True Prophets vs False Prophets (Can a true prophet of God be wrong?)

[Jesus_is_LORD]

This topic clearly has political connections, but I'm not focusing on the politics for the sake of this discussion.
More on the theological aspect.

So the questions is:

Can a true prophet of God be wrong?

I ask because I was reading ( news Christian source)where someone said that certain individuals were false prophets because
what they prophesize was wrong (did not come to past as they predicted.

The person responded to defend themselves by saying "a true prophet of God can be wrong."
The other person countered, "If a true prophet can be wrong, then how is one to distinguish between
true and false prophets if not from the truth of their statements?"

Just asking, not holding to a particular position, just trying to learn.
Thanks.

 

[Jesus_is_LORD]

If a true prophet of God can be wrong: we would ask why was He wrong?

(1) He didn't clearly hear from God?
(2) He heard from God but added to it?
(3) He had sin in his life which clouded his understanding of the prophecy?
(4) He heard from God but chose to lie?
(5) God changed God's mind?

The only reasonable answer for me would be number #5 (God changed God's mind). Add to my list so
I can better understand please.

If it is anything from #1 thru #4, one should not be listening to such a prophet anyway.

When I think about God changing God's mind, I think about Jonah.
Jonah(a prophet) told the people
"Jonah began by going a day's journey into the city, proclaiming, "Forty more days and Nineveh will be overthrown.""
Jonah 3:5

Jonah didn't say, Repent or else God will overthrow the city. Jonah said, in Forty days IT WILL be overthrown.
A condition wasn't given. Which is why (if you know the story) Jonah was upset when destruction did not come.
It was spoken as if this would happen. Read for yourself.

But we all know the story (I hope), the people repented and God did not do what he told Jonah:

-----
"Go to the great city of Nineveh and preach against it, because its wickedness has come up before me." Jonah 1:2

---" Then the word of the LORD came to Jonah a second time: " "Go to the great city of Nineveh and proclaim to it the message I give you." - Jonah 3:1

-----
I could see someone at that time looking at Jonah and saying, he is a false prophet because what he said "Forty more days and Nineveh will be overthrown."
did not come to past.

So how are we as believers to address this issue?

 

[Dave M]

I

All the "prophets" exposed themselves in this last election. IMO they may of meant well, they may of been sincere, but this is God we are talking about, they are misleading people. Exactly what all the false prophets did in the ot they told the people what they wanted to here, the thing is most of the real prophets of the OT told people what they did not want to here and were mostly not very popular.

I know of one street preacher who predicted the correct outcome, and when he did he was humble about it, and said it was not a audio voice but a inner voice of GOd. He said he would repent and stop youtubing if he was wrong,,,,,,,,,but he mainly was saying this in order that people start getting closer to God, and stop making idols ,,,, He is the only preacher I see preaching repentance all the time also. He wear sack cloth and ashes sometimes, and talks about the dark times we are headed for here in the usa.

Deuteronomy 18:20-22
But the prophet who presumes to speak a word in my name that I have not commanded him to speak, or who speaks in the name of other gods, that same prophet shall die.’ And if you say in your heart, ‘How may we know the word that the Lord has not spoken?’— when a prophet speaks in the name of the Lord, if the word does not come to pass or come true, that is a word that the Lord has not spoken; the prophet has spoken it presumptuously. You need not be afraid of him.

 

[B-A-C]

Deut 13:1; "If a prophet or a dreamer of dreams arises among you and gives you a sign or a wonder,
Deut 13:2; and the sign or the wonder comes true, concerning which he spoke to you, saying, 'Let us go after other gods (whom you have not known) and let us serve them,'
Deut 13:3; you shall not listen to the words of that prophet or that dreamer of dreams; for the LORD your God is testing you to find out if you love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul.
Deut 13:4; "You shall follow the LORD your God and fear Him; and you shall keep His commandments, listen to His voice, serve Him, and cling to Him.
Deut 13:5; "But that prophet or that dreamer of dreams shall be put to death, because he has counseled rebellion against the LORD your God who brought you from the land of Egypt and redeemed you from the house of slavery, to seduce you from the way in which the LORD your God commanded you to walk. So you shall purge the evil from among you.

