should be approached prayerfully. On must search their heart before the Lord asking to reveal any areas (doorways) that one needs to repent of. This is necessary because a heart not filled by the Holy Spirit is an invitation to demonic infestation 7 times worse than before.
If one is sure that the Lord is leading them to cast out a demon and if the heart is prepared then a simple "come out in Jesus Name" will do. If such a spirit tries to test your faith a simple "I cast you out in Jesus Name, all heaven's authority is behind that Name so if you have any issues talk to the Father about them".

All that being said typically one must be willing to submit their heart to the leading of the Holy Spirit, resist the thoughts and/or doubts Satan tries to get them to believe and he will flee. There is rarely a need for casting out demons when the flesh is dealt with by submitting the heart to the Holy Spirit.

 

[Boanerges]

Rereading your post I am unsure if this is a personal question or a theological one.
My opinion:
do not join either camp but be led of the Spirit. His wisdom is always best and a cut and paste theology will never answer all of life's issues.

 

[Turbopun]

Rereading your post I am unsure if this is a personal question or a theological one.
My opinion:
do not join either camp but be led of the Spirit. His wisdom is always best and a cut and paste theology will never answer all of life's issues.

To be honest, it's a personal issue that I am trying to see what God is saying through His Word (theology).

 

[Boanerges]

I understand my friend. Pray and seek God, study His Word, He will lead you.

 

[HisFollower]

for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.
Romans 14:23
Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.
James 4:17
sin is the transgression of the law.
1 John 3:4
All unrighteousness is sin
1 John 5:17
But every man is tempted (to sin), when he is drawn away (attracted) of his own lust, and enticed (flattered). Then when lust hath conceived (imagined or invented the idea), it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.
James 1:14-15

It is by the knowledge of God we attain to know what is right and wrong according to God, and not according to man; and this knowledge can only be obtained by the Word of God, which is the will of God.
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[Boanerges]

James 3:15 This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish.

1 Earthly- the world

2 Sensual- flesh

3 devish- demonic

One should note that the demonic is in 3rd place behind the world, it's temptations and the flesh with it's ungodly desires.
Satan generally is limited to tempting man's flesh (through the eye gate, ear gate, taste, touch, smell) but that flesh needs little motivation to sin and will gladly do so on it's own.
Jas 3:17 But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy.

It is only when man's mind is renewed, when his thoughts line up with the Word through the revelation of the Holy Spirit that he may walk in truth. This is demonstrated by the fruit that is produced in a life. If we walk in the Spirit, totally submitted to and moving only in the power and leading of we shall produce the fruit of the spirit.

Anything else is flesh. Bad and ugly or good and pretty all a man can truly produce without complete surrender to the Holy Spirit is flesh for what is born of the flesh is always flesh.
Our best efforts at holiness are but religious flesh as the flesh loves to feel good about it's decaying self.

It is truly necessary for a believer to see the depths of the depravity of his old man before he will be willing to lay self down and walk in the newness of life.
Total and complete dependence on God is the beginning of freedom.
Finding oneself in Christ. Discovering that Christ has become that ones righteousness, sanctification. Reclaiming what was lost in the garden means restoring God to godhood by dethroning the human will.
If one learns to walk in the truth of the recreated spirit that is within him the devils will tremble at his very footsteps.
One who has found freedom to become who he was created to be by dying to the old and living in the new- Satan will find no place in him.