Poll on a prosperous lifestyle

[KingJ]

I am going to harp on people driving Ferraris .

There are Christians that believe driving a Ferrari is fine. It is a sign of God's blessing. They must have given ten times Ferrari gifts to be blessed with one. It is a sign of faith and trusting God to answer our prayer requests for wants, not merely needs.

Then there are Christians that say a Ferrari sized blessing from giving Ferrari sized gifts should be the pleasure that comes from feeding an orphan. There is no way a Ferrari will not push pride. If you are a rich Christian invest your money and live modestly. There are always other Christians, orphans, widows and the unsaved in poverty that need help.

 

[KingJ]

For all that say ''yes'', please explain to me:

1. How a flashy car does not push our pride?
2. How a Ferrari > Toyota plus helping an orphan for life.

 

[amadeus2]

What if the answer depends on the real situation rather than a hypothetical one?

Jesus told one man, who was apparently rich in things of this world, to sell all that he had and give it all to the poor [Matt 19:16ff]. Must this apply then to every man who would have eternal Life? The OT was full of exacting literal rules given by God to Moses, but just having the rules did not get all of those who followed Moses into the Promised Land. If we are given more by God then He will require more of us [Luke 12:48]. Riches will not condemn us, but they do put more responsibility on us. The key is being able to hear what God is saying and then obeying what we have heard.

Scripture says that the love of money/mammon is the root of all evil. It does not say that only people who are poor will make it to the end of His road.

 

[KingJ]

What if the answer depends on the real situation rather than a hypothetical one?

1. Jesus told one man, who was apparently rich in things of this world, to sell all that he had and give it all to the poor [Matt 19:16ff]. Must this apply then to every man who would have eternal Life?

2. The OT was full of exacting literal rules given by God to Moses, but just having the rules did not get all of those who followed Moses into the Promised Land.

3. If we are given more by God then He will require more of us [Luke 12:48]. Riches will not condemn us, but they do put more responsibility on us. The key is being able to hear what God is saying and then obeying what we have heard.

4. Scripture says that the love of money/mammon is the root of all evil. It does not say that only people who are poor will make it to the end of His road.

1. No. The rich man had his heart in his riches.

2. True. Tithing alone proves that it was God's will to financially bless the Jews. Living lavishly with money was part and parcel of being a good Jew.

3. Amen. Riches does equal more expectations of us. Would God ever tell us to not buy a Ferrari if we have the money though?

4. Agreed. I am not suggesting we must be poor at all.

Prov Keep falsehood and lies far from me; give me neither poverty nor riches, but give me only my daily bread.

 

[Peter]

It is all relative to a point, and we can argue where that point is until we are blue in the face.
The bottom line is, can we let go of everything we have, without resentment, without fear of poverty, and still be in love with Christ and God?
- If not, then we value worldly things above our true spiritual self.
- If so, then we value our true spiritual self above worldly false-self (ego).

Our human body can be regarded as a car. Some shape and polish it look and perform like a Ferrari; and some abuse it. Most are in between.
Then there will be a time when the car dies, with us in it. Do we stay in it for ever, or get out all lost and helpless, or do we step out and be happy to go home?
(just an analogy).

 

[amadeus2]

3. Amen. Riches does equal more expectations of us. Would God ever tell us to not buy a Ferrari if we have the money though?

The question perhaps should be: Would God ever tell us to buy that Ferrari? While in most cases He probably would not, there might be a special lesson needed, which would come from making such a purchase.

4. Agreed. I am not suggesting we must be poor at all.

What we do need to desire to be is rich in whatever things God wants us to be rich. Would this not always include His Word and His Spirit?

Prov Keep falsehood and lies far from me; give me neither poverty nor riches, but give me only my daily bread.

And let that Word in us be quickened by His Spirit!

