Gay Or Homosexual

[Squeakybro]

HOMOSEXUAL

1 Cor 5:9-13
9 I wrote to you in my epistle not to keep company with sexually immoral people.
10 Yet I certainly did not mean with the sexually immoral people of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world.
11 But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortioner-- not even to eat with such a person.
12 For what have I to do with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside?
13 But those who are outside God judges. Therefore "put away from yourselves the evil person."
James 1:13-16
13 Let no one say when he is tempted, "I am tempted by God"; for God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does He Himself tempt anyone.
14 But each one is tempted when he is drawn away by his own desires and enticed.
15 Then, when desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, brings forth death.
16 Do not be deceived, my beloved brethren.
Gal 5:17
17 For the flesh lusts against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; and these are contrary to one another, so that you do not do the things that you wish.
Gal 5:19
19 Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness,
Gal 5:24
24 And those who are Christ's have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.
1 Pet 2:19
19 For this is commendable, if because of conscience toward God one endures grief, suffering wrongfully.
1 Pet 2:21-22
21 For to this you were called, because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that you should follow His steps:
22 "Who committed no sin, nor was deceit found in His mouth";
James 4:5
5 Or do you think that the Scripture says in vain, "The Spirit who dwells in us yearns jealously"?
James 4:7-8
7 Therefore submit to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you.
8 Draw near to God and He will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners; and purify your hearts, you double-minded.
1 Cor 6:9-11
9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites,
10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God.
11 And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.
1 Tim 1:8-10
8 But we know that the law is good if one uses it lawfully,
9 knowing this: that the law is not made for a righteous person, but for the lawless and insubordinate, for the ungodly and for sinners, for the unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
10 for fornicators, for sodomites, for kidnappers, for liars, for perjurers, and if there is any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine,
Luke 17:28-30
28 "Likewise as it was also in the days of Lot: They ate, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they built;
29 "but on the day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven and destroyed them all.
30 "Even so will it be in the day when the Son of Man is revealed.
Titus 1:10-11
10 For there are many insubordinate, both idle talkers and deceivers, especially those of the circumcision,
11 whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole households, teaching things which they ought not, for the sake of dishonest gain.
2 Pet 2:3
3 By covetousness they will exploit you with deceptive words; for a long time their judgment has not been idle, and their destruction does not slumber.
[Jde 1:7-8
[7] as Sodom and Gomorrah, and the cities around them in a similar manner to these, having given themselves over to sexual immorality and gone after strange flesh, are set forth as an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.
[8] Likewise also these dreamers defile the flesh, reject authority, and speak evil of dignitaries.
Rev 22:18-19
18 For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book;
19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.
(NKJ)

xxxxThis is a revelation I received from the Holy Spirit. Like it or not this is what the bible says. You can look up every verse. Whether your a homosexual or not if you approve of it you could condemn yourself. Homosexuality is a sin.

[Eph 5:11–13
[11] And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather expose [them].
[12] For it is shameful even to speak of those things which are done by them in secret.
[13] But all things that are exposed are made manifest by the light, for whatever makes manifest is light.
Rom 14:22
22 Do you have faith? Have it to yourself before God. Happy is he who does not condemn himself in what he approves.
(NKJ)

James 2:26
26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
(NKJ)


2 Pet 3:9-13
9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night, in which the heavens will pass away with a great noise, and the elements will melt with fervent heat; both the earth and the works that are in it will be burned up.
11 Therefore, since all these things will be dissolved, what manner of persons ought you to be in holy conduct and godliness,
12 looking for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be dissolved, being on fire, and the elements will melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to His promise, look for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells.
(NKJ)

Rom 1:22-32
22 Professing to be wise, they became fools,
23 and changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like corruptible man-- and birds and four-footed animals and creeping things.
24 Therefore God also gave them up to uncleanness, in the lusts of their hearts, to dishonor their bodies among themselves,
25 who exchanged the truth of God for the lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen.
26 For this reason God gave them up to vile passions. For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature.
27 Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due.
28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a debased mind, to do those things which are not fitting;
29 being filled with all unrighteousness, sexual immorality, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, evil-mindedness; they are whisperers,
30 backbiters, haters of God, violent, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
31 undiscerning, untrustworthy, unloving, unforgiving, unmerciful;
32 who, knowing the righteous judgment of God, that those who practice such things are worthy of death, not only do the same but also approve of those who practice them.
(NKJ)


2 Pet 2:12-22
12 But these, like natural brute beasts made to be caught and destroyed, speak evil of the things they do not understand, and will utterly perish in their own corruption,
13 and will receive the wages of unrighteousness, as those who count it pleasure to carouse in the daytime. They are spots and blemishes, carousing in their own deceptions while they feast with you,
14 having eyes full of adultery and that cannot cease from sin, beguiling unstable souls. They have a heart trained in covetous practices, and are accursed children.
15 They have forsaken the right way and gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Beor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;
16 but he was rebuked for his iniquity: a dumb donkey speaking with a man's voice restrained the madness of the prophet.
17 These are wells without water, clouds carried by a tempest, for whom is reserved the blackness of darkness forever.
18 For when they speak great swelling words of emptiness, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through lewdness, the ones who have actually escaped from those who live in error.
19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are slaves of corruption; for by whom a person is overcome, by him also he is brought into bondage.
20 For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning.
21 For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them.
22 But it has happened to them according to the true proverb: "A dog returns to his own vomit," and, "a sow, having washed, to her wallowing in the mire."
(NKJ)

 

[Dylan569]

