Transgender

[AudreyNicole]

So, i saw a show recently that featured transgendered children. One was a girl turned into a boy and was 7, the other was a boy turned into a girl at age 9. It seems this is becoming more common and I just had some questions about it.

Firstly, is this a recent thing? I know there has always been sexual perversion, but is there anything in the Bible about transgenders? And secondly, what is wrong with the parents of these kids as well as the children? There must be some psychological or biblical explanation for it... right? I just can't understand what it is that can pervert the mind so severely. They seem like good people, and the parents truly feel as though they are doing the right thing. How can this be explained, and more importantly, how can we as Christians do something to help these people?

 

[LordsLily]

Transgender is a brain disorder, where the baby's brain, in the womb, does not develop in line with the physical body. As they are children, I am sure you can understand it is not a sexual perversion thing, as they are children without sexual drives. It is purely the way the brain has been created by our wonderful creator, GOD. I feel he must have intended for these children to be born this way, as their parents are good people who have a child with what is, essentially, a medical condition. It is no different to the poor children who develop cancer, die young, are born with Down Syndrome.
God knows what will happen in our lives before we do, and I trust in him that he has sent these children for a reason.
I'm only new to this, do people agree? For they are children, it has always existed throughout history, and no matter how much their parents battle, the child has the wrong gendered brain in the body. It is in no way for sexual gratification/perversion.

 

[Alice.]

I don't think its a "more recent" thing, parents are now better at handling it rather then trying to change their child.

 

[Iceman]

Transgender I don't believe is becoming more common, but more acknowledged.

But it raises issues about Christian ethics when dealing with homosexuality.

Transgender is a very ambiguous word, but has recently been used to describe a condition that is not a brain disorder in children that removes their sex drive (though symptoms may include that). It is an as yet unexplained medical condition where a person of one sex, will physically change into the opposite sex, and is just as common in adults.

To present a case. I know of a precedent where an adult male, with wife and chidlren, was diagnosed transgender and became a woman. In her new body, she had female sex drives. That is that she was attracted to men.

What this means, is that at some level sex drive is indeed chemical. So, that means at the very least there is the possibility that in some cases of homosexuality, it isn't a choice....they are physically that way....So how should Christians then respond?

Just some food for thought.

 

[april showers]

I am sorry to have to disagree with everyone on this. My personal opinion is that these people have a spiritual problem, not a physical, mental, or emotional problem. They have evil spirits lying to them, and they are believing the lies. In the past, there were no medical procedures to change someone's sex, so in a sense, this whole issue is new. When people lived in cultures that were poorer and more conservative and family oriented, such perversions did not occur. I myself live in a poor Middle Eastern country, and these things just don't happen among people who are busy just trying to survive, and who live among large extended families where there is great family pressure to behave a certain way. They would risk their lives to behave so strangely, but I don't even think they would consider doing such things because it is not natural and they have never heard of such things.

I would say, as well, that although there may have been such perversions all throughout history, it is usually in the prosperous countries where people are bored and where they don't need God because they have their material needs met. People get a lot more religious when they are in relative poverty.

This is all part of Satan's end time plan to confuse gender.
Genesis 1:27 (King James Version)


27So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.



My last point is that God doesn't make mistakes!!! He does not put a man in a woman's body or a woman in a man's body! He knows how to put people together the right way!

It is so sad what people do when they don't know God, mutilating their own bodies or allowing such young children, who don't even know what they are doing, to undergo operations that are irreversible. It really breaks my heart.

 

[rizen1]

I'm sorry excuse my ignorance but you say " yet unexplained medical condition where a person of one sex, will physically change into the opposite sex. "

Was it some sort of over night mutation, because every case I know it took money and a knife. Not trying to be rude, but be careful in your description.

Scientist also believed we came from monkeys and mud, that a fetus have no life.
What do we say for people who believe having sex with a child is normal to them, they were never attracted to people their age or anyone over 7yrs old. What medical condition do we give people who have sex with animals. Where is the acceptance. If sexual drives and chemicals are normal and natural these people should have a place in society and not prison.

Everyone have a right to live their life according to what they want, ( God gave us free will ) But when a person decides to walk after God, after his principles, after his laws..well the things of this world, our fleshly desires must no longer exist.

