Christianity and prepping

[Bluebird]

I have not been on this site in over 5 years. Long story, which I will not get into, other than to say got tired of the trolls.

I have a question for all of you:

We are preppers. In case you do not know what that means, we believe that hard times are coming for everyone. Our economy is getting worse and worse, cost of living is going up out of control, unemployment is at record highs. I know many people cannot find full time jobs and are working numerous part time jobs, with no benefits, at minimum wage. The weather last growing season was awful right across the USA. Crop failures, dried up ponds and streams, grasshoppers eating everything in sight. Many homes around us have been robbed and there are meth labs popping up everywhere. The law enforcement officers (LEO's) are being laid off, as well as cutbacks in fire departments. We live in a mostly rural area and in a two mile stretch there are at least 6 or more foreclosed homes that sit empty - prime real estate for meth labs. We put up a security gate and other security measures we will not talk about.

We have gone back to gardening and putting away the food we grow - like my great grandparents did. We are learning new skills, such as canning meats and vegetables. We are learning how to bake bread from scratch, and I mean from buying wheat berries and grinding our own flour to even learning to grow the wheat. We have paid off the mortgage, paid off all debt. We joined a food buying club that enables us to buy food at wholesale prices - good, organic food. We are hoping to clean up a old storage area and get it ready for chickens and are researching how to care for a goat or two. We are in our late 60's...this is not the golden years as we thought we would have, that is for sure. Most of the time our get up and go has got up and went and we can't find it any where... there is more work to be done that we can possibly do.

I would like to know of others in our situation and what you are doing about it. And I would like your opinions about what we are doing and if you think we are on track or not. We believe that God will take care of us, but we don't believe sitting on our rears and doing nothing is what He had in mind. If we are prepared, we will be able to help others who cannot prepare, like the elderly around us or the single mom with children who was abandoned by her husband when the going got rough. We think too many people have their heads stuck in the sand, thinking the government will ride in on their white chargers to rescue them. Well, that is not about to happen; just look at the area Katrina and Sandy hit. Enuf said. Fire away!

 

[amadeus2]

You are involved in a lot of preparation, which from a carnal standpoint may not a bad thing for the reasons you have stated and more, but haven't you forgotten something in all of your preparation? Have you been preparing to meet your Maker at any time? Have you forgotten about trusting Him?

Did not Jesus say...?

"But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.

Take therefore no thought for the morrow: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself. Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof." Matt 6:33-34

 

[Brad Huber]

Hire someone younger and stronger who needs a job. They can help you around the home, and give you more of a break, and you can give a needy person a job. Anyone doing all the things you are doing has to have some assets. Share them with those in need in return for work.

 

[Bluebird]

Wow, amadeus2, good shot, right between the eyes! How very judgmental of you! You should be proud of yourself. :embarasse

First of all, I am a born-again Christian and I trust my Father in Heaven above all else. I am prepared to meet Him anytime He chooses. I HAVE sought first the kingdom of God. Jesus is my Savior and my Lord and there is no other Name by which I can be saved.

What is with the attack? Is this how Christians are supposed to treat their brothers and sisters in Christ? Oh, but forgive me...I should never assume that YOU are a Christian, right?

Why do I prep? "In the house of the wise man are stores of choice foods and oil, but a foolish man devours all he has." Prov 28:19 "If anyone does not provide for his relatives, and especially for his immediate family, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever." 1 Tim. 5:8 "Go to the ant, you sluggard; consider its ways and be wise! 7It has no commander, no overseer or ruler, 8yet it stores its provisions in summer and gathers its food at harvest." Prov 6: 6-8.

There are more, but hopefully you get it. I do not think following what the Bible says is carnal.


Brad Huber: Thanks for the non-judgmental advice. We do not have much extra cash as husband is retired and we are on a small pension and social security. I was a stay-at-home Mom raising our children and homeschooling the youngest. We used up the majority of cash we had to pay off the mortgage, loans and the bills at retirement. When we need heavy work done, we do hire a friend to help us out, as he has been unable to find much work (self employed in construction). And we have a son who also is here whenever we ask for his help. We have gone to raised beds for gardening, will be constructing another come spring, so we do not have all the bending and lifting.

