The Love Of Money Is Idol Worshipping

[Dave M]

the way you handle your money is a great tell tell of sign of your faith.

 

[Amos Ministries]

the way you handle your money is a great tell tell of sign of your faith.

Yes! Agreed! And amen!

 

[34BillionthHumanBeing]

In light of Acts 2:45 - They sold property and possessions to give to anyone who had need.
AND
Acts 4:34 - There were no needy people among them, because those who owned land or houses would sell them.
AND
Luke 14:33 - In the same way, those of you who do not give up everything you have cannot be my disciples.

It is obviously you who are interpreting Luke 14:33 wrong, and the disciples along with the first century church, who interpreted it in the way I am saying it reads.



Jesus is not asking us what we are willing to give up, he is telling us what we need to give up and that is EVERYTHING! No, Jesus is stating that in order to be a disciple you must give up everything (father, mother, wife, children, brothers and sisters,). We can learn a lot from Luke 14:25 onwards:

Luke 14:25-26 - Now large crowds were going along with Him; and He turned and said to them, 26“If anyone comes to Me, and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be My disciple.

This means that you must speak the truth, even though your own family will turn against you and persecute, revile and isolate you. In spite of this, you must put the teachings of Jesus first in your life. Otherwise you cannot be his disciple.

Luke 14:27 - And whoever does not carry their cross and follow me cannot be my disciple.

Here, Jesus is stating that you must do like him and be willing to lose your own life for his message. Jesus died for the message that he preached. He is stating that if we are not willing to suffer and even die for the teachings of Jesus and the preaching of it, then you cannot be his discu

Jesus goes on to say in Luke 14:28 - "Suppose one of you wants to build a tower. Won't you first sit down and estimate the cost to see if you have enough money to complete it? 29 For if you lay the foundation and are not able to finish it, everyone who sees it will ridicule you, 30saying, ‘This person began to build and wasn’t able to finish.’

31“Or suppose a king is about to go to war against another king. Won’t he first sit down and consider whether he is able with ten thousand men to oppose the one coming against him with twenty thousand? 32If he is not able, he will send a delegation while the other is still a long way off and will ask for terms of peace. 33In the same way, those of you who do not give up everything you have cannot be my disciples.

Jesus is saying to weigh up the cost of being a disciple; losing your own family and even possibly your life for the message he preached. Otherwise, you will compromise the teachings and become a blasphemer. Luke 14:33 - in the same way, Jesus is asking us to understand that we must give up our possessions and not deny Jesus and blaspheme by not believing his teachings.

Luke 14:34-35 - “Salt is good, but if it loses its saltiness, how can it be made salty again? 35It is fit neither for the soil nor for the manure pile; it is thrown out.

“Whoever has ears to hear, let them hear.”

Then Jesus goes on to speak about the uselessness of those who compromise and blaspheme the word of God and the message of Jesus by comparing them to salt less salt.



Matthew 6:24 - "No one can serve two masters. Either you will hate the one and love the other, or you will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and money.

Of course you despise the teachings of what Jesus is saying because you love your money and you cannot serve both.



I have showed you more than enough scriptures in the Bible about how the disciples AND 1st Century church interpreted this scripture.

Acts 2:45 - They sold their property and possessions and shared the money with those in need.

Acts 4:34 - There were no needy people among them, because those who owned land or houses would sell them bring the proceeds from the sales, 35and lay them at the apostles’ feet for distribution to anyone as he had need.…



Self preservation is what the rest of the world does. We are meant to have faith that God will provide.

Luke 12:30-31 -
“For all these things the nations of the world eagerly seek; but your Father knows that you need these things. 31“But seek His kingdom, and these things will be added to you. 32“Do not be afraid, little flock, for your Father has chosen gladly to give you the kingdom.
33“Sell your possessions and give to charity; make yourselves money belts which do not wear out, an unfailing treasure in heaven, where no thief comes near nor moth destroys. 34“For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.



It was the devil who offered Jesus the riches and wealth of this world, not God. You are mistaken that your wealth comes from God.

Luke 16:19-31 - 19“Now there was a rich man, and he habitually dressed in purple and fine linen, joyously living in splendor every day. 20“And a poor man named Lazarus was laid at his gate, covered with sores, 21and longing to be fed with the crumbs which were falling from the rich man’s table; besides, even the dogs were coming and licking his sores. 22“Now the poor man died and was carried away by the angels to Abraham’s bosom; and the rich man also died and was buried. 23“In Hades he lifted up his eyes, being in torment, and saw Abraham far away and Lazarus in his bosom. 24“And he cried out and said, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus so that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool off my tongue, for I am in agony in this flame.’ 25“But Abraham said, ‘Child, remember that during your life you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus bad things; but now he is being comforted here, and you are in agony. 26‘And besides all this, between us and you there is a great chasm fixed, so that those who wish to come over from here to you will not be able, and that none may cross over from there to us.’ 27“And he said, ‘Then I beg you, father, that you send him to my father’s house— 28for I have five brothers—in order that he may warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.’ 29“But Abraham said, ‘They have Moses and the Prophets; let them hear them.’ 30“But he said, ‘No, father Abraham, but if someone goes to them from the dead, they will repent!’ 31“But he said to him, ‘If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be persuaded even if someone rises from the dead.’”



