Televised Baptist Church-Demo's

[Maureen]

Did anyone see on TV the Baptist Church, can't remember the name of it now, it's in USA, they were on TV last night and out of curiousty I watched it.
They had bill posters saying God Hates ****.sorry Homosexuality they used their own word.
They preached a lot about God hating them, but I thought there message was wrong, God hates the sin, the act, not the person.
Jesus died for everyone, and took our sin upon Himself.

I'd be interested to hear if any of you saw it and what you thought.

I never heard once, Salvation mentioned, or how you can accept Jesus and get rid of the sin of Homosexuality.

They took much abuse from the public because of it, but I think they got their message wrong.
They even had one which read, Thank God for 9/11
and they picketed a funeral, because it was a soldier who'd died in Iraq.

The interviewer tried to refer to them as being a cult, which they weren't too pleased at.

What do you think?

 

[rizen1]

Well the media sees them as radicals and full of hate, but the truth is Homosexuality is a sin, and we are scared to go out in the streets and tell people unlike them.

To say God hates them would be off, God hates the sin.

But every Church have their own way of street ministry, this story is old and its not one church. The media will only show the offensive part so the church, not only baptist but the whole body of Christ as being ignorant.

These churches protested at funerals of soldiers who were gay, with posters in hand.

They go to abortion mills and speak out calling them murders,

It's a radical street ministry, like I said the media will not show us their sunday service or them talking about the love of God.

The Media is anti- God, and before it becomes illegal to speak in the streets I support them.

Now its a hate crime to tell a gay person they live in sin....
No one is allowed to shut me up when I spit the truth,
so let the baptist church have their season.

Around the world Pastors are getting arrested and charged for hate crimes for preaching homosexuality is a sin..in their own Church...

My advice lets pray for them, for God to tone them down ( not erase the truth ), but for them to witness in love.

 

[Maureen]

Rizen
I am by no means supporting the media.

It did actually show you some of a Sunday church service the love of God was not mentioned, nor Salvation nor Christ crucified.

They did tell people God hated them if they were homosexuals they used a differant four lettered word, put it on placards.

I only think it isn't a right approach to say that God hates, sure there is God's wrath, but they told people they had got cancer and such deseases because of it.

I know God will punish in His own way, but remember Job, that was satan but God would only allow what He would allow.

I don't know, perhaps I'm wrong, I'm all for street preaching, I've participated, (joining in singing, and handed out tracts, Pastor preached,I didn't)

Thanks for your post.

 

[ephesians4_23]

I agree it's a bit too harsh. God does not hate persons, even persons in sin. If He hated the people, how are we any different? We have sinned, we do sin and we will sin again.
I think the church that is protesting is stuck on one thing... homosexuality. Yes, it's a sin, yes, God detests the sin, yes, it's an abomination.
But so is divorce, abortion, lying, having idols, coveting, being greedy.

Proverbs 6:16 There are six things the LORD hates, seven that are detestable to him:
17 haughty eyes, a lying tongue, hands that shed innocent blood,
18 a heart that devises wicked schemes, feet that are quick to rush into evil,
19 a false witness who pours out lies and a man who stirs up dissension among brothers.
20 My son, keep your father's commands and do not forsake your mother's teaching.
21 Bind them upon your heart forever; fasten them around your neck.
22 When you walk, they will guide you; when you sleep, they will watch over you; when you awake, they will speak to you.
23 For these commands are a lamp, this teaching is a light, and the corrections of discipline are the way to life,
24 keeping you from the immoral woman, from the smooth tongue of the wayward wife.

Of the seven things specifically mentioned, being gay wasn't one of them. That doesn't lessen the sin, as C.S. Lewis said in "The Screwtape Letters",
“But do remember, the only thing that matters is the extent to which you separate the man from the Enemy (God). It does not matter how small the sins are, provided that their cumulative effect is to edge the man away from the Light and out into the Nothing. Murder is no better than cards if cards can do the trick. Indeed, the safest road to Hell is the gradual one- the gentle slope, soft underfoot, without sudden turnings, without milestones, without signposts.”
The Screwtape Letters by C.S. Lewis, page 56

Is it okay to be gay in our society? On average, I think it is yes. Does that make it okay to God? No. He does not change. We don't remember that the 'freedom' our founding fathers wanted (in the US) was to be free to be a follower of Christ. Now the freedom our society searches for is freedom from God (which is bondage).
Those without God are in a spider's web, never knowing that they are caught and bound, to paraphrase Francine Rivers.
We do know that those who do go into the door of hell had to pass by the Cross in front of that door-- the Bible makes it very clear that they do not choose God and His eternal life.
Do signs of hate convey God's love? Not to me. Rather than opening doors of communication, it has already put people on the defensive. Their ears, hearts and minds are closed. Does that mean that it doesn't work for anyone? Of course not. Maybe those signs did open someone's mind. I can only pray that it did.