I was basically asking if there is anyone else out there like us.

 

[Barabbas]

There is nothing wrong with being prepared to look after yourself, and your family during any kind of crises.
Is anyone foolish enough to think the government will be there to coddle you when the stuff happens? Yeah, right.

We have just started to build a small food cache, water, med supplies...etc. getting a decent generator is next up.

Understand this, for any Christian man your responsibility is to look after your family. Got that? If someone wants to live the hippy-dippy, stare gap-mouthed into the sky waiting for an army of angels to appear to make sure your toesies don't get bruised, is living in fantasy land that borders on ignorant superstition.

Do our brothers in Nigeria, and other garbage pits of the world receive angelic hosts to help them as Muslim militias kill them? Why not?
Did God spare all the Christians during Hurricane Sandy? Why not?

It's pretty easy sitting in an armchair in America enjoying the good life, but think on this for a minute, the electricity goes out right now. What are you gonna do?

It's winter, what are you gonna do?
Anyone who has even a cursory knowledge of North Americas power grid knows what can happen.
Supermarkets have at most three days of food, less if panic sets in...and after a couple of days frezzin' yer backside off it will.

What are you gonna do then?

You can pray. Good on ya.

I'll be prayin' too...warm, fed, cozy, protected.:shade:

 

[Larry.]

Wow, amadeus2, good shot, right between the eyes! How very judgmental of you! You should be proud of yourself. :embarasse

First of all, I am a born-again Christian and I trust my Father in Heaven above all else. I am prepared to meet Him anytime He chooses. I HAVE sought first the kingdom of God. Jesus is my Savior and my Lord and there is no other Name by which I can be saved.

What is with the attack? Is this how Christians are supposed to treat their brothers and sisters in Christ? Oh, but forgive me...I should never assume that YOU are a Christian, right?

BLUEBIRD, I think that you might have jumped the gun here in assuming that Amadeus2 was was attacking you. You did not mention in your initial post that you were a born again believer, and I think that he was simply trying to lead you into a relationship with God. As for the term "carnal", I do not believe that he meant that in the negative context in which you received it, but rather meaning "of the flesh" and that you were making excellent provisions to care for it. As for your spiritual readiness, you seem well prepared also.

That being said, I think that what you are doing to prepare for the impending collapse of our national system (economic, societal, financial, agricultural, governmental, etc.) is absolutely justifiable. I personally do not prep, but I have considered doing so for many years and may begin stockpiling canned foods and fuel in the near future. I do have some rather fanatical prepper friends who I'm sure would very happily be willing to share their knowledge with you. Just send me a private message and I'll try to put you in touch with them.
God bless!

 

[farout]

You and your husband are wise stewards of the wisdon of the LORD. There are many doing much like you. We have dome many of the same measures. As you all are in age so are we. Often the end of the month the pickens are not as plentifull as in the first part. We do not waste food, we drive a vehicle that has 140,000 miles on it, we this year are already starting our veggie seeds in the starting containers. We see just what your saying, and you are right! The Bible says the LORD brings calamity to nations that disobey HIM. Our courtry has abandoned the LORD. We kill babies, have openly rejected HIS SON Jesus, and His HOLY NAME is shamefully used as a sware word. Look at Joplin MO, and the forest fires, earthquakes, and Sandy Beack and places like that. Our President has done all he can to advance the acceptance of homosexuality, and Islam religion.

Friends BORN AGAIN beleivers better wake up! I ask have we become so complacent that we are no longer able to see the world is in controled by satan. We best be ready should the believers not be raptured until after the tribulation. Christians will be usless unless we can help others. I do not think we will be raptured until some time after the tribulation starts or at the end.

Way to go Mr & Mrs. Bluebird.

 

[Eric E Stahl]

Bluebird,

You are working in the right direction. Jesus told us that hard times would come when he was about to come back. Matthew 24:1-8

28 Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth.


I live in a rural small town. At the time of Y2K I prepared because I knew we are at the time of the end since the Jews have returned to Israel Zephaniah 1:14-2:3

I did not want to over spend so I bought only things I would use some day.

