Trump Nationalism and Nazi Nationalism: as Different as Night and Day

[JamesLedbetter]

Often times, when debating a liberal, they like to compare Trump to Hitler. Not only is this ignorant, but it is factually wrong. Recently, Trump doubled down on his nationalist stance. The liberal media pounced on the opportunity to compare Trump to a Nazi dictator. What the know is, the two ideologies cannot be compared as the same because they are both different ideologies.

Let’s start with the actual definition of “nationalism.” According to Encyclopedia Britannica, nationalism is defined like this:

Nationalism, ideology based on the premise that the individual’s loyalty and devotion to the nation-state surpass other individual or group interests.​

All respectable sources point to the same definition. So where do the liberals get that nationalism means white supremacy? They have relied on Wikipedia and other liberal websites to define these terms for them.

SEE SOURCE: Trump Nationalism and Nazi Nationalism: as Different as Night and Day

 

[Hekuran]

Haven't read the Trump/Hitler comparison. Based on the definition given here, all nationalism is sub-Christian.

 

[JamesLedbetter]

Haven't read the Trump/Hitler comparison. Based on the definition given here, all nationalism is sub-Christian.

Israel was Nationalists. God told them to defend their borders. How is Nationalism "sub-Christian?" God told them they were the greatest nation on earth. They all had pride for their nation. Think logically before you comment back. Please.

 

[Hekuran]

Couldn't find God telling Israel they were the greatest. Genesis 12 says

“I will make you into a great nation,
and I will bless you;
I will make your name great,
and you will be a blessing.
I will bless those who bless you,
and whoever curses you I will curse;
and all peoples on earth
will be blessed through you.”

Nationalism by your definition is not about defending borders is it?

Nationalism is sub-Christian because it runseems counter to the command to love your neighbor. Jesus made it perfectly clear in the parable of the good Samaritan that this command extends beyond national borders.

 

[Dovegiven]

........

Nationalism by your definition is not about defending borders is it?

Nationalism is sub-Christian because it runseems counter to the command to love your neighbor. Jesus made it perfectly clear in the parable of the good Samaritan that this command extends beyond national borders.

Scriptures say to love neighbor, pray for enemies. There is a difference between neighbor and enemy. Self defense extends to defense of one's nation else whole societies are easily lost due to neglect by its citizens having to live in this fallen world.

Luke 22:35-38 (KJV)
35 And he said unto them, When I sent you without purse, and scrip, and shoes, lacked ye any thing? And they said, Nothing.
36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.
37 For I say unto you, that this that is written must yet be accomplished in me, And he was reckoned among the transgressors: for the things concerning me have an end.
38 And they said, Lord, behold, here are two swords. And he said unto them, It is enough.

Acquiring a sword (Gr. large war knife) was not to provide a wall ornament. A little later we find Peter carrying a sword, supposedly one of the two found in the room, with Jesus knowing he had it. He cut off the ear of Malchus, which Jesus restored. In that instance Jesus made it clear the disciples must not interfere with the cup Jesus had to drink. It should also be clear that life, including security, would change for those men once Jesus left for heaven. He had been protecting and providing for them. They were left to provide whatever they could to survive and thrive, praying about everything, teaching thing like the issue of working to support one's family and have to give to them who have not. It isn't proper to sit back doing nothing about vital things while expecting God to do it all for us.

Consider how many times God is on record commanding Israel to attack and defeat their enemies. When they failed to act as commanded they were punished severely. Your own nation must come before any other, else yours can be destroyed and incapable of helping any such as for Israel.

Without nationalism our America would not have survived the rebellion against England under leadership of a primary nationalist who became President George Washington. Since then most Presidents were also nationalists and many were Christians.

 

[JamesLedbetter]

Couldn't find God telling Israel they were the greatest. Genesis 12 says

“I will make you into a great nation,
and I will bless you;
I will make your name great,
and you will be a blessing.
I will bless those who bless you,
and whoever curses you I will curse;
and all peoples on earth
will be blessed through you.”

Nationalism by your definition is not about defending borders is it?

Nationalism is sub-Christian because it runseems counter to the command to love your neighbor. Jesus made it perfectly clear in the parable of the good Samaritan that this command extends beyond national borders.

So then, God never told Israel to defend their borders? What Bible are you reading from? Second, when did God ever say allow people into your borders that will destroy it? You can love your neighbors and defend what is yours at the same time. Since you feel this way, how many are you going to take into your home? I know some people that can make it happen. How many can we write you down for?

