Somethings i dont get

[Zendra]

Ok i was at an Easter camp a while back and the guy speaking said we are all worthy of gods love. But then later our group leader was talking and said that no one deserved it. Which is it?
Also Jesus died on the cross so that we would be saved from going to hell. But in the bible it says that if we don't accept Jesus we will burn forever.
Speaking of hell Iv heard some say that is an actual place while others saying it is not knowing Jesus.
Thanks for your time

 

[cole]

You're going to get a wide variety of answers on this one, Zendra. Different traditions and cultures have their own answers -- I'll give you my opinion but I definitely recommend you take a course in theology and hit the books to find your own path.

...the guy speaking said we are all worthy of gods love. But then later our group leader was talking and said that no one deserved it. Which is it?

I believe we are all worthy of God's love -- we are all human beings who were created in His image, but further than that we are all fallible and everybody makes mistakes. I believe God loves us as his children, just as a Father or Mother loves his/her children unconditionally.

But in the bible it says that if we don't accept Jesus we will burn forever.

Here's where I'm sure a few people will not be too happy with my answer. Whether or not the entirety of the bible is divinely inspired or not it was written by people (fallible people!). What scholars generally agree that Jesus said is somewhat different than the picture we get in Pauline Christianity. Remember: Jesus was Jewish and in Judaism there is no intermediary between you and God (although there were ceremonies involving the Temple).

Throughout history different religions have used fear tactics to help convert numbers of people. I think saying that failure to accept Jesus = hell is inaccurate and crude theology from a loving god!

In my view, it is far more important to be a moral human being than a Christian, Jew, etc.

Speaking of hell Iv heard some say that is an actual place while others saying it is not knowing Jesus.

"Hell" in Hebrew is "Sheol" but I think it was mainly a literary/poetic device for isolation from God. I've heard several rabbis say that Judaism does not have heaven and hell (although there are certainly concepts of it in the literature), but rather closeness to God. If you are a moral person you will be drawn near to God, but if you are not then you separate yourself from Him and that's a painful, lonely existence.

In my opinion, it's important for you to read as much as you can (scripture, apocrypha, archaeological and anthropological books, etc) about Christianity and its origins. These will give you a good grounding to understand what's in scripture and what the biblical authors were referencing (hopefully, at least!).

 

[Questioning]

Ok i was at an Easter camp a while back and the guy speaking said we are all worthy of gods love. But then later our group leader was talking and said that no one deserved it. Which is it?

Worthy?

From my bible reading, which is quite extensive, it seems apparent that the gospel message is based on the prerequisite that NOBODY is worthy of God's love, but that God loves people in spite of the fact that no one is worthy of it. The state of being "not worthy" allows for the various doctrinal issues of predestination and election whereby god choses one and not another. Remember, before they were born or had done any right or wrong, God loved Isaac and hated Esau. He makes some vessels for honor and others for dishonor in order that he might make his power known through that wrath and destruction. If humans were "worthy" of God's love, then those sorts of decisions on his part would negate their worthiness of his love.

Also Jesus died on the cross so that we would be saved from going to hell. But in the bible it says that if we don't accept Jesus we will burn forever.Speaking of hell Iv heard some say that is an actual place while others saying it is not knowing Jesus.
Thanks for your time

The bible seems to say a lot of things on the subject of hell and the lake of fire. (Hell and the lake of fire are two different things, by the way). I wouldn't be able to reconcile a "good and holy" God even making an eternal torture pit, but I guess that for a lot people the description and the behavior are perfectly compatible.

As far as I am aware, the Old Testament does not mention an eternal punishment for those who don't believe but does mention eternal consequences for certain actions (but some of these don't seem to present a literal eternity but rather a figurative eternity--such as "it's going to take me forever to study for this test!") There's even one verse that declares that the dead know nothing at all once they are dead. (In Ecclesiastes). However, in the New Testament there seems to be quite a lot of talk about eternal punishment. There's even a verse that describes the smoke of those tormented in hell continually rising up before God's throne. This verse seems to imply that just as God enjoyed the sweet-smelling "incense" of the OT sacrifices on the altar, He also enjoys the smell of those who are continually burning in the lake of fire. So I guess on this issue you'll have to decide which scriptures make the most sense together and what that combination of verses say about hell or the lake of fire. Good luck in your search!

 

[Boanerges]

Ok i was at an Easter camp a while back and the guy speaking said we are all worthy of gods love. But then later our group leader was talking and said that no one deserved it. Which is it?
Also Jesus died on the cross so that we would be saved from going to hell. But in the bible it says that if we don't accept Jesus we will burn forever.
Speaking of hell Iv heard some say that is an actual place while others saying it is not knowing Jesus.
Thanks for your time

You may indeed get different answers and views but Jesus Christ talked more about hell than anyone else in the Bible.
If one believes the Bible is God's Word he will hear from God and grow in truth but as far as an unbeliever he might as well read an encyclopedia.
Grace is undeserved, unmerited favor from a God who loves us in spite of ourselves my friend.

 

[HoneyBare]

Gosh, Zendra, you are indeed getting differing responses. I think Bonerges said it right . . . you HAVE to believe the Bible is true and that He had full control of the interpretation it is in today, or of course you would be really confused. "Finding your own path" is easy, but Jesus said His path was narrow and that whoever followed His path would find eternal life.

As far as spending eternity in Hell as described in the Bible, I would not take the chance of finding out it was literal or poetic in the end. Why would you want to find your own path if there was a possibility that the "straight and narrow way" would lead you straight to God and you'd live the rest of your life in peace and contentment?

Believing in something means trusting that you have chosen the right way, there is no insecurity in knowing for sure if you are on the right path. When I surrendered my life to God, and listened only to the Bible and believed every part of it . . . that's when my feet turned around from the path I was on and the Bible became clear in my understanding. That's when I found the peace that passed all understanding and I'm clinging to it because I don't trust all that others say. I only trust God's Word and what He teaches me.

If surrendering your life to God meant finding all your questions answered, then I would consider doing that, my friend. All I know is that it worked for me.

 

[MelodyC]

You have received a number of conflicting answers. However I thought I would give it a go and hope i don't confuse things further.

As some earlier poster(memory not good) pointed out we are made by God and in His image. As God's creation we are valued by the Lord and He loves us.

Now there is the problem of SIN. None of us are worthy because of our SIN.

When God first created mankind there was no SIN and then when SIN entered the world we were no longer worthy.

However God still LOVED us and restored us to Him through Jesus. Our worthiness once again given back to us through His Son's death on the Cross which deals with our SIN.

We know God loves us and that SIN cuts us off from being able to relationship with Him. So we are worthy because we are God's workmanship but unworthy because of SIN.

I hope that makes some sense to you?

MelC