Living In Sinless Perfection: Are You?

[JerryfromMass]

I ask all of you who doubt that a born again believer can be once saved always saved this one simple question:

Are you living in sinless perfection?

If you are, say so.

If you aren't, say so.

I'll go first: I'm saved, I'm born again, I live with the indwelling Holy Spirit, loving my brothers and sisters with the unvarnished truth of God and HIS word. I am a sinner. I sin. I sin less than I did before I was saved, but I am not sinless, nor am I living in sinless perfection. I catch myself all the time, sometimes before the sin outwardly manifests, sometimes after the sin fully manifests. And when I do sin, I confess to my Savior and Lord who is faithful and just to forgive me of my sins and cleanse me of all unrighteousness. Do you get it: ALL UNRIGHTEOUSNESS. My prayers always include that God grant me increased strength for repentance, increased strength to stand against the wiles of the devil, and increased strength to resist all the temptations that come my way. My flesh is weak, but the SPIRIT in me is strong, and the SPIRIT will be what carries me home to be with the lord forever.

So, here it is again: Are you living your life in sinless perfection?

 

[PloughBoy]

Here is a fine, post# 1: "Are you living in sinless perfection?"
If you are, say so.

If you aren't, say so.

"I'll go first:" Now why didn't you say so? LOL, you did.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------PloughBoy Said:
I am not! Now Here's why:

"But I see another law at work in my body, warring against the law of my mind and holding me captive to the law of sin that dwells within me. What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God, through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, with my mind I serve the law of God, but with my flesh I serve the law of sin."

When I see a great pair of female legs, my heart go "Pitter-Patter"

and then I:
Berean Literal Bible
"But I batter my body and bring it into servitude, lest having preached to others, I myself might be disqualified."

I do not go to beaches nor to the Mall!

…

 

[PloughBoy]

Here is a fine, post# 1: "Are you living in sinless perfection?"
If you are, say so.

If you aren't, say so.

"I'll go first:" Now why didn't you say so? LOL, you did.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------PloughBoy Said:
I am not! Now Here's why:

"But I see another law at work in my body, warring against the law of my mind and holding me captive to the law of sin that dwells within me. What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God, through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, with my mind I serve the law of God, but with my flesh I serve the law of sin."

When I see a great pair of female legs, my heart go "Pitter-Patter"

and then I:
Berean Literal Bible
"But I batter my body and bring it into servitude, lest having preached to others, I myself might be disqualified."

I do not go to beaches nor to the Mall!
Key, The Practicing of the same sin can be a dilemma.
…

 

[B-A-C]

I guess for me. It comes down to what you practice. There are more verses about this, but here are several.

Matt 7:23 "And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.'
Rom 1:32 and although they know the ordinance of God, that those who practice such things are worthy of death, they not only do the same, but also give hearty approval to those who practice them.
Rom 2:2 And we know that the judgment of God rightly falls upon those who practice such things.
Rom 7:19 For the good that I want, I do not do, but I practice the very evil that I do not want.
1Cor 11:16 But if one is inclined to be contentious, we have no other practice, nor have the churches of God.
Gal 5:21 envying, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these, of which I forewarn you, just as I have forewarned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
Eph 4:19 and they, having become callous, have given themselves over to sensuality for the practice of every kind of impurity with greediness.
Php 4:9 The things you have learned and received and heard and seen in me, practice these things, and the God of peace will be with you.
1Thes 4:10 for indeed you do practice it toward all the brethren who are in all Macedonia. But we urge you, brethren, to excel still more,
1Tim 5:4 but if any widow has children or grandchildren, they must first learn to practice piety in regard to their own family and to make some return to their parents; for this is acceptable in the sight of God.
Heb 5:14 But solid food is for the mature, who because of practice have their senses trained to discern good and evil.
2Pet 1:10 Therefore, brethren, be all the more diligent to make certain about His calling and choosing you; for as long as you practice these things, you will never stumble;
1Jn 1:6 If we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth;
1Jn 3:10 By this the children of God and the children of the devil are obvious: anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor the one who does not love his brother.
Rev 22:11 "Let the one who does wrong, still do wrong; and the one who is filthy, still be filthy; and let the one who is righteous, still practice righteousness; and the one who is holy, still keep himself holy."
Rom 13:4 for it is a minister of God to you for good. But if you do what is evil, be afraid; for it does not bear the sword for nothing; for it is a minister of God, an avenger who brings wrath on the one who practices evil.
Col 3:9 Do not lie to one another, since you laid aside the old self with its evil practices,
1Jn 2:29 If you know that He is righteous, you know that everyone also who practices righteousness is born of Him.
1Jn 3:4 Everyone who practices sin also practices lawlessness; and sin is lawlessness.
1Jn 3:7 Little children, make sure no one deceives you; the one who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous;
1Jn 3:8 the one who practices sin is of the devil; for the devil has sinned from the beginning. The Son of God appeared for this purpose, to destroy the works of the devil.
1Jn 3:9 No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