 

[rizen1]

My question should of been, the media reporting this issue was it Christian or secular ?


then I'll proceed, but I was not saying you support them.

The point of calling someone a sinner would be to bring them to salvation, so its hard for me to believe they are only on the streets throwing stones.

And if the case of the matter is that they are only calling people sinners, and not sharing the gospel..then thats crazy.
I was not there at the church service to know what was edited. Was it the whole sermon or just parts that made the story more believable.

I want to judge this church by their statement of faith, not because the public was offend. Was the media upset because of their boldness or was it the fact that they were calling people sinners.

I'm against religious censorship, and its been my fear that the media is only reporting these things for more laws to come in place to silent the church.

I'm not saying the church is 100% correct in their style of witnessing, but the motives behind the report concerns me.

The title was baptist church...but in all reality the world is looking at "Christians ". You and Me.

The Baptist church spends more time talking about Hell and being saved, they are known for heavy street witnessing, than most churches who are wrapped up on good living, prosperity, emotionalism and self. And if you do a youtube search I'm sure you'll find more videos and maybe full sermons.

All we can do is pray for them to have compassion on the streets.
sin brings what ?

For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Romans 6:23

 

[Maureen]

Ephesions4_23
I agree they did seem very stuck on homosexuals, agree fully with all you've said too regards it and the other sins which our God abhores, but he does not hate the individual, Jesus went to the cross for the love of us, he died to make a way for us.
If God hated the person, how could they come to the cross for salvation, sure he hates them there'd be no point, that's what I say when I said they never spoke of how to get rid of their sin, through Christ.

It was as if they didn't want anything to do with them, Jesus was found among sinners. That's why He came, to seek and to save the lost.

Quoting you here:-
Do signs of hate convey God's love? Not to me. Rather than opening doors of communication, it has already put people on the defensive

I think that's exactly what it did.

Rizen
It's the same man every week so obviously it must be secular, but in his defence, he came of with good questions for them, he even quoted something from the Bible to them, I have no memory please forgive, there was so much to take in, but I remember thinking even this guy knows this (could have been rehersed, I know) even so, it was put to them, but they dismissed it. If it comes back I will post it, please forgive again, I know it's only half a story.

He asked one of the daughters in her 20's out for a coffee, it wasn't a 'date' he wanted to talk more about their beliefs she had to ask her parents permission, they refused, he thought it odd at her age, and them to refuse, it was entirely innocent, I thought it a nice thing her obeying her parents especially at that age, but I think there was more to it, she had hinted on a past experiences were she'd 'strayed' but wouldn't go into detail on questioning, I think perhaps it may have had some connection.
As if her parents didn't trust her fully, only my interpretation.

The serivce I cannot say how much was shown, not much I guess, but the interviewer was allowed to ask the Preacher Mrs Flepps he was called, a few mintues of questions, he was as I thought arrogant toward him with, well if you could call them answers, he just answered, 'already answered, same answer' or something to that effect, was not clear at all.

The gospel wasn't preached, I never heard it mentioned, all that was spoken on was God's hate, and billboards thanking God for death of people, 9/11 as I've said, and Lady Diana there were many more, not that I'm a 'Royalist' fan now.

The public were upset because of their boldness, sinner was not written on their boards.

I realize we are all branded with the same brush, and it reflects back on Christians as a whole as what do the public know, they see these people calling names no mention of how to get saved, and they immediatly think it's what every so called Christian does.

Oh there was a video made of Mr Phellps saying that Billy Graham was going to hell, he said much more but that was the punch line, wonder what Stephan would make of that one.

I now and then attend a Baptist Church when they hold their series of meetings weeks, this particular church did not conform with anything I have ever saw or heard at this church.

It had it's own name then Baptist Church I will try and find out the name from the guide.

Hope I have relayed this as understandable, I love to see witnessing or hear it, but to me warning bells rang.

 

[Maureen]

Louis Theroux: The Most Hated Family in America

Church is called Westboro Baptist Church

if you leave out his name (that's the interviewer) and type in the rest you will get a page to read on the whole thing.

