the rapture

[cman77]

i am curious about what all of you think about the rapture. do you believe it to be pre-tribulation or post- tribulation? i personally believe it to be post- tribulation. i am not interested in starting a debate i just want know what you all think.

 

[nEw.CrEaTiOn]

Personally, I am a pre-tribulation believer myself. Because the tribulation, Christians are going to be persecuted and killed. But the Bible says that Jesus will come back like a theif in the night. I think that the panic of all of the missing people will kick the tribulation into motion. That's what I believe, but I am curious as to why you believe it to be post-trib.

 

[Gracealone]

i am curious about what all of you think about the rapture. do you believe it to be pre-tribulation or post- tribulation? i personally believe it to be post- tribulation. i am not interested in starting a debate i just want know what you all think.

I believe Gods word to say we will be saved from the wrath to come, so I am pre-trib.....1Thes. 5:9 We are to comfort one another with these words. 1Thes. 4:18.....
There would be no comfort apart from his promise that we are not appointed unto wrath, and since we are told we will not know the day, or the hour, pre-trib alone makes sense. If the rapture was Post trib, we could count the days, and know what day....seems to me anyway.

 

[cman77]

i believe that the tribulation is post tribulation because if it wasn't then how would our faith be tested? the tribulation is the persecution of christians right. but if we are all raptured away what christians will be left to be persecuted. and when it says that we will be saved from the wrath to come i think it means the wrath of god not the wrath of man.

 

[nEw.CrEaTiOn]

I can see your side of it, but the I believe there will be no true Christians left, only people who believed to be Christians because they said it with their mouth only, or because they grew up in a Christian home. I think that when these people see that the rapture actually happened, they will definatley spread God's word. I also believe that many people who were family members of Chistians, will turn to the Bible because of their loved one's dissapearence. I love the movie LEFT BEHIND. I highly recommend it. I think that movie portrays the beliefs for pre-tribulation VERY well, and it makes perfect sense to me. As to our faith being test, we have trials in every day life....think of Job.

 

[nEw.CrEaTiOn]

Chad posted an awesome blog for the rapture. You should read it. IT gives scripture references and everything.

 

[Gracealone]

i believe that the tribulation is post tribulation because if it wasn't then how would our faith be tested? the tribulation is the persecution of christians right. but if we are all raptured away what christians will be left to be persecuted. and when it says that we will be saved from the wrath to come i think it means the wrath of god not the wrath of man.

The Tribulation is not the persecution of Christians, it is the wrath of God upon a non- believing world.
Many become Saints during that time, but it is not the Church.
The Church has been caught away for a wedding feast , and will return with Christ at the end of the tribulation.
We, the Church are the bride of Christ, we are not appointed unto wrath as the word tells us in 1Timothy 5:9
The Bible also tells us to escape the wrath to come.
How do we escape? By being born again now, before the tribulation starts.Matt 3:7

1Thesalonians 1:10 also says he delivered us from the wrath to come.

We have a promise from God, so dont confuse the tribulation saints with the church.....we are to comfort one another with that hope.

Dont let anyone tell you it is an escapist attitude, Christians today are being killed for their faith, but that is from the evil in mans heart.
The tribulation is the wrath of God against an evil and unrepentant world.

 

[cman77]

To Gracealone-

first i would like to respond to your first comment about how if the rapture was post trip we would be able to count the days. I'm curious do you know the how long the tribulation lasts? and another thing where does it say that we won't be persecuted? it doesn't. in fact it says quite the opposite.

Revelation 13:10

anyone destined for prison will be taken to prison. anyone destined to die by the sword will die by the sword. this means that gods holy people must endure persecution patiently and remain faithful.

Revelation 13:10


Revelation 7:13-14

then one of the twenty-four elders asked me, "Who are these who are clothed in white? Where did they come from?" And i said to him, "Sir, you are the one who knows." then he said to me, "these are the one who died in the great tribulation. they have washed their robes in the blood of the lamb and made them white."

Revelation 7:13-14

the tribulation is not referring to the wrath of god on unbelievers it is referring to the world persecuting Christians. the wrath to come is gods wrath on the world. i have one last question for you. are you sure that we are not in the Tribulation? like you said christians are being killed all over the world. there is documented violence against christians in over fifty different countries. and that is only the documented. how many more do you think have been put in prison, beaten or killed? it is hust something to think about

 

[Boanerges]

I am pan trib- I will wait and see how it pans out- lol!

Seriously though I am post trib. I do not believe God is going to pull out His people when the world needs them most. God has a different view of death than the average human and it is considered an honor to be martyred for Christ.
And of course there is this scripture :
1Co 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
It is at the sounding of the Last Trump that Christ returns for His people and that certainly happens late in the game.

 

[Ncdataman]

The true bottom line on the Tribulation is this, are you saved or not? It does not really matter when it occurs, the question is are you saved now? Can you afford to wait and find out after it happens? Are our friends and family saved? If not we have work to do, when Christ comes for us, we should be ready.

