Let me guess, that thread with the Oneness twist?
You'll push the need for everyone to be baptized with the Holy Spirit with the evidence of speaking in other tongues.
I'll push the fact that Paul made it clear, not everyone speaks in tongues.
The Trinity : revisted
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Let me guess, that thread with the Oneness twist?
You'll push the need for everyone to be baptized with the Holy Spirit with the evidence of speaking in other tongues.
I'll push the fact that Paul made it clear, not everyone speaks in tongues.
First and the Last
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That thread is not meant for discussion just an exposition unless engaged.
Well, if I were to read that thread, I would certainly engage.
I haven't read it, and don't really care to. That's not interesting to me, but that's just me, others will find it interesting.
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1 Corinthians 12:29-30, "Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers? are all workers of miracles? Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret?"
Addresses the diversity of spiritual gifts within the body of Christ, emphasizing that not every believer will have the same role or gift. The church is likened to a body, with each member having a distinct function, and all are necessary for the health and growth of the church. This diversity ensures that the church operates effectively, with apostles, prophets, teachers, miracle workers, those with gifts of healing, and others each contributing uniquely to the mission of the church.
It is important to distinguish between the different types of speaking in tongues mentioned in the New Testament. The Bible teaches that speaking in tongues serves different purposes and contexts. First, there is speaking in tongues as the initial evidence of receiving the Holy Spirit, which is a private and personal experience for every believer baptized in the Holy Ghost. This experience is a sign of the New Birth and is distinct from the spiritual gifts described in 1 Corinthians 12.
The passage in 1 Corinthians 12 refers to the specific gift of tongues used in a public worship setting. This gift, meant for the edification of the church, typically occurs during quiet spiritual moments and requires interpretation. Not all believers will possess this particular gift, just as not all are apostles, prophets, or teachers. This public exercise of the gift of tongues, accompanied by interpretation, is different from the personal prayer language experienced by individuals when they receive the Holy Spirit.
While every believer is encouraged to seek and receive the Holy Spirit with the evidence of speaking in tongues as a personal experience, the specific gift of tongues used in church settings for communal edification and requiring interpretation is given according to God’s sovereign will and purpose. This distinction clarifies the different roles of speaking in tongues within the body of Christ, both for individual spiritual growth and for the edification of the church.
Something I've always found strange, speaking in tongues and interpretation of tongues are the least of the 9 gifts, but yet by far the most discussed.
Why is that? It seems nowadays the words of Paul to the Corinthian Church ring clearer than ever.
1 Cor. 14:26
"How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying."
B-A-C
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I have to agree with this statement, but it's a chicken and egg problem.
I agree it's the most talked about gift among Pentecostals, but on the other hand it's also the most attacked gift by cessationists.
It was certainly attacked by Paul for misuse.
B-A-C
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Do you have a scripture passage for this?
I've already given it. Paul was scolding (in a nice way) the holy-rollers in the Corinthian Church for misuse of the gifts.
He pointed out that every one of them were involved and asked, "how is it that..."
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1Co 14:5 I wish you all spoke with tongues, but even more that you prophesied; for he who prophesies is greater than he who speaks with tongues, unless indeed he interprets, that the church may receive edification. (Nkjv)
Prophecy is GREATER than speaking in tongues UNLESS there is interpretation of tongues then they are equal.
…for he who prophesies is greater than he who speaks with tongues, unless indeed he interprets….
Prophecy is GREATER than speaking in tongues UNLESS there is interpretation of tongues then they are equal.
…for he who prophesies is greater than he who speaks with tongues, unless indeed he interprets….
B-A-C
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Don't see that as an attack in any way.
Agreed... but don't see that as an attack in any way either.
First and the Last
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I agree with that and especially in these last days so much imitation and false worship.
1 Corinthians 14:26, "How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying."
Emphasizes the importance of order and edification in church gatherings. Paul acknowledges that when believers come together, each may have a spiritual contribution, such as a psalm, a teaching, a tongue, a revelation, or an interpretation. The variety of gifts and contributions reflect the richness of the Spirit's work within the body of Christ. However, Paul stresses that all these should be exercised in a manner that builds up and edifies the church. The Scripture upholds this principle by encouraging orderly worship services where spiritual gifts are used to strengthen and encourage the entire congregation. This ensures that worship is conducted in a way that promotes unity, understanding, and spiritual growth, aligning with the broader biblical mandate to use spiritual gifts for the common good and the edification of the church community.
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Paul never attacked the Church for speaking in tongues, but that all things should be done in order.
Paul goes on from there to explain the proper use of tongues in edifying the Church. How to keep silent when there is no one to interpret, etc.
He is definitely attacking the misuse of tongues in the Corinthian Church.
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Paul wrote the letter of 1 Corinthians to address several issues that were troubling the church in Corinth. The church was experiencing division, moral and ethical problems, and confusion regarding spiritual gifts and worship practices. In particular, 1 Corinthians 14 focuses on the proper use of spiritual gifts, such as speaking in tongues and prophecy, within the church. Paul sought to correct misunderstandings and abuses related to these gifts by emphasizing the need for edification, clarity, and order in worship. His goal was to ensure that the church's gatherings were constructive and beneficial for all members, promoting unity and spiritual growth. Through his instructions, Paul aimed to guide the Corinthians toward a more mature and harmonious expression of their faith, aligning their practices with the love and truth of the gospel.
