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Cleansing one's home and life?

MedicBravo

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Joined
Jun 26, 2022
Messages
1,702
I used to have a friend who is gay. So much we had the "talk" and it didn't end well.
He insist he was "born that way" and has never been attracted to women. I have an office desk and chair well worn that I need to get rid of. I have replacements coming next week.
Second, I've a lot of books by Stephen King and Ann Rice. I used to be into Horror on such a level and read those books more than anything. I still have them and they're stitting on the bottom of a book shelf. I'd rather get rid of them than sell them to someone else
IMO and experience you don't keep evil things in your home. You don't let people who refuse to repent and change into your home.
 
Are you saying that you know more about whether your former friend was ever attracted to women or not? If the exclusively gay male has never desired women, but only other males, isn't it reasonable he would believe he was born that way? Doesn't everyone know some things about their life over which they had no choice? How is it explained except that it was ordained by God, predestined to be that way? If an individual made no choice about it, who ordered it? The question your former friend needed an answer to, is how they will deal with their situation?

"You will say, ‘Then why does God find fault, if no one can resist his will?’ Who do you think you are to answer God back? Can the pot say to the potter, ‘Why did you make me like this?’? Surely the potter can do what he likes with the clay. Is he not free to make two vessels out of the same lump, one to be treasured, the other for common use?" (Rom 9:19-21 REB)
 
I agree that we should not let evil things be in our homes, like uiji boards/games that promote being immoral like GTA. But ppl are not things, and despite the sin that we find in other people, we should always remember that we too were ppl who loved sin at one time. You should not pretend that immoral sexual desires are "okay", but neither should you show that you despise the ppl who harbor them either. Love the good you still see in them and encourage that but never be okay with the sin nature in yourselves or others. The idea is to win souls, not put evil ppl into areas you are not, to make your life easier.
 
How is it explained except that it was ordained by God, predestined to be that way?
What an evil god it would be to ordain or predestine the painful horrors of child bone cancer.

It's why most people of good reason are repelled by the evils of Calvinism.

God does not, nor ever did, predestine or ordain evil.

So God created humankind in his image, in the image of God he created them; male and female he created them.​
(Genesis 1:27 NRSV)

Oddly enough, doesn't the LG..(TQ...?) community vociferously deny that there is any genetic component to their "disposition"? Demanding that it be normalized and accepted as a choice?

And for the serial killer... HEY it wasn't my fault... GOD made me to do it.

Ashes and dust,
Rhema



@KingJ
 
I'd rather get rid of them than sell them to someone else
IMO and experience you don't keep evil things in your home.
Agreed. And that's why I dispose of every NIV translation I can get my hands on. :innocent:

You don't let people who refuse to repent and change into your home.
Not to validate them as "okay," but we are under Command... (and it's a good time to pause and read through the passage):

But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust. For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same? And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so? Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.​
(Matthew 5:44-48 KJV)

And what do we pray for? That the Holy Spirit convicts them of their belief. It's same thing we ought to pray for those of the Calvinistic bent.

God bless,
Rhema

PS: Confession time. I do keep one copy of the NIV in my library, but just for research purposes. :laughing:
 
I used to have a friend who is gay. So much we had the "talk" and it didn't end well.
He insist he was "born that way" and has never been attracted to women. I have an office desk and chair well worn that I need to get rid of. I have replacements coming next week.
Second, I've a lot of books by Stephen King and Ann Rice. I used to be into Horror on such a level and read those books more than anything. I still have them and they're stitting on the bottom of a book shelf. I'd rather get rid of them than sell them to someone else
IMO and experience you don't keep evil things in your home. You don't let people who refuse to repent and change into your home.

100% agreement on all points!

1. Gays born that way

This has been debunked so many times that anyone claiming it, is very ignorant. It is a well known fact that children are not mindful or aware of sexual desires until either around puberty age or if exposed to it at a younger age. You cannot be born gay but you are most certainly born straight. Thanks to all the recent 'boys in girls sport nonsense', the public at large has become very well informed. Your body, if a boy, will produce a lot more testosterone over estrogen. There is a natural attraction that one with high testosterone has for someone with high estrogen and vice versa. This is why transsexuals or sick parents do hormone replacement 'therapy'.

