Stigmata, the truth?

[Penguins4123]

Hello again. Everybody has seen photos of people displaying symptoms of stigmata. I've seen pictures of wounds on the hands which is where Jesus is alleged to have been nailed to the cross. However, I've read that this is anatomically impossible because the hands would not support the weight of the human body, leaving the only option of being nailed through the wrists between Ulna and radius bones.

So my question is this: If Jesus was nailed through the wrist, why does stigmata appear on the hands?

A friend of mine said that the human mind is a powerful thing and it could be purely down to the power of the mind. In other words, if a person believes that Jesus was nailed through the hands and were then affected by stigmata, then that is where the wounds would appear.

An interesting theory. Just wondering what the forum thinks about this.

Regards,
Kelley

 

[Brother Mike]

OK

First some test were done, it was found that with the way the legs were bound, it is possible for the hands to hold the weight.

As for that bleeding stuff, most if not all of it is FAKE!!! The mind does not contain the ability to do these things. The mind is just the organ that allows your soul to communicate with the physical world. That's Why science need to start looking at the Soul, and it's ability for memory as it is who you really are and personality.

I have seen, Devils move and operate in the Physical realm. I know they effect flesh, appear as dead loved ones (Ghost) and even tell those so called physics things about you, like what is in your cabinet's at home to amaze and impress you. (Familiar spirits)

WE must remember that Pharaohs Sorcerers did produce some physical things, so we should not get to awed about that.

The devil is a goof ball, and Jesus striped him of all power and authority. That's why, without going in to a major bible study I believe in some rapture before all the stuff hits the fan. The devil can not operate in full power with Spirit Filled Believers still on the earth. The Holy Ghost has to leave this planet.

As for all the bleeding, if it is actual real demonic power, by an oppressed or possessed person, I would not take to much thought about it. It's just one of many of the devils tactics to mislead people.

There is not biblical scripture that supports the occurrence of stigmata.

Jesus Is Lord.

 

[rizen1]

I wondered the same thing, the nail had to be through the wrist ( bone ). The hands surely would have ripped. In defense some might say well the wrist was tided.

Jesus died on the cross, and took the pain upon himself for our sins. There is no need for anyone to go through it.

What would be the purpose or benefit of it ?

I think its also a tool used by religious powers to distract us from Jesus, so we can worship these selective humans who were choosen to share in the suffering.

Stigmata - what is it? Is it Biblical?

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Godquestion.org




Question: "Stigmata - what is it? Is it Biblical?"

Answer: A stigmata is the appearance of the wounds of Jesus Christ on another person. Some include the wounds on Christ's back caused by the scourging and/or the head wounds caused by the crown of thorns in the concept of a stigmata, but traditionally a stigmata consists of five classic points: the side (where Jesus was pierced with the spear to confirm that He was dead), both hands and both feet (the wounds caused by crucifixion). Traditionally, a stigmata is also known as the "Five Wounds" or the "Sacred Wounds of our Lord." Several individuals in church history have claimed to have miraculously received a stigmata. However, there are serious challenges to the legitimacy of these supposed stigmatas. Many have been proven to have been self-inflicted in an attempt to fake a miraculous stigmata. The Bible nowhere instructs anyone to get a stigmata, states that God will give stigmatas, or even mentions the concept of a stigmata. Jesus suffered the wounds so we would not have to.

 

[paganmystic]

Let's try this again...lol

Awesome replies

I have noticed that what is not discussed, is that the incidents of the stigmata are in the Roman Catholic, Catholic and Orthodox Churches all of which have the same root. In research I have recently been doing, it would appear that the 1st century church had created a hybrid religion by mixing some of the teachings of Christ with Baal Worship, the state religion of the Roman Empire at the time of Christ. I have been scoffed at for the last thought, but let's look at what we do know. Paul, when he addressed the Romans looking for followers for Christ. He asked for those untouched by Baal Worship. That form of worship itself was reworked form of the original Asshurism by Nimrod(the great hunter) and great grandson of Noah. This was just after the formation of the Babylonian Empire. This is how far back Baal Worship goes. oops, back to the point. The 1st century church laid the ground work for the Roman Catholic Church, to come 300 years later. In addition to some teachings of Christ they had embraced, the stigmata(the afflicted were blessed by God), the reverence of Mary, mother of God and the sainting of the disciples to re-channel prayers away from Jesus and therefore God. This maintains the multi-god practices of Baal Worship. This sounds like a single pronged attack against Catholicism, but consider all the other religions. They all have their roots trace back to the 1st century or original Roman Catholic Church either by support or protest.

