Contraception is against human life

[Francis Drake]

Originally Posted by Francis Drake
Say I marry a lady who has been ill for some time in her reproductive organs. She has been told that any pregnancy will kill her. We are both deeply in love, and are greatly concerned for her future. Therefore we decide not to have children, and must use contraceptives.
How does your theory apply? Are we in rebellion here? Am I wrong to choose the life of my wife against her death, and that of the child. Or should we marry but never be allowed to consummate it.

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What are the odds of that situation happening? Extremely rare, I'll wager. Of course there should be exceptions for legitimate medical reasons, but that does not validate the casual use of contraceptives.

Ed, you would be foolish to place your wager on this daft notion!
Added to which, if a theology comes from God, rather than some religious zealots, then it will hold water when and wherever it is applied. The medical profession has absolutely no place in deciding the validity of biblical truth.

I wrote the comment because it is close to my personal experience with my wife. She has had a serious and painful problem with her womb for decades and has repeatedly been told that she should have a hysterectomy, something which she consistently refuses. We constantly fight and believe for healing, and always seek the Lord in that area.
We have therefore used contraceptives which brings us straight under the judgment of the legalists on this forum.

My wife and I both have a vibrant relationship with the Lord. We are both very sensitive to hearing the Holy Spirit, and know clearly when we walk outside of the will of the Lord.
My wife is also my best friend in the whole world, my closest companion and spiritual partner. I have never met anyone who sees the heart of God like she does.
We also both thoroughly enjoy the sexual side of our marriage. It is delightful and a special part of our relationship. She would be extremely aggrieved if we were not able to enjoy that part relationship because of the so called spiritual rules as presented here.
From both our experiences, from knowing the passionate heart of God, from knowing scriptural truths, the notion that the purpose of sex is primarily reproductive is shear unbiblical bunkum.
Perversion has made sex into something unclean in this world, so why are Christians again adding to Satan's weaponry against pure hearted marital sex?
What does the bible say about marital sex?
Hebrews 13v4. "Marriage is honourable in all, and the marriage bed undefiled, but fornicators and adulterers God will judge".

1Cor7v2. Nevertheless, to avoid fornication let every man have his own wife and let every woman have her own husband. 3. Let the husband render unto the wife her due, and likewise the also the wife unto the husband.

Read it people. Read it. This is totally about sexual enjoyment. Paul is not merely trying to enlarge the Corinthian church membership!

v4 The wife has not power over her own body, but the husband and likewise also the husband has not power over his own body but the wife. v5 Defraud you not one another except it be with consent for a time that you may give yourselves to fasting and prayer...........................etc.

There is nowhere in these passages which indicate that sex is primarily for reproduction purposes. Paul makes it clear that sex is a God created and obligatory part of marriage which should never be used to defraud the other. Paul couldn't be clearer that both sides have a right to demand sexual pleasure from the other!

Its about time some true scriptural evidence was given to support these legalistic ideas for making marital sex ever more sinful.

 

[Fragrant Grace]

legalists on this forum.........
[/B]
.....Perversion has made sex into something unclean in this world, so why are Christians again adding to Satan's weaponry against pure hearted marital sex?...

Its about time some true scriptural evidence was given to support these legalistic ideas for making marital sex ever more sinful.

Francis Drake
There does not appear to be any point in this thread where you and your wife come under judgement of those you call legalists on this forum.
Even the original poster with whom you 'loudly' disagreed with has not returned to discuss your view points.

The needs of women with certain medical conditions have been carefully mentioned (see posts by dannibear and rizen1)
And the beauty and preciousness of marital union has been raised by many on the thread

You have accused people of judging you...... but here are a few of your comments


To Arunangelo

Arunangelo, you really have met the high point of absurdity here. Your theology is so full of holes.


Your theology is exposed as groundless.

To EddyFire

Eddy Fire, this is not an issue of contraception.......

To SpiritLedEd

When you have a pet theory, it is always useful to test it somewhere else other than the location you develop it.


Ed, you would be foolish to place your wager on this daft notion!

They sound rather judgemental and corrective to me

 

[Francis Drake]

Francis Drake
There does not appear to be any point in this thread where you and your wife come under judgement of those you call legalists on this forum.
Even the original poster with whom you 'loudly' disagreed with has not returned to discuss your view points.

The needs of women with certain medical conditions have been carefully mentioned (see posts by dannibear and rizen1)
And the beauty and preciousness of marital union has been raised by many on the thread

You have accused people of judging you...... but here are a few of your comments


To Arunangelo

To EddyFire


To SpiritLedEd


They sound rather judgemental and corrective to me

This is a part of Arunangelo's opening post-
Use of contraception therefore makes marital union devoid of love. Furthermore, by divorcing sex from marital love and procreation contraception makes people promiscuous, lustful and selfish.

This post levels at me, and other contraceptive users, the accusation that we are promiscuous lustful and selfish, and have marital unions devoid of love.
I call that judgment!

Its not just the first post, but others also who oppose contraception do so with the implication that they represent the will of God.

My responses certainly speak against this fallacy, which is very legalistic. I maybe judging, but is a judging of their arguments which is very different to judging the person.
I don't believe that my comments are any more judging or corrective than any other contributor on this forum. It is surely the purpose to debate, discuss, explore, and challenge the propositions posted on this forum, especially from a biblical basis.
I may have missed them, but I would love to see some scriptures used to back the original notion. It would also be good to see some responses to the scriptures that I have posted.

 

[amanda123]

I have had a couple of ops and gyni problems.

I took the pill for a long time and depsite medics saying it wud help it didn't.

I came off and had a baby despite thinking I shouldn't. God looked after me and wow how wondeful.
The medics that said don't have a baby we're wrong.

