TULIP, here we go again.

[B-A-C]

What do Calvinists believe. These are the main 5 tenants of Calvinism.

1. T - Total Depravity: This doctrine asserts that as a result of the Fall, every part of human nature is tainted by sin. This means that people are inherently sinful and unable to choose God or do good on their own. Human will is not free but is in bondage to sin, making divine intervention necessary for salvation
   
   
2. U - Unconditional Election: This belief states that God has chosen certain individuals for salvation based on His will alone, not on any foreseen merit or action on their part. God's choice is not influenced by human behavior or decisions but is solely an act of His grace and mercy
   
   
3. L - Limited Atonement: Also known as "particular redemption," this doctrine teaches that Jesus Christ's atonement is limited to those whom God has elected for salvation. Christ's death effectively redeems only the elect, ensuring their salvation
   
   
4. I - Irresistible Grace: This principle holds that when God extends His grace to the elect, it cannot be resisted. The Holy Spirit works in the hearts of the chosen to bring them to faith and repentance, ensuring that God's purpose in their salvation is accomplished
   
   
5. P - Perseverance of the Saints: This doctrine asserts that those whom God has elected and drawn to Himself through the Holy Spirit will persevere in faith until the end. True believers will not fall away but will remain steadfast in their faith, secured by God's power
   

 

[B-A-C]

In simpler terms, these are the teachings of Calvinism.

T - mean people re unable to choose to come to God on their own.

John 6:44 "No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up on the last day.

Heb 11:6 And without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is and that He is a rewarder of those who seek Him.

U - basic Predestinations. God picked who gets saved and who doesn't before they were born. You have no say in the matter. No free-will.
God doesn't want everyone to be saved.

2Pet 3:9 The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.
1Tim 2:3 This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior,
1Tim 2:4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

L - Jesus's death and sacrifice wasn't for everyone, it was only for those who God chose to be saved above. Jesus's blood couldn't
cover everyone on Earth even if Jesus wanted it to.

1Jn 2:2 and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world.

I - Another non free-will tenant. When God chooses you to be saved, you can't say no even if you wanted to, but God will keep you from wanting to refuse Him.

Matt 23:37 "Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, the way a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were unwilling.

Acts 7:51 "You men who are stiff-necked and uncircumcised in heart and ears are always resisting the Holy Spirit; you are doing just as your fathers did.

P - This is basically OSAS. Once saved always saved. Even if you had free will to not chose God to save you, now you don't have free-will
to leave God if you wanted to, but the thought here is, God will never let you "want to".

1Tim 4:1 But the Spirit explicitly says that in later times some will fall away from the faith, paying attention to deceitful spirits and doctrines of demons,

 

[B-A-C]

This isn't really spelled out as a Calvinist tenant, but the Calvinist doctrine assumes God knows the future.

1. Jeremiah 29:11: "For I know the plans I have for you,” declares the Lord, “plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future"
   
   
2. Isaiah 46:10: "I make known the end from the beginning, from ancient times, what is still to come. I say, ‘My purpose will stand, and I will do all that I please’"
   
   
3. Psalm 139:4: "Before a word is on my tongue you, Lord, know it completely"
   
   
4. Proverbs 16:9: "In their hearts humans plan their course, but the Lord establishes their steps"

How can He predestine someone if He doesn't know they are going to exist at some point in the future?
How can He know that someone will never fall away from belief in Him if He doesn't know he future?

Not all denominations believe God knows the future or exists outside of time.
Rather some denominations believe God makes prophecy happen in real time. He said something
would happen in the past, and He makes it happen when the time is right. Again, no real free-will
as God makes some people do certain things at certain times.

Other denominations believe God knows the future, but He doesn't make people do things. He just knows what they are going to do before they do it. They also believe there are some events that God causes, not people. Things like the flood, the rapture, are not caused by any human.

 

[KingJ]

At least it is a thread started by someone who disagrees with it and will actively debunk those for it.