HOMOSEXUAL

1 Cor 5:9-13
9 I wrote to you in my epistle not to keep company with sexually immoral people.
10 Yet I certainly did not mean with the sexually immoral people of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world.
11 But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortioner-- not even to eat with such a person.
12 For what have I to do with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside?
13 But those who are outside God judges. Therefore "put away from yourselves the evil person."
James 1:13-16
13 Let no one say when he is tempted, "I am tempted by God"; for God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does He Himself tempt anyone.
14 But each one is tempted when he is drawn away by his own desires and enticed.
15 Then, when desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, brings forth death.
16 Do not be deceived, my beloved brethren.
Gal 5:17
17 For the flesh lusts against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; and these are contrary to one another, so that you do not do the things that you wish.
Gal 5:19
19 Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness,
Gal 5:24
24 And those who are Christ's have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.
1 Pet 2:19
19 For this is commendable, if because of conscience toward God one endures grief, suffering wrongfully.
1 Pet 2:21-22
21 For to this you were called, because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that you should follow His steps:
22 "Who committed no sin, nor was deceit found in His mouth";
James 4:5
5 Or do you think that the Scripture says in vain, "The Spirit who dwells in us yearns jealously"?
James 4:7-8
7 Therefore submit to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you.
8 Draw near to God and He will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners; and purify your hearts, you double-minded.
1 Cor 6:9-11
9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites,
10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God.
11 And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.
1 Tim 1:8-10
8 But we know that the law is good if one uses it lawfully,
9 knowing this: that the law is not made for a righteous person, but for the lawless and insubordinate, for the ungodly and for sinners, for the unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
10 for fornicators, for sodomites, for kidnappers, for liars, for perjurers, and if there is any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine,
Luke 17:28-30
28 "Likewise as it was also in the days of Lot: They ate, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they built;
29 "but on the day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven and destroyed them all.
30 "Even so will it be in the day when the Son of Man is revealed.
Titus 1:10-11
10 For there are many insubordinate, both idle talkers and deceivers, especially those of the circumcision,
11 whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole households, teaching things which they ought not, for the sake of dishonest gain.
2 Pet 2:3
3 By covetousness they will exploit you with deceptive words; for a long time their judgment has not been idle, and their destruction does not slumber.
[Jde 1:7-8
[7] as Sodom and Gomorrah, and the cities around them in a similar manner to these, having given themselves over to sexual immorality and gone after strange flesh, are set forth as an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.
[8] Likewise also these dreamers defile the flesh, reject authority, and speak evil of dignitaries.
Rev 22:18-19
18 For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book;
19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.
(NKJ)

xxxxThis is a revelation I received from the Holy Spirit. Like it or not this is what the bible says. You can look up every verse. Whether your a homosexual or not if you approve of it you could condemn yourself. Homosexuality is a sin.

[Eph 5:11–13
[11] And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather expose [them].
[12] For it is shameful even to speak of those things which are done by them in secret.
[13] But all things that are exposed are made manifest by the light, for whatever makes manifest is light.
Rom 14:22
22 Do you have faith? Have it to yourself before God. Happy is he who does not condemn himself in what he approves.
(NKJ)

James 2:26
26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
(NKJ)


2 Pet 3:9-13
9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night, in which the heavens will pass away with a great noise, and the elements will melt with fervent heat; both the earth and the works that are in it will be burned up.
11 Therefore, since all these things will be dissolved, what manner of persons ought you to be in holy conduct and godliness,
12 looking for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be dissolved, being on fire, and the elements will melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to His promise, look for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells.
(NKJ)

Rom 1:22-32
22 Professing to be wise, they became fools,
23 and changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like corruptible man-- and birds and four-footed animals and creeping things.
24 Therefore God also gave them up to uncleanness, in the lusts of their hearts, to dishonor their bodies among themselves,
25 who exchanged the truth of God for the lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen.
26 For this reason God gave them up to vile passions. For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature.
27 Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due.
28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a debased mind, to do those things which are not fitting;
29 being filled with all unrighteousness, sexual immorality, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, evil-mindedness; they are whisperers,
30 backbiters, haters of God, violent, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
31 undiscerning, untrustworthy, unloving, unforgiving, unmerciful;
32 who, knowing the righteous judgment of God, that those who practice such things are worthy of death, not only do the same but also approve of those who practice them.
(NKJ)


2 Pet 2:12-22
12 But these, like natural brute beasts made to be caught and destroyed, speak evil of the things they do not understand, and will utterly perish in their own corruption,
13 and will receive the wages of unrighteousness, as those who count it pleasure to carouse in the daytime. They are spots and blemishes, carousing in their own deceptions while they feast with you,
14 having eyes full of adultery and that cannot cease from sin, beguiling unstable souls. They have a heart trained in covetous practices, and are accursed children.
15 They have forsaken the right way and gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Beor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;
16 but he was rebuked for his iniquity: a dumb donkey speaking with a man's voice restrained the madness of the prophet.
17 These are wells without water, clouds carried by a tempest, for whom is reserved the blackness of darkness forever.
18 For when they speak great swelling words of emptiness, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through lewdness, the ones who have actually escaped from those who live in error.
19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are slaves of corruption; for by whom a person is overcome, by him also he is brought into bondage.
20 For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning.
21 For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them.
22 But it has happened to them according to the true proverb: "A dog returns to his own vomit," and, "a sow, having washed, to her wallowing in the mire."
(NKJ)

The OP title should read "GAY OR HOMOSEXUAL OR SODOMITE", not just gay or homosexual. The reason being, gay and homosexual in this day are synonyms, but "sodomite" has a different meaning. This is seen in the NKJV that the OP quotes on 1 Cor. 6:9, and I'll include the Greek words:

NKJV "Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor malakos/homosexuals, nor arsenokoites/sodomites",

It is obvious that the totally different words in the Greek are recognized as different, and the English used to translate them are likewise different in meaning. The NKJV is a fundamentalist/evangelical version. The NASB95 is likewise fundamentalist/evangelical and it is revealing to compare the two, and I'll again include the Greek:

NASB95"Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor malakos/effeminate, nor arsenokoites/homosexuals"

The 1946 RSV, a liberal translation was the first English version to use the word "homosexuals" and in the 1971 RSV Edition, the word "homosexuals" was removed and has not reappeared in the 1989 NRSV or the 2021 NRSVue. In the UK, the 1989 Revised English Bible removed the adjective "homosexual" found in the 1970 New English Bible, as it was also a misleading translation.

The NKJV & NASB were eager to condemn gays, but they could not agree on what word to translate as "homosexuals". The NASB arsenokoites and the NKJV malakos exposes the bias in the translations.

The word and concept "homosexual" first appeared in Germany in 1869 and came into American English about 1900. Many have Bible software that has the 1611/1769 KJV and the 1828 Webster's Dictionary of English. The KJV, RV and ASV all kept the same wording in 1 Cor. 6:9 and I'll quote the ASV -

"Or know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor arsenokoiktes/abusers of themselves with men" (1Cor 6:9 ASV). * From the 1828 Webster's

"ABU'SER, n. s as z. One who abuses, in speech or behavior; one that deceives; a ravisher; a sodomite. 1 Cor 6."
"RAV'ISHER, n. 1. One that takes by violence. 2. One that forces a woman to his carnal embrace."

The 1828 Webster's clearly equates the word "sodomite" with abuse, violence and rape. If you go to the Sodom record you'll see in Gen. 19:9 that the people of Sodom attempted rape, but the angels stopped them. Many Bibles with cross references will guide one to Judges -

"As they were making their hearts merry, behold, the men of the city, certain base fellows, beset the house round about, beating at the door; and they spake to the master of the house, the old man, saying, Bring forth the man that came into thy house, that we may know him. And the man, the master of the house, went out unto them, and said unto them, Nay, my brethren, I pray you, do not so wickedly; seeing that this man is come into my house, do not this folly. Behold, here is my daughter a virgin, and his concubine; them I will bring out now, and humble ye them, and do with them what seemeth good unto you: but unto this man do not any such folly. But the men would not hearken to him: so the man laid hold on his concubine, and brought her forth unto them; and they knew her, and abused her all the night until the morning: and when the day began to spring, they let her go. Then came the woman in the dawning of the day, and fell down at the door of the man's house where her lord was, till it was light." (Judg 19:22-26 ASV)*The record continues on...