 

[Fragrant Grace]

Greetings @KingJ

The scriptures are very clear

But godliness with contentment is great gain.
For we brought nothing into this world, and it is certain we can carry nothing out.
And having food and raiment let us be therewith content.
But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition.
For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.
1 Timothy 6:6-10

Not that I speak in respect of want: for I have learned, in whatsoever state I am, therewith to be content.
I know both how to be abased, and I know how to abound: every where and in all things I am instructed both to be full and to be hungry, both to abound and to suffer need.
Philippians 4:11-12

Better is little with the fear of the LORD than great treasure and trouble therewith.
Proverbs 15:16

 

[Wired 4 Fishen]

@KingJ Greetings,
Brother KJ so this is your well agreed apon thread you were talking about.
I pray that you do not go overboard here too and get things all twisted and stirred up.
God Bless You Kj
Jim

 

[Wired 4 Fishen]

The question perhaps should be: Would God ever tell us to buy that Ferrari? While in most cases He probably would not, there might be a special lesson needed, which would come from making such a purchase.




What we do need to desire to be is rich in whatever things God wants us to be rich. Would this not always include His Word and His Spirit?




And let that Word in us be quickened by His Spirit!

Greetings,
It is not about if God would tell us to buy a fancy car or house or what have you. Scripture says He gives us "all Things" richly to enjoy. Now scripture also tells us to NOT Love the things of this world. God is Love and we LOVE God and people and the things of God but we can sure enjoy these other things..........Now scripture also tells us to seek Him and His righteousness first and all these things will be added unto us. I put all but some translations use it.

Now these things can range from food to bills to clothes to cars and houses and spouses and mouses if you so desire.
The way to see these things is to draw close to God and learn to walk in the spirit. YOU actually do what His word says or another words walk by faith living as He has set forth for us to live. So to have a fancy home or car or anything else is not sin or being a poor steward or anything else as long as your heart is right and you are walking according to His will which is His word and ways.

Now tell me Kj the what you would call over the top boat God gave me for my fishing business I had, I was wrong to keep it and use it ? If so then God would have been wrong to give it to me.
Its not having these things that is wrong or gets you into trouble it is the LOVE of them which means they are most important in your life. Priorities and the heart brother make all the difference.
God Bless YOU
Jim

 

[amadeus2]

Greetings,
It is not about if God would tell us to buy a fancy car or house or what have you. Scripture says He gives us "all Things" richly to enjoy. Now scripture also tells us to NOT Love the things of this world. God is Love and we LOVE God and people and the things of God but we can sure enjoy these other things..........Now scripture also tells us to seek Him and His righteousness first and all these things will be added unto us. I put all but some translations use it.

Yes, it is where we place too much emphasis and where we do not.

Now these things can range from food to bills to clothes to cars and houses and spouses and mouses if you so desire.
The way to see these things is to draw close to God and learn to walk in the spirit. YOU actually do what His word says or another words walk by faith living as He has set forth for us to live. So to have a fancy home or car or anything else is not sin or being a poor steward or anything else as long as your heart is right and you are walking according to His will which is His word and ways.

Again, yes! Trying to make black and white rules that always apply is never the answer, but sometime some people insist on there being such rules and some people help (supposedly) people out by defining such rules.

 

[Chad]

here's a few things to consider

God is God. He is glorified when we are content in Him and display His good deeds in our lives to the world. This applies to everything. Finances, physical, material, spiritual.

It boils down foremost to a person's heart.

"The Lord does not look at the things man looks at. Man looks at the outward appearance, but the Lord looks at the heart." (1 Samuel 16:7)

If you strive to be rich, it's sinful and will fall into temptation. But, if you seek the kingdom first GOD may choose to bless your finances richly, knowing your heart.

2 Corinthians 9:6
Remember this: Whoever sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and whoever sows generously will also reap generously.

Matthew 6:24-25, 31-33
“No one can serve two masters. Either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and Money. “Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat or drink; or about your body, what you will wear. Is not life more important than food, and the body more important than clothes? So do not worry, saying, ‘What shall we eat?’ or ‘What shall we drink?’ or ‘What shall we wear?’ For the pagans run after all these things, and your heavenly Father knows that you need them. But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well.

The above Scripture shows a few Biblical principles clearly. First, it acknowledges that God is aware of our need for money. We need money to survive. God fully knows this.