 

[Hekuran]

So then, God never told Israel to defend their borders? What Bible are you reading from? Second, when did God ever say allow people into your borders that will destroy it? You can love your neighbors and defend what is yours at the same time. Since you feel this way, how many are you going to take into your home? I know some people that can make it happen. How many can we write you down for?

Stupid,stupid reply. Read my response again. I said that nationalism is not about defending borders.

It's not only nationalists that feel the need to defend their borders. You were rude and arrogant enough to tell me to use logic in your first reply. Please take the trouble to understand what is being said before weighing in.

 

[JamesLedbetter]

Stupid,stupid reply. Read my response again. I said that nationalism is not about defending borders.

It's not only nationalists that feel the need to defend their borders. You were rude and arrogant enough to tell me to use logic in your first reply. Please take the trouble to understand what is being said before weighing in.

Well, once a person starts with the name calling. it is a sign they have no logical argument. Read a book. Have a great day!

 

[Jesus_is_LORD]

Where is the love my brothers?

Focus on the topics, don't let the enemy divide you.

Continue the discussion to the glory of God.

Perhaps both try to listen openly and digest what the other is saying before instantaneously
counteracting with a rebuttal or defense.

Be married to the truth, not your position. We all have blind spots but we will not see it
unless we humble ourselves.

Love and God Bless

 

[Dovegiven]

Stupid,stupid reply. Read my response again. I said that nationalism is not about defending borders.

It's not only nationalists that feel the need to defend their borders. You were rude and arrogant enough to tell me to use logic in your first reply. Please take the trouble to understand what is being said before weighing in.

Offhand for now I think you must be considering another distinct group of citizens of a nation, not "globalists" of course, but perhaps "pacifists" by way of not accepting of violence, war or militarism for any reason even if their nation is at risk of losing sovereignty to an enemy. If pacifists, they would have no recourse for defense of borders other than a hazardous reliance on the World Court. But then how could they accept a rescue squad entering their nation to help them?

Even when Jesus comes back ruling from Jerusalem (in modern Israel) for a thousand years there will continually be rebels to be finally destroyed at the end. God has a violent end for them. That calls to question pacifism, which potentially threatens civil societies wherever they are.

So it would be interesting to know which group by name you think would "feel the need to defend their borders", and explain why they would care.

 

[Hekuran]

It's legitimate for any group to defend and protect itself. I can't think of any aspect of the bible that contradicts this.

But that's an entirely different discussion to the one on nationalism.

Nationalism, ideology based on the premise that the individual’s loyalty and devotion to the nation-state surpass other individual or group interests.

This is counter to Jesus command to love our neighbour as ourselves, and the parable of the good Samaritan that follows.

 

[Dovegiven]

It's legitimate for any group to defend and protect itself. I can't think of any aspect of the bible that contradicts this.

But that's an entirely different discussion to the one on nationalism.

Nationalism, ideology based on the premise that the individual’s loyalty and devotion to the nation-state surpass other individual or group interests.

This is counter to Jesus command to love our neighbour as ourselves, and the parable of the good Samaritan that follows.

NEIGHBOR is the key word. No fleshly enemy is a neighbor by any but a geographical or ideological definition only. You must not allow any enemy to equal that status lest you afford Satan "neighbor status". That "neighbor" deserves only a prayer from a Christian, but never for Satan, the father of lies.
I read a WWII book that described how some of our vets in WWII openly spoke against the dignities over them in POW camps. They tended to receive a bullet or two to the brain. Few witnesses live to recount that. God is not erroniously documented as testifying of his future judgment of nation Israel and "goat/sheep nations", elevating all 12 tribes to glory someday with servance from all other national groups. Meanwhile every Christian must not judge any, but love all, displaying by words and acions attributable to Father God by word delivered by Jesus, Son of God. Until Jesus returns, our only hope of existence within any sense of sanity residides of adherence to Christ.

 

[Hekuran]

Are you sure? Jews and Samaritans considered each other enemies to the extent that they would not talk to each other.

Jesus deliberately made a very sharp point about such hostility in the parable of the good Samaritan. They were enemies until the Samaritan made the difference.

Jesus was consistently gracious to the occupying Romans too.

I'll say again, it's a proper function of a nation to protect its citizens.

Nationalism goes further than that: it asks that we put loyalty to the nation above other interests. I cannot do that as I believe that God has created people of all nations, and loves with an all-surpassing love. If I were to put my nation above others, I'd be sinning against the vast majority of the world which is not British.