If you seek the sexual sin of Sodom, it was violence, attempted rape, and the similar account in the Judges shows this is the real Biblical meaning of sodomy and sodomite. To call a gay male a sodomite is not accurate, and it is derogatory; from Merriam-Webster: "sodomite -> used as a term of abuse and disparagement for a gay person"

There are born again young men who happen to love their own sex, and the fundamentalist/evangelical churches in their fervor to condemn the LGBTQ+, have driven them out of their churches. They either go to very liberal churches like the Episcopal, or they drop out of church altogether. There is no condemnation in the entire Bible that condemns a male who is in a same-sex relationship, and the churches should study to see how to give support to these young men. The shallow studies the churches present to condemn all gay relationships, will come back on them one day, maybe on the last day. I'm old enough to have seen the hate-filled homophobia grow from the 1960s on to today in the conservative churches. I do not expect to see any agreement on this Forum, but it will be of help to a family who is dealing with this complex situation if they happen upon this thread.

 

[B-A-C]

Lev 18:22 'You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an abomination.

1Cor 6:9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals,
1Cor 6:10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God.

1Tim 1:8 But we know that the Law is good, if one uses it lawfully,
1Tim 1:9 realizing the fact that law is not made for a righteous person, but for those who are lawless and rebellious, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers
1Tim 1:10 and immoral men and homosexuals and kidnappers and liars and perjurers, and whatever else is contrary to sound teaching,

Rom 1:24 Therefore God gave them over in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, so that their bodies would be dishonored among them.
Rom 1:25 For they exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen.
Rom 1:26 For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural,
Rom 1:27 and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts and receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error.
Rom 1:28 And just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer, God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do those things which are not proper,

Rom 1:32 and although they know the ordinance of God, that those who practice such things are worthy of death, they not only do the same, but those who also give hearty approval to those who practice them.

Merely approving of others doing it makes you guilty.

Deut 22:5 "A woman shall not wear man's clothing, nor shall a man put on a woman's clothing; for whoever does these things is an abomination to the LORD your God.

here does the term sodomite come from?

Gen 19:4 Before they lay down, the men of the city, the men of Sodom, surrounded the house, both young and old, all the people from every quarter;
Gen 19:5 and they called to Lot and said to him, "Where are the men who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us that we may have sexual relations with them."
Gen 19:6 But Lot went out to them at the doorway, and shut the door behind him,
Gen 19:7 and said, "Please, my brothers, do not act wickedly.

Gen 19:12 Then the two men said to Lot, "Whom else have you here? A son-in-law, and your sons, and your daughters, and whomever you have in the city, bring them out of the place;
Gen 19:13 for we are about to destroy this place, because their outcry has become so great before the LORD that the LORD has sent us to destroy it."

Gen 19:24 Then the LORD rained on Sodom and Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the LORD out of heaven,
Gen 19:25 and He overthrew those cities, and all the valley, and all the inhabitants of the cities, and what grew on the ground.
Gen 19:26 But his wife, from behind him, looked back, and she became a pillar of salt.
Gen 19:27 Now Abraham arose early in the morning and went to the place where he had stood before the LORD;
Gen 19:28 and he looked down toward Sodom and Gomorrah, and toward all the land of the valley, and he saw, and behold, the smoke of the land ascended like the smoke of a furnace.

 

[B-A-C]

There are born again young men who happen to love their own sex,

Loving one another is fine. I love men. Sleeping with them is not fine. I don't sleep with them.
Sex is not love, love is not sex.

You can not be born again and living this lifestyle. Period.

Who you love doesn't make you a homosexual, who you sleep with does.

NASEC -
G733a
ἀρσενοκοίτης
arsenokoitēs; from 733b and 2845; a male homosexual:—
homosexuals(1), homosexuals*(1).

Strongs -
G733
ἀρσενοκοίτης
arsenokoitēs
ar-sen-ok-oy'-tace
From G730 and G2845; a sodomite: - abuser of (that defile) self with mankind.
Total KJV occurrences: 2

 

[Dylan569]

The OP title should read "GAY OR HOMOSEXUAL OR SODOMITE", not just gay or homosexual. The reason being, gay and homosexual in this day are synonyms, but "sodomite" has a different meaning. This is seen in the NKJV that the OP quotes on 1 Cor. 6:9, and I'll include the Greek words:

NKJV "Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor malakos/homosexuals, nor arsenokoites/sodomites",

It is obvious that the totally different words in the Greek are recognized as different, and the English used to translate them are likewise different in meaning. The NKJV is a fundamentalist/evangelical version. The NASB95 is likewise fundamentalist/evangelical and it is revealing to compare the two, and I'll again include the Greek:

NASB95"Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor malakos/effeminate, nor arsenokoites/homosexuals"

The 1946 RSV, a liberal translation was the first English version to use the word "homosexuals" and in the 1971 RSV Edition, the word "homosexuals" was removed and has not reappeared in the 1989 NRSV or the 2021 NRSVue. In the UK, the 1989 Revised English Bible removed the adjective "homosexual" found in the 1970 New English Bible, as it was also a misleading translation.

The NKJV & NASB were eager to condemn gays, but they could not agree on what word to translate as "homosexuals". The NASB arsenokoites and the NKJV malakos exposes the bias in the translations.

The word and concept "homosexual" first appeared in Germany in 1869 and came into American English about 1900. Many have Bible software that has the 1611/1769 KJV and the 1828 Webster's Dictionary of English. The KJV, RV and ASV all kept the same wording in 1 Cor. 6:9 and I'll quote the ASV -

"Or know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor arsenokoiktes/abusers of themselves with men" (1Cor 6:9 ASV). * From the 1828 Webster's

"ABU'SER, n. s as z. One who abuses, in speech or behavior; one that deceives; a ravisher; a sodomite. 1 Cor 6."
"RAV'ISHER, n. 1. One that takes by violence. 2. One that forces a woman to his carnal embrace."