Second, it says that if you seek the kingdom of God first, all of those things (money, food, etc.) will be given to you. Jesus says that if we seek the kingdom of God first, everything that we need will be provided. This tells us that God indeed has plans to give us money or take care of our needs. God will feed you. So those are two powerful points. God knows we need money, God plans to give us money if we seek his kingdom first.

God does want us to prosper in all things

John 3:2-3
Beloved, I pray that all may go well with you and that you may be in good health, as it goes well with your soul.” Some translations say “that you prosper in all things

 

[KingJ]

@KingJ Greetings,
Brother KJ so this is your well agreed apon thread you were talking about.
I pray that you do not go overboard here too and get things all twisted and stirred up.
God Bless You Kj
Jim

Twisted and stirred up? As long as their are no Christians that teach... we must leave the world and lusts of the flesh behind by pursuing the world and the lusts of the flesh....I won't be getting stirred up .

 

[Wired 4 Fishen]

Twisted and stirred up? As long as their are no Christians that teach... we must leave the world and lusts of the flesh behind by pursuing the world and the lusts of the flesh....I won't be getting stirred up .

Happy Blessings My fried ! :thumbsup:

 

[KingJ]

Greetings,
It is not about if God would tell us to buy a fancy car or house or what have you. Scripture says He gives us "all Things" richly to enjoy. Now scripture also tells us to NOT Love the things of this world. God is Love and we LOVE God and people and the things of God but we can sure enjoy these other things..........Now scripture also tells us to seek Him and His righteousness first and all these things will be added unto us. I put all but some translations use it.

Now these things can range from food to bills to clothes to cars and houses and spouses and mouses if you so desire.
The way to see these things is to draw close to God and learn to walk in the spirit. YOU actually do what His word says or another words walk by faith living as He has set forth for us to live. So to have a fancy home or car or anything else is not sin or being a poor steward or anything else as long as your heart is right and you are walking according to His will which is His word and ways.

Now tell me Kj the what you would call over the top boat God gave me for my fishing business I had, I was wrong to keep it and use it ? If so then God would have been wrong to give it to me.
Its not having these things that is wrong or gets you into trouble it is the LOVE of them which means they are most important in your life. Priorities and the heart brother make all the difference.
God Bless YOU
Jim

There are three issues to be mindful of on everything we spend our money on. As we do ''all'' as unto God.

1. Vanity
2. Waste / excessive spending
3. Abusing a gift.

1. Vanity needs to be considered with every purchase. From a tattoo, I-phone 6 to a Ferrari. If we feel convicted of vanity, we feel convicted of vanity.

2. Self explanatory.

3. This is the chief issue imho. If God abnormally blesses us financially. He has given us a gift. We must use this gift for His glory. It must never be a case of self indulgement > selflessness.

Did Samson enter wrestling tournaments? Did Paul host magic shows picking up snakes? Did Moses abuse having God's ear to tell peoples fortunes?

Pastor driving a Ferrari = Christianity fail. You say I cannot judge? If a pastor does not want to be judged then he must not be a pastor. If Christians do not want to be judged according to scripture then we must not be Christians.

Christianity 101 = James 1:27. Feeding an orphan ''should'' bring us more joy then ownership of a Ferrari. Christianity can simply not be faked.

 

[KingJ]

Second, it says that if you seek the kingdom of God first, all of those things (money, food, etc.) will be given to you. Jesus says that if we seek the kingdom of God first, everything that we need will be provided. This tells us that God indeed has plans to give us money or take care of our needs. God will feed you. So those are two powerful points. God knows we need money, God plans to give us money if we seek his kingdom first.

God does want us to prosper in all things

I agree with all you have said. God does want us to prosper.

The only issue to bear in mind is that if we look at Abraham and Job, we see that they prospered because God could trust them. If God could not trust them, would they have prospered? If Abraham bought a Ferrari chariot of the day, would it be evidence of him being trustworthy with money? Would the people think he is a modest / humble / selfless man of God?

God does not change. Humility, modesty and selflessness is part and parcel of Him and Christianity from day 1.

 

[Wired 4 Fishen]

There are three issues to be mindful of on everything we spend our money on. As we do ''all'' as unto God.