Deut 18:18; 'I will raise up a prophet from among their countrymen like you, and I will put My words in his mouth, and he shall speak to them all that I command him.
Deut 18:19; 'It shall come about that whoever will not listen to My words which he shall speak in My name, I Myself will require it of him.
Deut 18:20; 'But the prophet who speaks a word presumptuously in My name which I have not commanded him to speak, or which he speaks in the name of other gods, that prophet shall die.'
Deut 18:21; "You may say in your heart, 'How will we know the word which the LORD has not spoken?'
Deut 18:22; "When a prophet speaks in the name of the LORD, if the thing does not come about or come true, that is the thing which the LORD has not spoken. The prophet has spoken it presumptuously; you shall not be afraid of him.

Jer 23:28; "The prophet who has a dream may relate his dream, but let him who has My word speak My word in truth. What does straw have in common with grain?" declares the LORD.
Jer 23:29; "Is not My word like fire?" declares the LORD, "and like a hammer which shatters a rock?
Jer 23:30; "Therefore behold, I am against the prophets," declares the LORD, "who steal My words from each other.
Jer 23:31; "Behold, I am against the prophets," declares the LORD, "who use their tongues and declare, 'The Lord declares.'
Jer 23:32; "Behold, I am against those who have prophesied false dreams," declares the LORD, "and related them and led My people astray by their falsehoods and reckless boasting; yet I did not send them or command them, nor do they furnish this people the slightest benefit," declares the LORD.
Jer 23:33; "Now when this people or the prophet or a priest asks you saying, 'What is the oracle of the LORD?' then you shall say to them, 'What oracle?' The LORD declares, 'I will abandon you.'
Jer 23:34; "Then as for the prophet or the priest or the people who say, 'The oracle of the LORD,' I will bring punishment upon that man and his household.

 

[Jesus_is_LORD]

Thanks @Dave M and @B-A-C

 

[Brad Huber]

Well, first of all, a prophet is simply someone who gets a "message" from God in some form, and shares it with others, and the message usually has some meaning for 1 or more people. If someone who "has" received msgs from God and then says something that came from himself and not God, that doesnt make him/her a false prophet. If I say Trump will win, notice I didnt say God told me Trump will win. Plus perhaps (only perhaps)Trump did legally win, but until the fraud becomes clear, the cheater who lost will take the presidency "even though" trump won. Dont make the mistake of assuming evil of someone who has had received a clear msg from God before, or you might well suffer the harm God bestows on those who wrong his prophets. I have seen it before. Its not a pretty thing. If someone is "looking" for wrong in other peoples lives, they will find it, even if its not there.

 

[Jesus_is_LORD]

Dont make the mistake of assuming evil of someone who has had received a clear msg from God before, or you might well suffer the harm God bestows on those who wrong his prophets. I have seen it before. Its not a pretty thing. If someone is "looking" for wrong in other peoples lives, they will find it, even if its not there.

Thanks for contributing to the discussion.

You state don't make the mistake of assuming evil. I'm not assuming anything my brother, which is why I'm asking questions to learn.
Someone could say the same thing you are saying in the opposite direction. "Don't make the mistake of assuming God is speaking
when God has not spoken to that person or you will be led astray, like various cults". So it clearly goes both ways with not assuming.

We can't assume just because someone said "God told me..." that they are speaking from God. We are told to test every spirit, and most
mature Christians I've met would agree that we need to test every spirit.

So the point of my discussion is not to put down any prophet of God, but to discuss how to recognize a true prophet and by what standard .
As we all know, when a prophet of God speaks there is not a bell that rings from heaven that signals this a true prophet. Similarly when
someone lies to you in life, there is not a magic rainbow that comes in the clouds that signals this is a lie. We use reason, we pray, we consider
the source, etc, etc.

So please add in the area of how you make that distinction brother; if you don't have a history of believing someone to be a prophet of God
and you hear a message. How do you distinguish for yourself if that word is from God. Some might say they ignore it if they don't know the
person, but if that is the case, then isn't the person guilty of assuming that person is not a prophet from God. And if they just believe it, aren't
the at risk of assuming that person is a prophet and being led astray by any word that comes their way?