Nowq I use natral contaception. I feel healthier. I have less pains.

Francis Drake
Maybe your wife is making herself worse if she taking contaceptives?


Also you haven't been judged here. Yoi have reacted to peoples views and named names in quite a dictatoriel n horribleway.

 

[Francis Drake]

I have had a couple of ops and gyni problems.

I took the pill for a long time and depsite medics saying it wud help it didn't.

I came off and had a baby despite thinking I shouldn't. God looked after me and wow how wondeful.
The medics that said don't have a baby we're wrong.

Nowq I use natral contaception. I feel healthier. I have less pains.

Francis Drake
Maybe your wife is making herself worse if she taking contaceptives?


Also you haven't been judged here. Yoi have reacted to peoples views and named names in quite a dictatoriel n horribleway.

My wife was 48 when we met. She had never been married before, but had suffered for decades in her womb which the doctors constantly told her should be removed. We used contraceptives for about 3-4 years only. She still has the same problem and they still want her to have a hysterectomy. Her problem has absolutely no connection with us using contraceptives.

However, this is all beside the point.
The implication from the first post is that contraceptives are wrong before God. Yet neither Arunangelo or anyone else has given a shred of biblical evidence to support such a view. Nor has he or anyone else responded to the scriptures that have been presented which demonstrate that sex is not primarily about procreation. In fact the only response has been to discredit the messenger!

This is a part of Arunangelo's opening post-
Use of contraception therefore makes marital union devoid of love. Furthermore, by divorcing sex from marital love and procreation contraception makes people promiscuous, lustful and selfish.

You cannot surely deny that this statement casts very unpleasant judgment upon all those who have used contraception. He spells it out for us. -Promiscuous, lustful, selfish, loveless.
Amanda, do you really support his statements? Even if I had never used contraception, I would have challenged his words as completely unbiblical and judgmental of those who do.

You said of me, "Also you haven't been judged here. Yoi have reacted to peoples views and named names in quite a dictatoriel n horribleway"
I am sorry that you think that way. However I have to deny it. I am not sure where I named names other than in the normal addressing of a person, (as I have done with your name above) which in any case this site automatically does when you respond to a quote.
Your accusing me of naming names in quite a dictatoriel n horribleway is far worse than anything I have said on this forum!
But again, my scripture representations are still unanswered.

 

[Fragrant Grace]

The IUD device (the coil) is effectively murder

Scriptural Evidence that certain forms of contraception are wrong


Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee,
Jeremiah 1:5

Millions of women around the world use the coil- the intrauterine device.
(I checked the statistics before posting here and wikipedia suggests over 160 million)

The coil which is generally a plastic t shaped device coiled with copper... is placed inside the uterus

]It does not stop the ***** meeting and fertilizing the egg.
The effect of the copper ions on the cervical mucus effectively stop the precious new life form from implanting in the uterine lining
So that tiny life, that the Lord already knows is murdered.

I am a registered nurse by profession and over my career I have also seen women hemorrhaging and seriously ill with infection associated with their use of the IUD device.

Thine eyes did see my substance, yet being unperfect; and in Thy book all my members were written, which in continuance were fashioned, when as yet there was none of them.
Psalm 139:16

 

[Francis Drake]

Scriptural Evidence that certain forms of contraception are wrong


Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee,
Jeremiah 1:5

Millions of women around the world use the coil- the intrauterine device.
(I checked the statistics before posting here and wikipedia suggests over 160 million)

The coil which is generally a plastic t shaped device coiled with copper... is placed inside the uterus

]It does not stop the ***** meeting and fertilizing the egg.
The effect of the copper ions on the cervical mucus effectively stop the precious new life form from implanting in the uterine lining
So that tiny life, that the Lord already knows is murdered.

I am a registered nurse by profession and over my career I have also seen women hemorrhaging and seriously ill with infection associated with their use of the IUD device.

Thine eyes did see my substance, yet being unperfect; and in Thy book all my members were written, which in continuance were fashioned, when as yet there was none of them.
Psalm 139:16

I agree with this. Most of the Christians I have met in the last 30-40 years have understood this. However this doesn't answer the original post that imply God is offended at the use of contraceptives.

However, in the light of your comment about IUD, what should a woman do, who repeatedly conceives but almost immediately loses the baby because of defects in the womb. Her womb effectively functioning as bad as an IUD device in its ability to kill a baby.
Just to make clear, I am in no way asserting that such a woman is a murderer. God forbid! It is however not an isolated case that some mothers repeatedly lose a child in the womb. Perhaps in such a case, particularly if she already has children, she could avoid the loss of yet another baby and the associated distress by using contraceptives. (Obviously not IUD!)
I personally believe that it is right for a couple to do everything in their power to produce a child, even if there are a number of failures along the route.

 

[christbased]

Hi Everyone,

These are important issues and in many ways goes right to the core of how we behave within our Loving matrimonial relationships. Let us remember something..

Romans 14:1-23
As for the one who is weak in faith, welcome him, but not to quarrel over opinions. One person believes he may eat anything, while the weak person eats only vegetables. Let not the one who eats despise the one who abstains, and let not the one who abstains pass judgment on the one who eats, for God has welcomed him. Who are you to pass judgment on the servant of another? It is before his own master that he stands or falls. And he will be upheld, for the Lord is able to make him stand. One person esteems one day as better than another, while another esteems all days alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind. ...


While this can be a heated discussion, and to some of us feel somewhat odd (on both sides of the fence) there are also some beautiful scriptures that we are opening up and discussing, and that is important. Let look at all sides and analysis this.

Maybe we could look at scripture and allow that to be our focus, we might have better understanding.