However I did store some bulk beans, wheat, corn and cooking oil. You can buy those at a feed mill for very few dollars. Store them in cans.

I told my friends that I bought enough spices to make dirt taste good.

After Y2K passed we gave the bulk foods to poor families in the church. They loved Y2K.


If you sprout wheat to double it’s length, it is very high in vitamins.
Or
(1)Wash wheat and get rid of what floats.
(2)Use double the water volume to the wheat volume and boil the water for 1 minute.
(3)Set the wheat and water aside for a five minutes to soak.
(4)Bring wheat and water to a boil for two minutes.
(5)Let soak and get rid of what sinks when the wheat floats.
(6) Drain the water.

This can be stored in the frig for a week. Heat it and put butter on it. It taste like macaroni but is tougher. It is great fried in butter then add Mrs butters worth. Add to soups. It is pasta.

 

[Bluebird]

Barabbas, thanks for the reply. About the generator, really research them. It is a big, expensive purchase. If you have a well, you will need one capable of pulling up the water. That is 220, not 110. Also, get one that is quiet...some are so loud they can be heard for miles, especially when there is no other background noise to cover it up. Also, make sure there are no holes that a mouse can get through. (we found out the hard way about that one, when a mouse or mice got in and ate the insulation off some of the wires and shorted out the generator :shock: A very expensive repair!) Our generator is a whole house generator that comes on automatically when it senses no power from the grid. It runs on propane. It is over 10 years old and has had some pricey repairs. It is also very loud.

Just my 2 cents worth...oops, that just went down to 1 3/4 cents worth...

 

[Bluebird]

Thanks Eric! Have you heard of the book "Nourishing Traditions" by Sally Fallon? Great book! She says that all grains and nuts should be 'sprouted' before use. The nuts are easy to do: Wash nuts then drain. Cover with water and 1 tsp sea salt and let soak overnight, up to 12 hours. Drain well; spread on cookie sheet and bake at no more than 150* for about 12 hours or until dry and crisp. My electric oven does not go down that far so I use my food dryer and dry at about 135* for 6 hours and then turn that down to 105* to finish. They are yummy!

For soaking wheat, you can actually do an overnight method for making bread. Grind the berries; using recipe, mix all liquids with the flour and let set overnight, covered. In the morning, mix in the rest of the ingredients and continue with the recipe.

The sprouting (you actually don't get a seedling, FYI) gets rid of hard to digest enzymes and makes the nutrients more available to your body.

We live outside a small rural town (about 2 miles). The crime rate has escalated in the past two years. So many people out of work, farms being lost to foreclosure, businesses closing. We have always given to a local food bank. God has blessed us so we bless others.

 

[Bluebird]

Thanks, Larry. I may have been wrong about Amadeus2. Or not. All he had to do is check out my previous posts, which are still here even tho' old, to know I was a Christian. He chose not to, he just assumed. Dangerous thing, that assuming.

Thanks for the offer for connecting me to your prepper friends. Actually, we are pretty well set as we have many prepper friends spread out across the country; although it is kinda like chocolate, you can never have too much. Just kiddin'!!

May I ask WHY you do not personally prep? Do you think if the 'impending collapse' happens your friend will take you in? BTW, do not confuse prepping with hoarding, okay?

 

[Bluebird]

Wow, thanks Farout!! I feel a little better about coming back to this site.

There are a few things that I feel Christians should be doing, and one I don't think they should do. I will start with the one thing they shouldn't do ~~~ be an ostrich.

A few of the top things?
1. Take a Red Cross First Aid class.
2. Take a Red Cross CPR class.
3. Find where CERT classes are offered and start taking them. CERT is Citizen Response Teams. They are well trained to go out into the community and help in any disaster. If none are offered in your area, research CERT so you know what you are talking about and go to your local fire department and ASK them to teach the classes. You will have to be stubborn and persistent. If they say no, ask a local church to offer the classes.
4. Begin stocking up on foods you eat on a normal basis. When on sale, instead of buying one, buy four. Use one, set aside the three. Write the expiration date in big numbers on outside of can/bottle. Remember, first in, first out.
5. Start storing water. Yes, even if you are on city water. Without electricity, you will have no water, no sewer. You cannot survive 3 days without water. Have a method of purifying water as you may have to get it from a pond or stream or lake. DO NOT STORE WATER IN OLD PLASTIC MILK CONTAINERS! You can never sterilize out the residue of milk. If you drink pop (soft drinks) you can sterilize those bottles, they hold up well. You will need 1-3 gallons per day per person.