So what I'm looking for is a process by which believers such as yourself and others make that distinction. Because I believe no one on here just believes
whatever someone says, or totally rejects everything people says. There has to be some type of process, standard, etc. Please explain yours.

My purpose is to examine the process laid out by each person and learn for myself. Thanks

 

[Reba1]

Having quoted passages or verse to others believing those were the verse God laid on my heart to share is not the same thing as declaring, using King James jargon , Thus saith the Lord. I can quote here 2Ch_7:14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land. This is quote from God it is in His Word i am not proclaiming anything other then what His Word already says. Although some folks will say quoting the word is prophesying i do not think that is the type of prophetic word we are speaking of in this thread. This is an example of heresy claiming to speak for God.

.

 

[Jesus_is_LORD]

Having quoted passages or verse to others believing those were the verse God laid on my heart to share is not the same thing as declaring, using King James jargon , Thus saith the Lord. I can quote here 2Ch_7:14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land. This is quote from God it is in His Word i am not proclaiming anything other then what His Word already says. Although some folks will say quoting the word is prophesying i do not think that is the type of prophetic word we are speaking of in this thread. This is an example of heresy claiming to speak for God.

.

Wow (reacting to the video)

 

[Brad Huber]

Thanks for contributing to the discussion.

My purpose is to examine the process laid out by each person and learn for myself. Thanks

Its an open forum, so it was open to discussion. I get worried when people are eager to call others false prophets without really "truly" checking out what was said, and truly what actions occured. Its better IMO to simply say, "I'm not so sure thats a prophecy from God" versus, they are probably false prophets because such and such a reason.

 

[Admon Mikha'el]

This topic clearly has political connections, but I'm not focusing on the politics for the sake of this discussion.
More on the theological aspect.

So the questions is:

Can a true prophet of God be wrong?

I ask because I was reading ( news Christian source)where someone said that certain individuals were false prophets because
what they prophesize was wrong (did not come to past as they predicted.

The person responded to defend themselves by saying "a true prophet of God can be wrong."
The other person countered, "If a true prophet can be wrong, then how is one to distinguish between
true and false prophets if not from the truth of their statements?"

Just asking, not holding to a particular position, just trying to learn.
Thanks.

Why are you worried about that? The story is not even finished yet... Just because God doesn't answer the way we want we think He can't handle it. Maybe God is waiting for his people to get off their duff and get to work. PRAYER changes things Whining changes nothing.

 

[Jesus_is_LORD]

Why are you worried about that? The story is not even finished yet... Just because God doesn't answer the way we want we think He can't handle it. Maybe God is waiting for his people to get off their duff and get to work. PRAYER changes things Whining changes nothing.

Who is whining?

 

[Reba1]

This topic clearly has political connections, but I'm not focusing on the politics for the sake of this discussion.
More on the theological aspect.

So the questions is:

Can a true prophet of God be wrong?

I ask because I was reading ( news Christian source)where someone said that certain individuals were false prophets because
what they prophesize was wrong (did not come to past as they predicted.

The person responded to defend themselves by saying "a true prophet of God can be wrong."
The other person countered, "If a true prophet can be wrong, then how is one to distinguish between
true and false prophets if not from the truth of their statements?"

Just asking, not holding to a particular position, just trying to learn.
Thanks.

When a person speaks for God as in Thus saith the Lord. if the statement is false he is not speaking for the Lord. God is not a man that He should lie. I do believe there is a difference between a person making a mistake and someone, as in the above video, using Hollywood tactics for personal gain. Back in the early 70 Wilkerson delivered what he thought could be a prophecy . I remember him stating something to the effect .. " i dont know how much of this is me and how much from the Lord" Wilkerson had class.

 

[Admon Mikha'el]

LOL What a strange world we live in...Say something, anything and somebody is sure to take offense... Does the world revolve around each person? Really. I did not say anything about YOU. My entire post was generic. So why do you take offense? My point is that Christians, generally speaking, are whiners and not winners. The prophesy did not come out the way they wanted so the prophet is automatically false. We need to go to God, find out what HE is doing and never mind the prophet. That prophet did a good job. We just wanted the temporary solution, Trump getting elected, while God is doing a permanent solution....