We must be careful how we tell a story, showing one side. Iceman do you know the regret and emotional problems some face after the surgery. Hollywood don't show that side, the drugs the depression , the confusion. We are only shown stories like " First man to have a baby ". I've yet to meet a man with ovaries, I'm sorry.

Everyone have the right and the choice to live as they please, because God gave us free will. But anyone who accepts Jesus in their life must live according to scripture. So my opinion or the opinion of anyone does not matter, but God's word says it all.

So how should Christians then respond?

With God's word, as christians we tend to be opinionated not realizing God's word have the answer to everything.

"A woman must not wear men's clothing, nor a man wear women's clothing, for the LORD your God detests anyone who does this. Deuteronomy 22:5"

 

[Faithful Son]

Thank you sister Rizen1. That is the correct way to handle it.

Our standards of life is God's Standards of life and we should never be ashamed to be responsible and obedient to God's Standards. He is the Almighty and He makes men and woman, not confused beings who don't know what they are. This issue needs to be prayed about within such a family and alternative routes need to be taken, rather than cutting and stitches.

God bless,
Unconditional Love,
Faithful Son

 

[MelodyC]

There is so much supposed medical evidence that people want to be the other gender. Here in Australia they were leaders in providing gender re-assignment some 25 years ago. However there are many of those patients who have come back and sued the doctors for giving them the re-assignment.

Sex change patient sues doctors

Kate Hagan | March 2, 2009 - 6:36AM

A MAN who underwent gender reassignment surgery to become a woman — then resumed dressing as a man five years later after deciding the change was "misconceived" — is suing psychiatrists who treated him at Monash Medical Centre's specialist clinic.

In a statement of claim filed with the Supreme Court, the man, 66, said psychiatrists Dr Trudy Kennedy and Dr Chris Grant had advised him that he was suffering from transsexualism, during consultations at Monash Medical Centre's gender dysphoria clinic between 1993 and 1995. He said the doctors had told him that gender reassignment surgery, entailing the removal of his ***** and testicles and associated cosmetic and hormonal changes, would be appropriate treatment.
The man claimed the doctors had not correctly diagnosed him with transsexualism in line with recognised practice.


He said he did not fit the criteria of transsexualism, including being convinced since childhood that he was a member of the opposite sex, finding his genitals disgusting and having a preoccupation with traditionally "female" activities.

He said the doctors had failed to investigate his history, which included being sexually abused by his mother between the ages of eight and 15.

rest of article at the following link
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/news/national/sex-change-patient-sues-doctors/2009/03/02/1235842282129.html

There are many more stories like this one. There is more than you and I see in these stories. People getting bad medical and pychological assessments as well.

I wouldn't trust what the medical profession tells you in this area because most of them are not Saved Believers and think it's normal for some to be transexual or transgender.

God said when he made man:-

GE 1:27 So God created man in his own image,
in the image of God he created him;
male and female he created them.

GE 1:31 God saw all that he had made, and it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning--the sixth day.

God made male and female. However when sin entered the world we got people abandoning the way God created them.

The Bible clearly states of those who reject Him and His teaching and His wisdom.

RO 1:21 For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools 23 and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles.

RO 1:24 Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another. 25 They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator--who is forever praised. Amen.

We live in a sinful world were people reject God and His ways and His Truth. So they no longer function as God created them.

Children I believe want to be the other sex because they are not taught from a young age about their maleness or the femaleness. Parents today who are without God don't bother with that kind of gender teaching. They think they are doing the right thing to allow their children indulge being like the opposite sex to the extreme.

Now I grew up a Tomboy. I ran around with boys but my Dad put a limit on how much of that I could do. I was upset but I realise now that I am older Dad was making sure I knew I was a girl. I hated being reminded of that because I could climb as high and well as my brothers and male cousins. I could shot as well as the boys. I wasn't as good a wrestler or boxer Dad made sure I didn't get into too much sparring and told the boys to back off.

My mother made me wear a dress when we went out visiting or to Church. I was to come inside and be with the women from time to time, not always out with the boys.