*Brother Mike: "There is not biblical scripture that supports the occurrence of stigmata".
*Rizen1: "Jesus died on the cross, and took the pain upon himself for our sins. There is no need for anyone to go through it. What would be the purpose or benefit of it ?"

Sorry about being long winded... lol

your brother in Christ

 

[rhomphaia]

Power of demons displayed

I would be pleased to tell you that these "miracles" are actually not new, but very old, as old as babylon itself.

In ancient babylon,statutes used to display alot of stigmata, even crying tears of blood or watery,salty tears.This was in Babylon, not the catholic church! Its somehow interesting that these "miracles" found their way into catholicism.

Since ancient times,catholicism strove to infuse traditions from pagan nations into its rituals, in order to make the religion comfortable to new converts.This is one direct origin of stigmata.

So i am very much convinced that the source of this stigmata is demonic, because the sacrifice of Jesus has always been belittled in some so called 'christian religions" as something that anyone can imitate.The worship of a false Jesus in the Eucharist , where the blood and the body of Christ are believed to physically materialise is an open doorway for demons that love to blaspheme the cross.

So if you are a catholic who loves to run after stigmata,research things carefully because the works of satan are everywhere to dupe even the elect of God.John cautioned Christians against believing things without testing the spiritual power behind them.

"Brothers, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see which are from God..."

This stigmata is an insult to the especial sacrifice of Jesus.It does not hallow the cross, but ridicules its suffering, especially the blood and wounds of Christ, as cheap and duplicateable.

 

[paganmystic]

Thank you of course you are right, that's that's why I wrote it. You didn't read it very carefully. If you had you won't have used Christian and religions together. I am a Christian one thing I do is dispel the myth that Christianity has anything to do with any religion. I fact I did say the Catholic Church is based on Baal Worship which is the chief Babylonian religion and it literally does pre-date the Babylonian Empire because it was established by Asshur, a Semitic Hebrew because he was Shem's son.

Please what ever you do never, confuse me for someone sympathizes with religious dogma.

Your brother in Christ

 

[rhomphaia]

apology

Hello paganmystic.I was not referring to you ,but to anyone who runs after that stigmata doctrine.

Sorry for any embarrassment caused.

The stigmata thing is a very poor farce/ "miracle" even by biblical standards.Its a conclusion anyone can come to on their own.

 

[Brother Mike]

Ok good

I think as rizen1 posted, It is a man made doctrine with no real power involved. I have not heard of once case that was not proven to be fake.

It is like UFO's all the sightings have never led to any alien, or evidence of other life anywhere. Why would all these space saucers fly around at the astounding rate that people claim to see them and not contact anybody here?

There is also no evidence of any wreckage from one of these saucers. Area 51 is a hoax.

The same with Bigfoot, no bones, or traces of this creature. I mean at least one body.

So we have to conclude that man is being duped with counterfeit things to keep their mind off the real creator.

Jesus Is Lord.

 

[paganmystic]

Amen Brother Mike

As long as the religious orders(denominations) can focus our attention one their doctrine alone those who follow it will be lost. To be a Christian we MUST rebuke these ideas and work to return the whole of the Laws of God that's in the Gospels, back to the Ministry of Christ where it belongs, in the hearts and minds of those who believe in and love in Christ.

It is this faith and love in Christ that leads or should lead us to live as He did. The way we Live and Love after Christ is what brings the lost to us. In turn we teach them to live and love after Christ and Christ alone so their faith can save them as well.

 

[rizen1]

Amen and Amen....

It's good to see how educated my brothers are. I think my eyes are getting teary.

