Hebrew study for beginners

[Brother Paul]

I would think we cannot divorce our own private interpretation as personal commentaries called heresises from His written interpretation. As it is writen or called sola scriptura. It is the full measure of the faith of our invisible God . It is called the book of law. . not the book of private interpretations as heresies, the philosophies of men .

In that way because we can understand Christ who works in those yoked with him and not comparing each other to one's own self ....again exclusively by his Spirit of faith as two walking together empowered by one. The Lord our God .

There must be heresies as oral traditions of men amongst us or differences as matters of opinion. God makes men different .What we do have as anything that could profit to His good pleasure is not of us. If we have received it from Him why would we boast we have not?

That kind of false boast would rise above all things written in the law and the prophets (sola scriptura.) Called the abomination of desolation . . . making desolate the whole living word of God . Turning things called inspiration upside down as if the Potter had no understanding to offer. Isaiah 29:16

The faithless atheistic Jew were known for putting their trust in a earthly inspiration after a government of men and not the doctrines of God that fall like rain from above.

Deuteronomy 32:2King James Version My doctrine shall drop as the rain, my speech shall distil as the dew, as the small rain upon the tender herb, and as the showers upon the grass

There must be differences as oral traditions of men.

1 Corinthians 11:19 For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.

Approved of God not seen not mankind seen. the first will be last

This is of course unless those differences as oral traditions does not do despite the fullness of the mercy mixed with grace of Christ ( the full payment for our sin ). many do do despite .

2 Peter 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

As far as the abbreviation YHVH. Some teach is a personal secret name of God names like we have George, Betsy Bob, Carol, Frank etc to understand our differences.

In the Psalms we are informed that Christ magnifies the power of his word (let there be and the testimony was good above all his attributes and he himself is subject to. He cannot violate his own words as thoughts . That should give us comfort

Psalm 138:2 I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name......( or power)

The name Jehovah which means; Our Almighty God has become the Savior of the nations was not know .He was known as Almighty God to Abraham but not as the savior of the nations or families . . .As in whenever two or three gather together under the hearing of his written word now that we have the perfect or complete

Two or thre the smalesd sect or denomnation

Matthew 18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

Every name God who is not a man as us has represents a multiple of attributes to include Jehovah .Like His name Jealous . In that way he owns all things and will not share his unseen glory with a dying creation (us) Fortunately for us His labor of love that works in us is not jealous .

Three things that make the essence of God not seen . God is light and not that he can only create it temporally under the Sun and Moon. God is Love and the same not only can he labor . God is Spirit and not a man as us as a son . he is referred to as our adopting father.

Previously we were all fatherless as widows not married to Christ called the church or bride .it helps us understand the kind of religion God sets his unseen glorious approval of

James 1: 27 Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows (believers) in their affliction, and to keep himself .

The only kind of religion God sets his approval on. The care of one another in our new family of God

Galatians 6:9-10King James Version9 And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not.
As we have therefore opportunity, let us do good unto all men, especially unto them who are of the household of faith.

I 100% agree.

 

[Rhema]

Thanks for misrepresenting the meaning of all l I said.

You're welcome, but I didn't. If you'd like, we can put the discussion under peer review to settle that misconception.

apparently went right over your head

Blame the teacher, not the student. (Especially in this case, were that the case.)

I showed you why it could not be Zechariah but you avoided that completely

This proves you did not read my posts, in that I did NOT avoid Zechariah, but said THIS (and I quote....)

one can make an extremely compelling case that ... the reference in Zechariah was to the Messiah,

So don't go accusing me of avoiding something that I actually commented on.

Those who translate Isaiah 48:16 implicate the "me"

You KEEP MAKING this claim, .... several times now, at least .... and yet despite my repeated requests, you have STILL NOT presented any support to back that up. The "me" is NOT implicated. The "me" is there.. in the text. Otherwise prove that it isn't. PLEASE I beg you.

So I say once again...

When you are willing to admit that you cannot support your claim of the "me" being "implied" in Isaiah, and accept the text as translated because you can provide no other reason to translate it differently, then perhaps you and I can move on to discussing (and in another thread) the interpretation of these verses and whom the "me" might be.