The scripture clearly states she gave all she had. You are trying to twist the scripture due to your love of money.



God didn't give it, the devil did.

1 John 2:6 - Those who say they live in God should live their lives as Jesus did.



Exactly! So claiming you love Jesus more than money without actually giving up your money shows that your faith is dead.



No, you must preach the word of God to the world and God will provide.

Mark 16:15 - And then he told them, “Go into all the world and preach the Good News to everyone.

Matthew 28:19 - Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,



No, it does not say this. You are omitting Luke 12:33 - Sell your possessions and give to the poor. Provide purses for yourselves that will not wear out, a treasure in heaven that will never fail, where no thief comes near and no moth destroys.



You are twisting the scriptures. I don't agree with anything you say.



You are a lover of money and I don't agree with you at all.

James 5:1-3 - Now listen, you rich people, weep and wail because of the misery that is coming on you. 2 Your wealth has rotted, and moths have eaten your clothes. 3 Your gold and silver are corroded. Their corrosion will testify against you and eat your flesh like fire. You have hoarded wealth in the last days.



They are adhering to Luke 12:33 and Luke 14:33 and my other scriptures. It was not free will, but more about accepting and obeying Jesus' command and understanding the cost of being a disciple.



You are a compromiser and manipulator of scripture who loves money.



2 Corinthians 7:10 - For the kind of sorrow God wants us to experience leads us away from sin and results in salvation. There’s no regret for that kind of sorrow. But worldly sorrow, which lacks repentance, results in spiritual death.

You are contrary to the scriptures.



No one is forcing you to do anything. But if you want to enter the Kingdom of Heaven, you must obey Jesus' commands.

John 14:15 - "If you love me, keep my commands."

John 14:21 - "Whoever has my commands and keeps them is the one who loves me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love them and show myself to them.

John 14:23 - "Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him."

John 15:10 - If you keep my commands, you will remain in my love, just as I have kept my Father's commands and remain in his love.

1 John 2:3 - "And by this we know that we have come to know him, if we keep his commandments."

All your doing is repeating scripture without refuting anything I've said. I really don't think you read what I articulated. The descriptions in Acts are not moral mandates. Go back re read the previous chapters leading up to last paragraphs on Acts Chapter. Its a historical account of what the disciples did, again not a litany of moral mandates.

Example of moral mandates in the bible:
The ten commandants, Thou Shalt Not ...
Jesus tells his disciples, the last commandment, Love One Another

Other moral mandates are derived from specific actions using them as nouns or labels: 1 Corinthians 6: 9-10 does a great job. Idolaters, Adulterers, Homosexuality, Thieves, Greedy, Drunkards, Revilers, Swindlers

Reading acts is like watching the news on television. This what happened. These are the people involved. This is the location it took place. This was the time of day. This was the conflict between this person and that person. This was how the conflict was resolved. This is how they lived. This how they got by and met their needs. ...And God Blessed them. Its basic reading comprehension.

Do you see the difference?

Every human being God created is entitled to their own life and freewill, which God created in each human being. Each human being is entitled to exist on earth in the flesh free from the initiation of force applied against him or her. Each human being is entitled to their own self preservation against the use of force, should the use of force be applied against him or her. Each human being is obligated to be a steward over their own existence, their own health and maintain their flesh whilst on earth. You can't do that, if you an object of sacrifice or reduced to a slave.

The Garden of Eden is on lock down. There's two angels blocking it. Nobody has ever successfully reentered. Yet metaphorically, the Left, strives to reenter the Garden of Eden. The Left wants the to be taken care of in the euphoric utopia of Eden, which only God can administer. But Adam sinned. God punished Adam with a curse. That curse persists through all future generations of man. Its called work. We have to work and survive. Its the birth of Capitalism. Without the use of force being applied, individuals work and produce goods, services and other values and exchange those goods, services and values per their own individual goals, which they believe may enhance their life on earth. Commonly traded goods or commodities get replaced with money because its easier to trade a bag of coins than a 200 pound stack of beaver pelts.

The Left on the other hand, is determined. If they can't reenter the garden of eden, then by god they'll create their own eden on earth. Its the birth of Socialism. The key problem here is not the idea in of itself but rather the implementation of the idea. The Left thinks they do what God did, be an administrator to all of mankind. So they set up a new "God" called government and they murder and slaughter their way and build New Eden.