I can appreciate the limitations set by my parents on me as a girl growing up with boys. I certainly wasn't confused about my gender or allowed to be confused by my parents. I just like to beat the older boys when I could because I was the second youngest. They didn't want to do girly things so I had to play boy games like chasings and football.

DT 22:5 A woman must not wear men's clothing, nor a man wear women's clothing, for the LORD your God detests anyone who does this.

The Bible doesn't give us in depth teaching but it is clear God made us to be the gender we were born with. Sin has corrupted everything.

DT 4:9 Only be careful, and watch yourselves closely so that you do not forget the things your eyes have seen or let them slip from your heart as long as you live. Teach them to your children and to their children after them.10 Remember the day you stood before the LORD your God at Horeb, when he said to me, "Assemble the people before me to hear my words so that they may learn to revere me as long as they live in the land and may teach them to their children."

Christian parents need to teach their children what the Lord has said in His Word.

My father wasn't a Christian. A Church goer but not a Saved Believer. When I grew up most parents were schooled in Christians ways even if they sisn't receive Jesus. Back then it God's ways were popular and socially Christianity was applied in Christian Nations.

I'm in my late forties now and back when I was a girl my father was following Christian and Social norms. Girls were meant to be girls and Boys were tuaght to become men. That is all long gone. Homosexuality, Transexual and Transgender were taboo back then even if you were inclined to be that way. Parents today do not feel Social pressure to make sure their girls wore dresses and their boys didn't wear pink. Almost anything goes gender wise these days.

I'm not surprised more and more kids these days are allowed to go transgender and even probably encouraged by well meaning parents who don't want to appear old world or draconian.

Don't bother to bawl me out if you think I'm wrong.

Not me you have to convince but God! He is the orginal designer. Take it up with the Lord.

 

[Iceman]

I'm sorry excuse my ignorance but you say " yet unexplained medical condition where a person of one sex, will physically change into the opposite sex. "

Was it some sort of over night mutation, because every case I know it took money and a knife. Not trying to be rude, but be careful in your description.

Scientist also believed we came from monkeys and mud, that a fetus have no life.
What do we say for people who believe having sex with a child is normal to them, they were never attracted to people their age or anyone over 7yrs old. What medical condition do we give people who have sex with animals. Where is the acceptance. If sexual drives and chemicals are normal and natural these people should have a place in society and not prison.

Everyone have a right to live their life according to what they want, ( God gave us free will ) But when a person decides to walk after God, after his principles, after his laws..well the things of this world, our fleshly desires must no longer exist.

We must be careful how we tell a story, showing one side. Iceman do you know the regret and emotional problems some face after the surgery. Hollywood don't show that side, the drugs the depression , the confusion. We are only shown stories like " First man to have a baby ". I've yet to meet a man with ovaries, I'm sorry.

Everyone have the right and the choice to live as they please, because God gave us free will. But anyone who accepts Jesus in their life must live according to scripture. So my opinion or the opinion of anyone does not matter, but God's word says it all.



With God's word, as christians we tend to be opinionated not realizing God's word have the answer to everything.

"A woman must not wear men's clothing, nor a man wear women's clothing, for the LORD your God detests anyone who does this. Deuteronomy 22:5"

No, this was not a surgical thing. It was a mutation. It wasn't overnight, but that's exactly what happened. One sex, mutating, or morphing into the opposite sex.

I am very familiar with the psychological implications of sexchange operations, but that's not what I'm talking about. I'm not talking about homosexuality, I'm not talking about transexuals, and I'm not trying to provide any argument at all. Not being an American I'm probably not as enamoured with the TV realities that are incredibly popular inside your culture.

Perhaps you would be so kind to re-read my post now knowing better where I am coming from, and I'm sorry I didn't make it clear in the beginning. I'm not trying to justify anyone's way of life. I'm trying to open the doors to an almost unknown issue. One that should have a heavy influence on Christian ethics but is almost exclusively ignored by the more hyper-charismatic and fundamentalist groups.

God's word is of course Jesus, and to respond with Jesus is to respond with Mercy, Tolerance and Love.

 

[Strypes]

Having read this thread, I am not sure what we are talking about.

Maybe if we define the terms it would help.