The 1828 Webster's clearly equates the word "sodomite" with abuse, violence and rape. If you go to the Sodom record you'll see in Gen. 19:9 that the people of Sodom attempted rape, but the angels stopped them. Many Bibles with cross references will guide one to Judges -

"As they were making their hearts merry, behold, the men of the city, certain base fellows, beset the house round about, beating at the door; and they spake to the master of the house, the old man, saying, Bring forth the man that came into thy house, that we may know him. And the man, the master of the house, went out unto them, and said unto them, Nay, my brethren, I pray you, do not so wickedly; seeing that this man is come into my house, do not this folly. Behold, here is my daughter a virgin, and his concubine; them I will bring out now, and humble ye them, and do with them what seemeth good unto you: but unto this man do not any such folly. But the men would not hearken to him: so the man laid hold on his concubine, and brought her forth unto them; and they knew her, and abused her all the night until the morning: and when the day began to spring, they let her go. Then came the woman in the dawning of the day, and fell down at the door of the man's house where her lord was, till it was light." (Judg 19:22-26 ASV)*The record continues on...

If you seek the sexual sin of Sodom, it was violence, attempted rape, and the similar account in the Judges shows this is the real Biblical meaning of sodomy and sodomite. To call a gay male a sodomite is not accurate, and it is derogatory; from Merriam-Webster: "sodomite -> used as a term of abuse and disparagement for a gay person"

There are born again young men who happen to love their own sex, and the fundamentalist/evangelical churches in their fervor to condemn the LGBTQ+, have driven them out of their churches. They either go to very liberal churches like the Episcopal, or they drop out of church altogether. There is no condemnation in the entire Bible that condemns a male who is in a same-sex relationship, and the churches should study to see how to give support to these young men. The shallow studies the churches present to condemn all gay relationships, will come back on them one day, maybe on the last day. I'm old enough to have seen the hate-filled homophobia grow from the 1960s on to today in the conservative churches. I do not expect to see any agreement on this Forum, but it will be of help to a family who is dealing with this complex situation if they happen upon this thread.

To continue from my previous post, there is a critical element in biblical interpretation, and it is using common sense. The word and concept of homosexuality came into English around 1900 and the first Bible to use the word in translation is the 1946 RSV. Ask yourself, Did the English speaking churches of Christ not know what arsenokoites meant until 1900 years after Paul wrote? Ridiculous. There are no significant variations in the manuscripts behind the key 'clobber' verses. So, how do we view the scholarship of the KJV translators?

"Not since the Septuagint—the Greek-language version of the Hebrew Scriptures (Old Testament) produced between the 3rd and the 2nd centuries BCE—had a translation of the Bible been undertaken under royal sponsorship as a cooperative venture on so grandiose a scale. An elaborate set of rules was contrived to curb individual proclivities and to ensure the translation’s scholarly and nonpartisan character." King James Version (KJV) | Bible, History, & Background | Britannica

"The population from which scholars can now be drawn is much larger than in the seventeenth century, but it would be difficult now to bring together a group of more than fifty scholars with the range of languages and knowledge of other disciplines that characterized the KJB Translators. (Bible – The Story of the King James Version 1611-2011 Oxford, Gordon Campbell, Oxford University Press 2010.)" King James Bible Translators

The Greek arsenokoites Paul used in 1 Tim. 1:10 between two other phrases: "whoremongers, for them that arsenokoites/defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers" KJV Remember the last KJV revision was 1769, and the 1828 Webster's gives the meaning in that time period. In the previous post I gave the Webster's definition of "abuser" in 1 Cor. 6:9. The 1828 Dict on "defile" of 1 Tim. 1:10 reads: "DEFILE, v.t. 5. To corrupt chastity; to debauch; to violate; to tarnish the purity of character by lewdness. Schechem defiled Dinah. Gen 34."

Read Genesis 34 and you see rape described. To go back to Sodom, I earlier gave a cross reference to the book of Judges to illustrate the type of sex that was going to happen in that wicked city, if the angels had not stopped it. There is a key verse in the Sodom story that explains it well: "And they said, Stand back. And they said again, This one fellow came in to sojourn, and he will needs be a judge: now will we deal worse with thee, than with them. And they pressed sore upon the man, even Lot, and came near to break the door." (Gen 19:9 KJV) * Language cannot be more plain, this was attempted rape. That has nothing to do with two males in a loving relationship.

Lev. 18:22; 20:13 are quoted as if they have relevance for the 'born again' New Covenant believer. What did God tell Moses at the close of Leviticus? "These are the commandments, which the LORD commanded Moses for the children of Israel in mount Sinai." (Lev 27:34 KJV) That does not rule over the born again child of God for that is not quoted in the NT. For the Israelites back then, it referred to male temple prostitutes. Those who prostituted themselves to idols, see Dt. 23:17-18.

Coming up to Rom. 1:26-27 notice first in v26, NOTHING is said about women having sex with women. They could have unnatural sex with men. In v27, too many skip over the words "leaving the natural use of the woman". Leaving means they were in possession of a M-F relationship. That does not sound like any gay unless he's forced against his will by culture or religion. Then the two Greek words behind for "burned" and "lust" are only found here in the NT, and they are words of extremities. In interpretation, it helps to know the historical context also. A Greek poet, wrote of what was going on, and it reads as if Paul was speaking of the very same thing. I'll quote that piece:

"In dealing with brothel-keepers and their trade we must certainly betray no weakness as though something were to be said on both sides, but must sternly forbid them...Such men bring individuals together in union without love and intercourse without affection, and all for the sake of filthy lucre...For evils are never wont to remain as they are; they are ever active and advancing to greater wantonness if they meet no compelling check...Indeed, beginning with practices and habits that seem trivial and allowable, it acquires a strength and force that are uncontrollable, and no longer stops at anything...Now at this point we must assuredly remember that this adultery committed with outcasts, so evident in our midst and becoming so brazen and unchecked, is to a very great extent paving the way to hidden and secret assaults upon the chastity of women and boys of good family...The man whose appetite is insatiate in such things, when he finds there is no scarcity, no resistance, in this field, will have contempt for the easy conquest and scorn for a woman's love, as a thing too readily given — in fact, too utterly feminine — and will turn his assault against the male quarters, eager to befoul the youth who will very soon be magistrates and judges and generals, believing that in them he will find a kind of pleasure difficult and hard to procure. His state is like that of men who are addicted to drinking and wine-bibbing, who after long and steady drinking of unmixed wine, often lose their taste for it and create an artificial thirst by the stimulus of sweatings, salted foods, and condiments."

Dio Chrysostom: Discourses 1-20 [Demonax | Hellenic Library Beta]

demonax.info

That was written at the time Paul lived, and it has nothing to do with males who love males. When we speak of men who love women, naturally we think that includes sexual desire, so the same with males who love males. I'm going over this topic in very brief form and maybe later I can expand on it. Next I believe it is important for a family dealing with a gay, to have come positive guidance from the scriptures, so I'll post that.