So for me, the question isn't so much... do you ever sin? It's more what are you practicing?

Rom 6:16 Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness?

If I stumble once a week, or once a month.. repent, ask for forgiveness, and move on.

If I'm willfully sinning everyday, and I never repent....

Heb 10:26; For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins,

 

[Dave M]

this is such a good topic, because it causes so much confusion, but it is key to understanding what being born again is. I have Ray explain this in a post its one of the best I wish we could find it. SO many think being born again is all you to do is say I believe and you are good to go.. When we look at the whole bible, and take all that Jesus says,,,,,,,,, we can see that being born again is when we are changed we are not longer the same person as we once were are desire to please or heavenly father is constant and should be growing.

No one in human flesh can live a sinless perfect life, even after being born again IMO BUT BUT BUT you can be set free of sin that has enslaved you. You now have power over the sin. ANd you should not be willifully sinning.

Your mind is the battle ground and you may have a unclean thought, but what you do with that unclean thought is the important part, do you dwell on it and think on it, or do you do you put it aside and intentionally run to Jesus.

The way you live matters, and if you are living in sin, say drinking all the time, or have sex outside of marriage, or even just willfully lusting after the opposite sex, these are all things a born again follower of CHirst is NOT going to be doing,,,,,,, if you think you can go on sinning like this on a regular basis and be saved you have another thing coming IMO

the language you use, the tv shows you watch, the people you hang around are all indications of what is inside of you.

so No I am not sinless or perfect,,,, but I am NOT a practicing sinner,,,,,,,,, and yes there is a HUGE difference IMO

 

[PloughBoy]

I do believe, that the "Original Copied Manuscript of The WORD of GOD" proclaims as well, that you may "practice righteous", you can heal the sick, visit them, feed them, and wash their feet, give them shelter and coin, and put clothing on their backs and shoes on their feet! And doing these things in the Name of Jesus", And telling them about The name "Jesus", But none of These things will matter on "Judgment DAY". " If HE Never Knew YOU"

'Our rejoicing comes, by knowing our names, are written in Heaven" and not by The works we do!

And still, I am Not taking away the "copies" of the translated verses that you are referring to. I do believe, The Word of GOD is without error. I do believe in The Inerrancy of "The Word of GOD".


For this world is full of the works of "Philanthropy"!

 

[PloughBoy]

this is such a good topic, because it causes so much confusion, but it is key to understanding what being born again is. I have Ray explain this in a post its one of the best I wish we could find it. SO many think being born again is all you to do is say I believe and you are good to go.. When we look at the whole bible, and take all that Jesus says,,,,,,,,, we can see that being born again is when we are changed we are not longer the same person as we once were are desire to please or heavenly father is constant and should be growing.

No one in human flesh can live a sinless perfect life, even after being born again IMO BUT BUT BUT you can be set free of sin that has enslaved you. You now have power over the sin. ANd you should not be willifully sinning.

Your mind is the battle ground and you may have a unclean thought, but what you do with that unclean thought is the important part, do you dwell on it and think on it, or do you do you put it aside and intentionally run to Jesus.

