Where Do We Go When We Die?

[RJ]

and there is also the second death....

• Yes, if you are a believer, there are two births and one death....physical birth, physical death and then spiritual birth.

• If you are a non-believer, there are one birth and two deaths...physical birth, physical death and spiritual death.

 

[amadeus2]

• Yes, if you are a believer, there are two births and one death....physical birth, physical death and then spiritual birth.

• If you are a non-believer, there are one birth and two deaths...physical birth, physical death and spiritual death.

A person who never has the second birth, will never have the second death as he is already spiritually dead. The second death is for people who were born again, but failed to stay with the Lord to the end.

 

[Chopper]

Luke 23:43 "And he said to him, "Truly, I say to you, today you will be with me in Paradise."

John 14:2 "In my Father's house are many rooms. If it were not so, would I have told you that I go to prepare a place for you?
14:3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and will take you to myself, that where I am you may be also."

I have highlighted Paradise and Fathers house to further my understanding of where we go when we die....The word paradise from "Strong's" is....
paradeisos
par-ad'-i-sos
Of Oriental origin (compare [H6508]); a park, that is, (specifically) an Eden (place of future happiness, “paradise”): - paradise.

Our Father's house....
οἰκία
oikia
oy-kee'-ah
From G3624; properly residence (abstractly), but usually (concretely) an abode (literally or figuratively); by implication a family (especially domestics): - home, house (-hold).


My thinking is that our Father's house is in Paradise. Paradise must be in Heaven, but where? As I've said before, I believe, our Father's house, and Paradise is in the New Jerusalem.

Lets see where the New Jerusalem has always been, prior to the time it comes down to the new Heaven's and Earth....
Revelation 21:9 "Then came one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls full of the seven last plagues and spoke to me, saying, "Come, I will show you the Bride, the wife of the Lamb."
21:10 And he carried me away in the Spirit to a great, high mountain, and showed me the holy city Jerusalem coming down out of heaven from God,"

So, the Holy City, the New Jerusalem was in Heaven with God, or should I say, the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, the Godhead. I maintain that this place called the "Holy City Jerusalem" has always been where the Godhead (YHWH or Elohim) has always operated. It's called the Father's House. In this Holy City, there is a Temple with the Ark of the Covenant. Lets look at....

Hebrews 9:11 "But when Christ appeared as a high priest of the good things that have come, then through the greater and more perfect tent (not made with hands, that is, not of this creation)
9:12 he entered once for all into the holy places, not by means of the blood of goats and calves but by means of his own blood, thus securing an eternal redemption."

Also see....
Revelation 21:2 "And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
21:3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, "Behold, the dwelling place of God is with man. He will dwell with them, and they will be his people, and God himself will be with them as their God."

Did you catch that? "THE DWELLING PLACE OF GOD" is with man.

So, where do we go when we die? All saints, Old Testament and New Testament are presently in the New Jerusalem. My Dear Wife who died of cancer in 1993 is in the New Jerusalem. When I die, I'm going there because that's where the Throne of God is and Jesus the Son of God is seated on His right hand.

So, at the age of 75, I'll probably beat most of you there, I don't know about RJ :laugh:, his looks are deceiving, I wonder how old he is

 

[humblepie]

For the last 40 years of being a Baptist Pastor/Teacher, one question has always topped what I had to answer. Where do we go when we die. Obviously, over the years, I've had to learn more and more so that my teaching would have an element of biblical Truth from the Scriptures as well as my own opinions of what I believe that I've received from the Holy Spirit of Almighty God Who sometimes has favored me with revelation.

First of all, before I start with my findings, I'm curious as to what you good folk have to say about this topic. Scriptures? and thoughts? Lets have fun with this and lets remember that we love each other and any harsh wording against what someone might believe is not good, and should not happen.

But you already think you know, so my thinking can't change your knowing

Unless you stop knowing.

 

[RJ]

The second death is for people who were born again, but failed to stay with the Lord to the end.

Horse Feathers!!! You have nothing to base this untruth on!

• Your first birth is physical from the womb of your Mother
• Your second birth is spiritual by the Holy Spirit. You can only have the second birth, if you have had the first birth. You can only have a second birth in this life or it is too late. If you and , only if, you have the second birth in this life, you spiritually will go to heaven
  
• Your first death is a physical death, like Jesus died a "physical" death. Your physical death is only predicated by your first physical birth.
• You better have a spiritual birth in this life or, when you die your second death, you will spiritually go to Hell, which is termed as dying spiritually! In Christian theology, spiritual death is separation from God. Hell is to be spiritually separated from God for all eternity!