So who really loves money? Who regards money as a God? Its the Left. They initiate the Use of Force against the innocent confiscating their wealth, their property and if you resist, they'll kill you. Once they have all the wealth, they forget the ideals of equal distribution making sure everyone's needs are met, which supposedly motivated them into action in the first place, and they keep it all for themselves and maybe... just maybe... throw a few scraps of it back from those they stole it from. Its all Satanic. It violates the moral mandates God told us, Do Not Kill. Do Not Steal. Do Not Lie. Love one another!

Are you a leftist using scripture trying to manipulate me? Because nothing you have provided refutes what I've said.

The Left makes the case that Jesus warns about serving God or Money. The people in bible in the book of acts, again, I repeat, sold their property, gave the proceeds and so forth, not because someone put a sword against their gut, but rather freewill. They wanted to. There was no use of force, government policy or some ethereal holy figure came out of the clouds that mandated them to do so.

Jesus says you must hate your father, mother brother, spouse and. etc... That's a metaphor, not a literal mandate. Jesus says love one another. Would any God fearing human being really hate? Absolutely not. Jesus uses the word hate as emphasis in a metaphor where if in your life, you encounter situation that challenges your faith in God, then you choose God over the challenge because that's what it takes to serve Jesus Christ. Jesus must come first.

Your response is 80% to 90% copy and paste without any thought or articulation of your own ideas and what you really believe to be true. I'm not trying hurt your feelings, I'm calling you out.

 

[Dave M]

the questions I ask myself to try to help me from having idols is

1. Thoughts are they more on this world or the kingdom of GOd?

2. Free time I spend more on myself and hobbies or the kingdom of GOd, we all have to work. We all have responsibilities but how much time do we intentionally make for God every day??

3. Prayers, what am I praying about?? is all about me and what God can do for me?? or is it about how I can become a better servant for the Lord, do I pray for money to help me or to help the needy?

4. Money do I spend more money on me and hobbies and clothes and cars and going out to eat, then I do on the Kingdom of God? am I intentional with my money for God or for me??

 

[Amos Ministries]

All your doing is repeating scripture without refuting anything I've said. I really don't think you read what I articulated. The descriptions in Acts are not moral mandates. Go back re read the previous chapters leading up to last paragraphs on Acts Chapter. Its a historical account of what the disciples did, again not a litany of moral mandates.

Luke 14:33 is what the disciples in the book of Acts are adhering to. They didn't just make up random rules to follow - they were followers of Jesus!

Jesus tells his disciples, the last commandment, Love One Another

Jesus uses the word "commandments" meaning plural. Everything he said for us to do is a command.

Reading acts is like watching the news on television. This what happened. These are the people involved. This is the location it took place. This was the time of day. This was the conflict between this person and that person. This was how the conflict was resolved. This is how they lived.

John 10:35 - If he called them ‘gods,’ to whom the word of God came—and Scripture cannot be set aside—

No scripture can be set aside. By making Acts into a news program, you are trying to set aside Jesus' teachings.

2 Timothy 3:16 - All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness

You are wrong and contrary to the bible.

Every human being God created is entitled to their own life and freewill, which God created in each human being. Each human being is entitled to exist on earth in the flesh free from the initiation of force applied against him or her. Each human being is entitled to their own self preservation against the use of force, should the use of force be applied against him or her. Each human being is obligated to be a steward over their own existence, their own health and maintain their flesh whilst on earth. You can't do that, if you an object of sacrifice or reduced to a slave.

Yes, we all have free will. But that does not mean that if you exercise your free will instead of obeying the teachings of Jesus, that you will enter the Kingdom of Heaven. It's only if you obey Jesus that you can be called a child of God and enter the kingdom of heaven. You are either a slave to sin through the love of money or a slave to Jesus.

The Garden of Eden is on lock down. There's two angels blocking it. Nobody has ever successfully reentered.

This is false teaching. The angel only signifies that you must now die to yourself in order to enter and eat of the tree of life, which is the Holy Spirit.

Yet metaphorically, the Left, strives to reenter the Garden of Eden. The Left wants the to be taken care of in the euphoric utopia of Eden, which only God can administer. But Adam sinned. God punished Adam with a curse. That curse persists through all future generations of man. Its called work. We have to work and survive.

No, you completely don't understand the scriptures. The work that is spoken of regarding Adam means his own interpretation of the word of God. Meaning, now that he has eaten from the tree of knowledge of good and evil, it means he has now developed his own understanding and standards of right and wrong. He no longer naturally follows God's standards. So now, he must try to understand God through his own works.

Its the birth of Capitalism. Without the use of force being applied, individuals work and produce goods, services and other values and exchange those goods, services and values per their own individual goals, which they believe may enhance their life on earth. Commonly traded goods or commodities get replaced with money because its easier to trade a bag of coins than a 200 pound stack of beaver pelts.

Romans 12:2 - Do not conform to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to test and approve what God's will is--his good, pleasing and perfect will.