The way you live matters, and if you are living in sin, say drinking all the time, or have sex outside of marriage, or even just willfully lusting after the opposite sex, these are all things a born again follower of CHirst is NOT going to be doing,,,,,,, if you think you can go on sinning like this on a regular basis and be saved you have another thing coming IMO

the language you use, the tv shows you watch, the people you hang around are all indications of what is inside of you.

so No I am not sinless or perfect,,,, but I am NOT a practicing sinner,,,,,,,,, and yes there is a HUGE difference IMO

May I say this .like i have, so said, in many cases, words are very important, especially "Biblical words and Biblical terminology". When a person Have been "Born from Above" He or she "DOES NOT" become a new person, He or She "BECOMES a NEW CREATURE"! That Person is no longer a "Normal Human being as the world knows Humans! FOR WE KNOW NOT WHAT WE ARE, BUT We are different, But When We See HIM! We are going to be JUST LIKE Him! And will not need, any clothes! For we will be "Clothe of GOD" Naked! And we are going to look GOOD! "Total Perfection"!
English Standard Version
"Beloved, we are God’s children now, and what we will be has not yet appeared; but we know that when he appears we shall be like him, because we shall see him as he is."

Now a lot of people who call themselves christians might become a new person. But we The "True Children of GOD" are "New Creatures" Born of GOD, Born from ABOVE, for this transition is not From the earth, it is from HEAVEN! There will be many who "appears as an Angel of Light", they say the right words, they talk the right talk, they walk the right walk, they dress the right dress, the even smell good, oh, they have become a "New person". They don't drink any more, they don't do drugs any more, they don't chase women anymore, they don't act like "Cats" anymore, they have become a new person.

I am not taking away from your "Post" by no means, for I am a part of "The Body of Christ".

 

[JerryfromMass]

I guess for me. It comes down to what you practice. There are more verses about this, but here are several.

Matt 7:23 "And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.'
Rom 1:32 and although they know the ordinance of God, that those who practice such things are worthy of death, they not only do the same, but also give hearty approval to those who practice them.
Rom 2:2 And we know that the judgment of God rightly falls upon those who practice such things.
Rom 7:19 For the good that I want, I do not do, but I practice the very evil that I do not want.
1Cor 11:16 But if one is inclined to be contentious, we have no other practice, nor have the churches of God.
Gal 5:21 envying, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these, of which I forewarn you, just as I have forewarned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
Eph 4:19 and they, having become callous, have given themselves over to sensuality for the practice of every kind of impurity with greediness.
Php 4:9 The things you have learned and received and heard and seen in me, practice these things, and the God of peace will be with you.
1Thes 4:10 for indeed you do practice it toward all the brethren who are in all Macedonia. But we urge you, brethren, to excel still more,
1Tim 5:4 but if any widow has children or grandchildren, they must first learn to practice piety in regard to their own family and to make some return to their parents; for this is acceptable in the sight of God.
Heb 5:14 But solid food is for the mature, who because of practice have their senses trained to discern good and evil.
2Pet 1:10 Therefore, brethren, be all the more diligent to make certain about His calling and choosing you; for as long as you practice these things, you will never stumble;
1Jn 1:6 If we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth;
1Jn 3:10 By this the children of God and the children of the devil are obvious: anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor the one who does not love his brother.
Rev 22:11 "Let the one who does wrong, still do wrong; and the one who is filthy, still be filthy; and let the one who is righteous, still practice righteousness; and the one who is holy, still keep himself holy."
Rom 13:4 for it is a minister of God to you for good. But if you do what is evil, be afraid; for it does not bear the sword for nothing; for it is a minister of God, an avenger who brings wrath on the one who practices evil.
Col 3:9 Do not lie to one another, since you laid aside the old self with its evil practices,
1Jn 2:29 If you know that He is righteous, you know that everyone also who practices righteousness is born of Him.
1Jn 3:4 Everyone who practices sin also practices lawlessness; and sin is lawlessness.
1Jn 3:7 Little children, make sure no one deceives you; the one who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous;
1Jn 3:8 the one who practices sin is of the devil; for the devil has sinned from the beginning. The Son of God appeared for this purpose, to destroy the works of the devil.
1Jn 3:9 No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

So for me, the question isn't so much... do you ever sin? It's more what are you practicing?

Rom 6:16 Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness?

If I stumble once a week, or once a month.. repent, ask for forgiveness, and move on.

If I'm willfully sinning everyday, and I never repent....

Heb 10:26; For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins,

What exactly is "practicing sin"? Is it it simply habitually sinning, or is it more, as in: habitually sinning with no regard for the consequences? Because when we sin, and confess our sin, the Lord is faithful and just to forgive us and cleanse us of all unrighteousness. So when does "making a practice of sin" become unforgivable?

