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There Really Was a Noah’s Ark & Flood

Sure, you'll not see God by looking through a telescope or a microscope. But you can see his handiwork through both.

Anything spiritual is -- by definition -- beyond the scope of material science. But that doesn't make science useless, just limited.

Scientific method can't say anything directly about God, but it can help us to discover a huge amount about the world that he's created.
 
Sure, you'll not see God by looking through a telescope or a microscope. But you can see his handiwork through both.

Anything spiritual is -- by definition -- beyond the scope of material science. But that doesn't make science useless, just limited.

Scientific method can't say anything directly about God, but it can help us to discover a huge amount about the world that he's created.
Ahhh, but I never said science is useless, just that its not always dependable. You probably woudnt believe it, but I love science, the how of how things work. I just dont worship science like many atheists do. Always wished I had the money to open up my own professional laboratory. Large tables with piped in gas for heating things up. Mini-centrifuges, vacuum creation devices, lasers, beakers, test tubes, computers and camera's to record processes, chemicals, metals, the whole works. And I would love to hire ppl from just graduating high school, before their minds are molded into the thought processes of things dont work that way. Have them brain storm up ideas (as I would be) and if they can create useful things or verily on their way within a year, then keep them on, if not, help them find another job.
 
Sure, you'll not see God by looking through a telescope or a microscope. But you can see his handiwork through both.

Anything spiritual is -- by definition -- beyond the scope of material science. But that doesn't make science useless, just limited.

Scientific method can't say anything directly about God, but it can help us to discover a huge amount about the world that he's created.
And there are some material things that can test the spiritual in very small ways, but they have never been seriously investigated. Why? Because its looked down upon as non-scientific, hence the anti-spiritual bent of most of established science. Just one example is kyrillian photography. There are other devices that assist in it, simple heat/cold sensors, high speed motion camera's, and magnetic fields and the testers of the same in the experimental scenarios. It would take a LOT of experimenting over generations before anything significant would arise. So there are venues, just not venues that traditonal science "wants" to explore. It upsets their ideas of how things should be. But its probably for the best, in the wrong hands, the more advanced tech that could arise from such research, would be very very deadly I would think.
 
Science doesn’t claim to know everything though. The difference between science and religion is that science is willing to change when new evidence comes up. We had previously thought that the earth was the center of the universe, but math and science proved otherwise, and scientist were accepting of this new development. But religion, however, refuses to change its mind. When we thought that the earth was the center, scientist were accepting of the change in idea, but the church wasn’t, despite the evidence that proved otherwise. Why? Because it didn’t align with the Bible and their worldview. The church thought that it knew everything, and anything else people said was heresy. That is why, even today, the church would rather claim that science and scientist are heretics, or lost, or should be ignored, than adapt their reasoning to the newfound evidence because of they don’t want to shatter their fragile worldview that is based on a book that was written thousands of years ago by people who didn’t understand the world the same way that we do today. So, no, it’s not the scientists who think that they are masters of the universe or whatever, it’s the church. And it’s because of the silencing of the church that science was delayed in its discoveries, and that, to me, is such a crying shame.
I challenge the people in this thread to do some research on topics that they may not feel comfortable looking into. As a young debater and aspiring law student in my day, I was always told to look at both sides of the argument. That way, I can get an idea as to how to break down the other sides argument and come out on top. However, I can see on this thread that a lot of you guys can’t even begin to comprehend the other sides arguments, let alone fight against it. Excuse my harsh words, but having a discussion with someone when you don’t even understand what they’re saying makes you look childish and ridiculous.
In other words, if you can’t even properly define what a theory is in science, or what evolution is, then you have no business discussing your objections to it.
End of discussion.
 