Why, after all the solid reasons I've given to show that the "me" IS present in Isaiah, do you still keep saying it isn't?

Prove it.

Make a solid case for your claim that all the translations which have the word "me" in Isaiah 48:16 are wrong. Could they be wrong? Yes, I can allow for that, but prove it.

Or stop making that claim.

This is an issue of honesty, and yes, Honesty is a hill that I'm willing to die on.

Rhema

 

[Rhema]

We have learned in recent times from a number of Ugaritic Documents and the Mari Tablets that people in ancient Mesopotamia made consensus decisions so that a man could ADOPT his wife as his sister (which legally made her so) so she could inherit became they had such a Patriarchal system that wihtout this option should a husband die, all his wealth and property would return to whatever male was the head of the family for sidtribution between the brothers and sisters. The wife was cast out and if SHE did not have family would be ofrced into begging or else prostitution. Do odd as this may seem, Abraham being wealthy by that cultures standards, loved Sarah and wanted her to be cared for (as well as her children if any) should he have passed first. Just an example of a cultural norm being misunderstood!

Citation.

 

[Rhema]

YHVH the Son is not "made",

Jesus (in Hebrews 2) is MADE a little lower than the angels.

You even put MADE in caps, so.....

(make up your mind.)

Rhema

your dispute is not with me but the words of Scripture

No, my dispute is with you not checking your work, and making contradictory statements. (Based on poor English translations to be precise.)

 

[Rhema]

It is called the book of law. . not the book of private interpretations as heresies, the philosophies of men .

I 100% agree.

(Jeremiah 8:8 NRSV) How can you say, "We are wise, and the law of the LORD is with us," when, in fact, the false pen of the scribes has made it into a lie?​

 

[Garee]

I 100% agree.

So then you had a change of heart ?

 

[Garee]

The basis behind my position has been given in post 16 as to why this cannot be Isaiah. I do however appreciate your position and will agree to disagree.

Same problem occurs in Zechariah 2. 10-11. According to the association of the pronouns the "me" that is sent is the YHVH who is speaking. But like many who cannot see the one Yah as Father Son, and Spirit, they must conclude the me here must be Zech but remember Jesus tells us no one has ever seen the Father's form, or heard His voice. It IS the Son who declares Him (that is, makes Him manifest)

Are you assuming God is Father and Son rather than God is one in respect to the father ?

 

[Garee]

(Jeremiah 8:8 NRSV) How can you say, "We are wise, and the law of the LORD is with us," when, in fact, the false pen of the scribes has made it into a lie?​

Is that directed toward both of us?

 

[Brother Paul]

You're welcome, but I didn't. If you'd like, we can put the discussion under peer review to settle that misconception.


Blame the teacher, not the student. (Especially in this case, were that the case.)


This proves you did not read my posts, in that I did NOT avoid Zechariah, but said THIS (and I quote....)

So don't go accusing me of avoiding something that I actually commented on.


You KEEP MAKING this claim, .... several times now, at least .... and yet despite my repeated requests, you have STILL NOT presented any support to back that up. The "me" is NOT implicated. The "me" is there.. in the text. Otherwise prove that it isn't. PLEASE I beg you.

So I say once again...

Why, after all the solid reasons I've given to show that the "me" IS present in Isaiah, do you still keep saying it isn't?

Prove it.

Make a solid case for your claim that all the translations which have the word "me" in Isaiah 48:16 are wrong. Could they be wrong? Yes, I can allow for that, but prove it.

Or stop making that claim.

This is an issue of honesty, and yes, Honesty is a hill that I'm willing to die on.

Rhema

Rhema. In the Hebrew the word ME is not there in Isaiah 48:16 it ends with Saleh (to send or be sent). I have no idea whether it has been put in, in some modern versions, but in the original Masoretic Text it is implied where as in Zechariah it is there and yes it is speaking of Messiah (God with us) who would come and dwell among us as God IN the flesh ((the fullness of Deity bodily, the visible image of the invisible God and so on)..

 

[Brother Paul]

Are you assuming God is Father and Son rather than God is one in respect to the father ?

