Courts of heaven heresy Robert Henderson fake apostle?

[psz]

I'd say that the effects are very individual in nature. God deals with everyone on an individual basis. Always has. Who are you to say what the effects should be. The knowledge of God comes from reading and studying his word, which for most doesn't occur until after salvation.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

I'd say that the effects are very individual in nature. God deals with everyone on an individual basis. Always has. Who are you to say what the effects should be. The knowledge of God comes from reading and studying his word, which for most doesn't occur until after salvation.

The knowledge of God comes from God, not man.

Corinthians 2:4-16

King James Version

​

4 And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power:
5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.
6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:
7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:
8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.
10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.
11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? but we have the mind of Christ.

 

[psz]

You always refuse to answer questions. Who are you to say what the immediate effects of salvation should be? Where in the bible does it specify this?

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

You always refuse to answer questions. Who are you to say what the immediate effects of salvation should be? Where in the bible does it specify this?

I have been answering your questions. Maybe you just don’t like the answers?

Look to those who received the Holy Spirit in scripture. The effects were immediate. Like Paul ….

Acts 9:17-18

King James Version

​

17 And Ananias went his way, and entered into the house; and putting his hands on him said, Brother Saul, the Lord, even Jesus, that appeared unto thee in the way as thou camest, hath sent me, that thou mightest receive thy sight, and be filled with the Holy Ghost.
18 And immediately there fell from his eyes as it had been scales: and he received sight forthwith, and arose, and was baptized.

 

[psz]

And just where does it say and I quote you: "Like waking up out of a deep sleep."? And where does it say everyone should have the exact same experience?

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

And just where does it say and I quote you: "Like waking up out of a deep sleep."? And where does it say everyone should have the exact same experience?

I compared it to this…..

1 Corinthians 15:34
Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.

Here’s another one that compares being in darkness as to sleep…

1 Thessalonians 5:5-7

King James Version

​

5 Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.
6 Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.
7 For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night.”

So Awake to Righteousness! And stop sinning!

 

[psz]

Sir, you claim everyone should an immediate experience and that it should be "Like waking up out of a deep sleep." What gives you the right to determine that a person is not saved if they didn't have such an experience?
And of coarse one is to stop sinning.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

Sir, you claim everyone should an immediate experience and that it should be "Like waking up out of a deep sleep." What gives you the right to determine that a person is not saved if they didn't have such an experience?
And of coarse one is to stop sinning.

The immediate experience I speak of is being born again of God’s Holy Spirit.

Jesus is the one who said you must be born again.

John 3:7
Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

 

[psz]

I know that one must be born again. You claim that one is to have some kind of specific experience in order to determine if one is actually saved. Where exactly in the bible is this declared?
Paul says we are to examine ourselves to see if we are in the faith. I don't find any teaching about some kind of "immediate experience" that one must have. Being born again is not necessarily some kind of fantastic experience one is supposed to have. The Holy Spirit fills us and directs our path. This doesn't mean we walk in a sinless state. The Holy Spirit is also there to show us where we have strayed. Once again: WHO EXACTLY DO YOU THINK YOU ARE TO DETERMINE IF SOMEONE IS SAVED OR NOT. And please don't just quote a bunch of scripture.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

I know that one must be born again. You claim that one is to have some kind of specific experience in order to determine if one is actually saved. Where exactly in the bible is this declared?
Paul says we are to examine ourselves to see if we are in the faith. I don't find any teaching about some kind of "immediate experience" that one must have. Being born again is not necessarily some kind of fantastic experience one is supposed to have. The Holy Spirit fills us and directs our path. This doesn't mean we walk in a sinless state. The Holy Spirit is also there to show us where we have strayed. Once again: WHO EXACTLY DO YOU THINK YOU ARE TO DETERMINE IF SOMEONE IS SAVED OR NOT. And please don't just quote a bunch of scripture.

Ah, receiving the gift of the Holy Spirit is not an experience that one could soon forget. If I told you of my experience, you wouldn’t believe it, so I won’t bother.

But the goods news friend is this, the Holy Spirit is a gift from God given to those who believe in Jesus Christ.

I know you don’t want me to post a bunch of scriptures but this is a Bible forum after all. And I’ll post just this one for now….


Luke 11:13
If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?

 

[psz]

Just because you say you had some kind of miraculous experience when you were saved does not mean everybody necessarily does. I don't find any teaching about some kind of "immediate experience" that one must have. Being born again is not necessarily some kind of fantastic experience one is supposed to have. Once again: WHO EXACTLY DO YOU THINK YOU ARE TO DETERMINE IF SOMEONE IS SAVED OR NOT. You said one must have an immediate experience. Jesus said ask and ye shall receive. Are we to doubt the word of God just because our puny little self didn't have an "immediate exprience".

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

Just because you say you had some kind of miraculous experience when you were saved does not mean everybody necessarily does. I don't find any teaching about some kind of "immediate experience" that one must have. Being born again is not necessarily some kind of fantastic experience one is supposed to have. Once again: WHO EXACTLY DO YOU THINK YOU ARE TO DETERMINE IF SOMEONE IS SAVED OR NOT. You said one must have an immediate experience. Jesus said ask and ye shall receive. Are we to doubt the word of God just because our puny little self didn't have an "immediate exprience".

Examine yourself.

2 Corinthians 13:5
Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

 

[psz]

You don't answer questions. I can only guess because you really don't have any ground to stand on. And if you read my post, I stated earlier that "Paul says we are to examine ourselves to see if we are in the faith". I just didn't have to look up scripture to say that.
Again, if you can, answer this . Otherwise I think our conversation has terminated. WHO EXACTLY DO YOU THINK YOU ARE TO DETERMINE IF SOMEONE IS SAVED OR NOT. You said one must have an immediate experience. Jesus said: Ask and ye shall receive. Are we to doubt the word of God just because our puny little self didn't have an "immediate exprience"?

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

WHO EXACTLY DO YOU THINK YOU ARE TO DETERMINE IF SOMEONE IS SAVED OR NOT. You said one must have an immediate experience. Jesus said: Ask and ye shall receive. Are we to doubt the word of God just because our puny little self didn't have an "immediate exprience"?

Sorry I don’t respond to straw man arguments and false accusations.

Have a nice day.

 

[psz]

You won't back up what you yourself have said.

Blessings

 

[Br. Bear]

Greetings you two,

i point no fingers but if the hat fits, wear it, ok ...

it is so sad to read the interaction here.

Perhaps i missed something but somehow it seems to be totally off track of the thread?

When one is grafted in, the life that one then receives is from the 'vine', not of themselves. Our Father is the Husbandman and He knows what He is doing and can be trusted in all He does, amen.

May i ask where the term 'sinless perfection' can be found in Scripture?

It is the Lord Who perfects that which He has started. Perfecting is/can be similar to a baby growing to child to adolescent to adult, fullness of years. The 'original' baby never changes or swaps or morphs to something else.
Always a human person thing. However, if the Lord wanted and expected us to always remain babies, we would only ever have milk.


Post in Peace


Bless you ....><>