Science doesn’t claim to know everything though. The difference between science and religion is that science is willing to change when new evidence comes up. We had previously thought that the earth was the center of the universe, but math and science proved otherwise, and scientist were accepting of this new development. But religion, however, refuses to change its mind. When we thought that the earth was the center, scientist were accepting of the change in idea, but the church wasn’t, despite the evidence that proved otherwise. Why? Because it didn’t align with the Bible and their worldview. The church thought that it knew everything, and anything else people said was heresy. That is why, even today, the church would rather claim that science and scientist are heretics, or lost, or should be ignored, than adapt their reasoning to the newfound evidence because of they don’t want to shatter their fragile worldview that is based on a book that was written thousands of years ago by people who didn’t understand the world the same way that we do today. So, no, it’s not the scientists who think that they are masters of the universe or whatever, it’s the church. And it’s because of the silencing of the church that science was delayed in its discoveries, and that, to me, is such a crying shame.
I challenge the people in this thread to do some research on topics that they may not feel comfortable looking into. As a young debater and aspiring law student in my day, I was always told to look at both sides of the argument. That way, I can get an idea as to how to break down the other sides argument and come out on top. However, I can see on this thread that a lot of you guys can’t even begin to comprehend the other sides arguments, let alone fight against it. Excuse my harsh words, but having a discussion with someone when you don’t even understand what they’re saying makes you look childish and ridiculous.
In other words, if you can’t even properly define what a theory is in science, or what evolution is, then you have no business discussing your objections to it.
End of discussion.
LOL, I think it humerous when people say things like "End of discussion", its a manipulative tactic for professional debaters, to seem to win any argument, if the other doesnt reply. Science changes sometimes, but not often as it could, there is a lot of resistance to new ideas that challenge set ways. You dont know what I know about science, which is more than you assume. Whereas I know a lot about spiritual matters, and you know practically none. And I really have to sign off here, I went beyond what I intended, beginning to get drawn into a worthless argument which scripture warns us against.
 
Although I have no doubt that its Noah's Ark, the Islamic controlled Turkey will not allow people to see it or to study it any more, and I doubt they will share what they find about it either. Just a guess, but I am pretty sure its accurate.
 
Although I have no doubt that its Noah's Ark, the Islamic controlled Turkey will not allow people to see it or to study it any more, and I doubt they will share what they find about it either. Just a guess, but I am pretty sure its accurate.


True, I read some time ago that Turkey had declared the area a national park, allowing no more digging, or any other investigations or tests.
 
I don’t believe that the global flood happened based off of a few reasons. These are some notes I made based off of an essay written by two scientists that explains how the flood was improbably from a meteorological perspective:
our oceans consists of 1.7 billion cubic kilometers of water.
to cover mountains requires +4.4 billion cubic kilometers. 3 times the amount of water that we have on earth
where did the water come from?
If the water came from the land then the land would still be covered in water.
Mount ararat is 3 miles high and is a volcano that is formed by magma and lava solidifying over time.
The firmament?
The firmament. It wouldn’t work unless water was pumped in from space and pumped back out into space.
If there was a firmament that surrounded the earth, then scientists say that the atmospheric pressure would’ve been about 840 times what it is now and it would be 99.9% water vapor, making it impossible for humans and animals to breathe. Not enough hydrogen or nitrogen to create clouds.
Thermodynamics. As each kilogram of water vapor condenses, 2.26 million Jules of energy are liberated. This is known as the latent heat of vaporization and this is the source of thunderstorms and hurricanes. So to convert water vapor to rain over 40 days would radiate 10^28 Jules of energy worldwide, raising the atmospheric temperature beyond 6,400 degrees, making the earth the second hottest rock in the solar system. Oceans would boil, and the ark would literally burn. So no, the water didn’t come from the firmament. The firmament doesn’t exist. The firmament was an idea commonly held by those in the ancient world that space was solid.
The hydroplane theory by Dr. Walt Brown argues that God sealed 435 billion kilometers of water under the earths crust more than 20 miles thick, and it broke from the tidal pulling on the moon. This implies that God placed the water there on purpose and that water was going to burst like a balloon whether humanity sinned or not, but I digress.
Water takes time to heat up or cool down, but with that amount of water sitting under the earths crust for a couple of thousand years, the water would’ve been boiling. Steam would be released into the atmosphere, and if life on earth, including Noah and the animals, weren’t steam cooked, then they would’ve been boiled alive. So no, the water didn’t come from under ground.
A ball of ice 13,000 miles across from space. Twice as wide as Texas. A thousand miles thicker than the atmosphere. If a ball of ice that size would’ve landed in the earth, then it would’ve had the impact of 12 trillion megatons of TNT, wiping out all life on earth faster than a flood would, including Noah and his family.
Anything smaller than that would heat up and vaporize in the atmosphere, generating heat, and heating up the atmosphere in the process to 12,000 degrees hotter than the surface of the sun.
Where did the water go after then? If the water returned to under the earth, then we wouldn’t have oceans because that would be where all of our water came from originally. Another theory would be tsunami’s but tsunamis would return back to the ocean after a few days, not after 40 days and 40 nights. (Nelson and Siroca). If we say that there were multiple tsunamis over the span of 40 days, then the energy used to create these tsunamis would’ve generated heat, which would’ve heated up the earth to an estimate of 36,000 degrees.