Actually, I need to revise the numbering. FIRST is shelter. SECOND is water. THIRD is food. You can live 3 hours without shelter in bad weather; 3 days without water; 3 weeks without food. This is the law of 3.

Sorry if this is too much information all at once!

 

[amadeus2]

Wow, amadeus2, good shot, right between the eyes! How very judgmental of you! You should be proud of yourself. :embarasse

I do humbly apologize my friend. It was not my intention to hurt you or to attack you... only to be certain that you were not forgetting the most important thing.

Bluebird: First of all, I am a born-again Christian and I trust my Father in Heaven above all else. I am prepared to meet Him anytime He chooses. I HAVE sought first the kingdom of God. Jesus is my Savior and my Lord and there is no other Name by which I can be saved.

I am very glad to hear these things. Give God always the glory!

Bluebird: What is with the attack? Is this how Christians are supposed to treat their brothers and sisters in Christ? Oh, but forgive me...I should never assume that YOU are a Christian, right?

Just being on this forum, of course, doesn't make a person necessarily anything of worth, does it? My eyes are not yet all seeing as are those of the Father. Forgive me my shortcoming. God is still working on me.

Bluebird: Why do I prep? "In the house of the wise man are stores of choice foods and oil, but a foolish man devours all he has." Prov 28:19 "If anyone does not provide for his relatives, and especially for his immediate family, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever." 1 Tim 5:8 "Go to the ant, you sluggard; consider its ways and be wise! 7It has no commander, no overseer or ruler, 8yet it stores its provisions in summer and gathers its food at harvest." Prov 6:6-8.

You'll get no argument from me for doing what you see the Lord telling you to do.

Bluebird: There are more, but hopefully you get it. I do not think following what the Bible says is carnal.

I disagree only slightly. I believe that men can and do misuse and abuse what the Bible says when they are being led in that usage by their own minds and their own ways, instead of being led by the Holy Spirit. An easy example to see of this would be the well read atheist perusing the Bible to prove its error and the non-existence of the Creator. An example for all us should also be the existence of a multitude of supposedly Bible believing groups who are often very opposed to each other based on scriptural arguments. Too many of us, it would seem, are too often double-minded as James calls it. [I have all too often fallen into the double-mindedness, but God is not finished with me yet.]

When a person goes through the Bible and draws conclusions, which are not from or by the Holy Spirit, is that not carnal?

 

[amadeus2]

Thanks, Larry. I may have been wrong about Amadeus2. Or not. All he had to do is check out my previous posts, which are still here even tho' old, to know I was a Christian. He chose not to, he just assumed. Dangerous thing, that assuming.

Again, I am sorry, Bluebird. I really assumed nothing. As to going back an reviewing your old posts, that would not have proved anything definite about you now, would it? God never change, but unfortunately, men do sometimes change in the wrong direction. Recall for example the unnamed prophet out Judah who came to the Jeroboam, the first king of the separated northern 10 tribes. He prophesied about a future king of Judah and his prophecy came to pass, but prophet himself failed to keep in touch with God and as a result was slain by a lion (I Kings 13). I glad that you are not as that prophet. I was only responding to your post; not to your history. Give God the glory in every situation.

 

[Bluebird]

amadeus2, I accept your apology and forgive you. Perhaps a gentler approach would have been better on both our parts. Please accept my apology for over-reacting.

Interestingly, and I was not sure how forthcoming I should be on this site, it WAS the Holy Spirit that put prepping on my heart. First in dreams, which I choose to ignore, than that still, small voice that said VERY clearly "Hard times are coming. Begin to prepare for them NOW." Of course, my first, immediate reaction was panic. What?! Prepare for WHAT?? Husband just retired - we just bought a travel trailer! We want to travel at least two months out of the year!! But! But!! How are we going to do this and do what WE want, too??