 

[Dylan569]

To continue from my previous post, there is a critical element in biblical interpretation, and it is using common sense. The word and concept of homosexuality came into English around 1900 and the first Bible to use the word in translation is the 1946 RSV. Ask yourself, Did the English speaking churches of Christ not know what arsenokoites meant until 1900 years after Paul wrote? Ridiculous. There are no significant variations in the manuscripts behind the key 'clobber' verses. So, how do we view the scholarship of the KJV translators?

"Not since the Septuagint—the Greek-language version of the Hebrew Scriptures (Old Testament) produced between the 3rd and the 2nd centuries BCE—had a translation of the Bible been undertaken under royal sponsorship as a cooperative venture on so grandiose a scale. An elaborate set of rules was contrived to curb individual proclivities and to ensure the translation’s scholarly and nonpartisan character." King James Version (KJV) | Bible, History, & Background | Britannica

"The population from which scholars can now be drawn is much larger than in the seventeenth century, but it would be difficult now to bring together a group of more than fifty scholars with the range of languages and knowledge of other disciplines that characterized the KJB Translators. (Bible – The Story of the King James Version 1611-2011 Oxford, Gordon Campbell, Oxford University Press 2010.)" King James Bible Translators

The Greek arsenokoites Paul used in 1 Tim. 1:10 between two other phrases: "whoremongers, for them that arsenokoites/defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers" KJV Remember the last KJV revision was 1769, and the 1828 Webster's gives the meaning in that time period. In the previous post I gave the Webster's definition of "abuser" in 1 Cor. 6:9. The 1828 Dict on "defile" of 1 Tim. 1:10 reads: "DEFILE, v.t. 5. To corrupt chastity; to debauch; to violate; to tarnish the purity of character by lewdness. Schechem defiled Dinah. Gen 34."

Read Genesis 34 and you see rape described. To go back to Sodom, I earlier gave a cross reference to the book of Judges to illustrate the type of sex that was going to happen in that wicked city, if the angels had not stopped it. There is a key verse in the Sodom story that explains it well: "And they said, Stand back. And they said again, This one fellow came in to sojourn, and he will needs be a judge: now will we deal worse with thee, than with them. And they pressed sore upon the man, even Lot, and came near to break the door." (Gen 19:9 KJV) * Language cannot be more plain, this was attempted rape. That has nothing to do with two males in a loving relationship.

Lev. 18:22; 20:13 are quoted as if they have relevance for the 'born again' New Covenant believer. What did God tell Moses at the close of Leviticus? "These are the commandments, which the LORD commanded Moses for the children of Israel in mount Sinai." (Lev 27:34 KJV) That does not rule over the born again child of God for that is not quoted in the NT. For the Israelites back then, it referred to male temple prostitutes. Those who prostituted themselves to idols, see Dt. 23:17-18.

Coming up to Rom. 1:26-27 notice first in v26, NOTHING is said about women having sex with women. They could have unnatural sex with men. In v27, too many skip over the words "leaving the natural use of the woman". Leaving means they were in possession of a M-F relationship. That does not sound like any gay unless he's forced against his will by culture or religion. Then the two Greek words behind for "burned" and "lust" are only found here in the NT, and they are words of extremities. In interpretation, it helps to know the historical context also. A Greek poet, wrote of what was going on, and it reads as if Paul was speaking of the very same thing. I'll quote that piece:

"In dealing with brothel-keepers and their trade we must certainly betray no weakness as though something were to be said on both sides, but must sternly forbid them...Such men bring individuals together in union without love and intercourse without affection, and all for the sake of filthy lucre...For evils are never wont to remain as they are; they are ever active and advancing to greater wantonness if they meet no compelling check...Indeed, beginning with practices and habits that seem trivial and allowable, it acquires a strength and force that are uncontrollable, and no longer stops at anything...Now at this point we must assuredly remember that this adultery committed with outcasts, so evident in our midst and becoming so brazen and unchecked, is to a very great extent paving the way to hidden and secret assaults upon the chastity of women and boys of good family...The man whose appetite is insatiate in such things, when he finds there is no scarcity, no resistance, in this field, will have contempt for the easy conquest and scorn for a woman's love, as a thing too readily given — in fact, too utterly feminine — and will turn his assault against the male quarters, eager to befoul the youth who will very soon be magistrates and judges and generals, believing that in them he will find a kind of pleasure difficult and hard to procure. His state is like that of men who are addicted to drinking and wine-bibbing, who after long and steady drinking of unmixed wine, often lose their taste for it and create an artificial thirst by the stimulus of sweatings, salted foods, and condiments."

Dio Chrysostom: Discourses 1-20 [Demonax | Hellenic Library Beta]

demonax.info

That was written at the time Paul lived, and it has nothing to do with males who love males. When we speak of men who love women, naturally we think that includes sexual desire, so the same with males who love males. I'm going over this topic in very brief form and maybe later I can expand on it. Next I believe it is important for a family dealing with a gay, to have come positive guidance from the scriptures, so I'll post that.

The salvation that is by and from God is for anyone, without exception. Gay guys are not excluded!

"Everything that the Father gives me will come to me, and anyone who comes to me I will never drive away, for I have come down from heaven not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me. And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me but raise it up on the last day." Joh 6:37-39 NRSVue *It is clear, "everyone" with NO exceptions

Do not be astonished that I said to you, ‘You must be born from above.’ The wind blows where it chooses, and you hear the sound of it, but you do not know where it comes from or where it goes. So it is with everyone who is born of the Spirit.” (John 3:7-8 NRSV) *The traditional 'born again' is better 'born from above' because it is a sovereign act of God, NOT of man.

"But to all who received him, who believed in his name, he gave power to become children of God, who were born, not of blood or of the will of the flesh or of the will of man, but of God." Joh 1:12-13 NRSVue

"For all alike have sinned, and are deprived of the divine glory; and all are justified by God’s free grace alone, through his act of liberation in the person of Christ Jesus." (Rom 3:23-24 REB) *Works have nothing to do with justification, it is by "by God's free grace alone". Dr. Martin Luther was correct!

It is a known fact, except to the willingly ignorant, a man does not choose his sexual orientation, who he is attracted to and loves. If it was not man's choice, who did make one gay? The Apostle Paul tells us.

"Who do you think you are to answer God back? Can the pot say to the potter, ‘Why did you make me like this?’? Surely the potter can do what he likes with the clay. Is he not free to make two vessels out of the same lump, one to be treasured, the other for common use? (Rom 9:20-21 REB)

Jesus teaches us a major fact about living in a fallen world, a world of not only sin, but of innocent consequences that differ from the perfection at the beginning, in Eden. For example, divorce:

"He answered, ‘It was because of your stubbornness that Moses gave you permission to divorce your wives; but it was not like that at the beginning. I tell you, if a man divorces his wife for any cause other than unchastity, and marries another, he commits adultery.’" (Matt 19:8-9 REB)

Jesus continues with an interest statement further in his talk:

"For while some are incapable of marriage because they were born so, or were made so by men, there are others who have renounced marriage for the sake of the kingdom of Heaven. Let those accept who can.’" (Matt 19:12 REB) *The literal word is "eunuch" but it is referring to those incapable of marriage in a biblical context.