Another reason why I don’t believe the flood happened is because my dad specializes in fish. He’s an avid fisherman and has been keeping a salt water fish tank in our living room since I was in diapers. Because of this, I know a few fun facts about fish. For instance, salt water fish have a high concentration of salt in their bodies. So when you place a salt water fish in fresh water, all of the salt will leave their body, leaving them to bloat and die. Fresh water fish on the other fin don’t have a lot of salt in their bodies, so when you throw a fresh water fish into salt water, the salt water will suck all of the water out of the fish, dehydrating it to death. Yes, it is possible to acclimate freshwater to saltwater and vise versa, but the conditions have to be specific and only a handful of fish could do this, other wise the fish will die. So if the earth was going through immense amounts of rain that filled even to the highest mountains, fresh rainwater would’ve destroyed the ecosystem of the oceans, and the rising oceans would’ve destroyed the freshwater environment.

I also can’t believe in the flood as a literal event is because there are tribes that are older than when creationists believe the ark took place. For example, creationists say that the ark floated about 10,000 years ago give or take, but the Aborigines moved to Australia around 50,000 years ago, and they still continue to thrive in their communities. Another example would be tribes in Africa, their names escape me at the moment, who had been around for longer than that and still thrive to this day, almost as if they’d missed the news about a global flood.

There are other reasons, too many to name and not enough time to list them and explain them all, but this is the gist of it.

Another thing, the videos above me have been proven as hoaxes. The one found in Turkey was proven to be nothing more than a natural, geological structure, and that there is no evidence that the beams that are located inside the structure housed any animals.
 
Tribes in Africa don't have internet. They're busy living their lives. And the Aborigines moving to Australia around 50,000 yrs ago. On who's say-so // evolutionists?

According to Scripture the pre-flood earth was pretty much flat. There were no mountains / oceans. There Were fountains of the deep / springs of water underground. We dig wells for water frequently. So - when God caused the world-wide flood -- it rained continually for 40 days and then the undergroud springs came up. The earth was literally turned inside out. We Now have Grand Canyon State Park and vast oceans// deep sea divers talk about the under water world of sea animals.

In the very beginning -- the land Was watered from underground. That's where the water was.

And it Has been asked -- where did all the flood waters disappear to. Obviously they Didn't. We have areas of ocean that are Miles deep. All that flood water never had to evaporate. And we have the Atlantic, Pacific , Indian oceans. The Gulf of Mexico. And the North and South poles. Frozen water. The situation with global warming. It Isn't, but there's a lot of ice up there.
 
Tribes in Africa don't have internet. They're busy living their lives. And the Aborigines moving to Australia around 50,000 yrs ago. On who's say-so // evolutionists?

According to Scripture the pre-flood earth was pretty much flat. There were no mountains / oceans. There Were fountains of the deep / springs of water underground. We dig wells for water frequently. So - when God caused the world-wide flood -- it rained continually for 40 days and then the undergroud springs came up. The earth was literally turned inside out. We Now have Grand Canyon State Park and vast oceans// deep sea divers talk about the under water world of sea animals.