2. No evil people in your house

Paul is clear in 1 Cor 5 on the following:

A - If they are in a mortal sin (as highlighted by Paul in the first verse) and call themselves Christians, they should not be allowed to step foot in your house.

B - If they are in a mortal sin and do not call themselves Christians, they should be welcomed into your house but they should only have a 'visitor's' permit. If you have kids and a wife in your house, you have a responsibility to them too and would need to consider the actual sin of the person.

3. No evil objects in your house

Avoiding all appearance of evil 1 Thess 5:22 is part and parcel of our 'one' job as a Christian. Namely, being ambassadors for Jesus 2 Cor 5:20.

I don't believe there is a cap on this. If something convicts you or someone else who is a Christian, it must be removed.
 
I do not know if a person is born gay or not, but the most important thing to realize is we are all born into sin ! and being gay is sin.

So I would never argue if they are born that way or not, I would say of course we are all born into sin. and leave it at that.

God is chain breaker he frees us from our enslavement to a sinful lifestyle when we trust in him. Being gay is no different then a person who is not gay sleeping with someone when not married.

For the word of God say fornicators and homosexuals will no inherit the Kingdom of God.

1 Corinthians 6:9-10O do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.​


the main point when anyone says they are born that way is not to argue with them about that, but to make it clear it is sin, and sin is something we are all needing cleansing from.
 
It pays to be knowledgeable on a topic before being dogmatic.
From a current College Psychology Textbook available online
CHAPTER 11 WHAT DRIVES US: HUNGER, SEX, BELONGING, AND ACHIEVEMENT 401
Myers, D. G., & C. N. DeWall (2021), Psychology, 13th edition. New York: Worth Publishers.

Today’s psychologists view sexual orientation as neither willfully chosen nor willfully
changed. “Efforts to change sexual orientation are unlikely to be successful and involve
some risk of harm,” declared a 2009 American Psychological Association report. A con
sensus of British mental health organizations agreed that such attempts are “unethi
cal and potentially harmful” (Gale et al., 2017). Recognizing this, in 2016, Malta became
the first European country to outlaw the controversial practice of “conversion therapy,”
which aims to change people’s gender identity or sexual orientation. An increasing num
ber of U.S. states and cities have likewise banned conversion therapy with minors.
Sexual orientation in some ways is like handedness: Most people are one way, some
the other. A smaller group experiences some form of ambidexterity. Regardless, the way
we are endures, especially in men (Dickson et al., 2013; Norris et al., 2015). Women’s
sexual orientation tends to be less strongly felt and, for some women, is more fluid and
changing. Heterosexual women may experience genital arousal to either male or female
sexual stimuli (Chivers, 2017). In general, men are sexually simpler. Men’s lesser sexual
variability is apparent in many ways (Baumeister, 2000). Across time, cultures, situations,
and differing levels of education, religious observance, and peer influence, men’s sexual
drive and interests have been less flexible and varying than have women’s. Women, for
example, more often prefer to alternate periods of high sexual activity with periods of
almost none (Mosher et al., 2005). Baumeister calls this flexibility erotic plasticity.

“ There is no sound scientific evidence
that sexual orientation can be changed.”
— UK Royal College of Psychiatrists, 2014