Do we have scripture that precisely looks at that life begins "before" birth at conception and in the womb ?
Jeremiah 1:4–5 Then the word of the Lord came to me, saying: “Before I formed you in the womb I knew you; Before you were born I sanctified you; I ordained you a prophet to the nations.”

Thine eyes did see my substance, yet being unperfect; and in Thy book all my members were written, which in continuance were fashioned, when as yet there was none of them.
Psalm 139:16

Does life begin BEFORE conception (scripture)?
This MIGHT be a reference here, or not..., but it''s interesting. Or is this predetermination of who will be a Christian (isolating who is NOT written in the book of life), or does it play into a role when we disallow ***** from fertilizing an egg, and giving birth.
Revelation 13:8 “all who dwell on the earth will worship him (the beast), everyone whose name has not been written from the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb who has been slain.”

Revelation 17:8 “… And those who dwell on the earth will wonder, whose name has not been written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they see the beast, that he was and is not and will come.”

More regarding the Book of Life, and is it more a Blotting Out, of those who regect Christ..
When we examine Scripture as a whole, there is evidence that some names, however, will be blotted from the book of life. In relation to Revelation 3:5, Walvoord writes:

On the basis of this some have considered the book of life not as the roll of those who are saved but rather a list of those for whom Christ died, that is, all humanity who have possessed physical life. As they come to maturity and are faced with the responsibility of accepting or rejecting Christ, their names are blotted out if they fail to receive Jesus Christ as Saviour; whereas those who do accept Christ as Saviour are confirmed in their position in the book of life, and their names are confessed before the Father and heavenly angels.24

In a loving relationship between a married man and a woman, is the act of NOT allowing there ***** to fertilize an egg, a sin? (scripture)

Or is that a killing of a life ? (scripture)

Or a responsible act between a loving husband and wife? (scripture) Where does God fit in the picture, and do we have scripture? (Let here from God on the subject!). Do we have any scripture on Family Planning?

Is the contraception use question really about it's use between a loving husband and wife ? Or is the the question/concern more about the general over abuse of contraception outside the bonds of marriage, in a sex crazed lustful society that is devoid of real love, more the point of our concern? We probably have tonnes of scripture against fornication and god abhorrence and judgement on that.

What ARE the purposes of a making Love within the bonds of marriage, making children only?
Lo, children are an heritage of the Lord: and the fruit of the womb is His reward.
Psalm 127:3

Expression of mutual Love for one another?
Let thy fountain be blessed: and rejoice with the wife of thy youth.
Let her be as the loving hind and pleasant roe; let her breasts satisfy thee at all times; and be thou ravished always with her love.
Proverbs 5:18-19

Hebrews 13v4. "Marriage is honourable in all, and the marriage bed undefiled, but fornicators and adulterers God will judge".

Are they mutually exclusive? or Only together (scripture)


Does the use of contraception within marriage cause Lust, which is a sin? (this is an interesting question) Is Lust something else and a different subject? What is it's true source? (spirit or "our" heart). How to avoid Lust (abstinence, remain Christ centered, prayer, non-use of contraception)


What are our obligations to one another as Husband and Wife ? And our obligations to Christ ?
Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave Himself for it;
Ephesians 5:25

v4 The wife has not power over her own body, but the husband and likewise also the husband has not power over his own body but the wife. v5 Defraud you not one another except it be with consent for a time that you may give yourselves to fasting and prayer...........................etc.

1Cor7v2. Nevertheless, to avoid fornication let every man have his own wife and let every woman have her own husband. 3. Let the husband render unto the wife her due, and likewise the also the wife unto the husband.


I think we all probably agree that the use of chemicals in general is bad for the human body, at least from a point of using it for contraception, so we can probably take that off the table.


So if we could use scripture, we might be able to shed some more light on this QUESTION . Remember, it is OK to wrestle with these questions and we might find some very good truths through that journey. Everyone, keep an open mind, we might learn a lot here.

May Christ's light continue to shine on us! In the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit

 

[Fragrant Grace]

However, in the light of your comment about IUD, what should a woman do, who repeatedly conceives but almost immediately loses the baby because of defects in the womb. Her womb effectively functioning as bad as an IUD device in its ability to kill a baby.
Just to make clear, I am in no way asserting that such a woman is a murderer. God forbid! It is however not an isolated case that some mothers repeatedly lose a child in the womb. Perhaps in such a case, particularly if she already has children, she could avoid the loss of yet another baby and the associated distress by using contraceptives. (Obviously not IUD!)
I personally believe that it is right for a couple to do everything in their power to produce a child, even if there are a number of failures along the route.

I would say in this type of situation a Christian couple should seek the Lord's in prayer, believing in His power to heal and restore. And to perhaps prayerfully use a natural, non chemical, non abortive type of contraception.

There are some conditions where women are medically advised to go onto the contraceptive pill (whether or not they are sexually active), to control heavy bleeding and inflammatory disorders. Over the years I have witnessed an over usage of these types of prescriptions.....perhaps because it is quicker and easier for the doctor to write a quick prescription than to investigate further or even to consider more natural remedies. There are a number of herbs and plant remedies that have powerful and effective properties for uterine disorders. Again a Christian couple should always seek the Lord's guidance in prayer, trusting that He will reveal His will for them in these matters, and in doing so not neglecting the Lord's mighty power to heal.

Cast thy burden upon the Lord, and He shall sustain thee
Psalm 55:2

 

[Francis Drake]

I would say in this type of situation a Christian couple should seek the Lord's in prayer, believing in His power to heal and restore. And to perhaps prayerfully use a natural, non chemical, non abortive type of contraception.