Ah, yeah. That old rebellious nature. I want what I want when I want it. After much prayer, and searching the scriptures, I began to begin to do what the Lord had asked. Had very many interesting things happen along the way, knowledge dropped into my mind about what to store, how to store. Sure didn't come from me! BTW, hubby was NOT on board, but is now. At first he kinda looked at me strange but then God opened his eyes, too, and he saw what was happening in the world and how many things started to dovetail together in his mind (good choice of a word as he is a woodworker now).

We found and joined a food buying club and were able to purchase organic products and raw ingredients next to wholesale. If we could not use 50# of oats, there were people who we split the 50# with. I had to learn how to make sure no bugs and bug eggs survived in my grains and grain products. I had to learn how to store food so it would last as long as possible. I learned about food safe buckets, dry ice, oxygen absorbers, Mylar bags, using a Food Saver, Dehydrator, and grain mill; not to store anything in cardboard boxes (lost over 30# of oats and 10# salt that way...the mice found the box, ate through it and chewed small holes in every single bag). We also learned the hard way that DeCon was no way to kill mice...they crawled into the walls to die, you could not reach those stinkin' little bodies and had to live with the smell for at least a month. Traps, the old fashioned ones with bacon and peanut butter, works best. We live in the country, mice coming into the house are a fact of life. You can't find every hole they can squeeze in to but we try.

We changed our eating habits (boy, was THAT hard to do!), went back to gardening after many years of not doing that, built a hip-high raised bed so our poor backs would survive gardening; re-learned how to can, make pickles, dehydrate veggies and fruits.

But the most miraculous thing was that God was working on a relative before we started prepping. This man sat me down and told me what he was doing and why. Now, I did not agree with everything he said (at the time) but I listened. Then the dreams started and then the still small voice. This man had taught himself how to prepare a meal, dehydrate it so that all he had to do was add boiling water to reconstitute it; he then took those meals and went backpacking in the wilderness all by himself, for weeks at a time. Many of the emergency sites on the Internet will sell you dehydrated meals and most taste either blah, too salty and all are mushy. This man figured out how to do it himself. He also learned all about our Constitution, our laws, the 2nd Amendment, and met with his representatives at the state and federal levels. He has taken Red Cross classes, CPR, wilderness first aid, learned how to stitch a wound, how to shoot, clean and cook wild game. He was a practicing Christian at one time but got completely disillusioned when his pastor was caught with his hand in the offerings and using the church credit cards to the max for redoing a house (did not belong to the church but to the pastor) and then cooked up this scheme that members of the congregation 'adopted' various mission families and supported them (make the checks out to the church...) and then not one cent went to the missions but in his pocket...you get the picture. I pray for thisrelative daily, that he would come back to the Lord.

 

[amadeus2]

Interestingly, and I was not sure how forthcoming I should be on this site, it WAS the Holy Spirit that put prepping on my heart. First in dreams, which I choose to ignore, than that still, small voice that said VERY clearly "Hard times are coming. Begin to prepare for them NOW." Of course, my first, immediate reaction was panic. What?! Prepare for WHAT?? Husband just retired - we just bought a travel trailer! We want to travel at least two months out of the year!! But! But!! How are we going to do this and do what WE want, too??

Ah, yeah. That old rebellious nature. I want what I want when I want it. After much prayer, and searching the scriptures, I began to begin to do what the Lord had asked. Had very many interesting things happen along the way, knowledge dropped into my mind about what to store, how to store. Sure didn't come from me! BTW, hubby was NOT on board, but is now. At first he kinda looked at me strange but then God opened his eyes, too, and he saw what was happening in the world and how many things started to dovetail together in his mind (good choice of a word as he is a woodworker now).

We do serve a wondorus God who will always show us what to do and when to do it, if we are only paying attention. While He has led the two of you that way, my wife and I have been to led to seriously downsizing, twice. Last year, we thought we had done it all when we moved 50 miles closer to where we worship regularly to a smaller house... and had to adopt out our two beloved pets to a dear sister in the Lord. Now within 30 days we'll be moving again, at the Lord's urging to a still smaller place. He is getting us ready to do some work for Him. All the encumbrances have to be gone... including the debts which were holding us back. We also will be traveling to places God wants us to go to do His work. We thought that we had been serving God already, and we were, in a measure, but we couldn't do what God was asking us to do without making some changes. This, apparently, is what is happening to you and your husband.