1 John 2:15 - Do not love the world or anything in the world. If anyone loves the world, love for the Father is not in them.

Ephesians 5:10-17 -
trying to learn what is pleasing to the Lord. 11Do not participate in the unfruitful deeds of darkness, but instead even expose them; 12for it is disgraceful even to speak of the things which are done by them in secret. 13But all things become visible when they are exposed by the light, for everything that becomes visible is light.
14For this reason it says,
“Awake, sleeper,
And arise from the dead,
And Christ will shine on you.”

15Therefore be careful how you walk, not as unwise men but as wise, 16making the most of your time, because the days are evil. 17So then do not be foolish, but understand what the will of the Lord is.

James 1:27 - Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world.

James 4:4 - You adulterous people, don't you know that friendship with the world means enmity against God? Therefore, anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God.

Are you a leftist using scripture trying to manipulate me? Because nothing you have provided refutes what I've said.

If you cannot see the truth in the scriptures I have provided, then you are a completely unrepentant person.

1 Corinthians 2:14 - The person without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them because they are discerned only through the Spirit.

The Left makes the case that Jesus warns about serving God or Money. The people in bible in the book of acts, again, I repeat, sold their property, gave the proceeds and so forth, not because someone put a sword against their gut, but rather freewill.

Nobody's putting a gun to your head either. Jesus is not forcing anybody - it's your choice. Everyone must sit down as a king does before he goes to war and weigh up the cost of being a disciple. Not everyone can do it.

Jesus says you must hate your father, mother brother, spouse and. etc... That's a metaphor, not a literal mandate. Jesus says love one another. Would any God fearing human being really hate?

The word 'hate' means 'to esteem less'. Meaning you must esteem less or hold in lesser regard, the philosophies of your family than Jesus' philosophies - such as to give up all.

Your response is 80% to 90% copy and paste without any thought or articulation of your own ideas and what you really believe to be true. I'm not trying hurt your feelings, I'm calling you out.

If anyone needs to be called out, it should be I calling you out on being a compromiser. What you're saying only makes sense to you because you are a lover of money.

1 Corinthians 2:14 describes you perfectly:

The person without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them because they are discerned only through the Spirit.

 

[34BillionthHumanBeing]

Amos Ministries. Once again you are throwing scripture around without any original thought or analysis. I'm not going to repeat myself. What I will do is give you and your argument the benefit of the doubt.

You have, from me, the benefit of the doubt. You are right and I'm wrong. So let's start from there. Let's stay on point without rambling scripture, copying and pasting and telling me because its printed in ink, and its God's word that its true. Of course it true, but you are saying its true whilst applying it in incorrect context. So here's what we're going to do:

Start with Acts Chapter 2 from the start. You probably already know it like the back of your hand, but if you want to reread it, that's fine. Look at the things that occurred in that Chapter. Now focus on the end of the chapter the conclusion paragraph. I'll copy it:

"They devoted themselves to the apostles' teaching and to the fellowship, to the breaking of bread and to prayer. Everyone was filled with awe, and may wonders and miraculous signs were done by the apostles. All the believers were together and had everything in common. Selling their possessions and goods, they gave to anyone as he had need. Every day they continued to meet together in their homes and ate together with gald and sincere hearts, praising God and enjoying the favor of all people. And the Lord added to their number daily those who were being saved."

Okay, you're in charge.

We need make sure that everyone who is saved in Jesus Christ sells their possessions and goods. We need make sure that everyone gives to anyone that has need.

Once again you're charge to execute Jesus' teaching. Make it happen.

Articulate what you would do.
How would you handle it?
What should become of fellow believers who decided that that should keep their possessions and goods as opposed to selling and giving to those in need.

Remember this your gig. Whatever you say, goes. Make it happen. Articulate what you would do.

 

[Dave M]

What should become of fellow believers who decided that that should keep their possessions and goods as opposed to selling and giving to those in need.

I would take you to what is written in Timothy, first we better be helping the needy but to what extreme is up to the individual.

1 Timothy 6:17-19
As for the rich in this present age, charge them not to be haughty, nor to set their hopes on the uncertainty of riches, but on God, who richly provides us with everything to enjoy. They are to do good, to be rich in good works, to be generous and ready to share, thus storing up treasure for themselves as a good foundation for the future, so that they may take hold of that which is truly life.

Helping the needy is a commandment from Jesus its not a suggestion, if your not helping the needy I would look closely at some of these scriptures. I am not sure if your sugeting it ok NOT to help the needy or if your suggesting that you do not need to sell everything to help the needy in that case I would agree.

1 John 3:17
But if anyone has the world's goods and sees his brother in need, yet closes his heart against him, how does God's love abide in him?

Hebrews 13:16
Do not neglect to do good and to share what you have, for such sacrifices are pleasing to God.

1 Timothy 5:8
But if anyone does not provide for his relatives, and especially for members of his household, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.