 

[JerryfromMass]

May I say this .like i have, so said, in many cases, words are very important, especially "Biblical words and Biblical terminology". When a person Have been "Born from Above" He or she "DOES NOT" become a new person, He or She "BECOMES a NEW CREATURE"! That Person is no longer a "Normal Human being as the world knows Humans! FOR WE KNOW NOT WHAT WE ARE, BUT We are different, But When We See HIM! We are going to be JUST LIKE Him! And will not need, any clothes! For we will be "Clothe of GOD" Naked! And we are going to look GOOD! "Total Perfection"!
English Standard Version
"Beloved, we are God’s children now, and what we will be has not yet appeared; but we know that when he appears we shall be like him, because we shall see him as he is."

Now a lot of people who call themselves christians might become a new person. But we The "True Children of GOD" are "New Creatures" Born of GOD, Born from ABOVE, for this transition is not From the earth, it is from HEAVEN! There will be many who "appears as an Angel of Light", they say the right words, they talk the right talk, they walk the right walk, they dress the right dress, the even smell good, oh, they have become a "New person". They don't drink any more, they don't do drugs any more, they don't chase women anymore, they don't act like "Cats" anymore, they have become a new person.

I am not taking away from your "Post" by no means, for I am a part of "The Body of Christ".

"Act like cats"?

 

[B-A-C]

So when does "making a practice of sin" become unforgivable?

I think if you have to ask, your heart is already in the wrong place. Why would a Christian ask.. "How much can I get away with"?
Live as righteous as you can.

 

[JerryfromMass]

I think if you have to ask, your heart is already in the wrong place. Why would a Christian ask.. "How much can I get away with"?
Live as righteous as you can.

I never asked what you quoted. When you quote something that I did not write and attribute it me, that makes you a liar, a proud liar no doubt. You're so full of hypocricy. Pride is your sin.

"Live as righteous as you can." What? Are you serious? All of your righteousness is like menstrual rags to the Lord. You don't think so, though, do you? Prideful puffed-up left-coaster.

I live in Jesus's righteousness, for it is HIS sinless perfection and HIS righteousness that covers me.

Must be something in the water in Oregon. You living in an autonomous zone? Examine yourself quickly. You know not when the Lord will require your soul.

 

[B-A-C]

I never asked what you quoted. When you quote something that I did not write and attribute it me,

I didn't attribute anything to you. I didn't quote you.
I said if "you" have to ask, you as in anyone reading this.

"Live as righteous as you can." What? Are you serious? All of your righteousness is like menstrual rags to the Lord.

It says something similar (speaking of misquotes) in the old testament, it doesn't say that in the new testament.

Luke 17:9; "He does not thank the slave because he did the things which were commanded, does he?
Luke 17:10; "So you too, when you do all the things which are commanded you, say, 'We are unworthy slaves; we have done only that which we ought to have done.'"

 

[Dave M]

So when does "making a practice of sin" become unforgivable?

1 Corinthians 6:9-11
Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

what the diffrence between these people who are practicing sin and the people who are going to heaven?????? I know lots of people who say they believe, and are drunkards and greedy, and revilers.... are you saying they are going to heaven,,,,?????? Paul says these people are not going to heaven

can a born again believer be a drunk found at the local pub every night for 20 years???? does the way you live matter????

 

[JerryfromMass]

I didn't attribute anything to you. I didn't quote you.
I said if "you" have to ask, you as in anyone reading this.



It says something similar (speaking of misquotes) in the old testament, it doesn't say that in the new testament.

Luke 17:9; "He does not thank the slave because he did the things which were commanded, does he?
Luke 17:10; "So you too, when you do all the things which are commanded you, say, 'We are unworthy slaves; we have done only that which we ought to have done.'"

You are a liar and a pharisee. Repent.

 

[JerryfromMass]

1 Corinthians 6:9-11
Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

what the diffrence between these people who are practicing sin and the people who are going to heaven?????? I know lots of people who say they believe, and are drunkards and greedy, and revilers.... are you saying they are going to heaven,,,,?????? Paul says these people are not going to heaven

can a born again believer be a drunk found at the local pub every night for 20 years???? does the way you live matter????

Ahhh, please go back to my question. It's very straight forward and specific, and shouldn't be so difficult to answer.