Bluebird: We found and joined a food buying club and were able to purchase organic products and raw ingredients next to wholesale. If we could not use 50# of oats, there were people who we split the 50# with. I had to learn how to make sure no bugs and bug eggs survived in my grains and grain products. I had to learn how to store food so it would last as long as possible. I learned about food safe buckets, dry ice, oxygen absorbers, Mylar bags, using a Food Saver, Dehydrator, and grain mill; not to store anything in cardboard boxes (lost over 30# of oats and 10# salt that way...the mice found the box, ate through it and chewed small holes in every single bag). We also learned the hard way that DeCon was no way to kill mice...they crawled into the walls to die, you could not reach those stinkin' little bodies and had to live with the smell for at least a month. Traps, the old fashioned ones with bacon and peanut butter, works best. We live in the country, mice coming into the house are a fact of life. You can't find every hole they can squeeze in to but we try.

We changed our eating habits (boy, was THAT hard to do!), went back to gardening after many years of not doing that, built a hip-high raised bed so our poor backs would survive gardening; re-learned how to can, make pickles, dehydrate veggies and fruits.

We must surely continue to listen and to obey the "still small voice". Not every member of the Body of Christ will have the same function, but everyone will have a function. How can we not put ourselves fully into that function?

Bluebird: But the most miraculous thing was that God was working on a relative before we started prepping. This man sat me down and told me what he was doing and why. Now, I did not agree with everything he said (at the time) but I listened. Then the dreams started and then the still small voice. This man had taught himself how to prepare a meal, dehydrate it so that all he had to do was add boiling water to reconstitute it; he then took those meals and went backpacking in the wilderness all by himself, for weeks at a time. Many of the emergency sites on the Internet will sell you dehydrated meals and most taste either blah, too salty and all are mushy. This man figured out how to do it himself. He also learned all about our Constitution, our laws, the 2nd Amendment, and met with his representatives at the state and federal levels. He has taken Red Cross classes, CPR, wilderness first aid, learned how to stitch a wound, how to shoot, clean and cook wild game. He was a practicing Christian at one time but got completely disillusioned when his pastor was caught with his hand in the offerings and using the church credit cards to the max for redoing a house (did not belong to the church but to the pastor) and then cooked up this scheme that members of the congregation 'adopted' various mission families and supported them (make the checks out to the church...) and then not one cent went to the missions but in his pocket...you get the picture. I pray for thisrelative daily, that he would come back to the Lord.

Unfortunately, my wife and I can relate to that type of pastor from our own experience, who is either is not really a pastor at all, or he has gone very far astray from his calling.

The pastor we have now may be the only really dedicated (to the Lord) pastor we have had in all our many years of serving God. This is why we were commuting 100 miles (round trip) twice a week to attend services with him. The Lord moved us closer initially so my wife could care for our pastor's wife in her last several weeks of natural life. She died of pancreatic cancer 9-1-2012. She passed on, but the her testimony will continue to live in those who knew her.

Now we, my wife and I, are striving to fulfill that dear lady's wish for someone to watch out for her husband, our pastor. Spiritually, he watches out for everyone, while his wife had always cared for the natural needs on his behalf. Now that task has fallen to us. In this task we have been blessed as we have never been blessed previously.

You and your husband hold fast to your calling. God will keep you well for as long as you trust Him.

 

[Bluebird]

Thanks, amadeus2. We also were in this same church this relative was in. At first the pastor was on fire for the Lord and many, many miracles happened. He was so humble and full of the Holy Spirit. Then one of his children developed a life-changing disease and we watched in dismay as his faith fell apart. We were both part of the staff and did all we could but he would listen to no one. It was so sad, it just broke our hearts. The pastor became suspicious of everyone on his staff. He got rid of the youth pastor, got rid of the music minister and got rid of most of the board. We were told to leave also so we did. Whenever anyone left the church, no one still there was allowed to contact them. So we lost many friends in the process. We were so burned out. After we left was when the mission fraud and credit card fraud were discovered. The church went from nearly 400 people down to 20. Finally he was asked to leave. Now the church has been built back up and the new pastor is a young man who grew up in that church. He has many people surrounding him to keep him accountable - which was his idea. I have great respect for him.