I thought Louis was pretty fair in his comments until I got to the end, when he said there is some weird stuff in the Bible, didn't like that.

read it though and see what you make of it.

 

[rizen1]

I've seen the reports,videos and documentaries done on these radical groups.

All we can do is pray for them....the world sees Christians they don't see this church alone.

When they go on the streets talking about sinners...they represent all of us, which is the sad part.

But Honestly ask yourself..
what does a secular person get from doing a news report like this ?
And what impact will it have on the whole body of Christ ?

I would read it, but you must ask what did this secular person get from this.


Please note to everyone that reads this I'm not saying I support this church, I'm only questioning the source of this report.

The motive behind.

Where are the reports on anti God, and anti Christian sites..when will they talk about the prosecuted Christians around the world. They won't but they do enjoy finding faults on anything labelled Christian

 

[rizen1]

I figured it was those people, like I said before this is not new, sad to say.

All we can do is pray, we pray for Jehovah witnesses and Mormons. Now we can add them to our list.

 

[pafindr]

The Westboro Baptist Church (WBC) is a church headed by Fred Phelps and based in Topeka, Kansas, United States.
They have been around for a long time and Fred Phelps' daughter, Shirley Phelps-Roper, is on the news quite a bit when a fallen US soldier comes home to be buried. They will scream that the US supports homosexuality and the soldiers deserve to die for serving this country.

As far as God not hating the sinner I think you may be off on that. Mahatma Gandhi had a saying "Hate the sin not the sinner" and it has made it's way into Christianity.
The Bible says the opposite.
Psa 5:5 The foolish shall not stand in Your sight. You hate all doers of iniquity.
Mal 1:2 I have loved you, says Jehovah. But you say, In what have You loved us? Was not Esau Jacob's brother? says Jehovah; yet I loved Jacob,
Mal 1:3 and I hated Esau and made his mountains a desolation, and his inheritance to be for the jackals of the wilderness.

Now does that allow us to hate? No. We have a duty, as Christians, to lovingly guide those that are lost and teach them about Christ and what He did for them. God is not only love. He is also just and we can't forget that.

pafindr

 

[jiggyfly]

Ephesians 5:1&2
1 Follow God’s example in everything you do, because you are his dear children. 2 Live a life filled with love for others, following the example of Christ, who loved you and gave himself as a sacrifice to take away your sins. And God was pleased, because that sacrifice was like sweet perfume to him.

 

[rizen1]

The Westboro Baptist Church (WBC) is a church headed by Fred Phelps and based in Topeka, Kansas, United States.
They have been around for a long time and Fred Phelps' daughter, Shirley Phelps-Roper, is on the news quite a bit when a fallen US soldier comes home to be buried. They will scream that the US supports homosexuality and the soldiers deserve to die for serving this country.

As far as God not hating the sinner I think you may be off on that. Mahatma Gandhi had a saying "Hate the sin not the sinner" and it has made it's way into Christianity.
The Bible says the opposite.
Psa 5:5 The foolish shall not stand in Your sight. You hate all doers of iniquity.
Mal 1:2 I have loved you, says Jehovah. But you say, In what have You loved us? Was not Esau Jacob's brother? says Jehovah; yet I loved Jacob,
Mal 1:3 and I hated Esau and made his mountains a desolation, and his inheritance to be for the jackals of the wilderness.

Now does that allow us to hate? No. We have a duty, as Christians, to lovingly guide those that are lost and teach them about Christ and what He did for them. God is not only love. He is also just and we can't forget that.

pafindr

I remember that story, it made headlines.
God is also Just and you're right we should not forget.

I have to admit, when I see devastating news on tv, the first thing that pops in my head is " sin", our leaders stand for everything and this generation will pay for it, unless they turn from their wicked and evil ways.

Nahum 1:3 (King James Version)
3The LORD is slow to anger, and great in power, and will not at all acquit the wicked: the LORD hath his way in the whirlwind and in the storm, and the clouds are the dust of his feet.

New American Standard
3The LORD is slow to anger and great in power,
And the LORD will by no means leave the guilty unpunished
In whirlwind and storm is His way,
And clouds are the dust beneath His feet.


Romans 1:18 (King James Version)
18For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;

2 Chronicles 7:14
If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

 

[Maureen]

But Honestly ask yourself..
what does a secular person get from doing a news report like this ?
And what impact will it have on the whole body of Christ ?