There are some conditions where women are medically advised to go onto the contraceptive pill (whether or not they are sexually active), to control heavy bleeding and inflammatory disorders. Over the years I have witnessed an over usage of these types of prescriptions.....perhaps because it is quicker and easier for the doctor to write a quick prescription than to investigate further or even to consider more natural remedies. There are a number of herbs and plant remedies that have powerful and effective properties for uterine disorders. Again a Christian couple should always seek the Lord's guidance in prayer, trusting that He will reveal His will for them in these matters, and in doing so not neglecting the Lord's mighty power to heal.

Cast thy burden upon the Lord, and He shall sustain thee
Psalm 55:2

I have no quarrel with what you are saying, but-
It is all very well discussing the various aspects of contraception and how it works in a given scenario, but we are still avoiding the main the original question. The original post proposed the notion that contraception was an offense towards God, and that it produced all sorts of evil fruit. This whole thread was started by that post but everyone is avoiding a direct response to it.

I have pasted below a part of the original post in red.- The phrase highlighted in blue indicates what the writer considers God"s sole purpose for sexual intercourse. He states that sex using contraception is devoid of love. He states that is against what God ordained. Therefore use of contraception must be a sin.

Similarly, when a couple holds back their total giving to one another and to a potential child that might result from their marital act by using contraception, they go against the very purpose of the marital act. Furthermore, contraception means against conception (of a new human being). It is therefore, against human life. Use of contraception therefore makes marital union devoid of love. Furthermore, by divorcing sex from marital love and procreation contraception makes people promiscuous, lustful and selfish. These result in teenage pregnancies, divorce, fornication, incest, and adultery. These in turn result in broken homes, and children with psychological disorders, criminal behavior and immorality.

Those who comment against contraception seem happy to permit this unsupported notion to be perpetuated as a backdrop to their own viewpoint, but as far as I can see, they have never biblically examined or proved it in this thread to date.
Why not? The simple answer is that it has no biblical basis!

I might have an irritating pet hobby horse which I ram down people's throats with regularity. However if I were to find someone agreeing with me, but incorrectly using scripture, I would oppose him completely because such methods discredit honest faith. Such doctrines when unchallenged leave the door open for demonic bondages to be established in those who are weak in faith. We should all deal honestly with them, whether we agree or disagree with their aim.
I respect those here of an opposing view to me, ie. those who reject contraception, but they need to pause from discussing the whys and wherefores of different types and circumstances of people, and carefully read again the original post and make a biblically based decision whether to agree or disagree. If you believe that my view is wrong, then please please tell me why, but don't turn your backs on such a strong original post and calmly discuss peripheral issues. Lets get back to the original thread.

Finally, if you already consider that the original post is biblical justified, you cannot then (as some here seem to advocate) permit anyone go to a secular doctor and obtain a "get out of jail free" card on medical grounds, confirming that in their case, the use of contraception would be completely sin free!
That is surely hypocritical?

 

[s.i.e.]

This thread ought to be placed in a new category called "rants and raves"...or, simply, "op-ed". That is what this is, and nothing more.

As a friendly suggestion, I might advise the originator to curb the vergiage used in the first couple sentences with his or her spouse...especially in the realm of any foreplay. Words like "conjugal union", or "physiologically uniting with the other through their reproductive organs" --- to describe what you are about to enjoin into with your spouse will....uh...have the dampening effect of delivering to you what you so mechanically describe the act to be: simply procreation, and nothing more.

Ugh. Choose your own adventure, my friend. As for me, although I may blush...I rather prefer the example given to us in the Song of Solomon. Close your eyes if you really don't want to enjoy your sexuality....BUT...this is the word of God as I read it:

Song of Solomon 5
“Open to me, my sister, my darling,
my dove, my flawless one.
My head is drenched with dew,
my hair with the dampness of the night.”
3I have taken off my
robe—
must I put it on again?
I have washed my feet—
must I soil them again?
4My lover thrust his hand
through the latch-opening;
my heart began to pound for him.
5I arose to open for my
lover,
and my hands dripped with myrrh,
my fingers with flowing myrrh,
on the handles of the lock.
10 My beloved is radiant and ruddy,
outstanding among ten thousand.
11 His head is purest gold;
his hair is wavy
and black as a raven.
12 His eyes are like doves
by the water streams,
washed in milk,
mounted like jewels.
13 His cheeks are like beds of spice
yielding perfume.
His lips are like lilies
dripping with myrrh.
14 His arms are rods of gold
set with topaz.
His body is like polished ivory
decorated with lapis lazuli.
15 His legs are pillars of marble
set on bases of pure gold.
His appearance is like Lebanon,
choice as its cedars.
16 His mouth is sweetness itself;
he is altogether lovely.

Whoa! That is seriously hot and heavy. No holds barred. You think that's the kind of verbiage that would suggest a mere "physiologically uniting" or "uniting" of "reproductive organs"?

The idea within Christendom that sex ought not to be enjoyed, and is only given to us for procreation is faulty, and was promulgated widely by the likes of Tertullian (150-230), Saint Jerome (331-420) and Saint Augustine (354-430), and is still quite prevelant today.

It is a heresy, and is simply not in line with God's word.

Thank you Lord


Indeed...by looking at the best portrayal of what healthy sexuality should like like vis-a-vis the Song of Solomon....we are to enjoy this gift of God greaty. We should allow ourselves and our spouse the grace to be thankful for it, and drink deeply!

 

[amanda123]

Well ranted s.I.e

I ahvqe found this thread very onteresting *nd not just a rant

 

[Fragrant Grace]

It is all very well discussing the various aspects of contraception and how it works in a given scenario, but we are still avoiding the main the original question. The original post proposed the notion that contraception was an offense towards God, and that it produced all sorts of evil fruit. This whole thread was started by that post but everyone is avoiding a direct response to it....