Origins of Sexual Orientation
So, if we do not choose our sexual orientation and (especially for males) cannot change
it, where do these feelings come from? In an early search for possible environmen
tal influences on sexual orientation, Kinsey Institute investigators in the 1980s inter
viewed nearly 1000 lesbian/gay and 500 heterosexual people. They assessed nearly every
imaginable psychological cause of same-sex attraction—parental relationships, child
hood sexual experiences, peer relationships, and dating experiences (Bell et al., 1981;
Hammersmith, 1982). Their findings: Gay and lesbian people were no more likely than
heterosexual people to have been smothered by maternal love or neglected by their
father. And consider this: If “distant fathers” were more likely to produce gay sons, then
shouldn’t boys growing up in father-absent homes more often be gay? (They are not.)
And shouldn’t the rising number of such homes have led to a noticeable increase in
the gay population? (It has not.) Most children raised by gay or lesbian parents display
gender-typical behavior and are heterosexual (Farr et al., 2018; Gartrell & Bos, 2010). And
they grow up with health and emotional well-being similar to (and sometimes better
than) children with straight parents (Bos et al., 2016; Farr, 2017).
So, what else might influence sexual orientation? One theory has proposed that people
develop same-sex erotic attachments if segregated by sex at the time their sex drive
matures (Storms, 1981). Indeed, gay men tend to recall going through puberty somewhat
earlier, when peers are more likely to be all males (Bogaert et al., 2002). But even in tribal
cultures in which same-sex sexual behavior is expected of all boys before marriage, most
men are still heterosexual (Hammack, 2005; Money, 1987). (As this illustrates, sexual behav
ior is not always indicative of sexual orientation.) Moreover, though peers’ attitudes predict
teens’ sexual attitudes and behavior, they do not predict same-sex attraction. “Peer influ
ence has little or no effect” on sexual orientation (Brakefield et al., 2014).
Environment likely contributes to sexual orientation—nature and nurture work
together—but the inability to pin down specific environmental influences has led
researchers to explore several lines of biological evidence. These include same-sex
attraction in other species, brain differences, and genetic and prenatal influences.

SAME-SEX ATTRACTION IN OTHER SPECIES In Boston’s Public Gardens, care
takers solved the mystery of why a much-loved swan couple’s eggs never hatched. Both
swans were female. In New York City’s Central Park Zoo, penguins Silo and Roy spent
several years as devoted same-sex partners. Same-sex sexual behaviors have also been
observed in several hundred other species, including grizzlies, gorillas, giraffes, monkeys,
flamingos, and owls (Bagemihl, 1999). Among rams, for example, some 7 to 10 percent
display same-sex attraction by shunning ewes and seeking to mount other males (Perkins
& Fitzgerald, 1997). Same-sex sexual behavior seems a natural part of the animal world.
 
Many conservative evangelical versions use some form of "homosexuality" as the translation, but is it correct?

Eerdmans Dictionary of the Bible, Copyright 2000
"The terms 'homosexuality' and 'homosexual' are coinages of the 19th century C.E. and have no equivalent in ancient Hebrew or Greek. It is debatable whether the modern idea of homosexuality (an erotic attraction focused only or primarily on persons of the same gender) existed at all in antiquity. The Bible does not appear to say anything directly about homosexuality in this modern sense of the term, but a few passages do refer to same-gender genital acts." page 602

New Bible Dictionary, Third Edition, IVP Copyright 1996
"The Bible says nothing specifically about the homosexual condition (despite the rather misleading RSV translation of 1 Cor. 6:9), but its condemnations of homosexual conduct are explicit. The scope of these strictures must, however, be carefully determined. Too often they have been used as tools of a homophobic polemic which has claimed too much." page 478

Evangelical Dictionary of Theology, Second Edition, Copyright 2001, Baker Reference Library
"Traditionally homosexuality was the sin for which Sodom was destroyed by divine judgment, hence the popular term 'sodomy.' This interpretation depends upon uncertain translation, while Ezekiel 16:48-50 and Sirach 16:8-9 give other reasons for the judgment. The assumption of homosexuality in Sodom dates from the Greek occupation of Palestine, when 'the Greek sin' seriously endangered Jewish youth and strong scriptural warning was necessary... It is usually assumed that the male cult prostitutes common in heathen shrines but forbidden in Israel (Deut. 23:17), though sometimes prevalent (1 Kings 14:24; 15:12; 22:46; 2 Kings 23:7), were homosexual." page 574

We hear it and read it, that homosexuals are condemned as sinners in the past history of the church, but the only references that can be given show "sodomites' and/or male "cult prostitutes" (NRSV) There is not one single verse or passage in the entire Bible that condemns two males in a loving homoerotic relationship. The references in Leviticus are often pointed to, but there are 2 problems with that. One is, the last verse of the book states clearly these were laws given to Israel at Mt. Sinai in the Old Covenant; and in addition, it is referring to the male cult prostitutes, not what today is known as two gay guys in a relationship. I've scoured commentaries from the past and have found none that describe a sin that is equivalent to a gay relationship in itself.