This stigmata is an insult to the especial sacrifice of Jesus.It does not hallow the cross, but ridicules its suffering, especially the blood and wounds of Christ, as cheap and duplicateable.....rhomphaia

There is not biblical scripture that supports the occurrence of stigmata...
So we have to conclude that man is being duped with counterfeit things to keep their mind off the real creator.
Brother Mike

As long as the religious orders(denominations) can focus our attention one their doctrine alone those who follow it will be lost. To be a Christian we MUST rebuke these ideas and work to return the whole of the Laws of God that's in the Gospels, back to the Ministry of Christ where it belongs, in the hearts and minds of those who believe in and love in Christ.
Paganmystic

 

[paganmystic]

rhomphaia: no worries, misunderstandings are just that...lol

Many people make generalized assumptions about me, most I consider humourous because they simply don't understand. As I have stated my work is to help return the term Christianity back to the Ministry of Christ and out of the hands of those that mean to destroy everything my(our) Saviour walked the Earth to teach us.

God bless you my brother

 

[Repent]

2 Thessalonians 2
International Standard Version (©2008)
The coming of the lawless one will be accompanied by the power of Satan. He will use every kind of power, including miraculous signs, lying wonders,

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
that is, the one whose coming is in accord with the activity of Satan, with all power and signs and false wonders,

GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
The man of sin will come with the power of Satan. He will use every kind of power, including miraculous and wonderful signs. But they will be lies.

King James Bible
Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

American King James Version
Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

American Standard Version
even he , whose coming is according to the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

Bible in Basic English
Even the one whose coming is marked by the working of Satan, with all power and signs and false wonders,

Douay-Rheims Bible
Whose coming is according to the working of Satan, in all power, and signs, and lying wonders,

Darby Bible Translation
whose coming is according to the working of Satan in all power and signs and wonders of falsehood,

English Revised Version
even he, whose coming is according to the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

Webster's Bible Translation
Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan, with all power, and signs, and lying wonders,

Weymouth New Testament
The appearing of the Lawless one will be attended by various miracles and tokens and delusive marvels--for so Satan works--

World English Bible
even he whose coming is according to the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

Young's Literal Translation
him, whose presence is according to the working of the Adversary, in all power, and signs, and lying wonders,

 

[natty threads]

paganmystic, have you seen the book Rosslyn? It is about Rosslyn Cathedral in Scottland, but it also covers how the mediaeval pilgrimmages followed a path that related to the seven chakras and also had- which I remember from my art history studies- secret churches underneath. According to Rosslyn the Black Isis replaced the Virgin Mary in worship in these.

Unbelievable, but true.

Brother Mike, amazing.

I have held for a while that "ghosts" are demons who are missing the human bodies with which they had associated to experience corporeality.

Is this accurate in your understanding?
If not, explain?

I have known for a long time that the Catholic Church is a continuation of pagan sungod worship. I'm not sure that this is Baal? Michael Rood always refers to Tammuz. (What a blessing his show was to us here for so many years. Someone besides Mom was saying NO to Christmas and Easter. And every time I had a bible question no one else could answer, that would be the topic of his show. Thank-you God for Michael Rood).

Bless up.
Jennifer

 

[natty threads]

Also, it is so very incredible to me how quickly we returned to sheer ungrateful wickedness after the Flood. We deserve to be evolved.

Thank-you God for Jesus.
Thank-you that we are the special creation of a Loving God.

Bless up.

 

[Daniisalivenow]

"Brothers, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see which are from God..."

Hi, very new to forum, please explain how to test the spirits......I'm not mocking, I'm really interested.

 

[Rain]

Danii, it's really easy to answer your question, =) all you need to do is read further in 1 John from where you quoted your passage:

1 John 1:1-6 (NIV)

1Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. 2This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, 3but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world. 4You, dear children, are from God and have overcome them, because the one who is in you is greater than the one who is in the world. 5They are from the world and therefore speak from the viewpoint of the world, and the world listens to them. 6We are from God, and whoever knows God listens to us; but whoever is not from God does not listen to us. This is how we recognize the Spirit [or spirit - little 's'] of truth and the spirit of falsehood.

SO... in practice what John is saying is if you think you're talking with a spirit and you want to know if it's Godly or not ask it! Hehe, or more specifically ask "Who is Lord?" and if the answer that comes to you is "Jesus Christ is Lord" then you are on the right track! =)


Please keep in mind this comes from a person who is less educated than an infant on the spiritual realm, I only specialise in scriptural answers =P

 

[Daniisalivenow]

Amen and thank you Rain, that was great, it is obvious the Lord is with you, helping you answer me with scriptural answers, not matter how young you are (spiritually of course)

 

[Brother Mike]

Well.