I am not assuming anything. In the language of the Nicene council God is one Ousia in three Hypostases. Their is only one YHVH (numerically) who has presented Himself as Father Son, and Holy Spirit.

 

[Brother Paul]

(Jeremiah 8:8 NRSV) How can you say, "We are wise, and the law of the LORD is with us," when, in fact, the false pen of the scribes has made it into a lie?​

I 100% agreed that it is not called "the book of Private Interpretations" OR "the book of Philosophies of men". Don't you agree? I have never heard it called that. Therefore, I do not see that as garee said I changed my mind.

Now I have changed my mind about the sword being the rhema though, because it is correct and true ( I had simply never explored it before) and I love coming closer and closer to the truth.

Also, NOT wanting to go there here (perhaps a separate thread), but in my humble opinion, I think you should look at this passage in a number of versions, as the NRSV is a terrible and intentionally tainted presentation (in many places) of the Critical Text.

 

[Garee]

I am not assuming anything. In the language of the Nicene council God is one Ousia in three Hypostases. Their is only one YHVH (numerically) who has presented Himself as Father Son, and Holy Spirit.

We have the complete living word today . Why would we seek the councils of dying mankind????

it was councils of atheists jewish men that gathered themselves together. Not called by God . Refusing to believe Almighty God not seen reigning over them. They had become jealous of the pagan surrounding nation . Acording to thier religious belief as faith no God not seen.Christ calls them fools.

God gave them over to that which they should not until the time of the first century reformation (hebrew 9) he restored the order of Judges . . apostles men and worm prophets sent out with the gospel .

God is one Holy Spirit . . . not a son

1 samauel 8: 4 Then all the (atheist) elders of Israel gathered themselves together,(not called by God ) and came to Samuel unto Ramah,And said unto him, Behold, thou art old, and thy sons walk not in thy ways: now make us a king to judge us like all the nations. But the thing displeased Samuel, when they said, Give us a king to judge us. And Samuel prayed unto the Lord. And the Lord said unto Samuel, Hearken unto the voice of the people in all that they say unto thee: for they have not rejected thee, but they have rejected me, that I should not reign over them. According to all the works which they have done since the day that I brought them up out of Egypt even unto this day, wherewith they have forsaken me, and served other gods, so do they also unto thee.Now therefore hearken unto their voice: howbeit yet protest solemnly unto them, and shew them the manner of the king that shall reign over them

The time or reformation came over two thousand year ago.

 

[Brother Paul]

We have the complete living word today . Why would we seek the councils of dying mankind????

it was councils of atheists jewish men that gathered themselves together. Not called by God . Refusing to believe Almighty God not seen reigning over them. They had become jealous of the pagan surrounding nation . Acording to thier religious belief as faith no God not seen.Christ calls them fools.

God gave them over to that which they should not until the time of the first century reformation (hebrew 9) he restored the order of Judges . . apostles men and worm prophets sent out with the gospel .

God is one Holy Spirit . . . not a son

1 samauel 8: 4 Then all the (atheist) elders of Israel gathered themselves together,(not called by God ) and came to Samuel unto Ramah,And said unto him, Behold, thou art old, and thy sons walk not in thy ways: now make us a king to judge us like all the nations. But the thing displeased Samuel, when they said, Give us a king to judge us. And Samuel prayed unto the Lord. And the Lord said unto Samuel, Hearken unto the voice of the people in all that they say unto thee: for they have not rejected thee, but they have rejected me, that I should not reign over them. According to all the works which they have done since the day that I brought them up out of Egypt even unto this day, wherewith they have forsaken me, and served other gods, so do they also unto thee.Now therefore hearken unto their voice: howbeit yet protest solemnly unto them, and shew them the manner of the king that shall reign over them

The time or reformation came over two thousand year ago.

If you say so friend. Ever read Hebrews 1 and 2? God is the Holy Spirit but He is also our Father and He IS a Son and that IS the word of God, not my interpretation, or the words of some atheists, or some Jewish people, or devillish government controlled heretics.