 

[PloughBoy]

Please do not take this Harsh, in what I am about to say and how I am going to say it. But my "Being" is about to "Explode" as I think about this, and on top of that, the reason has come to mind, even why the feeling of "Explosion". And the "Word" came into my mind:>
King James Bible
"But ye shall receive "power", after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth."

So as i thought of this "the Dynamite" exploded in me! when you "primed" me, concerning the word "Prophet". That drove me into Light speed in mind to here with completion of within a moment of time, it seem.

NASB 1977 ►► God’s Final Word in His Son 1God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways,2in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world. 3And He is the radiance of His glory and the exact representation of His nature, and upholds all things by the word of His power. When He had made purification of sins, He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high; 4having become as much better than the angels, as He has inherited a more excellent name than they. 5For to which of the angels did He ever say, “THOU ART MY SON, TODAY I HAVE BEGOTTEN THEE”?And again, “I WILL BE A FATHER TO HIM AND HE SHALL BE A SON TO ME”? 6And when He again brings the first-born into the world, He says, “AND LET ALL THE ANGELS OF GOD WORSHIP HIM.” 7And of the angels He says, “WHO MAKES HIS ANGELS WINDS, AND HIS MINISTERS A FLAME OF FIRE.” 8But of the Son He says, “THY THRONE, O GOD, IS FOREVER AND EVER, AND THE RIGHTEOUS SCEPTER IS THE SCEPTER OF HIS KINGDOM. 9“THOU HAST LOVED RIGHTEOUSNESS AND HATED LAWLESSNESS; THEREFORE GOD, THY GOD, HATH ANOINTED THEE WITH THE OIL OF GLADNESS ABOVE THY COMPANIONS.” 10And, “THOU, LORD, IN THE BEGINNING DIDST LAY THE FOUNDATION OF THE EARTH, AND THE HEAVENS ARE THE WORKS OF THY HANDS; 11THEY WILL PERISH, BUT THOU REMAINEST; AND THEY ALL WILL BECOME OLD AS A GARMENT, 12AND AS A MANTLE THOU WILT ROLL THEM UP; AS A GARMENT THEY WILL ALSO BE CHANGED. BUT THOU ART THE SAME, AND THY YEARS WILL NOT COME TO AN END.” 13But to which of the angels has He ever said, “SIT AT MY RIGHT HAND, UNTIL I MAKE THINE ENEMIES A FOOTSTOOL FOR THY FEET”? 14Are they not all ministering spirits, sent out to render service for the sake of those who will inherit salvation? Now that "Erupted" in my "BEING"! Today GOD Speaks to us By Jesus Christ! in these last days! It does not take a "Rhodes Scholar" to understand this potion of Scripture but only a "True Child of GOD", who needs a Prophet when you got Jesus! Please do not be mad! For I do understand the english language. and I don;'t need a "Interpreter" or a "translator" or a "Commentary". to understand "The Letter to the Hebrews who have confess "Jesus Christ" as The Messiah. A better sacrifice, a better Covenant, {with a whole lot more benefits]. Shalom.

 

[Jesus_is_LORD]

Its an open forum, so it was open to discussion. I get worried when people are eager to call others false prophets without really "truly" checking out what was said, and truly what actions occured. Its better IMO to simply say, "I'm not so sure thats a prophecy from God" versus, they are probably false prophets because such and such a reason.

Thanks for sharing.
Yea, I'm not calling anyone a false or a true prophet. But I see your emphasis.
Thanks for sharing.

 

[Jesus_is_LORD]

LOL What a strange world we live in...Say something, anything and somebody is sure to take offense... Does the world revolve around each person? Really. I did not say anything about YOU. My entire post was generic. So why do you take offense? My point is that Christians, generally speaking, are whiners and not winners. The prophesy did not come out the way they wanted so the prophet is automatically false. We need to go to God, find out what HE is doing and never mind the prophet. That prophet did a good job. We just wanted the temporary solution, Trump getting elected, while God is doing a permanent solution....