Speaking of marriage, the Apostle Paul teaches us about the sex drive, and it presents a dilemma to the gay man.

"I should like everyone to be as I myself am; but each person has the gift God has granted him, one this gift and another that. To the unmarried and to widows I say this: it is a good thing if like me they stay as they are; but if they do not have self-control, they should marry. It is better to be married than burn with desire." (1Cor 7:7-9 REB) *Biblically, by the Christian's guide, marriage is for M-F, so what is the gay guy to do? God did not leave him without an answer, and he gives it through the wise man Solomon:

"Here again I saw futility under the sun: someone without a friend, without son or brother, toiling endlessly yet never satisfied with his wealth—‘For whom’, he asks, ‘am I toiling and denying myself the good things of life?’ This too is futile, a worthless task. Two are better than one, for their partnership yields this advantage: if one falls, the other can help his companion up again; but woe betide the solitary person who when down has no partner to help him up. And if two lie side by side they keep each other warm; but how can one keep warm by himself? If anyone is alone, an assailant may overpower him, but two can resist; and a cord of three strands is not quickly snapped." (Eccl 4:7-12 REB) *God said it was NOT good that man be alone, and he did not say "except for gays"

"Then the LORD God said, 'It is not good for the man to live alone. I will make a suitable companion to help him.'” (Gen 2:18 GNB92) *Who is a suitable companion for the gay guy, a woman or a man?

King David and his friend Jonathan both married and had children, so they were what we'd call 'straight', or 'heterosexual'. But, after Jonathan was killed in a battle, David lamented:

"I grieve for you, Jonathan my brother; you were most dear to me; your love for me was wonderful, surpassing the love of women." (2Sam 1:26 REB) *David did not say "love of mother or wife", or "love of father", or even "love of a brother"... he clearly said Jonathan's love surpassed that of "women", plural.

The love of Jonathan for David was earlier stated most clearly:

"That same day, when Saul had finished talking with David, he kept him and would not let him return any more to his father’s house, for he saw that Jonathan had given his heart to David and had grown to love him as himself." (1Sam 18:1-2 REB)

For the child of God, the one 'born from above' by God's sovereign will alone, for him if he is gay the preceding gives a few pointers to keep in mind. It is not an easy life for a gay Christian, but he must keep in mind the following words of Jesus:

"‘Alas for you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! You shut the door of the kingdom of Heaven in people’s faces; you do not enter yourselves, and when others try to enter, you stop them. ‘Alas for you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! You travel over sea and land to win one convert; and when you have succeeded you make him twice as fit for hell as you are yourselves." (Matt 23:13-15 REB)

This concludes a very brief, three reply response to the OP. I pray that it helps some family or individual for whom this very personal and family struggle is so very difficult.

 

[B-A-C]

The salvation that is by and from God is for anyone, without exception. Gay guys are not excluded!

They can saved if they repent. If they don't, they aren't saved.

 

[Dylan569]

They can saved if they repent. If they don't, they aren't saved.

Repentance is a gift of God, given to all of God's elect as are all that is needed:

"Simeon Peter, a servant and apostle of Jesus Christ, To those who have received a faith as precious as ours through the righteousness of our God and Savior Jesus Christ: May grace and peace be yours in abundance in the knowledge of God and of Jesus our Lord. His divine power has given us everything needed for life and godliness, through the knowledge of him who called us by his own glory and goodness." (2Pet 1:1-3 NRSV)

"God exalted him at his right hand as Leader and Savior that he might give repentance to Israel and forgiveness of sins." (Acts 5:31 NRSV)

"When they heard this, they were silenced. And they praised God, saying, 'Then God has given even to the Gentiles the repentance that leads to life.'” (Acts 11:18 NRSV)

"...correcting opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant that they will repent and come to know the truth" (2Tim 2:25 NRSV)

Repentance does not apply to the gay believer any more than a heterosexual believer:

"If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us." (1John 1:8 NRSV)

 

[Twistie]

For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.”

Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.

Therefore now amend your ways and your doings, and obey the voice of the Lord your God; and the Lord will repent him of the evil that he hath pronounced against you".

 

[Dylan569]

For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.”

Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.

Therefore now amend your ways and your doings, and obey the voice of the Lord your God; and the Lord will repent him of the evil that he hath pronounced against you".

AMEN!

 

[B-A-C]

Repentance does not apply to the gay believer any more than a heterosexual believer:

That's true, adulterers and fornicators are just as guilty. But the title of this thread doesn't mention adultery or fornication.

1Cor 6:9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals,
1Cor 6:10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God.

Those who believe these people will inherit the kingdom of God are deceived.

2Tim 3:13 But evil men and impostors will proceed from bad to worse, deceiving and being deceived.

2Tim 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance to their own desires,

 

[Twistie]

But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance

Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord.

From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.


You can't dance with the demons and eat with the Lord look what happen to Judas..

Either ya r lead by the Spirit of Truth or ya following the father of lies half truths..

Man like to make things complicated but His Yolk is easy...


If they are His Abba will call them out of the world when it's time for them to come out..


He knew us before we were in the womb He knew we would all sin all fall short yet He still gave us breathe He still allowed us free will to do what He detest and eventually go back to Him


ʘ⁠‿⁠ʘ

 

[Dylan569]

That's true, adulterers and fornicators are just as guilty. But the title of this thread doesn't mention adultery or fornication.

1Cor 6:9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals,
1Cor 6:10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God.

Those who believe these people will inherit the kingdom of God are deceived.

2Tim 3:13 But evil men and impostors will proceed from bad to worse, deceiving and being deceived.

2Tim 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance to their own desires,

Can you explain why you chose a translation with the word "homosexuals' in it rather than "sodomites" as in the YLT?

"have ye not known that the unrighteous the reign of God shall not inherit? be not led astray; neither whoremongers, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor sodomites," (1Cor 6:9 YLT)

Can you tell us of a Bible commentary prior to the 20th century, that describes the Greek word arsenokoites in a way that matches the meaning of "homosexuals" in our day? Do you really think the church for 1900 years did not fully understand what the Greek arsenokoites meant?