Without getting into a bunch of scripture, I'll give some simple things.

First you must realize we are bombarded with devils thoughts all the day. Devils are everywhere.

Now don't fret, We have to deal with them until the appointed time, and we don't need to be devil conscience. So don't be bothered by it.

Test the spirits, any spirit that does not confess Jesus Christ has come in the flesh are not of God.

I could show lots of scriptures why a devil will not confess that. I'll just say Satan has a hard time accepting the fact that God can operate though us by the anointing just like Jesus operated with the anointing.
The word Christ is Greek for smeared all over, it's the Hebrew root of Messiah or anointed of God. So, Jesus the anointed one.

How to tell.

The only way to separate your thoughts, God's Thoughts and the Devil's Thoughts is the Word of God.

Test the spirits......The Word of God is Spirit.

Joh 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

Heb 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.


So, any information that you get whether in your head, or someone tells you that does not line up with the Word of God is coming from the wrong spirit. Some examples.

1) Go sing the gospel, everyone loves your voice, and you really know how to move the crowd over to Jesus.

This is a wrong spirit, it can be deceiving. Notice how this statement focuses on YOU? Your nice voice, You know how to move the crowd? This is a trick of Satan to play on pride. Though a harmless statement it seems, but it is a start of many more statements to come to pull you in the wrong direction.

2) You know, God does not heal everyone. You might not get healed, so prepare for the worse.

This is not from God. Anything that comes from God will never depress you, make you sad, is full of peace, and always gives the victory. By his stripes you are healed. So, bad dreams, things the scare you are not from God, even though the devil will try to dress it up like God.

3) I got a new Job in a different town with lots more money!!! God is really blessing me!!

This is hard. Many Christians have moved from the Church God had them in for better money. They don't even pray, or ask God about it. Any major life Change should be Spirit led, and not money led. It could be Satan's Attempt to get you away from where God wants you to be.
These things you stop, get Gods Wisdom, lots of prayer. Things are not always black and White, but seek God and he is faithful to get the answer to you in a way you will understand. Just do your part and seek.

God Bless.

Jesus Is Lord.

 

[Daniisalivenow]

Thanks Brother Mike, putting all that together makes it easier to understand. God bless you and this site, I have learned so much in a short month since I have been on.

 

[Repent]

This is not from God. Anything that comes from God will never depress you, make you sad, is full of peace, and always gives the victory. By his stripes you are healed. So, bad dreams, things the scare you are not from God, even though the devil will try to dress it up like God.

That is not biblical Brother Mike.

Look at the test Job went through.

<dl><dt> There Lived in Arabia a very rich man named Job. He loved God and avoided sin. He had seven sons and three daughters. He had thousands of sheep and cattle. One day God wished to prove the goodness of Job to Satan who said that it was easy for Job to be good because he was rich. </dt><dt> God said to Satan, "You can do what you want to Job's property, but do not hurt his body. You shall see how he will remain faithful to Me." Soon after, a messenger arrived before Job to tell him that his cattle had been stolen and all his servants slain. Another messenger told him that, his sheep and shepherds had been struck by lightning. A third messenger came to say that his camels and those who took care of them had been killed. </dt><dt> The fourth messenger brought the worst news: "There came a strong wind from the desert. It shook the whole house. The house fell and killed all your sons and daughters. I alone escaped to tell you." When Job heard all this, he was filled with great sorrow. He did not sin by blaming God, but prayed, "The Lord gave, and the Lord has taken away! Blessed be the Name of the Lord!" </dt><dt> Satan caused sores to break out, all over Job's body. But Job did not complain. His friends said that his trials must be a punishment for his sins. But he answered that he had done no wrong. Job said, "Although He should kill me, I will trust in Him. He shall be my Savior. For I know that my Redeemer lives, and in the last day I shall rise out of the earth, and in my flesh I shall see my God." </dt><dt> God was much pleased with the patience of Job. He freed him from his sufferings. He gave him even more riches than he had had before. God also gave him seven sons and three daughters. Job lived happily till he was one hundred and forty years old.</dt></dl>God will test your loyalty. Because you are of God, You must strive harder. Everything is a lesson, even pain.