...Those who comment against contraception seem happy to permit this unsupported notion to be perpetuated as a backdrop to their own viewpoint, but as far as I can see, they have never biblically examined or proved it in this thread to date.
Why not? The simple answer is that it has no biblical basis!

Dear Francis

I read a very interesting article today that gives a balanced scriptural write up on these very matters.
As I agree with what is written in article I will post it here.....(much better than my ramblings)
It is worth reading all through although it is quite lengthy


Birth Control And The Bible by Silent Voices

Trusting God For His Perfect Plan For Our Lives
Going Against The Flow

Modern culture continually bombards Christians with certain ideals in the area of sexuality within marriage, as well as family size and timing. It's accepted - and expected - that a newlywed couple will use birth control for at least two years before having their first child - and that they will stop having children after two. The world - including the Evangelical world - believes that this is "responsible." But is this the way God's people should think? Have we adopted the world's mind set in this area of our lives? Do our beliefs, attitudes and choices look any different than those of the world's? Should they look any different? Isn't the Bible silent on birth control?


While the Bible is "silent" on birth control - there isn't a commandment that says "Thou shall not use birth control" - neither is there a commandment forbidding abortion, yet we can clearly see in scripture the case against it. In the same way, we can see God's heart on birth control if we're willing to look. We need to understand His heart on human life, the value of children, His purpose for sex, and the role of faith in every area of our lives.

"In His Image"

Then God said, 'Let Us make man in our image, according to Our likeness; let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth. So God created man in His own image, in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.
Genesis 1:26-27

Genesis states that human life is created in "God's own image." That's what sets us apart from the rest of His creation - only men and women are "stamped" or "imprinted" with His image and nature. It also states that He created us "male and female." There's something about how He created the male that uniquely bears the image of God - and there's something about how He created the female that uniquely bears His image, too. There are obvious physical differences that we cannot ignore - but there are other differences that are more easily rejected or suppressed - consciously or subconsciously - and by doing so, the "image of God" in that man or woman is also being rejected or suppressed. When it comes to matters of hormonal methods of birth control, this is most definitely true for women. Men were created by God to have a steady supply and flow of hormones that control his sexual health/life. From puberty until death, a man's levels of FHS, LH and testosterone remain constant - they remain the same from day to day. In contrast, a woman's hormones are changing daily - they ebb and flow - come and go - all in a finely tuned hormonal "symphony" that controls her fertility. That's how God made her! When a woman is using a hormonal method of birth control her hormones "flat line" - like a male's. Is it possible that the very thing that makes her uniquely "created in His image" has been tampered with?

Is it really any wonder that women who use hormonal birth control notice a significant change in their moods and emotions - as well as in their libido? Shouldn't we embrace the differences that God has built into men and women, instead of trying to suppress them?

Continued

 

[Fragrant Grace]

Part 2
Birth Control And The Bible

Be Fruitful And Multiply

“Then God blessed them, and God said to them, ‘Be fruitful and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it; have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over every living thing that moves on the earth.’”
Genesis 1:28

This, the first directive that God gave to mankind, has never been rescinded. The rest of the verse instructs man to replenish (fill) the earth and subdue (tread down, conquer) it. The increase of a population is a two-fold blessing. Proverbs 14:28 tells us that “In a multitude of people is a king’s honor, but in the lack of people is the downfall of a prince.” Society as a whole, benefits economically by adding more members to it. New people have new ideas and invent ways to do things more efficiently and cost effectively. God has blessed everyone, even those who do not know Him, with different gifts and talents and abilities to bless others and function in a larger body of society. When Christians multiply, they are raising up children to know Jesus and function in the Body of Christ, blessing others with their individual gifts and talents to further the Kingdom of God. There are many verses where God bestows a blessing upon His people by promising them an increase in numbers and fertility and likewise a cursing for disobedience by taking away their fertility.


Deuteronomy: 7:12-16 "Where it shall come to pass, if ye hearken to these judgements, and keep, and do them, that...He will love thee and bless thee, and multiply thee: He will also bless the fruit of thy womb....Thou shalt be blessed above all people: there shall not be male or female barren among you...." See also: Deuteronomy 28:1-6, 30:5, 9, Jeremiah 30:19, Hosea 9:11-17.


They Shall Become “One Flesh”

“Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and they shall become one flesh.”
Genesis 2:24

Sexual intimacy allows husband and wife to experience a “oneness” that cannot be experienced in any other way. It is a beautiful expression of love, and is a gift of God for marriage. Over the years Evangelical Christians have moved away from the original perspective of the gift of sexuality - our views on sex within marriage differ very little from those outside the church. This has not always been the case. Historically, sexual intimacy was viewed as a three dimensional act - physical, procreative and spiritual.


“Now Adam knew Eve his wife, and she conceived and bore Cain...” Genesis 4: 1
“And Adam knew his wife again, and she bore a son and named him Seth...” Genesis 4: 25
“But did He not make them one, having a remnant of the Spirit? And why one? He seeks godly offspring.”
Malachi 2:15

The act of “knowing” a spouse resulted in conception - it wasn’t just a physical act for pleasure’s sake. We’re not discounting the pleasure that comes with sexual intimacy. That is a gift from God to husbands and wives, and we believe that it was His intent that it be pleasurable. He created us - male and female - with all the nerve endings that make sex an incredible experience. BUT - He didn’t create sex solely for pleasure - it was part of His divine design, but not the complete design. We’re also not saying that sexual intimacy should be reserved only for procreation (which the Gnostics did) - but it was and is part of His design. Why? Because “God desires godly offspring.” And - what could be the fullest expression of “becoming one” than the co-mingling of genetic material that occurs at conception, resulting in the creation of a new human life?