James 2:14-17
What good is it, my brothers, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can that faith save him? If a brother or sister is poorly clothed and lacking in daily food, and one of you says to them, “Go in peace, be warmed and filled,” without giving them the things needed for the body, what good is that? So also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.

 

[34BillionthHumanBeing]

I would take you to what is written in Timothy, first we better be helping the needy but to what extreme is up to the individual.

1 Timothy 6:17-19
As for the rich in this present age, charge them not to be haughty, nor to set their hopes on the uncertainty of riches, but on God, who richly provides us with everything to enjoy. They are to do good, to be rich in good works, to be generous and ready to share, thus storing up treasure for themselves as a good foundation for the future, so that they may take hold of that which is truly life.

Helping the needy is a commandment from Jesus its not a suggestion, if your not helping the needy I would look closely at some of these scriptures. I am not sure if your sugeting it ok NOT to help the needy or if your suggesting that you do not need to sell everything to help the needy in that case I would agree.

1 John 3:17
But if anyone has the world's goods and sees his brother in need, yet closes his heart against him, how does God's love abide in him?

Hebrews 13:16
Do not neglect to do good and to share what you have, for such sacrifices are pleasing to God.

1 Timothy 5:8
But if anyone does not provide for his relatives, and especially for members of his household, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.

James 2:14-17
What good is it, my brothers, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can that faith save him? If a brother or sister is poorly clothed and lacking in daily food, and one of you says to them, “Go in peace, be warmed and filled,” without giving them the things needed for the body, what good is that? So also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.

Dave, I'm in total agreement with you.
My reasoning for agreeing with you, you may or may not agree with however. I agree with you because we have freewill to determine for ourselves what defines need and how much is given to meet that need. Because we are all individuals and our relationship with God is subjective, to mean that each individual is on a subjective level with God. God dealing with an individual that believes on him, is dealt with between that individual and God alone as opposed to a self appointed anointed one who declares by decree what the standard of need is and what the standard is given to satisfy that standard. Huge difference!

God can only be the one who moves an individual through their subjective relationship with each other and inform a believer you did or did not give enough.

This is why I rebuke Amos Ministries because he's uses scripture taking the role of the self appointed anointed one. He declares the book of Acts as a moral mandate as opposed to the "many adventures of the apostles after Jesus." This is why its called the book of Acts. Its all the things the apostle did after Jesus, Its a historical account or a description of time, place, person, reason, conflict, resolution and a state of being. Its not a moral mandate. There is no thou shalt not... or commandants.

In today's age of radical leftism and the satanic resurgence of socialism, Christians are deceived and manipulated to sacrifice their material blessings God has given them whilst in the flesh. These are material blessings where money is the fiat of exchange. They (or people) traded their time for money or they invested their own wealth in order to create more wealth which in turn creates opportunity for others to be blessed with employment. Amos Ministries argues that such economic activity is the ways of the world and sinful as opposed to a mechanic where God blesses humanity.

It further illustrates Amos Ministries in my opinion is a hypocrite because if you argue his premise that selling all that you have is a moral mandate, that would suggest that he himself should be impoverished. But he's not impoverished, he uses a computer, logs into internet and and makes posts here on this website. He argues that this is mandate whilst ignoring a key phrase in the scripture. Look at this:

Selling their possessions and goods, they gave to anyone as he had need. Every day they continued to meet together in their homes and ate together

If they sold their possessions and goods, then why do they still have property, or a home?

So you see, its not a mandate. Its a report of events in the post resurrection era. They sold some possessions and goods. They gave money or stuff to people in need. They still have stuff and own stuff and they still acquired more material goods in the course of their lives on earth which they didn't give or sell. This is evident because they didn't give up their houses, did they?

Its my opinion that Amos Ministries is a leftist fraud.

 

[Amos Ministries]

Articulate what you would do.
How would you handle it?
What should become of fellow believers who decided that that should keep their possessions and goods as opposed to selling and giving to those in need.

Let us consider Luke 12:22-34 -

22 Then Jesus said to his disciples: “Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat; or about your body, what you will wear. 23 For life is more than food, and the body more than clothes. 24 Consider the ravens: They do not sow or reap, they have no storeroom or barn; yet God feeds them. And how much more valuable you are than birds! 25 Who of you by worrying can add a single hour to your life[b]? 26 Since you cannot do this very little thing, why do you worry about the rest?

27 “Consider how the wild flowers grow. They do not labor or spin. Yet I tell you, not even Solomon in all his splendor was dressed like one of these. 28 If that is how God clothes the grass of the field, which is here today, and tomorrow is thrown into the fire, how much more will he clothe you—you of little faith! 29 And do not set your heart on what you will eat or drink; do not worry about it. 30 For the pagan world runs after all such things, and your Father knows that you need them. 31 But seek his kingdom, and these things will be given to you as well.