 

[Garee]

If you say so friend. Ever read Hebrews 1 and 2? God is the Holy Spirit but He is also our Father and He IS a Son and that IS the word of God, not my interpretation, or the words of some atheists, or some Jewish people, or devillish government controlled heretics.

I have read Hebrews 1 and 2 .Was there something in those chapters that gives you that kind of understanding that God is a son and not a father as one God our faithful creator .

 

[Brother Paul]

I have read Hebrews 1 and 2 .Was there something in those chapters that gives you that kind of understanding that God is a son and not a father as one God our faithful creator .

Though you are way off topic yes. The chapter speaks of the Son as God.

 

[Garee]

Though you are way off topic yes. The chapter speaks of the Son as God.

What do you mean way of topic ?

Is God a man ?

Jesus the a son of God is a man. . . not the one Creator

Jesus our brother in the lord is the first born-again of many sons and daughters .A man must be born again .

Whoever does the will of the father the same are his brother sister and mother .

the topic begins in verse 1

Hebrews 1King James Version1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

 

[Garee]

If you say so friend. Ever read Hebrews 1 and 2? God is the Holy Spirit but He is also our Father and He IS a Son and that IS the word of God, not my interpretation, or the words of some atheists, or some Jewish people, or devillish government controlled heretics.

Sons of God , as apostles or messengers (angels) bring the living word of God .They themselves are not the word . God remains invisible.

They can plant the incorruptible seed Christ (spiritual ) not fleshly (flesh gives birth to flesh). and water it with the water of the word .But they are considered as nothing . Christ unseen must do the work of creating new creatures .

Every man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour to include Jesus a son of man who became a born-again son of God .

1 Corihtinans 3: 5 Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers by whom ye believed, even as the Lord gave to every man? . . . . .(to include Jesus our brother in the lord the son of man) I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase. So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour.

 

[Brother Paul]

What do you mean way of topic ?

Is God a man ?

Jesus the a son of God is a man. . . not the one Creator

Jesus our brother in the lord is the first born-again of many sons and daughters .A man must be born again .

Whoever does the will of the father the same are his brother sister and mother .

the topic begins in verse 1

Hebrews 1King James Version1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

Okay Garee, I hear you and sometimes the writings of the ancient Hebrews (all the books) can appear to be confusing, sometimes contradictory, and definitely hyperbolic (speaking in extremes to emphasize a point and not to be taken literally) so begin at Deuteronomy 10:17 in this passage we read that Yah'hoveh Elohim IS THE Lord of lords. So the one and only God (there is no other) IS the Lord of lords! Agreed? We see this also in Psalm 136 and 1 Timothy and so on. The ONE and ONLY Yah'hoveh Elohim IS THE Lord above all lords.

Okay, I am sure we are in full agreement on this! Now turn to Revelations 17:14 and read it out loud and answer the question as to how and why Jesus Christ was able to defeat Satan and his armies? What does the word say? Read it out loud...Thanks

 

[Brother Paul]

What do you mean way of topic ?

Is God a man ?

Jesus the a son of God is a man. . . not the one Creator

Jesus our brother in the lord is the first born-again of many sons and daughters .A man must be born again .

Whoever does the will of the father the same are his brother sister and mother .

the topic begins in verse 1

Hebrews 1King James Version1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

The topic was can someone help me learn about the Hebrew language, not whether Christ id the Son of God and if this means He is God. See the OP....but this is a good conversation also (though we could start a new thread)

 

[Brother Paul]

What do you mean way of topic ?

Is God a man ?

Jesus the a son of God is a man. . . not the one Creator

Jesus our brother in the lord is the first born-again of many sons and daughters .A man must be born again .

Whoever does the will of the father the same are his brother sister and mother .

the topic begins in verse 1

Hebrews 1King James Version1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

Is God a man? Absolutely not. But He can take on the form of a man and indwell a man if He so wills (in fact according to the Scriptures He has and did on multiple occasions). According to the ancient pre-Christian Rabbis (see the Targum Jonathan ben-Uzziel from the mid-1st century) when Yah'hoveh Elohim did this it was the Word of God (the Son...YHVH manifest).

So why was Jesus Christ able to destroy Satan and his armies in Rev. 17:14? Because???