Transgender~

Transgender is an umbrella term used to describe people whose gender identity (sense of themselves as male or female) or gender expression differs from that usually associated with their birth sex. Many transgender people live part-time or full-time as members of the other gender. Broadly speaking, anyone whose identity, appearance, or behavior falls outside of conventional gender norms can be described as transgender. However, not everyone whose appearance or behavior is gender-atypical will identify as a transgender person.

source: American Psychological Association
Answers to Your Questions About Transgender Individuals and Gender Identity

Intersex~

True Gonadal Intersex. Here the person must have both ovarian and testicular tissue. This might be in the same gonad (an ovotestis), or the person might have one ovary and one testis. The person may have XX chromosomes, XY chromosomes, or both. The external genitals may be ambiguous or may appear to be female or male. This condition used to be called true hermaphroditism. In most people with true gonadal intersex, the underlying cause is unknown, although in some animal studies it has been linked to exposure to common agricultural pesticides.
source:national institue of health/ medline plus
Intersex: MedlinePlus Medical Encyclopedia

Transgender is psychological. The individual chooses their sexual identity based on their feelings and preferences.

Intersex is physical. A birth defect where they are born with ambiguous genitalia.


Jesus loves us all and gave his life to ransom all who believe in Him.

We all have crosses we must carry. Life challenges we must face. Some are more difficult than others.

Imagine being a boy born with ambiguous genitalia and the doctors decide to make you a girl (but you have xy cromosomes). Life challenges would be very difficult and made even more so by the judgementl attitudes of well meaning "christians"

I believe the "issue" should be between the person and God and we should all stay out of their business and bedrooms.

If we have someone in our lives that are either transexual or intersex we should share the Love of God with them and let the Holy Spirit guide them and help them in their identity issues.

 

[Boanerges]

One was a girl turned into a boy and was 7, the other was a boy turned into a girl at age 9.

What a tragedy that a parent would allow a confused (or is it the parents confused) child not much older than a babe to be mutilated like that.

 

[Gerlinde]

I am sorry to have to disagree with everyone on this. My personal opinion is that these people have a spiritual problem, not a physical, mental, or emotional problem. They have evil spirits lying to them, and they are believing the lies. .

April showers,

I had this problem . I was transsexual. I knew even as a child that I was " different from the other children." Bio I was born a boy. Feels like I had always considered myself girl.
I grew up in the LDS church in Idaho. Very strict, very patriarchal. My father often beat me , just with my sister when we are not doing what he wanted. I met my father when I was almost 6 years old . My first years of life I spent in Germany . My former church did not accept it , what I felt , it confused with homosexuality ( as you can see how stupid Mormons ) .
I tried for many years to be like a normal boy . I went for my church on a mission , got married then , "father" was .
But the woman in me was not death, as much as I tried to suppress it . Serious depression , alcoholism, and two suicide attempts were the result.
Then I accepted the transsexuality of me and my healing could begin.
Transsexualism is rightly referred to as " gender identity disorder ", because this is it. There is no cure , the sex reassignment surgical operation is not a cure , but a considerable improvement of life . I no longer think of suicide. I live , work and love .
With evil spirits or the devil TS has absolutely nothing to do .

 

[B-A-C]

I agree this is really sad that young children, (pre-teen) are told they are born the wrong way.
We are all born the wrong way, we are all messed up. Some have different tendencies. Some want to lie, some want to steal, some want to be sexually perverse.
God didn't make us that way. We are human, we are born into sin. Period. God didn't make a mistake ( and if He did, do you think YOU can fix his mistakes? )
God made us the way we are for a reason, the reason wasn't for us to go change how he made us.
This is different from changing from our sinful nature (God didn't make that either) to a spiritual nature.

People may not always get sex changes for "sexual gratification" (although some have confessed this was indeed the reason).
However it is for gender role reason almost always. The world says there is no difference between men and women, (the Bible says we are different).
Yet even though the world is trying to make us all "one gender", people still want to reverse their genders. (Why do this if you believe we are all one gender anyway?)
God created men to be men, to be protectors, providers, and leaders for their families. God created women to be women, loving nurturing, preparing their children
to live on their own. Somewhere along the way this has gotten lost and people have bought into "God made a mistake when he made me".