32 “Do not be afraid, little flock, for your Father has been pleased to give you the kingdom. 33 Sell your possessions and give to the poor. Provide purses for yourselves that will not wear out, a treasure in heaven that will never fail, where no thief comes near and no moth destroys. 34 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

The scripture clearly says that once you give up your possessions and rely on God, He will provide for your needs. Obviously this takes great faith and if you are lacking the faith, then you're going to miss the point.

A repentant person will pray and ask God "help me with my unbelief or faith" but an unrepentant person will just twist the scriptures to suite their argument to keep their money. As it says in Luke 16:14 - The Pharisees, who loved money, heard all this and were sneering at Jesus.

This is the attitude I feel you have towards Luke 14:33 and every other scripture that supports the commandment to give up your possessions.

Jesus gave up his possessions and preached the gospel whilst God provided for him and we are called to do the same.

1 John 2:4 - 6 - Whoever says, “I know him,” but does not do what he commands is a liar, and the truth is not in that person. 5 But if anyone obeys his word, love for God is truly made complete in them. This is how we know we are in him: 6 Whoever claims to live in him must live as Jesus did.

If we are not referencing the scriptures, then we have nothing to talk about. I encourage you to reference scripture from now on otherwise what you are saying is merely conjecture and does not benefit anyone.

But if you really want to know how it works to give up all, I'll say this - it's a slow process, nothing happens quickly. Giving up all needs to be a completely informed decision, and Jesus says to take all the time you need to make this decision.

Right before Luke 14:33, verses 28-32 say this:

28“Suppose one of you wants to build a tower. Won’t you first sit down and estimate the cost to see if you have enough money to complete it? 29For if you lay the foundation and are not able to finish it, everyone who sees it will ridicule you, 30saying, ‘This person began to build and wasn’t able to finish.’

31“Or suppose a king is about to go to war against another king. Won’t he first sit down and consider whether he is able with ten thousand men to oppose the one coming against him with twenty thousand? 32If he is not able, he will send a delegation while the other is still a long way off and will ask for terms of peace.

We need to weigh up whether we can accept the cost of discipleship or not. We must remember that the first step is to just accept the statement of Luke 14:33.

Mark 10:22 says - Shocked at this statement, the man went away sad, because he had many possessions.

Matthew 19:22 - And having heard this statement, the young man went away grieving; for he was one having many possessions.

This man could not even accept the statement . If he would have at least accepted the statement but not actually done it, this would be considered 'annulling' and he would have still entered the kingdom of heaven.

Matthew 5:19 - Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

This is why Jesus goes on in Mark and Matthew to say:

Matthew 19:30 - But many who are the greatest now will be least important then, and those who seem least important now will be the greatest then.

Mark 10:31 - But many who are the greatest now will be least important then, and those who seem least important now will be the greatest then.”

So the first step is just to accept the statement and not to actually do it. This in itself is a great feat but we must separate the action from the philosophy in order to acknowledge the truth in what Jesus is saying. Don't imagine what it will be like but rather first simply focus on whether Jesus said it.

Matthew 6:31-32 - So do not worry, saying, 'What shall we eat?' or 'What shall we drink?' or 'What shall we wear?'

At this point, if you can accept the statement and you believe Jesus' words and have not denied them, you have entered the kingdom of heaven. However, you will have entered as the least. If at any moment, you stop annulling the commandment and give up all in action, you have now become the greatest in the kingdom of God.

But it all begins with accepting the statement. You cannot move any further without accepting the statement first. Once you have accepted the statement, the Holy Spirit will begin to enable you to actually do it, meaning make it possible to actually do it in action. Which is why Jesus said:

Luke 18:27 - Jesus replied, “What is impossible with man is possible with God.”

Matthew 19:26 - Jesus looked at them and said, "With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible."

Mark 10:27 - Jesus replied, “What is impossible with man is possible with God.”

It is impossible to do this with our own spirit but through the Holy Spirit, all things are possible.

For the one who does not even accept Jesus' statement, he is a blasphemer of the Holy Spirit and this is an unforgivable sin.

John 6:63 - The Spirit alone gives eternal life. Human effort accomplishes nothing. And the very words I have spoken to you are spirit and life.

Jesus words are spirit and if we reject them, do not believe them and deny them, then we blaspheme the Holy Spirit by calling what is right that which is wrong.

Matthew 12:31-32 - Therefore I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. 32Whoever speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the one to come

Luke 12:10 - And everyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven.

Mark 3:28-29 - 28Truly I tell you, the sons of men will be forgiven all sins and blasphemies, as many as they utter. 29But whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven; he is guilty of eternal sin.”

Matthew 10:20 - For it is not you who will be speaking—it will be the Spirit of your Father speaking through you.

Luke 12:12 - for the Holy Spirit will teach you at that time what you should say."

John 7:16 KJV - Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me.

John 12:49 - For I did not speak on my own, but the Father who sent me commanded me to say all that I have spoken.