Looks like you made an error on your post. You posted it as if you were quoting me but you were making a statement. So it looks like your post is what I said (take a look above post #14 you will see), however that is your speech not mine. Just a little update FYI.

In response to your statement, I wasn't taking offense I was asking a question to understand.
It seems you are reading some emotion into my post which was not my intention.

I wasn't sure if you were responding to someone who was whinning, or thought I was; so I asked the question, "who is whinning" to better understand what you were talking about and to whom.
Relax. I'm not offended, just trying to understand.

Similar to if I posted and said something like, "People are always angry and so rude" And you replied and asked "Who is rude", to understand if your post came across as rude, etc.
Your post "who is rude" does not only have to be made because you are offended, if can be made simply because you are trying to understand.
Just checking in that is all.

I see you share that you feel Christians in general are whiners, I agree, that can be true in many situations. I think there is ample evidence on this forum to support your claim.
And as I shared, my post is not about Trump specifically, though the scenario brought about the question. I think you assumed that I wanted Trump to win.
That assumption would have been wrong. Which may be leading in your mind to other assumptions as to why I asked the question. I'm just gathering information
and learning how people, Christians, go through that process of determining a true vs a false prophets since you have so many people claiming to hear from God, especially since the elections.

Thanks for sharing your process, much appreciated.

 

[Admon Mikha'el]

Looks like you made an error on your post. You posted it as if you were quoting me but you were making a statement. So it looks like your post is what I said (take a look above post #14 you will see), however that is your speech not mine. Just a little update FYI.

In response to your statement, I wasn't taking offense I was asking a question to understand.
It seems you are reading some emotion into my post which was not my intention.

I wasn't sure if you were responding to someone who was whinning, or thought I was; so I asked the question, "who is whinning" to better understand what you were talking about and to whom.
Relax. I'm not offended, just trying to understand.

Similar to if I posted and said something like, "People are always angry and so rude" And you replied and asked "Who is rude", to understand if your post came across as rude, etc.
Your post "who is rude" does not only have to be made because you are offended, if can be made simply because you are trying to understand.
Just checking in that is all.

I see you share that you feel Christians in general are whiners, I agree, that can be true in many situations. I think there is ample evidence on this forum to support your claim.
And as I shared, my post is not about Trump specifically, though the scenario brought about the question. I think you assumed that I wanted Trump to win.
That assumption would have been wrong. Which may be leading in your mind to other assumptions as to why I asked the question. I'm just gathering information
and learning how people, Christians, go through that process of determining a true vs a false prophets since you have so many people claiming to hear from God, especially since the elections.

Thanks for sharing your process, much appreciated.

In truth I would be surprised if I did not make a mistake somewhere.... I have dementia and things are getting more and more difficult...Where I used to type at around seventy wpm a month ago with no mistakes, in the time it took me to write this sentence I had to correct about twenty typos. I have to admit too that it's harder and harder for me to take offense because as time progresses I feel less and less emotion....Frustration anger and depression are what I feel most often but I can still recognize that there is seldom a cause for it.

 

[Reba1]

hang in there @Admon Mikha'el

 

[Jesus_is_LORD]

In truth I would be surprised if I did not make a mistake somewhere.... I have dementia and things are getting more and more difficult...Where I used to type at around seventy wpm a month ago with no mistakes, in the time it took me to write this sentence I had to correct about twenty typos. I have to admit too that it's harder and harder for me to take offense because as time progresses I feel less and less emotion....Frustration anger and depression are what I feel most often but I can still recognize that there is seldom a cause for it.

Sorry to hear that you are dealing with dementia.

I don't have dementia, as I'm 38, but I notice that because I type so fast or seem to be in a rush, I often have tons of typos. It can be embarrassing. I go back over my post
and I'm reading it, and I'm like, who wrote, this . I see words there that I did not tell my brain to type. I've caught myself doing it before. I'll start typing (just did it now)
and I'm thinking a word, but my fingers type something different. The sentence previously I was trying to type the word "typing" but I put the word "thinking" and had to go
back and erase it. I think I'm thinking faster than I type and expect my fingers to keep up. I need to slow down when I type and proof read better, myself.