 

[RJ]

So, at the age of 75, I'll probably beat most of you there, I don't know about RJ :laugh:, his looks are deceiving, I wonder how old he is

You know me @Chopper , I say we are already there with your wife and the rest of the Saints, tasting the heavenly gifts but we just do know it yet. BTW, I am just a youngster at 68....who knows, maybe I will realize all this after I go to bed tonight....that wouldn't be so bad!:laugh:
Ephesians 2:6 And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus

 

[amadeus2]

Horse Feathers!!! You have nothing to base this untruth on!

• Your first birth is physical from the womb of your Mother
• Your second birth is spiritual by the Holy Spirit. You can only have the second birth, if you have had the first birth. You can only have a second birth in this life or it is too late. If you and , only if, you have the second birth in this life, you spiritually will go to heaven
  
• Your first death is a physical death, like Jesus died a "physical" death. Your physical death is only predicated by your first physical birth.
• You better have a spiritual birth in this life or, when you die your second death, you will spiritually go to Hell, which is termed as dying spiritually! In Christian theology, spiritual death is separation from God. Hell is to be spiritually separated from God for all eternity!

Nothing?

The second spiritual birth brought us again to the place where the first man Adam was before he sinned. That Adam was born of God, but failed:

"...Adam, which was the son of God." Luke 3:38

God gave man a new opportunity through the sacrifice of Jesus, but as with the first man Adam it was a conditional opportunity or guarantee. All of the power was given for man to make it, but he must walk through the gate to get to the Tree of Life.

The Way to the Tree of Life was initially open to Adam and Eve but before they were able to eat of it they ate from that other forbidden tree. They were immediately dead and the Way to the Life was closed. They were removed from the Garden of Eden and a guard placed on the gate.

It was for them as you put it "separation from God".

The guard, I believe, was the Word of the God [flaming sword of Gen 3:24]. That same sword (Jesus) paid the price so that man could partake of Life, but man first had to pass through the Gate in order to approach that Tree. To join the feast at this Tree this man had to have on the proper garment..

"And when the king came in to see the guests, he saw there a man which had not on a wedding garment:
And he saith unto him, Friend, how camest thou in hither not having a wedding garment? And he was speechless.
Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth." Matt 22:11-13

What garment was needed?

"Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.
Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness;
And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace;
Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked.
And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God." Eph 6:13-17

[We need to take up Jesus, the flaming sword at the gate in order to continue our journey successfully.] Jesus paid the price to open the gate and he also was the Gate or Door through we enter in...[I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture." John 10:9]

It is all in him!

The man had the right invitation and he arrived without the proper attire. [Who says it makes no difference how we are dressed when we attend on the Lord?] and then to his great surprise he was bound and cast out into darkness. For him it was the second death.

 

[Christ4Ever]

My thinking is that our Father's house is in Paradise. Paradise must be in Heaven, but where? As I've said before, I believe, our Father's house, and Paradise is in the New Jerusalem.

Lets see where the New Jerusalem has always been, prior to the time it comes down to the new Heaven's and Earth....

Hello Brother Chopper!!!!

Great thread.

I can agree with your assessment. Heaven currently contains Paradise so it existed prior to our mansions...

And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise. Luke 23:43

and the mansions that our Lord built starting to build after His Ascension

In my Father's house are many mansions: if [it were] not [so], I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. John 14:2

would be in New Jerusalem.

And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife. 10 And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God, Revelation 21:9-10

Confirming verses including the ones above, that Paradise is in New Jerusalem which is in Heaven.

[Rev 2:7 KJV] 7 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God.

[Rev 22:2, 14 KJV] 2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, [was there] the tree of life, which bare twelve [manner of] fruits, [and] yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree [were] for the healing of the nations. ... 14 Blessed [are] they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

So where will be after we die?

In the flesh? Worm food.

In the spirit?

[Col 2:5 KJV] 5 For though I be absent in the flesh, yet am I with you in the spirit, joying and beholding your order, and the stedfastness of your faith in Christ.

[2Co 5:6, 8-9 KJV] 6 Therefore [we are] always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: ... 8 We are confident, [I say], and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. 9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him.

With the Lord!

I am curious how you will tie it all together!

YBIC
C4E
<><

 

[RJ]

Nothing?

The second spiritual birth brought us again to the place where the first man Adam was before he sinned. That Adam was born of God, but failed:

"...Adam, which was the son of God." Luke 3:38

God gave man a new opportunity through the sacrifice of Jesus, but as with the first man Adam it was a conditional opportunity or guarantee. All of the power was given for man to make it, but he must walk through the gate to get to the Tree of Life.

The Way to the Tree of Life was initially open to Adam and Eve but before they were able to eat of it they ate from that other forbidden tree. They were immediately dead and the Way to the Life was closed. They were removed from the Garden of Eden and a guard placed on the gate.

It was for them as you put it "separation from God".