In the very beginning -- the land Was watered from underground. That's where the water was.

And it Has been asked -- where did all the flood waters disappear to. Obviously they Didn't. We have areas of ocean that are Miles deep. All that flood water never had to evaporate. And we have the Atlantic, Pacific , Indian oceans. The Gulf of Mexico. And the North and South poles. Frozen water. The situation with global warming. It Isn't, but there's a lot of ice up there.

And the Aborigines moving to Australia around 50,000 yrs ago. On who's say-so // evolutionists?
No, geneticists, and I don't think tribes in Africa and their internet connection have anything to do with them missing the global flood. Not only that, but tribes in Africa do have internet. Africa is actually a lot more civilized than you think.
And the pre-flood world wasn't flat. Genesis 7:19 says, "They rose greatly on the earth, and all the high mountains under the entire heavens were covered." So there were mountains, and Paleoceanography tells us that the oceans are about 4 billion years old. And even if the ocean water did come from under the ground, like I said in my above post, the water would've been boiling hot as it was sitting under the earth's crust, so it would've let out so much steam when the ground bursted open that it would've made life on earth inhabitable. The grand canyon shows layers in the walls that could've only been made throughout hundreds and thousands of years of water erosion.
 
Going to Genesis 7:19 -20 And the waters prevailed exceedingly on the earth, and all the high hills under the whole heaven were covered; vs 20 The waters prevailed fifteen cubits upward, and the mountains were covered." NKJV

A cubit = approx 19-20 inches. The length between a persons elbow and longest finger. Which comes out to approx 29.5 feet. Which makes their high hills approx. 29.5 ft high.

The earth / heavens were created with age so that when Adam and Eve were here as the 1st human beings, they could produce children themselves. They could live on the land -- a perfect world was provided for them and for us. That is what those 1st few chapters in Genesis tell us.

Adam and Eve did not have parents.

Nothing in this world is 4 billion years old. Human beings can't be traced that far back.

Water we have Now from underground aquaducts are not boiling hot. There are spas that are warm water.

Or those layers in the walls of the grand canyon COULD have come as a result of the grounding up of the earth during the world-wide flood.

This thread is assuming that there was indeed a Noah's flood and ark.

But say -- for the sake of discussion -- that evolution is right. And there was no flood. IF God did Not create everything. Logically speaking nothing would be 'here'. No need For anything. So - why and how Are we here. Obviously we Are. and this world does exist. But Why? For what purpose? I would suggest that it's because of exactly what the Bible says. "In the beginning... God created....." And we learn the how and when. And everything leads up To the flood.
 
A cubit = approx 19-20 inches. The length between a persons elbow and longest finger. Which comes out to approx 29.5 feet. Which makes their high hills approx. 29.5 ft high.

Gen 7:19; The water prevailed more and more upon the earth, so that all the high mountains everywhere under the heavens were covered.
Gen 7:20; The water prevailed fifteen cubits higher, and the mountains were covered.

The way I read this, the hills could have been any height, even thousands of feet tall. The water covered them, and then went fifteen cubits higher.
 
I was just looking at a KJV which uses both high hills And mountains being covered by 15 cubits high of water. My NKJ uses just the term 'high hills'.

The mountains we see Now are extremely high, yes. So, yes, we Could picture those mountains As being that tall cause that's what We are used to seeing.

But the Main point is that there was a huge amount of water needed To cover that heighth. And the remaining water has been our huge , very deep oceans.

And the Bigger point is that God Caused that flood situation because of the excessive wickedness of the people His chose to create. We can look back and read about it -- mankind Does have the propensity for very Good and very Bad. And the very Bad, we've seen throughout history can be very, Very evil.

God's Word says it Did happen so yes, it Did.
 
What are now mountain's height and the depths of the ocean are not the same as prior flood, many earthquakes have shifted the plates during the flood and after to bring about what we have today. And our tectonic plates although much more stable now, are soon to be shaken again, and the high places will be made low and the whole earth will have less differences from the highest to the lowest. And the mountain in Jerusalem shall be the highest on the earth.
 
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