I feel this link to a sticky in the bible study section is necessary for this thread.

Calvinism - HyperCalvinism - TULIP : Simplified

Reader... John Calvinism.. Hyper Calvinism.. The "5 Points" "TULIP">... is a Theological blasphemy committed willfully against the Holy Spirit, that is incredible. ITs an attack on God, personally,...... and an attack against the Cross, Literally. John Calvin has his deceived believing that...

www.talkjesus.com

Note how 5 Point Calvinists and their supporters do not deal with any interrogation of their belief.

 

[Rockerduck]

No one I've run into at 50 different churches I've preached to, who says they believe in predestination, bring up the name Calvin ever. In fact, no body name drops anything but the bible. You say tulip to any normal church member; they'll look at you like a dog's sideways face. What's with the Calvin bashing, when nobody cares.

 

[joestue]

No one I've run into at 50 different churches I've preached to, who says they believe in predestination, bring up the name Calvin ever. In fact, no body name drops anything but the bible. You say tulip to any normal church member; they'll look at you like a dog's sideways face. What's with the Calvin bashing, when nobody cares.

Ive met a lot of angry calvanists who cannot be reasoned with.

Consider your experience a blessing.

 

[KingJ]

No one I've run into at 50 different churches I've preached to, who says they believe in predestination, bring up the name Calvin ever. In fact, no body name drops anything but the bible. You say tulip to any normal church member; they'll look at you like a dog's sideways face. What's with the Calvin bashing, when nobody cares.

Calvinists have their own churches. There are many remnants of this ideology in many churches. But only the hyper, extreme 5 point are heretical, just above satanist believers.

After much study and debate, it is only the U and L that is really evil. It suggests God is partial. This kind of teaching is 100% behind all racist type thought.

 

[Rockerduck]

Calvinists have their own churches. There are many remnants of this ideology in many churches. But only the hyper, extreme 5 point are heretical, just above satanist believers.

After much study and debate, it is only the U and L that is really evil. It suggests God is partial. This kind of teaching is 100% behind all racist type thought.

So, why do I only see this against Calvin so much and not Mormons or oneness Pentecostal.

 

[KingJ]

So, why do I only see this against Calvin so much and not Mormons or oneness Pentecostal.

Well, this site has seen a number of recent hyper Calvinists post threads here. Unlike Mormons. The oneness group is a non-trinitarian movement, we have them here too I guess, but their teaching is not as heretic a message as is 5-point Calvinism.

 

[Rockerduck]

Well, this site has seen a number of recent hyper Calvinists post threads here. Unlike Mormons. The oneness group is a non-trinitarian movement, we have them here too I guess, but their teaching is not as heretic a message as is 5-point Calvinism.

I would have to disagree. At least the Tulip is more scriptural than Mormons or oneness

 

[KingJ]

I would have to disagree. At least the Tulip is more scriptural than Mormons or oneness

Well Mormons add three books to the bible, and this done 200 years ago. It has more in common with Islam. We should not even talk about them on a Christian site.

Beliefs like Calvinism and oneness are intentional or unintentional reading and discernment blunders of the bible we all use.

We are to discern the impact of the error / false teaching being pushed. Judge how 'destructive' the heresy is!

2 Pet 2:1 But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction.

Now both these beliefs are certainly not Rom 14:5 type disagreements.

Of the two, I would argue that only Calvinism incriminates God as an evil Being.

Oneness is false as the trinity is real. But you can still tick the block of being a good Christian ambassador 2 Cor 5:20, which is our one job, as someone who does not believe in the trinity.

IE Oneness = John 3:16 For God so loved the world that He sent Jesus to die for all, Calvinism = John 3:16 For God so loved the world that He sent Jesus to die for only a few elect.

The U and L in TULIP heavily incriminate God as an evil Being. See my post # 3, 4 & 5 here for a detailed explanation of why I say this Christian Acid Test to be applied to all doctrines.