 

[Bill]

Idol worship is anything that comes between you and God

 

[Amos Ministries]

Idol worship is anything that comes between you and God

Yes this is true, but the Scriptures clearly state that greed and covetousness is idol worshipping. So this is the most likely one we would fall for and should watch out for.

Colossians 3:5 Put to death therefore what is earthly in you: sexual immorality, impurity, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry.

 

[Amos Ministries]

Dave, I'm in total agreement with you.
My reasoning for agreeing with you, you may or may not agree with however. I agree with you because we have freewill to determine for ourselves what defines need and how much is given to meet that need. Because we are all individuals and our relationship with God is subjective, to mean that each individual is on a subjective level with God. God dealing with an individual that believes on him, is dealt with between that individual and God alone as opposed to a self appointed anointed one who declares by decree what the standard of need is and what the standard is given to satisfy that standard. Huge difference!

God can only be the one who moves an individual through their subjective relationship with each other and inform a believer you did or did not give enough.

This is why I rebuke Amos Ministries

You are flattering yourself you have not rebuked me you have Merely argued with me. You must also learn the difference between reviling and rebuking. Rebuking means you are speaking the truth and not telling me the truth but I am stating you are reviling which means you were angrily criticizing me due to me speaking the truth.


because he's uses scripture taking the role of the self appointed anointed one.

I have in No way stated I am any sort of anointed one I have merely stated what Jesus has said in Luke 14:33 and then if you can be my disciple and less he giv I have in Norway stated I am any sort of anointed one I have merely stated what Jesus has said in Luke 14:33 and then if you can be my disciple and less he gives Up all his possessions.


He declares the book of Acts as a moral mandate as opposed to the "many adventures of the apostles after Jesus."

Once again look at Luke 14:33 and Luke 12:33 and you will see Jesus giving this same mandate.

Luke 12:33 33 Sell your possessions and give to the poor. Provide purses for yourselves that will not wear out, a treasure in heaven that will never fail, where no thief comes near and no moth destroys.



This is why its called the book of Acts. Its all the things the apostle did after Jesus, Its a historical account or a description of time, place, person, reason, conflict, resolution and a state of being. Its not a moral mandate. There is no thou shalt not... or commandants.

In today's age of radical leftism and the satanic resurgence of socialism, Christians are deceived and manipulated to sacrifice their material blessings God has given them whilst in the flesh.

It was Satan that offered wealth power and riches to Jesus whilst in the wilderness so what you are saying is contrary to the Scriptures.

These are material blessings where money is the fiat of exchange. They (or people) traded their time for money or they invested their own wealth in order to create more wealth which in turn creates opportunity for others to be blessed with employment. Amos Ministries argues that such economic activity is the ways of the world and sinful as opposed to a mechanic where God blesses humanity.


If this money aspect is not the ways of this world and I don’t know what is greed lust for power jealousy Envy competitive spirit is all demonic James states. James 3:
13 Who is wise and understanding among you? Let them show it(P) by their good life, by deeds(Q) done in the humility that comes from wisdom. 14 But if you harbor bitter envy and selfish ambition(R) in your hearts, do not boast about it or deny the truth.(S) 15 Such “wisdom” does not come down from heaven(T) but is earthly, unspiritual, demonic.(U) 16 For where you have envy and selfish ambition,(V) there you find disorder and every evil practice.



It further illustrates Amos Ministries in my opinion is a hypocrite because if you argue his premise that selling all that you have is a moral mandate, that would suggest that he himself should be impoverished. But he's not impoverished, he uses a computer, logs into internet and and makes posts here on this website. He argues that this is mandate whilst ignoring a key phrase in the scripture. Look at this:

For the 25th time you are ignoring and omitting the scripture where Jesus states if you put the kingdom of heaven first sell your positions and give it to the poor that God will add the things you need to you and part of the things you need a shelter food water clothing. This can be found in Luke 12:22 to 34
22 Then Jesus said to his disciples: “Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat; or about your body, what you will wear. 23 For life is more than food, and the body more than clothes.24 Consider the ravens: They do not sow or reap, they have no storeroom or barn; yet God feeds them.(T) And how much more valuable you are than birds! 25 Who of you by worrying can add a single hour to your life[b]?26 Since you cannot do this very little thing, why do you worry about the rest?

27 “Consider how the wild flowers grow. They do not labor or spin. Yet I tell you, not even Solomon in all his splendor(U) was dressed like one of these. 28 If that is how God clothes the grass of the field, which is here today, and tomorrow is thrown into the fire, how much more will he clothe you—you of little faith!(V)29 And do not set your heart on what you will eat or drink; do not worry about it. 30 For the pagan world runs after all such things, and your Father(W) knows that you need them.(X)31 But seek his kingdom,(Y) and these things will be given to you as well.(Z)

32 “Do not be afraid,(AA) little flock, for your Father has been pleased to give you the kingdom.(AB) 33 Sell your possessions and give to the poor.(AC) Provide purses for yourselves that will not wear out, a treasure in heaven(AD) that will never fail, where no thief comes near and no moth destroys.(AE) 34 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.(AF)




Selling their possessions and goods, they gave to anyone as he had need. Every day they continued to meet together in their homes and ate together

If they sold their possessions and goods, then why do they still have property, or a home?