We have looked and looked for a church home near us. We have decided we may as well look in other denominations, too. It will happen in God's timing, not ours.

Now we, my wife and I, are striving to fulfill that dear lady's wish for someone to watch out for her husband, our pastor. Spiritually, he watches out for everyone, while his wife had always cared for the natural needs on his behalf. Now that task has fallen to us. In this task we have been blessed as we have never been blessed previously.

Please be careful to keep watch over your pastor so that he does not 'overdo'. He needs to be encouraged to take time for himself. Many times someone grieving buries themselves in work, which can be detrimental. You are a good friend to him, as is your wife.

I am not sure what God has in store for us. This time off from church has been a blessing and a curse. It is so easy to drift and do nothing. We pray God will direct us where he wants us.

 

[amadeus2]

Thanks, amadeus2. We also were in this same church this relative was in. At first the pastor was on fire for the Lord and many, many miracles happened. He was so humble and full of the Holy Spirit. Then one of his children developed a life-changing disease and we watched in dismay as his faith fell apart. We were both part of the staff and did all we could but he would listen to no one. It was so sad, it just broke our hearts. The pastor became suspicious of everyone on his staff. He got rid of the youth pastor, got rid of the music minister and got rid of most of the board. We were told to leave also so we did. Whenever anyone left the church, no one still there was allowed to contact them. So we lost many friends in the process. We were so burned out. After we left was when the mission fraud and credit card fraud were discovered. The church went from nearly 400 people down to 20. Finally he was asked to leave. Now the church has been built back up and the new pastor is a young man who grew up in that church. He has many people surrounding him to keep him accountable - which was his idea. I have great respect for him.

Unfortunately, these kind of things are happening too often in too many places. God does not require us to make vows to Him, but if we do we had better very slow to break such a vow. I am not condemning the man for I do not know him, but something very serious went wrong in his ministry and it apparently cost not only him, but those who trusted him. This is why it is so very important, that while must necessarily attempt to help and encourage those who are over us, we must always put our first trust always in God. Men can and do fail. God never fails.

Bluebird: We have looked and looked for a church home near us. We have decided we may as well look in other denominations, too. It will happen in God's timing, not ours.

Absolutely! It is not you or I who should do the choosing (as to where we will gather ourselves together), but God. Leaving an assembly or a denomination may be the best thing, but going ahead and doing it needs to be in accord with God's will and timing, not ours.

Bluebird: Please be careful to keep watch over your pastor so that he does not 'overdo'. He needs to be encouraged to take time for himself. Many times someone grieving buries themselves in work, which can be detrimental. You are a good friend to him, as is your wife.

Yes, we understand that very well. He is now 87 years old. He was married to his wife for 66 years and all of that time he was a minister working for God in various places in the United States and in other countries. They were together more than either of them was every any place else. He regularly calls us on the phone or comes by the house to visit. We know that sometimes, he has not real business to conduct with us. He is simply lonely. 66 years of marriage, but they never had natural children. We are his children. He will come in and talk to us about some of the things that God has shown him and experiences he had with his wife over the years. He blessed us with his testimonies, while we simply fill in some of the empty space left by his departed wife. No one can fill up that space, not really.

Bluebird: I am not sure what God has in store for us. This time off from church has been a blessing and a curse. It is so easy to drift and do nothing. We pray God will direct us where he wants us.

Amen! Your plans should always be according to His plan. He will always let you know what to do next, if you stay in touch with Him.

 

[Bluebird]

amadeus2, Be sure to record or write down the many stories he tells you. What a treasure trove of faith!

 

[amadeus2]

amadeus2, Be sure to record or write down the many stories he tells you. What a treasure trove of faith!

Yes, I have a notebook at hand most of the time recording things. I know that his time is probably not long, although at 87 he is seeminly very good health. Sometime he will tell stories of his youth as if it were yesterday. My own memory of my youth is not so clear as his seems to be.