“For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh.’ This is a great mystery, but I speak concerning Christ and the church.”
Ephesians 5: 31-32

This verse in Ephesians teaches us that sexual union is a “mysterious” representation of the union of Christ and His church. If that is true, where does contraception fit into that picture? Would Jesus do anything that would prevent complete union with His Bride? Would He do anything - or ask the Bride to do anything -that would prevent that union from bearing fruit?

Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit He takes away; and every branch that bears fruit He prunes, that it may bear more fruit.
John 15:2

In 1930, when the Anglican Church stepped away from thousands of years of teaching against “pagan” methods of birth control, and opened the door for married couples to use condoms, sexual intimacy became simply a physical act. The result of their decision should be clear to everyone - extramarital affairs increased, divorce rates soared, and the “need” for abortion as a back up to failed birth control brought what was once considered a crime into the mainstream.

continued

 

[Fragrant Grace]

Part 3
Birth Control And The Bible


Are Children A Blessing - Or A Curse?

Most Christians would answer “a blessing.” By this they often mean that the children they “wanted” or “planned” for are blessings. But what if God chooses to bless them with another family member? Would they be happy with God’s gift? Usually not - especially if this child wasn’t “planned.” The majority of the church has openly embraced birth control, even though it’s very name clearly implies that someone else is in control other than God. Their bodies, destiny, family size, timing and structure have never been turned over to God. Birth control says to God - “I can’t/won’t trust you with my fertility. I am choosing to be in control of this area of my life. You can be Lord over everything else - but not this.” (Granted, most Christians don’t consciously think this when they choose birth control - but their “actions speak louder than words!”)


Ask yourself this question - and be honest - when you see a large family (three or more children), what do you think? Do you think, “My, they have so many blessings! What a beautiful family!” Or - do you think -or say - “Don’t they know what causes pregnancy? Don’t they know about birth control? When are they going to stop!?” When someone tells you that they’re expecting, do you ask them if it was “planned” - or an “accident?” When someone using Natural Family Planning becomes pregnant, do you immediately assume that the method “failed.”


If we believe that children are ALWAYS a gift from God, do your thoughts and attitudes reflect His heart?

What Does God Say About Children And Who Creates Life*


Behold, children are a heritage from the Lord, the fruit of the womb is a reward. Like arrows in the hands of a warrior, so are the children of one's youth. Happy is the man who has his quiver full of them. They shall not be ashamed, But shall speak with their enemies in the gate.
Psalm 127:3-5

Then He (Jesus) said to them, "Whoever welcomes this little child in My name welcomes Me; and whoever welcomes Me welcomes the One who sent me. For he who is least among you all- he is the greatest.
Luke 9:48.........


For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by Him, and for Him:"
Colossians 1:16

Did not He that made me in the womb make him? And did not One fashion us in the womb?"
Job 31:15.

As thou knowest not what is the way of the spirit, nor how the bones do grow in the womb of her that is with child: even so thou knowest not the works of God who maketh all."
Ecclesiastes 11:5.


Another interesting scripture to consider is found in Leviticus 15 -


If a woman has a discharge and the discharge from her body is blood, she shall be set apart seven days; and whoever touches her shall be unclean until evening. ...When she is cleansed from her discharge, then she shall count for herself seven days, and after that she shall be clean. And on the eighth day she shall take for herself two turtle-doves or two young pigeons, and bring them to the priest, to the door of the tabernacle or meeting...and the priest shall make atonement for her before the LORD for the discharge of her uncleanness.
Leviticus 15:19 & 28-30

This section of verses deal with a woman’s menstruation - or any discharge of blood. She is considered to be “unclean” for the seven days of bleeding - then she counts off an additional 7 days. On the following day she goes to the priest for atonement - 15 days after she started bleeding. For most women, that’s exactly at the time of ovulation - the only fertile time in a woman’s cycle! God set up the guidelines for sexual intimacy so that a husband and wife would be able to resume intercourse at exactly the time when conception could occur!


(Verses 25-27 discuss a woman who has a blood discharge that is beyond the normal seven days. There are those who argue that verses 28-30 only apply to that situation. However, historically - and to this day -Orthodox Jews stringently follow these guidelines without distinguishing between menstrual bleeding or bleeding from other causes, and as a result, tend to have large families. It’s interesting to note that Muslims also follow these same guidelines, and also have large families, which is causing a demographic “shift” in many areas of the world where Islam has taken root.)


Another common argument against these verses being applied to Evangelicals is that they are “Old Testament” - they “don’t apply to Christians.” While it is true that we do not live “under the law,” can we really ignore the Old Testament because it makes us uncomfortable? Doesn’t the New Testament say that the Old Testament is a “shadow” of things to come (Hebrews 10:1)?

All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.
2 Timothy 3:16-17

Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.
Matthew 5: 17-18

continued

* I omitted a few scriptures/verses in this part of the article here as the list was very long

 

[Fragrant Grace]

Part 4
Birth Control And The Bible

But Didn’t God Gave Us Common Sense?*


Couples can read these (and more) verses and agree that it is God who is the Creator of all Life. When asked, however, if they think God alone should ultimately be in control of the number and spacing of their children, their reply is often negative. “God gave us common sense, after all,” or “God gave me a brain and He expects me to use it,” are typical responses. But the Bible does not say that God expects - or wants - us to use our own logic or “common sense” - it actually says quite the opposite.


For My thoughts are not your thoughts, Nor are your ways My ways,” says the LORD. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are My ways higher than your ways, and My thoughts than your thoughts.
Isaiah 55:8-9

There is a way that seems right to a man, but it’s end is the way of death.
Proverbs 14:12

So if we cannot trust in ourselves to make the right decision in this matter, whom can we trust?