B-A-C
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If you say so. Laying the foundational rules for a new thing, is hardly attacking them.
How do you think the Corinthians knew there was such a thing as speaking in tongues and interpreting?
Paul had taught them when he was with them. Then Paul receives a report of their misuse, and sends them a letter, 1 Corinthians.
Yes, he was correcting and attacking the misuse. He was not pleased by any means.
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It is so rough these days talking to people sometimes about this because majority of the church today doesn't follow these instructions. And causes so much confusion in the church and outside the church. See 1 Corinthians 14:23 below.
1 Corinthians 14:39, "Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues,"
Highlights the importance of both prophecy and speaking in tongues as essential spiritual gifts for the edification of the church. The Apostle Paul encourages believers to eagerly desire the gift of prophecy, which involves speaking forth God's word under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit for the building up, encouragement, and consolation of believers. Prophecy is seen as a means through which God communicates His will and purposes to His people, providing guidance and direction in personal and communal life.
Similarly, Paul emphasizes the value of speaking in tongues, which is the initial evidence of baptism in the Holy Spirit. Speaking in tongues is viewed as a spiritual gift that allows believers to communicate directly with God in a language unknown to the speaker, enabling deeper intimacy with God and strengthening one's spiritual life. Paul's exhortation not to forbid speaking in tongues underscores the belief that this gift is a legitimate and valuable manifestation of the Holy Spirit's presence and power in the believer's life.
1 Corinthians 14:23, "If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in those that are unlearned, or unbelievers, will they not say that ye are mad?"
Underscores the importance of maintaining order and clarity in worship services to effectively witness to unbelievers and newcomers. The Scripture values the gift of tongues as a sign of receiving the Holy Spirit and a powerful aspect of personal worship. However, this verse highlights the potential confusion and misunderstanding that can arise if everyone speaks in tongues simultaneously without interpretation, especially in the presence of those unfamiliar with the practice.
To avoid this, the church emphasizes the need for balance and discernment in public worship. While speaking in tongues is encouraged as a personal and spiritual expression, it should be done in a way that promotes understanding and edification for all attendees. This means prioritizing clear communication and ensuring that any message in tongues meant for the congregation is interpreted. By doing so, the church can create an environment where both believers and unbelievers can be edified, and the gospel message can be conveyed effectively without causing confusion or appearing chaotic. This approach aligns with Paul's broader teaching in 1 Corinthians 14 on the orderly use of spiritual gifts to build up the church and reach others with the message of Christ.
1 Corinthians 14:39, "Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues,"
Highlights the importance of both prophecy and speaking in tongues as essential spiritual gifts for the edification of the church. The Apostle Paul encourages believers to eagerly desire the gift of prophecy, which involves speaking forth God's word under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit for the building up, encouragement, and consolation of believers. Prophecy is seen as a means through which God communicates His will and purposes to His people, providing guidance and direction in personal and communal life.
Similarly, Paul emphasizes the value of speaking in tongues, which is the initial evidence of baptism in the Holy Spirit. Speaking in tongues is viewed as a spiritual gift that allows believers to communicate directly with God in a language unknown to the speaker, enabling deeper intimacy with God and strengthening one's spiritual life. Paul's exhortation not to forbid speaking in tongues underscores the belief that this gift is a legitimate and valuable manifestation of the Holy Spirit's presence and power in the believer's life.
1 Corinthians 14:23, "If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in those that are unlearned, or unbelievers, will they not say that ye are mad?"
Underscores the importance of maintaining order and clarity in worship services to effectively witness to unbelievers and newcomers. The Scripture values the gift of tongues as a sign of receiving the Holy Spirit and a powerful aspect of personal worship. However, this verse highlights the potential confusion and misunderstanding that can arise if everyone speaks in tongues simultaneously without interpretation, especially in the presence of those unfamiliar with the practice.
To avoid this, the church emphasizes the need for balance and discernment in public worship. While speaking in tongues is encouraged as a personal and spiritual expression, it should be done in a way that promotes understanding and edification for all attendees. This means prioritizing clear communication and ensuring that any message in tongues meant for the congregation is interpreted. By doing so, the church can create an environment where both believers and unbelievers can be edified, and the gospel message can be conveyed effectively without causing confusion or appearing chaotic. This approach aligns with Paul's broader teaching in 1 Corinthians 14 on the orderly use of spiritual gifts to build up the church and reach others with the message of Christ.
The problem with the gifts and especially the tongues was the least of Paul's problems with the Corinthian Church.
In 1 Cor. 1:10-18 Paul tells them that he received a report from the house of Chloe that there were divisions and contentions among them.
They were divided on the doctrine of Christ with some siding with Paul, some Peter and some with Apollos.
This was the biggest problem and there were several more problems, including the misuse of the gifts.
Paul had more problems with the Corinthian Church than all the other Churches put together.
I should also mention that the city of Corinth was at the top of the list of one of the most ungodliest cities in the Roman Empire.