The Tyndale Old Testament Commentary series, Leviticus, by Professor R. K. Harrison
"The regulations of Leviticus condemn certain aberrations found among the Egyptians and Canaanites, who went far towards deifying sexual activity, and assigned the title 'holy ones' to cultic prostitutes. Sacro-homosexual practices and female prostitution within the context of the cultus was probably well established throughout the ancient Near East long before the Israelites occupied Canaan. Homosexuality of a non-religious variety is poorly documented in Mesopotamian texts..."

It is foolish to point to the creation account. Sin is the breaking of God's law, not being at variance to the created design. It is equally foolish to claim there is no reference to homoerotic element in male friendship found in the Bible. It clearly existed in the love of Jonathan for David and a little bit of study proves it to be so. Of course, those who ignorantly make "sodomite" and "homosexual" synonymous, will not be able to see it because of their blind homophobia.
 
When you look to the world and its ever changing morals, you will eventually find something that you will agree with, but God's word is the only absolute authority on morals. Posting what they world thinks should mean little to christians, other than to compare the two.
 
When you look to the world and its ever changing morals, you will eventually find something that you will agree with, but God's word is the only absolute authority on morals. Posting what they world thinks should mean little to christians, other than to compare the two.
When writing and talking about what God says in His word, the language we are to use in translation must reflect the language of the day, which means the world of today, and on this topic that means avoiding the word "homosexual" and its derivatives. The word "homosexual" that came into English around 1900 is not a synonym for "sodomite", which expresses the biblical meaning today, and that remains the same meaning found in the KJV, RV, ASV, YLT, etc., in 1 Cor. 6:9 and 1 Tim. 1:10:

"have ye not known that the unrighteous the reign of God shall not inherit? be not led astray; neither whoremongers, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor sodomites," (1Cor 6:9 YLT)

"whoremongers, sodomites, men-stealers, liars, perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that to sound doctrine is adverse," (1Tim 1:10 YLT)

"sodomize, To subject to an act of sodomy, especially forcibly."
The American Heritage dictionary of the English Language, copyright ©2022

"ABU'SER, n. s as z. One who abuses, in speech or behavior; one that deceives; a ravisher; a sodomite. 1 Cor 6"
The 1828 Webster's dictionary of English
 
"sodomite :someone who practices sodomy —used as a term of abuse and disparagement for a gay person"
Merriam-Webster, Est. 1828

Any Christian who continues to use "homosexual" in the place of "sodomite" is either an ignoramus or a homophobic bible thumper who picks a translation according to his bigotry. Since 1971, the RSV, NRSV and NRSVue ceased using any form of "homosexuals" because it is very misleading. The NRSV and NRSVue are considered 'academic' translations, which are Formal Equivalence translations avoiding theological opinions.
 


:
anal or oral copulation with another person
especially : anal or oral copulation with a member of the same sex


2
: copulation with an animal


the sexual act of putting the ***** into another person's anus


sodomy, noncoital carnal copulation. The term is understood in history, literature, and law in several senses: (1) as denoting any homosexual practices between men, in allusion to the biblical story of Sodom (Genesis 18:19), (2) as denoting anal intercourse, (3) as synonymous with bestiality or zoophilia (i.e., sexual relations between human beings and animals), and (4) as comprehending a number of other sexual activities, ranging from sexual contacts with minors to oral-genital contacts and oral intercourse between adults.
 






That's odd. Has anyone ever seen an English Bible that contains the word "sodomy" anywhere? I've never seen one and I've been around for a good while.
 