The guard, I believe, was the Word of the God [flaming sword of Gen 3:24]. That same sword (Jesus) paid the price so that man could partake of Life, but man first had to pass through the Gate in order to approach that Tree. To join the feast at this Tree this man had to have on the proper garment..

"And when the king came in to see the guests, he saw there a man which had not on a wedding garment:
And he saith unto him, Friend, how camest thou in hither not having a wedding garment? And he was speechless.
Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth." Matt 22:11-13

What garment was needed?

"Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.
Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness;
And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace;
Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked.
And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God." Eph 6:13-17

[We need to take up Jesus, the flaming sword at the gate in order to continue our journey successfully.] Jesus paid the price to open the gate and he also was the Gate or Door through we enter in...[I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture." John 10:9]

It is all in him!

The man had the right invitation and he arrived without the proper attire. [Who says it makes no difference how we are dressed when we attend on the Lord?] and then to his great surprise he was bound and cast out into darkness. For him it was the second death.

so!

 

[Ellie]

wow.....

 

[KingJ]

Greetings @KingJ ,

I don't do 'kids' so that one went over my head. Perhaps try again, if you don't mind?

Bless you ....><>

The Sheep and the Goats from Matthew 25:31-46

When the Son of man shall come in His glory, and all the holy angels with Him, then shall He sit upon the throne of His glory: And before Him shall be gathered all nations: and He shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: And He shall set the sheep on His right hand, but the goats on the left.

Then shall the King say unto them on His right hand, Come, ye blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: For I was an hungred, and ye gave Me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave Me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took Me in: Naked, and ye clothed Me: I was sick, and ye visited Me: I was in prison, and ye came unto Me. Then shall the righteous answer Him, saying, Lord, when saw we Thee an hungred, and fed Thee? or thirsty, and gave Thee drink? When saw we Thee a stranger, and took Thee in? or naked, and clothed Thee? Or when saw we Thee sick, or in prison, and came unto Thee? And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these My brethren, ye have done it unto Me.

Then shall He say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from Me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: For I was an hungred, and ye gave Me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave Me no drink: I was a stranger, and ye took Me not in: naked, and ye clothed Me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited Me not. Then shall they also answer Him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee? Then shall He answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to Me. And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

Maybe I miss-understood your first post. You asked ''if we go to heaven and a what the time-frame was''. A few believe we don't go to heaven, but stay on earth. Others believe we go to heaven but only after a while in the ground. So my statement was in response to these assumptions. So the logical / sane argument against this is my example with a kid. The scripture you quoted makes it clear we are talking about two different issues :whistle.

 

[KingJ]

1. Ermmm, scripture does not say hell is a good place. 2. I do not know of any scripture that tells us hell is not a bad place?

1. That's because compared to heaven it's not. Much like earth. Look at these harsh words from God on earth. Imagine the pulpit message on hell if God said this about hell.

Gen 3:16-19 Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee. And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life. Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field. In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.

Gen 3:16-19 is true, but not the full truth exactly. Just as is the case on scripture on hell.

2. You sure? Does scripture saying that God is a good judge / God is love / God is light with no darkness in Him at all / God telling us to love our enemy...not point to God doing better or at least on par with what the Geneva convention proposes for treatment of enemies?

Are we not evidence of it? As Christians / new creations in Him, we long to treat the evil with love. As unsaved we long for eye for an eye / torture.

Anyway, I have a valid question for all who believe in a cruel hell. (Please no Godwins law ). The Germans ran from the east to the west after WW2. They knew in the west they faced the Geneva convention and in the east, cruel and merciless Russians who would not sign the Geneva convention. So....are we to compare our God, with the Russians or the western allies....?

 

[Brother-Paul]

1. That's because compared to heaven it's not. Much like earth. Look at these harsh words from God on earth. Imagine the pulpit message on hell if God said this about hell.

Gen 3:16-19 Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee. And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life. Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field. In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.

Gen 3:16-19 is true, but not the full truth exactly. Just as is the case on scripture on hell.

2. You sure? Does scripture saying that God is a good judge / God is love / God is light with no darkness in Him at all / God telling us to love our enemy...not point to God doing better or at least on par with what the Geneva convention proposes for treatment of enemies?

Are we not evidence of it? As Christians / new creations in Him, we long to treat the evil with love. As unsaved we long for eye for an eye / torture.

Anyway, I have a valid question for all who believe in a cruel hell. (Please no Godwins law ). The Germans ran from the east to the west after WW2. They knew in the west they faced the Geneva convention and in the east, cruel and merciless Russians who would not sign the Geneva convention. So....are we to compare our God, with the Russians or the western allies....?