Trust in the LORD with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding; in all your ways acknowledge Him and He shall direct your paths.
Proverbs 3:5.
...
Where is the wise? Where is the disputer of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?…Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men, and the weakness of God is stronger than men…But God has chosen the foolish things of the world to put to shame the wise, and God has chosen the weak things of the world to put to shame the things that are mighty…that, as it is written, ‘He who glories, let him glory in the LORD.” 1 Corinthians 1:20, 25, 27, 31.


Does the Bible actually say anywhere that Christian couples are supposed to be exercising control over the number and spacing of their children? Many have never even thought to look and see, and have just gone along with the world’s wisdom without a second thought on the matter.


Aren’t We Supposed To Walk By Faith?


The largest stumbling block is usually, “What about the money to feed and raise a lot of children?” That sounds right, doesn’t it? The verse typically used to support this is, “But if anyone does not provide for his own, and especially for those of his household, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.” 1 Timothy 5:8. Let’s take a look to see what this verse is sandwiched between. Verses 3-16 are all dealing with how widows should be treated. Verse 8 is not referring to a man providing for his family at all. It is instructing children of a widow to stay at home to care for her rather than turning her over to the care of the church. It could still be inferred that a man should provide for his household, especially since Paul also says


if anyone will not work, neither shall he eat.
2 Thessalonians 3:10.

So, has God given directives to husbands to take control of their family size based on their own perception of finances and provisions? No! Jesus said,


Therefore do not worry, saying, ‘What shall we eat?’ Or ‘What shall we drink?’ Or ‘What shall we wear?’ For after all these things the Gentiles (non-believers) seek. For your heavenly Father knows that you need all these things. But seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added to you. Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about its own things. Sufficient for the day is its own trouble.
Matthew 6:31-34.

The passages before these verses show the Lord teaching His disciples that our Father knows our needs and that we need to be concerning ourselves with the things of God rather than the things of money, food, and clothes. We cannot serve both God and mammon. In Matthew 7, Jesus continues to exhort them that we only need to ask and seek and that our Father is faithful to give good things to those who ask Him (Matthew 7:7-11).”* Here are some more verses concerning God’s provisions for His children as opposed to man’s worries over the future:


Oh, taste and see that the LORD is good; Blessed is the man who trusts in Him! Oh fear the LORD, you His saints! There is no want to those who fear Him. The young lions lack and suffer hunger; But those who seek the LORD shall not lack any good thing.
Psalm 34:8-10.

O Lord, by your hand save me from such men, from men of this world whose reward is in this life. You still the hunger of those you cherish; their sons have plenty, and they store up wealth for their children.
Psalms 17:14


For we walk by faith, and not by sight.
2 Corinthians 5:7

Faith says, “God, I don’t know how we’ll take care of more children, but we’re willing to trust You for the resources we’ll need.” That’s quite different than someone who, by using birth control, says, “God I know we can’t take care of more children, and I’m not willing to trust You to provide. We can only handle one or two children. You might make a mistake and give us one child too many, so I’m going to take care of it myself.

Continued

* A few listed omitted as list very long

 

[Fragrant Grace]

Part 5.....final one!!!
Birth Control And The Bible

But I Don’t Have Enough Time To Care For Any More!


God never promised any of us enough time to do all the things we want to do. Whether it be with our children or any other pursuits in our lives. We tend to live our life making our own plans and asking God to bless them as an afterthought. In our own strength we will never have enough time, or patience for that matter, to deal with our children, be it two or ten. But Jesus has patience and we get our strength from Him. Sometimes we also tend to become tunnel-visioned on meeting our children’s every whim under the guise of “needs” and feeling guilty if we cannot. We all desire to give each child our very best and plenty of time and love. But we have to face the reality that we cannot physically or mentally be all that they need. Only God can do that.


What’s The Difference Between Natural Family Planning (NFP) And Using Birth Control?


Couples who are using NFP to postpone pregnancy are doing so with the understanding - and willingness to accept - that God is ultimately in control of how many children they have. They do not use NFP like someone who is using the Pill or condoms - with the mind-set that they are in control. Should a pregnancy occur, the child is seen as an unexpected blessing from God - rather than a “mistake” or an “accident” - or worse still - something that needs to be “fixed” through abortion (and yes, married Christians do choose abortion, often when contraception has failed).


Couples using NFP are also cooperating with how God created them - the husband understands his wife’s cycle and is able to “live with her in understanding (1 Peter 3:7)” - they are not using drugs that can cause lasting physical harm, or devices that block the ability to fully “become one.” NFP couples seek God on issues relating to their family size on a monthly basis - they are always open to hearing from Him about His plans for their family. They treat fertility as a gift - not a disease that needs to be treated.


Couples using NFP exercise “self-control” (which is a fruit of the Spirit) - instead of using birth control. NFP couples know that they were created with the ability to choose - they are not driven by uncontrollable physical urges that must be suppressed through medication, or removed through surgery. Men and women weren’t created like dogs and cats who need to be “fixed” to control their drive to reproduce. They can willingly give up sexual intimacy for a few days each month if they have chosen to postpone pregnancy.


And there are benefits to these differences that go beyond the physical - divorce rates among NFP users are less than 5%! Since sexual intimacy isn’t available “whenever,” these couples spend a lot of time “keeping the romance alive” in their relationships - they take the time to learn how to express love to their mate in non-sexual ways. When the couple is able to be intimate, the sexual act is complete - they don’t have to worry or think about anything but enjoying the moment. Since they can’t always have “make-up sex,” they actually have to talk through the conflicts in their relationship. All of these things strengthen marriage! And that’s always good!