STOP THE PRESSES. DYLAN DISCOVERS THAT THE BOOK "Psychology, 13th edition." OVERRIDES HIS BIBLE.
It pays to be knowledgeable on a topic before being dogmatic.
From a current College Psychology Textbook available online
CHAPTER 11 WHAT DRIVES US: HUNGER, SEX, BELONGING, AND ACHIEVEMENT 401
Myers, D. G., & C. N. DeWall (2021), Psychology, 13th edition. New York: Worth Publishers.

Eerdmans Dictionary of the Bible, Copyright 2000
New Bible Dictionary, Third Edition, IVP Copyright 1996
Evangelical Dictionary of Theology, Second Edition, Copyright 2001, Baker Reference Library
The Tyndale Old Testament Commentary series, Leviticus, by Professor R. K. Harrison

ALL these books, and no wisdom.

Here's an example:
Any Christian who continues to use "homosexual" in the place of "sodomite" is either an ignoramus or a homophobic bible thumper who picks a translation according to his bigotry.
That's odd. Has anyone ever seen an English Bible that contains the word "sodomy" anywhere? I've never seen one and I've been around for a good while.
So you're demanding that we use the word sodomite when you yourself clearly state that the word "sodomy" is not contained in any English Bible? (That's not very wise.)

That's odd....
There shall be no w.hore of the daughters of Israel, nor a sodomite (H6945) of the sons of Israel.​
(Deuteronomy 23:17 KJV)

Granted, though, I think it to be obvious that H6945 wasn't well understood by those particular KJV translators...

None of the daughters of Israel shall be a temple prostitute; none of the sons of Israel shall be a temple prostitute. You shall not bring the fee of a prostitute or the wages of a male prostitute into the house of the LORD your God in payment for any vow, for both of these are abhorrent to the LORD your God.​
(Deuteronomy 23:17-18 NRSV)

You're friendly neighborhood bible thumper,
Rhema


 
Since 1971, the RSV, NRSV and NRSVue ceased using any form of "homosexuals" because it is very misleading. The NRSV and NRSVue are considered 'academic' translations, which are Formal Equivalence translations avoiding theological opinions.
If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall be put to death; their blood is upon them.​
(Leviticus 20:13 NRSV)

Nope, not misleading.

Merely descriptive.

(Thump),
Rhema
 
There is not one single verse or passage in the entire Bible that condemns two males in a loving homoerotic relationship. The references in Leviticus are often pointed to, but there are 2 problems with that. One is, the last verse of the book states clearly these were laws given to Israel at Mt. Sinai in the Old Covenant
Do you see why I have stated that you post contradictions, Dylan?

(Do you understand why you had to put me on ignore?)

You say, "not one single verse or passage in the entire Bible..." yet you declare that "there were laws given to Israel at M.t Sinai in the Old Covenant."

The laws given to Israel at Mt. Sinai in the Old Covenant, are STILL IN THE BIBLE.

If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall be put to death; their blood is upon them.​
(Leviticus 20:13 NRSV)

Rhema

(@B-A-C, while it's likely to be a fool's errand, it's obvious that Dylan has me on ignore because he cannot post a substantive rebuttal to my replies. Perhaps you could be so kind as to post Leviticus 20:13 from his beloved NRSV? You too could join the chosen to be ignored. ;) )
 
That's odd. Has anyone ever seen an English Bible that contains the word "sodomy" anywhere? I've never seen one and I've been around for a good while.
Sodomy refers to anal or oral intercourse.

Do not have sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman; that is detestable.

Ya can try n twist the Word all ya want dissect it all ya want best believe this tho nothing good will come from..

Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men".

Idk if your gay n need a reason to keep doing what ever it is your doing n your looking for validation that do so or if one who is close to you is gay but the Truth will not change not for me or you or anyone else..

It's not feelings that are sinful it is the actions when we do it n to say one can't control their sexual urges is just showing they follow the animal instincts like brute beast

B,ut these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;

Personally idc what one is but stop trying to convince people that One can't fight temptation if they choose too..