I would read it, but you must ask what did this secular person get from this.


Please note to everyone that reads this I'm not saying I support this church, I'm only questioning the source of this report.

The motive behind.

Where are the reports on anti God, and anti Christian sites..when will they talk about the prosecuted Christians around the world. They won't but they do enjoy finding faults on anything labelled Christian

Your spot on here Rizen, the Media never come up with reports on the persecuted Christians but are quick to jump and find fault with the Christian Faith.

I don't know what the aim was only to exploit what Christians are at now, kind of thing.
As said the world only see it as 'Christians' again, not as a single church, they won't grasp that, so we all get tarred.
It's a pity we can't write into such programmes and let them know just what Christians do think.



Do we not then love the sinner and hate the sin?
Do we hate both?
How can we 'love' people to Jesus if we are to hate them because they're sinners.
There but for the grace of God go I.

 

[AustinD88]

Your spot on here Rizen, the Media never come up with reports on the persecuted Christians but are quick to jump and find fault with the Christian Faith.

I don't know what the aim was only to exploit what Christians are at now, kind of thing.
As said the world only see it as 'Christians' again, not as a single church, they won't grasp that, so we all get tarred.
It's a pity we can't write into such programmes and let them know just what Christians do think.



Do we not then love the sinner and hate the sin?
Do we hate both?
How can we 'love' people to Jesus if we are to hate them because they're sinners.
There but for the grace of God go I.

Westboro Baptist church sickens me! As a Southern Baptist, i find it extremely offensive what the WB does. They are nothing more than bigots paradeing around leading people away from Christ. They teach hate and nothing more than that. Is the Gospel not good enough? I think it is and then some. The WB has lead thousands of people to Hell. They are prolly all lost themsleves but it's not my place to say either way. Woe to Westboro Baptist church for the Hell they have caused in the hearts and lives of people around the country.

 

[Maureen]

Westboro Baptist church sickens me! As a Southern Baptist, i find it extremely offensive what the WB does. They are nothing more than bigots paradeing around leading people away from Christ. They teach hate and nothing more than that. Is the Gospel not good enough? I think it is and then some. The WB has lead thousands of people to Hell. They are prolly all lost themsleves but it's not my place to say either way. Woe to Westboro Baptist church for the Hell they have caused in the hearts and lives of people around the country.

Austin
Did you watch the programme you sound like you know of them anyway?
I just compared the message I heard in my own church yesterday (The Lords Day) and it was totally opposite to what these people were preaching.
A differant gospel for sure.

 

[AustinD88]

Austin
Did you watch the programme you sound like you know of them anyway?
I just compared the message I heard in my own church yesterday (The Lords Day) and it was totally opposite to what these people were preaching.
A differant gospel for sure.

Yes, sadly i know of them. they are nothing more than false teachers with Hell in their hearts. Lord have mercy on them!

 

[Maureen]

Would make you wonder why the media would choose them to televise and not a sound Christian Church wouldn't it?

 

[AustinD88]

Would make you wonder why the media would choose them to televise and not a sound Christian Church wouldn't it?

Doesn't make for good TV or it's our nature to want to know the negative. For example, if you see a wreck on the road, what is the first thing you do? You look! It's our nature.

 

[Maureen]

Do you think the 'world' see's us Christians like this?
Are we all then put into that category?

My husband who's unsaved yet, understood it was off a certain church, but the unsaved out in the world with no Christian influence around them, would they?

It is not good publistity but again was that intentional, with so many churches doing good for Jesus they choose this, makes me wonder at their motives, as I'm sure there are some.

 

[AustinD88]

Do you think the 'world' see's us Christians like this?
Are we all then put into that category?

My husband who's unsaved yet, understood it was off a certain church, but the unsaved out in the world with no Christian influence around them, would they?

It is not good publistity but again was that intentional, with so many churches doing good for Jesus they choose this, makes me wonder at their motives, as I'm sure there are some.

Well America has a negative view of Christianity anyway. Read a book called "unchristian'. It's a good one. It shows what normal people think about Christians ect. Some many times, we as Christians display what we're against instead of for. We're against same-sex marriage, abortion, ect. What about what we stand for? Love, grace, forgiveness? The media has had it's fieldd day with Christians since it's start. i don't blame them. it's their right to show whatever they want to. It's still a business. What i don't like is Christians who profess Christ with their mouth but not with their lives. Westboro Baptist church is a cult full of lost sinners. Nothing more, nothing less.


Austin D.