You are acting like renting a property Does not exist where did God say that if you give up your possessions I will not give to you and you will be destitute. As I stated before if you put the kingdom of heaven first by giving up your possessions and selling it and giving it to the poor God will add your needs to you.



So you see, its not a mandate. Its a report of events in the post resurrection era.

Luke 14:33 And Luke 12 and Luke 12:33 Or Jesus his actual words so I don’t know what you’re talking about.



They sold some possessions and goods. They gave money or stuff to people in need. They still have stuff and own stuff and they still acquired more material goods in the course of their lives on earth which they didn't give or sell. This is evident because they didn't give up their houses, did they?

Already answered this above.

Its my opinion that Amos Ministries is a leftist fraud.

You are hurling slanderous accusations they are defamatory.

 

[Bill]

Yes this is true, but the Scriptures clearly state that greed and covetousness is idol worshipping. So this is the most likely one we would fall for and should watch out for.

Colossians 3:5 Put to death therefore what is earthly in you: sexual immorality, impurity, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry.

It is the same. Greed , money, food, your spouse, yourself , even your faith . Whenever you set anything between God's love of you , and your love for God . That causes any separation , you have now made that thing / person greater than God

 

[Amos Ministries]

It is the same. Greed , money, food, your spouse, yourself , even your faith . Whenever you set anything between God's love of you , and your love for God . That causes any separation , you have now made that thing / person greater than God

I understand but Jesus specifically states you cannot serve both God and money.

Exodus 20:23
You are not to make any gods alongside Me; you are not to make for yourselves gods of silver or gold.

 

[Bill]

I understand but Jesus specifically states you cannot serve both God and money.

Exodus 20:23
You are not to make any gods alongside Me; you are not to make for yourselves gods of silver or gold.

My point exactly. ( in this example , Jesus is making referance to silver and gold . But there are many other things people make " gods " out of . Sometimes gods are just ideas . Such as aliens from outerspace . )

 

[Mister]

1 Tim 5:7 comes to mind for me. I was technically tithing but not meeting the needs of my household. My daughter hadn't any clothing and was wearing the same outfit daily. We happened to stumble upon this situation as she didn't say anything. And several other examples of like nature. My (currently ex) pastor preached tithing and offerings at 10 and 5 percent respectively. He says from the pulpit "tithes are holy, I don't need em".

I always thought this was kinda wrong or felt out of shape but I stayed the course - tithing and trying to meet an offering of 5 percent. I haven't tithed since September since we stopped attending church there.

After all the bills I have there isn't much left beyond the necessities. My wife has started Door Dashing to help pay my consumer credit card debt to the tune of $14k. We are a mess! One day at a time Lord thank you for your mercy and loving kindness. Please keep with us and guide our hearts to do the right thing with what we have.

 

[Bill]

1 Tim 5:7 comes to mind for me. I was technically tithing but not meeting the needs of my household. My daughter hadn't any clothing and was wearing the same outfit daily. We happened to stumble upon this situation as she didn't say anything. And several other examples of like nature. My (currently ex) pastor preached tithing and offerings at 10 and 5 percent respectively. He says from the pulpit "tithes are holy, I don't need em".

I always thought this was kinda wrong or felt out of shape but I stayed the course - tithing and trying to meet an offering of 5 percent. I haven't tithed since September since we stopped attending church there.

After all the bills I have there isn't much left beyond the necessities. My wife has started Door Dashing to help pay my consumer credit card debt to the tune of $14k. We are a mess! One day at a time Lord thank you for your mercy and loving kindness. Please keep with us and guide our hearts to do the right thing with what we have.

Tithing as a monetary issue was imposed by God in the Old Testament because the Jews were so stubborn.

But in the New Testament Jesus tells us it isn't the money that God seeks, it's our hearts

 

[Dave M]

But in the New Testament Jesus tells us it isn't the money that God seeks, it's our hearts

and usually there is a direct relationship, what you spend your money on is a great way to tell what you truly love. Show me a mans check book and I will show you wear his heart is

Matthew 6:21
For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

 

[Mister]

Tithing as a monetary issue was imposed by God in the Old Testament because the Jews were so stubborn.

But in the New Testament Jesus tells us it isn't the money that God seeks, it's our hearts

Sorry I meant 1 Tim 5:8. Do you have scripture references?

 

[Bill]

Sorry I meant 1 Tim 5:8. Do you have scripture references?

Im sure you can look it up as well as anyone.

I rarely post where the scripture comes from . But im always quoting