1. Vanity
2. Waste / excessive spending
3. Abusing a gift.

1. Vanity needs to be considered with every purchase. From a tattoo, I-phone 6 to a Ferrari. If we feel convicted of vanity, we feel convicted of vanity.

2. Self explanatory.

3. This is the chief issue imho. If God abnormally blesses us financially. He has given us a gift. We must use this gift for His glory. It must never be a case of self indulgement > selflessness.

Did Samson enter wrestling tournaments? Did Paul host magic shows picking up snakes? Did Moses abuse having God's ear to tell peoples fortunes?

Pastor driving a Ferrari = Christianity fail. You say I cannot judge? If a pastor does not want to be judged then he must not be a pastor. If Christians do not want to be judged according to scripture then we must not be Christians.

Christianity 101 = James 1:27. Feeding an orphan ''should'' bring us more joy then ownership of a Ferrari. Christianity can simply not be faked.

Brother KJ
Your views on judging are not quite clear here for it sounds as if christians should be judging christians...That is not true.
Taking care of widows and orphans is NOT a command as if everything we have must go to these.
If God gives a pasdtor a fancy car then here is what the pastor should do.
Thank You Lord God and drive the thing and when God says give thisd fancy car to so and so then the pastors says Praise God it is so and gives the casr away and perhaps the next car he gets will be even fancier.

Why is it that you think a Christian is wrong to have nice things ?
We are to be the light (Gods love and ways) We are meant to be above the people iin the world. The things created which means fancy cars are not for the worldy brother.

As you put it Christianity 101
It is not money that is the root of evil BUT THE LOVE OF MONEY which means your cares for money is more then anything else including God.
Could you clear these matters up
Bless You brother KJ

 

[Wired 4 Fishen]

I agree with all you have said. God does want us to prosper.

The only issue to bear in mind is that if we look at Abraham and Job, we see that they prospered because God could trust them. If God could not trust them, would they have prospered? If Abraham bought a Ferrari chariot of the day, would it be evidence of him being trustworthy with money? Would the people think he is a modest / humble / selfless man of God?

God does not change. Humility, modesty and selflessness is part and parcel of Him and Christianity from day 1.

Brother KJ no disrespect meant here but your views on a prosperous Christian are more in tune with rteligion then God and His ways.

 

[KingJ]

Now tell me Kj the what you would call over the top boat God gave me for my fishing business I had, I was wrong to keep it and use it ? If so then God would have been wrong to give it to me.

Bad business? Sell it, buy a reliable boat that will do the job and invest the excess.

 

[Wired 4 Fishen]

Bad business? Sell it, buy a reliable boat that will do the job and invest the excess.

So God hired you to go around and fix all His mistakes ? KJ if God gives it to you then howis it wrong ?

 

[KingJ]

Brother KJ
1. Your views on judging are not quite clear here for it sounds as if christians should be judging christians...That is not true.
2. Taking care of widows and orphans is NOT a command as if everything we have must go to these.
3. If God gives a pasdtor a fancy car then here is what the pastor should do.
Thank You Lord God and drive the thing and when God says give thisd fancy car to so and so then the pastors says Praise God it is so and gives the casr away and perhaps the next car he gets will be even fancier.

4. Why is it that you think a Christian is wrong to have nice things ?
5. We are to be the light (Gods love and ways) We are meant to be above the people iin the world. The things created which means fancy cars are not for the worldy brother.

As you put it Christianity 101
It is not money that is the root of evil BUT THE LOVE OF MONEY which means your cares for money is more then anything else including God.
Could you clear these matters up
Bless You brother KJ

1. Your views on judging are not quite clear here for it sounds as if christians should not be judging Christians. We should live as we please?
2. Please quote me. I don't like it when people put words in my mouth.
3. A pastor needs to wait for God to ''magically'' tell him the right thing to do? Then when the pastor does the right thing he will get more gifts to boost his vanity and self indulgence? Are we talking about Satanism or Christianity here? My bible tells me we should give expecting nothing in return. My bible tells me we should want treasure in heaven.
4. Please quote me. I don't like it when people put words in my mouth.
5. Modesty, humility and selflessness are Christianity 101. Pride, self indulgence and arrogance are satanism 101.