Couples choosing to use NFP see a positive impact on their children. As sons and daughters witness their mothers and fathers practicing a life of purity within their marriage, it sets an example for their children to follow. When sons see their fathers willingly giving up sexual intimacy so that their mothers don’t have to suffer the physical affects of birth control - they are more likely to see women as a person who deserves to be protected and cherished. When sons see their fathers choosing to give up sexual intimacy for a few days each month, they learn that they, too, can exercise self-control with their sexuality. When sons and daughters see sex as something that’s more than just a physical act, they come to value and protect their own fertility and sexuality.
And yes, couples using NFP tend to have larger families than those who contracept - but perhaps not for the reasons you might think. It’s not that their method “failed.” It’s that with each child who comes into their family, their hearts expand with love and grace, and they see them as incredible gifts, not just to their family, but to the world, and ultimately, to God. They come to realize that their ONLY “possession” with eternal value is their children! Their cars - their homes - their bank accounts - all of their earthly possessions - will burn. But a child is eternal, and is immeasurably valuable to God. They have chosen to put their “investment” into an eternal Kingdom!


Article from Silent Voices . org with input from Quiver ministries

 

[Francis Drake]

This thread ought to be placed in a new category called "rants and raves"...or, simply, "op-ed". That is what this is, and nothing more.

As a friendly suggestion, I might advise the originator to curb the vergiage used in the first couple sentences with his or her spouse...especially in the realm of any foreplay. Words like "conjugal union", or "physiologically uniting with the other through their reproductive organs" --- to describe what you are about to enjoin into with your spouse will....uh...have the dampening effect of delivering to you what you so mechanically describe the act to be: simply procreation, and nothing more.

Ugh. Choose your own adventure, my friend. As for me, although I may blush...I rather prefer the example given to us in the Song of Solomon. Close your eyes if you really don't want to enjoy your sexuality....BUT...this is the word of God as I read it:

Song of Solomon
(I chose to delete the Song of Solomon as it might offend those of a more delicate or prudish disposition)
(Actually, it wouldn't post -Francis Drake)

Whoa! That is seriously hot and heavy. No holds barred. You think that's the kind of verbiage that would suggest a mere "physiologically uniting" or "uniting" of "reproductive organs"?

The idea within Christendom that sex ought not to be enjoyed, and is only given to us for procreation is faulty, and was promulgated widely by the likes of Tertullian (150-230), Saint Jerome (331-420) and Saint Augustine (354-430), and is still quite prevelant today.

It is a heresy, and is simply not in line with God's word.

Thank you Lord


Indeed...by looking at the best portrayal of what healthy sexuality should like like vis-a-vis the Song of Solomon....we are to enjoy this gift of God greaty. We should allow ourselves and our spouse the grace to be thankful for it, and drink deeply!

Thanks, its good to hear some sense.
Its a good job that Solomon never read the majority of this thread, otherwise he might never have written Song of Solomon

 

[amanda123]

Dear Francis

I read a very interesting article today that gives a balanced scriptural write up on these very matters.
As I agree with what is written in article I will post it here.....(much better than my ramblings)
It is worth reading all through although it is quite lengthy


Birth Control And The Bible by Silent Voices

Trusting God For His Perfect Plan For Our Lives
Going Against The Flow

Modern culture continually bombards Christians with certain ideals in the area of sexuality within marriage, as well as family size and timing. It's accepted - and expected - that a newlywed couple will use birth control for at least two years before having their first child - and that they will stop having children after two. The world - including the Evangelical world - believes that this is "responsible." But is this the way God's people should think? Have we adopted the world's mind set in this area of our lives? Do our beliefs, attitudes and choices look any different than those of the world's? Should they look any different? Isn't the Bible silent on birth control?


While the Bible is "silent" on birth control - there isn't a commandment that says "Thou shall not use birth control" - neither is there a commandment forbidding abortion, yet we can clearly see in scripture the case against it. In the same way, we can see God's heart on birth control if we're willing to look. We need to understand His heart on human life, the value of children, His purpose for sex, and the role of faith in every area of our lives.

"In His Image"

Then God said, 'Let Us make man in our image, according to Our likeness; let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth. So God created man in His own image, in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.
Genesis 1:26-27

Genesis states that human life is created in "God's own image." That's what sets us apart from the rest of His creation - only men and women are "stamped" or "imprinted" with His image and nature. It also states that He created us "male and female." There's something about how He created the male that uniquely bears the image of God - and there's something about how He created the female that uniquely bears His image, too. There are obvious physical differences that we cannot ignore - but there are other differences that are more easily rejected or suppressed - consciously or subconsciously - and by doing so, the "image of God" in that man or woman is also being rejected or suppressed. When it comes to matters of hormonal methods of birth control, this is most definitely true for women. Men were created by God to have a steady supply and flow of hormones that control his sexual health/life. From puberty until death, a man's levels of FHS, LH and testosterone remain constant - they remain the same from day to day. In contrast, a woman's hormones are changing daily - they ebb and flow - come and go - all in a finely tuned hormonal "symphony" that controls her fertility. That's how God made her! When a woman is using a hormonal method of birth control her hormones "flat line" - like a male's. Is it possible that the very thing that makes her uniquely "created in His image" has been tampered with?

Is it really any wonder that women who use hormonal birth control notice a significant change in their moods and emotions - as well as in their libido? Shouldn't we embrace the differences that God has built into men and women, instead of trying to suppress them?

Continued

Superb article.

Well worth the long read. Answerrs a lot of questions.

Read all 5 posts everyone very good

 

[Barabbas]

Hardly what I would consider a "balanced" viewpoint.

We live in a fallen world, this is not how God ever intended. Are women to be merely incubators? Is it responsible to bring children into the world if a family cannot care for them financially? This is a personal decision for parents, or would be parents to make that includes many considerations.

Saying that contraception somehow rejects God is an incredible reach. Extreme guilt tripping, with a dose of clumsy hermeneutics.

Comparing abortion with contraception is intellectually lazy, and illogical.