The Specific and General Raptures

[james1523]

Some Christians have seen the truth of a pre-tribulation rapture, and others have seen the truth of a post-tribulation rapture, however few believers have seen the truth of both raptures and their significance. Hopefully this post will show that pre-trib and post-trib believers need not fight each other, and that the Scripture can be reconciled to accommodate both views.

Here we will show the difference between the specific (or pre-tribulation) rapture as stated by the Lord, and the general (or post-tribulation) rapture as stated by scripture.

Firstly, regarding the pre-tribulation rapture, Jesus in Matt 24:39-42, Luke 21:36, Rev 3:10, Rev 12:5 and Rev 14:1-5 indicated that those believers who overcame and endured would be kept safe from the trial upon the Earth - the tribulation period (Rev 3:10). I call this the specific rapture because it is only for a few overcoming believers - it is not available to all believers simply because they have believed in Christ. These believers are signified by the male child in Revelation 12:5 who is raptured up to heaven before the tribulation.

The Bible indicates that the majority of Christians will have to go through the tribulation lasting 3 and a half years. This is proved by Revelation 12:6 The woman fled into the wilderness to a place prepared for her by God, where she might be taken care of for 1,260 days. Here, the woman (church) has fled into the wilderness and is taken care of by God, for 1260 days which is 3 and a half years which is the period of the tribulation (also see Daniels' prophecy).

Further, that the majority of believers will not be raptured before the tribulation is again shown by 1 Thess 4:16-17. Here, the ones who are raptured are those who are still alive at the end of the 3 and a half years into the tribulation period. This coincides with the resurrection and the Lord's return.
1 Thess 4:16-17 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.
After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever.

Summary

• The Bible teaches a specific pre-tribulation rapture for overcoming believers. The number of such believers will be few, even as few as 10 or 20. The reason it will be few is firstly a) the Bible indicates such, and b) when the tribulation occurs, the love of many would have grown cold, even colder than it is today, the church will not in general be in an overcoming position (Matt 24:12).
• The Bible teaches a general post tribulation rapture for all believers. The number of such believers will be many.

 

[just-a-servant]

James1523 says:

Firstly, regarding the pre-tribulation rapture, Jesus in Matt 24:39-42, Luke 21:36, Rev 3:10, Rev 12:5 and Rev 14:1-5 indicated that those believers who overcame and endured would be kept safe from the trial upon the Earth - the tribulation period (Rev 3:10). I call this the specific rapture because it is only for a few overcoming believers - it is not available to all believers simply because they have believed in Christ. These believers are signified by the male child in Revelation 12:5 who is raptured up to heaven before the tribulation.

If you believe in a pre-trib rapture then ALL Christians will be raptured at that time - there would be no need to "overcome and endure." In your scenario, what would one have to do to be included? Since simply believing is not good enough, then there must be some component of works that you're not telling us which would make us eligible for this "specific" rapture.
As far as the male child in Rev 12:5, this is a clear reference to Jesus and there can be no other interpretation. The surrounding scriptures (Rev 12:1-6) paint a picture of Israel and her protection by God from Satan. Only when Satan realizes Israel is being protected does he begin to wage war on her offspring, the Christians. (Rev 12:13-17) There is no indication whatsoever the "male child" is the "believers raptured up to heaven" as you claim.

The Bible indicates that the majority of Christians will have to go through the tribulation lasting 3 and a half years.

I guess that would depend on whether you're a pre-, mid-, or post-trib believer. Each one of these groups could show you evidence stating their belief is true and that Christians will have to endure either none, half, or all the tribulation period, and what do you mean by "the majority of Christians?" Aren't we all in this boat together?, or are there some special and enlightened ones who will be priviledged to go first? Where is your proof?

This is proved by Revelation 12:6 The woman fled into the wilderness to a place prepared for her by God, where she might be taken care of for 1,260 days. Here, the woman (church) has fled into the wilderness and is taken care of by God, for 1260 days which is 3 and a half years which is the period of the tribulation (also see Daniels' prophecy).