 

[JerryfromMass]

I didn't attribute anything to you. I didn't quote you.
I said if "you" have to ask, you as in anyone reading this.



It says something similar (speaking of misquotes) in the old testament, it doesn't say that in the new testament.

Luke 17:9; "He does not thank the slave because he did the things which were commanded, does he?
Luke 17:10; "So you too, when you do all the things which are commanded you, say, 'We are unworthy slaves; we have done only that which we ought to have done.'"

I didn't quote anyone but you. You're not illiterate, are you?

 

[Dave M]

Ahhh, please go back to my question. It's very straight forward and specific, and shouldn't be so difficult to answer.

I already gave the straightforward answere, yet it is not a straightforward topic,

 

[JerryfromMass]

I already gave the straightforward answere, yet it is not a straightforward topic,

No you didn't. You cited scripture of Paul pointing to unsaved people that are not going to heaven. I asked specifically in regard to the saved, and I'll repost it here:

What exactly is "practicing sin"? Is it it simply habitually sinning, or is it more, as in: habitually sinning with no regard for the consequences? Because when we sin, and confess our sin, the Lord is faithful and just to forgive us and cleanse us of all unrighteousness. So when does "making a practice of sin" become unforgivable?

 

[Dave M]

this is a great thread by Ray giving truth to the matter as so many are confused with all the free grace to sin being preached today I hope it helps some,

Pre-meditated sin

There is a word used in legal courts today. This word isn't in the Bible anywhere, but I believe the concept of this.. is in the Bible. "premeditated". What does that word mean? It simply means I thought about something and contemplated it, before I actually do it. I'm an old guy, over half...

www.talkjesus.com

There is a word used in legal courts today. This word isn't in the Bible anywhere, but I believe the concept of this.. is in the Bible.

"premeditated". What does that word mean? It simply means I thought about something and contemplated it, before I actually do it.

I'm an old guy, over half a century old. But I remember when we had "heat of the moment" laws.
If you came home from work, and you caught your wife in bed with another man, and you pulled out a gun and killed them both right in that moment...
the courts went easier on you. (Of course you still had to prove the circumstances).
If you knew about this, and them waited days and days to plan some diabolical end for them.. maybe even make it look like an accident... but then you
were caught. The courts went harder on you. The difference is, you didn't really think very much about what you did in the heat of the moment.
You did think quite a bit about the second scenario. You took a lot of time and planned out their demise.

I see this concept in the Bible also.
Now maybe I'm hammering a nail into a board today, and I accidentally hit my thumb with the hammer... and I yell out something similar to "oh shoot". (maybe not that exact word)
I didn't plan on hitting my thumb today, it was unexpected. Maybe I wasn't even planning on nailing some board together, it just happened.
But even so... I sinned. I said a bad word.

Second scenario. I'm having an affair on my wife. It's been going on for a couple of months now. I hide my phone texts, I hide my emails, I delete my phone call history.
I make excuses to say I'm working late, or I'm going to visit some guys I know. I've had a lot of time to plan this out. ..and I keep doing it, and keep doing it.
I know I saw this lady yesterday, and I know I'll see her tomorrow, in fact, I'm planning on seeing her tomorrow, and the day after, and the day after... and so on.

One of these two sins... is willful sin. The other is not willful sin. I didn't plan on hitting my thumb, I didn't willfully do it.
The other sin, I'm willfully doing it, I'm willfully planning on doing it. There is a difference.

Heb 10:26; For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27; but a terrifying expectation of judgment and the fury of a fire which will consume the adversaries

Notice it doesn't say, if you've ever sinned. It doesn't say if you stumbled. When you stumble.. you fall on accident.

James 3:2; For we all stumble in many ways. If anyone does not stumble in what he says, he is a perfect man, able to rein in the whole body as well.
Some people fall on purpose.

James is talking about stumbling. I tripped over that rock I didn't see. I wasn't trying to trip over it, I just wasn't aware of it.
The writer of Hebrews is talking about willful, planned, premeditated sin. I know I did that sin yesterday, and I'm planning on doing it tomorrow.

We may never be able to stop stumbling. But if we don't stop the willful sin... Jesus's sacrifice no longer covers us.

 

[Dave M]

No you didn't.

so No I am not sinless or perfect,,,, but I am NOT a practicing sinner,,,,,,,,, and yes there is a HUGE difference IMO