 

[Dovegiven]

Nationalism goes further than that: it asks that we put loyalty to the nation above other interests. I cannot do that as I believe that God has created people of all nations, and loves with an all-surpassing love. If I were to put my nation above others, I'd be sinning against the vast majority of the world which is not British.

Please try to name one nation that God preferred equal to or higher than Israe in all of scripturesl. What city other than Jerusalem did Jesus command to pray for the peace thereof? What nations did God frequently rescue in spite of their sin habits? What is "Goat nation" vs. "Sheep nation"?

America is the one other nation founded upon biblical concepts and benevolent heroism like with judge Gideon. Our Declaration of Independence specifically links this nation to God of the Bible. Our Constitution protects our religious choices. That alone should be enough to prefer America above others. In that is strength to be of substantive help to the nations of the world, free to present the gospel of Christ. No other nation is like America, the reason so many seek to move here rather than put somewhere else at the top of their list. What good woould we find preferring Saudi Arabia where anyone caught with a Bible is subject to severe penalty.

 

[Hekuran]

So you'd ask me, a British man, to be an American nationalist?

 

[Hekuran]

Constitution of the Independent State of Western Samoa 1960

 

[Dovegiven]

Thanks for finding a Christian nation to study. Nice place to visit but nobody can choose to live there unless their parent or grandparent is a citizen of Samoa. They prefer their own country over others. Your British heritage would not help you even though their history was heavily influenced by Westerners, and particularly New Zealand. Their form of government is based on British, their immigration law updated 2017. They are seeking to preserve their Samoan culture like American Indians used to do, their unique cultures dying out. Anyway, few on earth are welcome there as new citizens, allowing only tourists. Selfish? Again, there's no place quite as wonderful and blessed as America which was significantly grown of legal immigrants who chose to adopt American culture.

 

[Hekuran]

Thanks for finding a Christian nation to study. Nice place to visit but nobody can choose to live there unless their parent or grandparent is a citizen of Samoa. They prefer their own country over others. Your British heritage would not help you even though their history was heavily influenced by Westerners, and particularly New Zealand. Their form of government is based on British, their immigration law updated 2017. They are seeking to preserve their Samoan culture like American Indians used to do, their unique cultures dying out. Anyway, few on earth are welcome there as new citizens, allowing only tourists. Selfish? Again, there's no place quite as wonderful and blessed as America which was significantly grown of legal immigrants who chose to adopt American culture.

Why did you ask me to find such a country?

 

[Quantrill]

Are you sure? Jews and Samaritans considered each other enemies to the extent that they would not talk to each other.

Jesus deliberately made a very sharp point about such hostility in the parable of the good Samaritan. They were enemies until the Samaritan made the difference.

Jesus was consistently gracious to the occupying Romans too.

I'll say again, it's a proper function of a nation to protect its citizens.

Nationalism goes further than that: it asks that we put loyalty to the nation above other interests. I cannot do that as I believe that God has created people of all nations, and loves with an all-surpassing love. If I were to put my nation above others, I'd be sinning against the vast majority of the world which is not British.

Jews and Samaritans were divided on religious grounds, not nationalistic. (1 Kings 13:32, 16:29). Such a division was from God. (1 Kings 12:24)

God has always divided. Division of man curbs wickedness among men. The more united man is, the more wicked he becomes. Consider the flood. No divisions of nations prior to. After the flood God began dividing man. (Gen. 10:5, 10;20, 10:31) God told Noah and his sons to move out into the earth and replenish it. But their descendants instead united together at Babel and refused to be scattered. (Gen. 11:4) And we know how that turned out.

God has divided the land masses through the use of oceans. (Gen. 10:25) And He has divided the nations through race and languages. (10:31-32) All for the intent to curb or slow down the wickedness of man.

And it works. But satan is busy. He puts much effort in uniting mankind. Much effort in building the bridges between these divisions God has made. And so now days, the 'unity of man' is seen as such a glorious thing. Which it would be if man were united under God, but he doesn't. He is just united man, with evil multiplying in the earth till it comes to the place again where God will bring about judgement upon man on the earth.

So, nationalism is a good thing. It helps stop the works of satan. That doesn't mean every nation is following God. Some of them, satan has in control. But it restricts satan controlling everyone of them. And of course this is his, satan's, effort at uniting the nations today.

Quantrill