Which seems your trying very hard to do

Idk what god you follow but it mustn't be a very good one if he can't even help ya in the midst of being in trouble




J.s.
Geez
(⁠┛⁠✧⁠Д⁠✧⁠)⁠)⁠┛⁠彡⁠┻⁠━⁠┻
 
"sodomite :someone who practices sodomy —used as a term of abuse and disparagement for a gay person"
Merriam-Webster, Est. 1828

Any Christian who continues to use "homosexual" in the place of "sodomite" is either an ignoramus or a homophobic bible thumper who picks a translation according to his bigotry. Since 1971, the RSV, NRSV and NRSVue ceased using any form of "homosexuals" because it is very misleading. The NRSV and NRSVue are considered 'academic' translations, which are Formal Equivalence translations avoiding theological opinions.
associated with the people of Sodom, a city in the Hebrew Bible that was destroyed by God for its wickedness. The story of Sodom's destruction is told in Genesis 18–19. The connection between Sodom and homosexuality comes from the Bible's description of a mob of Sodomites attempting to rape Lot's male guests.

Idk what god you follow frfr
 
The word "sodomite" in the KJV & ASV

KJV margin on Dt. 23:17 - "*****: or, sodomitess" " Therefore the KJV translators recognized that this is more than simple prostitution. Sodomitess and sodomite would be temple prostitutes. (Since when does the legitimate KJV word "wh*re" need to be blanked out??)

ASV margin on Dt. 23:17 on prostitute: "Hebrew: kedeshah. See Genesis 38:21", and on sodomite: "Hebrew: kadesh"

The BDB Hebrew Dictionary:
qedêshâh (kedeshah) - female temple prostitute, harlot
qâdêsh (kadesh) - male temple prostitute

"Sodom in the Strong's Hebrew Dictionary
"sedôm sed-ome' From an unused root meaning to scorch; burnt (that is, volcanic or bituminous) district; Sedom, a place near the Dead Sea:—Sodom."

The word "sodomite" in the NRSV & YLT from Strong's Greek Dictionary
"arsenokoitēs From G730 and G2845; a sodomite:—abuser of (that defile) self with mankind."

What did the Lord GOD say the iniquity of Sodom was?
"As I live, saith the Lord GOD, Sodom thy sister hath not done, she nor her daughters, as thou hast done, thou and thy daughters. Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, fulness of bread, and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy. And they were haughty, and committed abomination(tô‛êbah) before me: therefore I took them away as I saw good." (Ezek 16:48-50 KJV)
"abomination" here is the Hebrew tô‛êbah which is also used in this same chapter earlier:

"Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because thy filthiness was poured out, and thy nakedness discovered through thy whoredoms with thy lovers, and with all the idols of thy abominations (tô‛êbah), and by the blood of thy children, which thou didst give unto them;" (Ezek 16:36 KJV)
Ezekiel uses tô‛êbah 41 times and it is usually connected with idolatry.

If the word "sodomy" were to be found in the Bible, it would be there in Ezekiel. There is just no word in the Hebrew or Greek that can be translated "sodomy". I repeat, there is NO sin called "sodomy" in the English translations, because there is no Hebrew or Greek word that can be translated as "sodomy". The KJV uses "sodomite" in the OT, never in the NT. The NRSV uses "sodomite" in the NT, never in the OT. The English translations don't even agree where to use "sodomites", in Hebrew or in Greek. There is no sin called "sodomy" in the Bible languages, so you cannot connect "sodomite" to a word that does not exist in the Bible. If you wish to know the meaning of today of "sodomite", it is best to see it in the synonyms, as in the Roget:

From the Seventh Edition of Roget's International Thesaurus, 2010 we find "sodomites" in this group:
"75.16 sexual pervert; pervert, perve <nf>, deviant, deviate, sex pervert, sex fiend, sex criminal, sexual psychopath; sodomist, sodomite, sob <Brit nf>, bugger; pederast; paraphiliac; zoophiliac..." Seen within the category of synonyms, the meaning of the word "sodomite" in this day is more clear, and it is not "homosexual" but is synonymous with "sexual pervert".
 
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