Eerdmans Dictionary of the Bible, Copyright 2000
"The terms 'homosexuality' and 'homosexual' are coinages of the 19th century C.E. and have no equivalent in ancient Hebrew or Greek. It is debatable whether the modern idea of homosexuality (an erotic attraction focused only or primarily on persons of the same gender) existed at all in antiquity. The Bible does not appear to say anything directly about homosexuality in this modern sense of the term, but a few passages do refer to same-gender genital acts." page 602

New Bible Dictionary, Third Edition, IVP Copyright 1996
"The Bible says nothing specifically about the homosexual condition (despite the rather misleading RSV translation of 1 Cor. 6:9), but its condemnations of homosexual conduct are explicit. The scope of these strictures must, however, be carefully determined. Too often they have been used as tools of a homophobic polemic which has claimed too much." page 478

 

[B-A-C]

Can you explain why you chose a translation with the word "homosexuals' in it rather than "sodomites" as in the YLT?

I used the NASB which 99% of the messages I post in all threads is. I consider the NASB to be more accurate than the YLT.
But I can do other versions as well if you like.

1 Corinthians 6:9
(AMPC) Do you not know that the unrighteous and the wrongdoers will not inherit or have any share in the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived (misled): neither the impure and immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor those who participate in homosexuality,
(ASV) Or know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with men,
(BSB) Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who submit to or perform homosexual acts,
(CSB) Don’t you know that the unrighteous will not inherit God’s kingdom? Do not be deceived: No sexually immoral people, idolaters, adulterers, or males who have sex with males,
(ESV) Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality,
(GNB) Surely you know that the wicked will not possess God's Kingdom. Do not fool yourselves; people who are immoral or who worship idols or are adulterers or homosexual perverts
(Greek NT BYZ+) ηG2228 PRT ουκG3756 PRT-N οιδατεG1492 V-RAI-2P οτιG3754 CONJ αδικοιG94 A-NPM βασιλειανG932 N-ASF θεουG2316 N-GSM ουG3756 PRT-N κληρονομησουσινG2816 V-FAI-3P μηG3361 PRT-N πλανασθεG4105 V-PPM-2P ουτεG3777 CONJ-N πορνοιG4205 N-NPM ουτεG3777 CONJ-N ειδωλολατραιG1496 N-NPM ουτεG3777 CONJ-N μοιχοιG3432 N-NPM ουτεG3777 CONJ-N μαλακοιG3120 A-NPM ουτεG3777 CONJ-N αρσενοκοιταιG733 N-NPM
(HCSB) Don't you know that the unrighteous will not inherit God's kingdom? Do not be deceived: No sexually immoral people, idolaters, adulterers, or anyone practicing homosexuality,
(ISV) You know that wicked people will not inherit the kingdom of God, don't you? Stop deceiving yourselves! Sexually immoral people, idolaters, adulterers, male prostitutes, homosexuals,
(KJV) Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
effeminate,G3120 norG3777 abusers of themselves with mankind,G733
(MKJV) Do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor abusers, nor homosexuals,
(NAS77) Or do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals,
(NAS95) Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals,
(NET) Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived! The sexually immoral, idolaters, adulterers, passive homosexual partners, practicing homosexuals,
(NIrV) Don't you know that evil people will not receive God's kingdom? Don't be fooled. Those who commit sexual sins will not receive the kingdom. Neither will those who worship statues of gods or commit adultery. Neither will men who are prostitutes or who commit homosexual acts.
(NIV) Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor men who have sex with men
(NKJV) Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites,
(NLT) Don’t you realize that those who do wrong will not inherit the Kingdom of God? Don’t fool yourselves. Those who indulge in sexual sin, or who worship idols, or commit adultery, or are male prostitutes, or practice homosexuality,
(RV) Or know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with men,
(YLT) have ye not known that the unrighteous the reign of God shall not inherit? be not led astray; neither whoremongers, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor sodomites,

 

[B-A-C]

Do you really think the church for 1900 years did not fully understand what the Greek arsenokoites meant?

They did, you apparently do not.

Arsenokite is a term used in the New Testament to refer to men who engage in sexual relations with other men12. It is often translated as "homosexuals" or "sodomites" in English versions of the Bible2. The word is derived from the Greek words "arsen" (man) and "koite" (bed)1.

Does the Greek word arsenokoitai in 1 Corinthians 6:9 really mean “homosexuals” or something else? | GotQuestions.org

Does the Greek word arsenokoitai in 1 Corinthians 6:9 really mean “homosexuals” or something else? Does arsenkoitai refer to homosexuality?

www.gotquestions.org

What did Paul mean by "Arsenokoitēs"? Was he condemning homosexual activity as we know it today?

The below two paragraphs often pop up when one discusses/debates about Biblical stance towards homosexuality. “Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do n...

hermeneutics.stackexchange.com

What Does

That word is an unusual word. It’s a new word; we don’t know of any other instances of the word until Paul coins the word in 1 Corinthians 6 and 1 Timothy 1.

www.crossway.org

 

[Dylan569]

Once I see translations translating in order to support their theology, rather than translating honestly and then basing their theology on that doubt the legitimacy of the version. I find that the modern fundamentalist and evangelical translations all translate to support their theology. The two examples I always check are:

The NASB77 Ex. 21:22 translated as "miscarriage" as had been understood for centuries, but then the NASB95 changed to, "gives birth prematurely" in order to support the evangelical theology. You can read the NASB77 here -

Exodus 21 NASB 1977

The 1946 RSV in 1 Cor. 6:9 used "homosexuals", and then when it was seen to be a misleading translation the 1971 RSV 2nd Ed changed it to "sexual perverts".

When the RSV 2nd Ed, NRSV, NRSVue and REB had stopped using "homosexuals", again the fundamentalist and evangelical versions began using "homosexuals". Just as the NASB77 wrote "miscarriage", when it was seen to affect the anti-abortion campaigns, they changed the translation to support their theology on the "sodomites". The words "sodomites" and "homosexuals" are not synonyms.

BAC, you can quote all the modern evangelical translations you wish, but they all are translating to support their theology. When I find I cannot trust a group of translations on a couple of key issues like this, I consider them untrustworthy. I challenged you to show, demonstrate why you choose the evangelical translations that use "homosexuals", but quoting other men is not convincing. Study it out for yourself and prove it means homosexuals. Since I challenged you, I'll show why I use the mainline translations and reject the evangelical mistranslations. It is a long study, so I'll post it as a stand-a-lone.

 

[Dylan569]

Is it "sodomite" or "homosexual"? The Greek arsenokoites is a compound of G730 ἄρσην and G2845 κοίτη koite. Defining a word by its etymology can be consistent if dealing with the one who coined the compound word, and in this case, the Apostle Paul.