If this is your proof, I would again point you to the surrounding scriptures, i.e. "the context." This scripture is clearly talking about the woman who gave birth to the male child, Jesus. In Rev 12:1 the scripture clearly defines her as Israel and in no way the "believers" or the "church."

Further, that the majority of believers will not be raptured before the tribulation is again shown by 1 Thess 4:16-17. Here, the ones who are raptured are those who are still alive at the end of the 3 and a half years into the tribulation period. This coincides with the resurrection and the Lord's return.
1 Thess 4:16-17 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.
After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever.

Again, you made the claim that the majority will/will not be raptured. I won't go into that again, but the next statement you've made that it will definitely be at the end of the first 3 1/2 year period of the tribulation is speculative at best. The scripture reference you've cited makes no reference to any time period.

Summary

• The Bible teaches a specific pre-tribulation rapture for overcoming believers. The number of such believers will be few, even as few as 10 or 20. The reason it will be few is firstly a) the Bible indicates such, and b) when the tribulation occurs, the love of many would have grown cold, even colder than it is today, the church will not in general be in an overcoming position (Matt 24:12).
• The Bible teaches a general post tribulation rapture for all believers. The number of such believers will be many.

Okay, I'm throwing the horse-hockey card. None of your Summary is supported by scripture. I'd say you need to spend a little more time studying and a lot less time writing. Had you looked at the scripture verses immediately surrounding those you've quoted, you would have seen the interpretations are totally different than what you've pontificated here. I sincerely hope nobody takes what you've written seriously.

IMHO
just-a-servant

 

[RJ]

Some Christians have seen the truth of a pre-tribulation rapture, and others have seen the truth of a post-tribulation rapture, however few believers have seen the truth of both raptures and their significance. Hopefully this post will show that pre-trib and post-trib believers need not fight each other, and that the Scripture can be reconciled to accommodate both views.

Here we will show the difference between the specific (or pre-tribulation) rapture as stated by the Lord, and the general (or post-tribulation) rapture as stated by scripture.

Firstly, regarding the pre-tribulation rapture, Jesus in Matt 24:39-42, Luke 21:36, Rev 3:10, Rev 12:5 and Rev 14:1-5 indicated that those believers who overcame and endured would be kept safe from the trial upon the Earth - the tribulation period (Rev 3:10). I call this the specific rapture because it is only for a few overcoming believers - it is not available to all believers simply because they have believed in Christ. These believers are signified by the male child in Revelation 12:5 who is raptured up to heaven before the tribulation.

The Bible indicates that the majority of Christians will have to go through the tribulation lasting 3 and a half years. This is proved by Revelation 12:6 The woman fled into the wilderness to a place prepared for her by God, where she might be taken care of for 1,260 days. Here, the woman (church) has fled into the wilderness and is taken care of by God, for 1260 days which is 3 and a half years which is the period of the tribulation (also see Daniels' prophecy).

Further, that the majority of believers will not be raptured before the tribulation is again shown by 1 Thess 4:16-17. Here, the ones who are raptured are those who are still alive at the end of the 3 and a half years into the tribulation period. This coincides with the resurrection and the Lord's return.
1 Thess 4:16-17 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.
After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever.

Summary

• The Bible teaches a specific pre-tribulation rapture for overcoming believers. The number of such believers will be few, even as few as 10 or 20. The reason it will be few is firstly a) the Bible indicates such, and b) when the tribulation occurs, the love of many would have grown cold, even colder than it is today, the church will not in general be in an overcoming position (Matt 24:12).
• The Bible teaches a general post tribulation rapture for all believers. The number of such believers will be many.

I understand that all of scripture is not necessarily written in chronological order of the events as the occured. But, could you explain and use further scripture to show how Revelation 12:6 happens before 1 Thesolonians 4:16-17?