IN Christ,

NC

 

[Boanerges]

The true bottom line on the Tribulation is this, are you saved or not? It does not really matter when it occurs, the question is are you saved now? Can you afford to wait and find out after it happens? Are our friends and family saved? If not we have work to do, when Christ comes for us, we should be ready.

IN Christ,

NC

Agreed 100% my friend. Personally I believe that if we work on developing our personal relationship with God, study His Word and keep up with personal evangelism we will be ready no matter when He comes.

 

[Gracealone]

To Gracealone-

first i would like to respond to your first comment about how if the rapture was post trip we would be able to count the days. I'm curious do you know the how long the tribulation lasts? and another thing where does it say that we won't be persecuted? it doesn't. in fact it says quite the opposite.

Revelation 13:10

anyone destined for prison will be taken to prison. anyone destined to die by the sword will die by the sword. this means that gods holy people must endure persecution patiently and remain faithful.

Revelation 13:10


Revelation 7:13-14

then one of the twenty-four elders asked me, "Who are these who are clothed in white? Where did they come from?" And i said to him, "Sir, you are the one who knows." then he said to me, "these are the one who died in the great tribulation. they have washed their robes in the blood of the lamb and made them white."

Revelation 7:13-14

the tribulation is not referring to the wrath of god on unbelievers it is referring to the world persecuting Christians. the wrath to come is gods wrath on the world. i have one last question for you. are you sure that we are not in the Tribulation? like you said christians are being killed all over the world. there is documented violence against christians in over fifty different countries. and that is only the documented. how many more do you think have been put in prison, beaten or killed? it is hust something to think about

I think Sir, you need to go back and read through Revelation again.

The Saints mentioned in Revelation, is not the Church, but tribulation Saints. A big difference.
They are the ones clothed in white ,coming out of the tribulation.

The tribulation will be for 7 years filling in the last week of Daniel
which speaks of 70 weeks of years......there is one week left.
The tribulation time. Daniel 9:24-27 490 have been accomplished, 7 left.

Revelation clearly says it is the wrath of God, in several places.
Rev. 6:16
Rev. 11:18
Rev. 14:10
Rev. 15:1
Rev. 16:1
Rev. 16:19

Then, I didn't say Christians wouldn't be persecuted, we are, even this very day.
I said, according to scripture we are not appointed unto Gods wrath.

That is why we will not be in the tribulation, we are not appointed unto Gods wrath as promised in 1Thes. 5:9

After the letter to the Churches in Rev. 1-2-3- John is called to come up here.....a picture of the rapture. The church is not mentioned again until Rev. 19: where we will return with him.
WE have to be there to return with him.

Rev.19:6 -10 describes the marriage supper of the Lamb, the church is the Bride of Christ.
The voice of those praising God in vrs one Rev. 1:1 is the church, we are at a marriage feast......the 24 elders are represent the church.

The rider then, on the white horse in none other than our Lord
Jesus Christ.

 

[Gracealone]

Originally Posted by Ncdataman
The true bottom line on the Tribulation is this, are you saved or not? It does not really matter when it occurs, the question is are you saved now? Can you afford to wait and find out after it happens? Are our friends and family saved? If not we have work to do, when Christ comes for us, we should be ready.

IN Christ,

Also Ncdataman, I agree with you.
We will soon find out the truth of Gods timing , and those who are truly born again will be with him, even as we are now.

I have unsaved family, and my hearts desire is for them to be saved.

That is the most important thing ,at this time.

Love the Lord, with all my heart, and be found faithful.
In Christ, Gracealone

 

[Gracealone]

Boanerges said;

Agreed 100% my friend. Personally I believe that if we work on developing our personal relationship with God, study His Word and keep up with personal evangelism we will be ready no matter when He comes.

Glad to have a lot of AMENS this morning! Praise God! Right on ,Boanerges

 

[cman77]

you are right about it not mattering when christ comes. it is no reflection on our faith whether we believe its pre-trib or post-trib. like i originally said i was just curious about your thoughts on the subject. thank you all for posting your thoughts. and remember that there is nothing wrong with having debates

 

[nEw.CrEaTiOn]

Great point, Nc. It really doesn't matter. I'll be here working for God as long as we have time, we all should.

 

[Gracealone]

Amen to both of you, and may God richly bless you both.....:friends:

 

[Molaoa]

I was asking myself and my dad about the same thing early last year. the way I read revelations or interpret it is that it is post tribulation, but thats a personal view. I aagree with som e of the people before me that it doesn't mater when it is, just like it is said we must stay ready at all times because He will come like theif in the night. I know its a scary thought going through all the bad things prophesied but if God wants it that way then it is good because He is good. We cannot comprehend the plans he has for us Ephesians chapt 3 verse 20. so don't stress about it

sho!
Molaoa