Paul uses the Greek[G730] ἄρσην arsen in 2 verses, in Rm 1:27 three times and in Gal 3:28 once. It means specifically "male' as in -

"There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus." (Gal 3:28 KJV)

Paul uses the Greek[G2845] κοίτη koite in three verses, once in each. The BDAG gives the general meaning as "bed". Paul uses the word in the following verses -

"Let marriage be had in honor among all, and let the bed be undefiled: for fornicators and adulterers God will judge." (Heb 13:4 ASV)

"And not only so; but Rebecca also having conceived by one, even by our father Isaac—" (Rom 9:10 ASV)

"Let us walk becomingly, as in the day; not in revelling and drunkenness, not in chambering and wantonness, not in strife and jealousy." (Rom 13:13 ASV)
*1828 Websters defines chambering as "Wanton, lewd, immodest behavior", in Rm 13:13 probably "lewd" as repeated or repetitious fornication and/or adultery by M-F.

In Heb 13:4 it means the marriage bed, not a good fit for koites 1 Cor 6:9,and meaning conception in Rm 9:10, so that definitely does not fit koites in 1 Cor. 6:9. That leaves Rm 13:13 where koites means repetitious fornication or adultery, obviously M-F; if in 1 Cor. 6:9 & 1 Tim. 1:10 it refers to M-M. Viewing koites in Rm 13:13, a vice list, between drunkenness and wantoness; it means a vile promiscuity so when compounded with ἄρσην in another vice list, it must mean M-M sexual promiscuity, with drunkenness and debauchery. Paul uses arsenokoites a second time -

"For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;" (1Tim 1:10 KJV)

In 1 Cor. 6:9 there is not structure to the wording by which we can get a hint of the meaning by the immediate context. But, in 1 Tim. 1:9-10, there is a structure to the sins listed, as seen -

A. lawless, disobedient, ungodly, sinners, unholy, profane
B. murderers of fathers, murderers of mothers, manslayers
C. whoremongers(fornicators), arsenokoites, menstealers(or slave traders)
D. liars, perjured persons

In context it is seen between fornicators and menstealers or slave traders; so we find an element of violence added to the sexual nature of the word. Therefore -

Combining what we know of the meaning of koites as promiscuity in Rm 13:13, and added to arsen in 1 Cor. 6:9 we have M-M promiscuity. Then the word arsenokoites in a context of violence in 1 Tim. 1:10. So, the meaning of arsenokoites amounts to "sodomites" NT O"homosexuals". The Roget's Thesaurus is considered the standard, and seen in the grouping of synonyms, we see that -

Page 60 Sect. 75.14 "homosexual" gay person, homosexualist, homophile, invert;"

Page 60 Sect. 75.16 "sexual pervert; pervert, perve <nf>, deviant, deviate, sex pervert, sex fiend, sex criminal, sexual psychopath; sodomist, sodomite, sob <Brit nf> , bugger, pederast"

When I find myself questioning the meaning of a Biblical word where translations differ, I go to the Hebrew or Greek and study it out for myself. Then from that, I know what translation(s) I can trust on a verse:

"Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind," (1Cor 6:9 KJV) *Abusers in the 1828 Webster's is clearly "sodomites".

"have ye not known that the unrighteous the reign of God shall not inherit? be not led astray; neither whoremongers, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor sodomites," (1Cor 6:9 YLT) The 1989 NRSV also used "sodomites" here as did the YLT

If Paul had Lev. 18:22; 20:13 in mind, he would have merely quoted it as he quoted from Leviticus in other places. Also, why go back to the Septuagint for the components of the compound word when he, Paul, has used the two words making the compound himself by which we can see his meaning?

 

[Dylan569]

I am not making this up. It was seen happening back in the 1950s -

From an article found in the 1952 RSV:
"A recent speaker has told of a project to issue 'a theologically conservative translation of the Bible.' Doubtless this is an appealing undertaking in the eyes of many. But the fact must be stressed that there is no place for theology in Bible translation, whether conservative or radical or whatever else. A 'theological translation' is not a translation at all, but merely a dogmatic perversion of the Bible. Linguistic science knows no theology; those of most contradictory views can meet on common ground devoid of polemic, agreed that Hebrew words mean such and such, and their inflection and syntactical relations imply this or that. These facts establish an agreed translation. Then, and then only, may the exegete and dogmatist busy himself with theological deductions from the thoughts of the Biblical writers. The Bible translator is not an expositor; however pronounced his views about Biblical doctrines, he has no right whatever to intrude his opinions into the translation, or to permit his dogmatic convictions to qualify or shape its wording. His one responsibility, and it is absolute, is to render the Biblical meaning as accurately and effectively as is possible into appropriate English." page 14

https://ia903104.us.archive.org/13/items/introductiontore00inte/introductiontore00inte.pdf

 

[Twistie]

Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.

 

[Christ4Ever]

Is it natural?
No.
God created man and woman, and although in Christ Jesus there is no distinction between male and female, sinful behavior persists. And man laying with man, as is woman with woman, or both with beasts is sinful behavior. Outside of marriage, you then can have a natural acceptable act between a man & woman, done in which it is now sin!

No matter how you want to twist it, to accommodate the current mores of the day, the behavior in question is sinful. We believe that sodomy is unnatural, anal, act of sex. This is not love, or to be confused with love. This is an act that does not produce anything, but sexual gratification, nor can it do otherwise. The effeminate now can easily include the "Trans" too, as they are identified in these days. Not acceptable.

Argue it as much as you want, but to say that now all of sudden due to some great insight, it's now okay, because linguistically, we believe it to be something else, so that as a Christian it is excused through Christ Jesus...makes such thoughts/behaviors still an abomination to God. It's the devil's work, no different than in the Garden of Eden. You can do whatever you want and be like God! Anathema!

For those who have the proclivity of any sinful behavior, being a Christian does not say its okay now to do what otherwise is seen as a sin! Again, Anathema to the one who would lead others astray to sin under the guise of it being acceptable to God because you believe in His Son Jesus Christ who died on the Cross with the weight of the very sins you proclaim are otherwise for the sake of "love" now okay to do!

To use Galatians 3:28 to justify this behavior, again is anathema! Do you forget that positionally the husband (man) is set above the wife (woman)! In Christ Jesus, we are all equal when it comes to salvation, not as a justification for sinful conduct.

Even though in this perverse society found in this world, you can find man marrying man, and women marrying amongst themselves as well, and it is seen as being fine and dandy to do! Not so for those in Christ Jesus who continue to practice sin, without repentance!

Everyone who practices sin also practices lawlessness; and sin is lawlessness. You know that He appeared in order to take away sins; and in Him there is no sin. No one who remains in Him sins [continually;] no one who sins [continually] has seen Him or knows Him. Little children, make sure no one deceives you; the one who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous; the one who practices sin is of the devil; for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The Son of God appeared for this purpose, to destroy the works of the devil. No one who has been born of God practices sin, because His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin [continually,] because he has been born of God. By this the children of God and the children of the devil are obvious: anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor the one who does not love his brother [and sister.] 1 John 3:4-10 NASB20

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
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