Dear brother

What is hell?. Hell is the separation from God, it is darkness and despair, no grace, no mercy, no love (agape love). God is Love, God is light, in Him is no darkness.

Where is hell? It starts on earth, here, right now, for none believers.

Where is Heaven? It is on earth, here, right now, for those who are born again.

Our Father in Heaven... Thy Kingdom come, Thy will be done, on earth as it is in Heaven.

Those who walk in darkness, still walk in darkness, they do not understand, cannot comprehend the light. But those who have accepted Jesus into their hearts and are truly born again, the light lives in them. We are to be an example to the world that lives in darkness, ambassadors for Christ, doing the work for God, saving lost souls.

But this is now, the subject of the thread is where do we go when we go when we die.

The body returns to the dust of the earth, the spirit of God within us, believer or none believer, no matter how small returns to God in Heaven. To the current Heaven, Paradise. It was Paradise on earth once, Adam and Eve walked in the garden with God. That was lost with the Fall, when the curse was put on all the earth. But this Paradise will be restored, Jesus will return, the devil will be defeated, we will receive new resurrected bodies and be with God, be with Jesus forever.

When God created the earth and placed Adam and Eve on it, He breathed into them his spirit, the breath of life. That was Paradise.

Although Paradise was lost with the Fall it will be restored, on earth, Jesus will be with His sheep, the goats will not.

Every one has the same choice, God's word is the same yesterday, today, forever, not just a period of time. A period of time is what we live in, what others have lived in, what others will live in, until God commands Jesus to Return.

Thank you Father, thank you Jesus, thank you Holy Spirit.

 

[Brother-Paul]

Luke 23:39-43

39 And one of the malefactors which were hanged railed on him, saying, If thou be Christ, save thyself and us.

40 But the other answering rebuked him, saying, Dost not thou fear God, seeing thou art in the same condemnation?

41 And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss.

42 And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom.

43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, Today shalt thou be with me in paradise.


Only one of the two on the cross at the side of our Lord accepted Jesus, only one was told 'Today shalt thou be with me in paradise'.

Paradise is not 'dust of the earth' that is where the body returns when we die.

God is Spirit, the Spirit of God was in us from birth to last breath.

To be in Paradise is to be with God, to be with our Lord. God is light and in that light we be all born again believers, in Spirit until the Lord returns. But with new resurrected bodies after Christ returns and defeats the devil.

But to enter Heaven, we must accept Jesus, we must repent of our sins, we must be Born Again. The Bible tells us clearly what we must do to go to Heaven, we all have the same chance. This is not being harsh, this is not preaching what happens to none believers, this is the Good News of accepting Jesus and being Born Again. We are told to preach the Truth, Jesus is the Way, the Truth and the Life. We are not to preach what hell is like, God's love is paramount, God is love. But God is creator and judge, His Word is for all mankind, through Himself or through His son.

Some take God's love to the extreme in that He would not do anything to hurt us. God is love we must never forget or mistake that. It is also true that it is His will that not one soul should be lost, but lets not forget, He flooded the whole world because He couldn't find any worshippers of the one true God except Noah and his family. Lets not forget the End Time warnings.

If we are not for Him we are against Him. If we are not in the light, we are in the dark, if we are not saved we are lost. We are commissioned to share the Good News, to make disciples of all nations, to bring people to Christ. God calls us, we do not call Him, we cannot save anyone, but we sow the seeds and water and nurture them through fervent believing prayer.

Peace be with you always.

 

[Ellie]

The body returns to the dust of the earth, the spirit of God within us, believer or none believer, no matter how small returns to God in Heaven. To the current Heaven, Paradise. It was Paradise on earth once, Adam and Eve walked in the garden with God. That was lost with the Fall, when the curse was put on all the earth. But this Paradise will be restored, Jesus will return, the devil will be defeated, we will receive new resurrected bodies and be with God, be with Jesus forever.

When we die the body returns to the earth, the spirit goes to Heaven, it returns back to God. It belongs to God. At this stage a person will get a glimpse of either Heaven or hell, but it is a waiting place before the real thing. Heaven is actually the earth we stand on now. Jesus will RETURN, the devil will be defeated, we will have resurrected bodies. The New Jerusalem will come down from Heaven, God will command Jesus to Return, before man (with satan's help) destroys the earth we now live in. Paradise that once was (before the Fall) will be replaced on the earth God created, Heaven will be on earth, God will be with us as He was with Adam and Eve, Sin will be no more.

Honestly/ humbly asking :
Why would we want, or need, a resurrected body? If God is Spirit, wouldn't we just remain Spirit as well (formed in His image)? Just trying to picture heaven on earth with way more overcrowding than what we have today, if that makes sense.

GBU Brother Paul

 

[RJ]

Honestly/ humbly asking :
Why would we want, or need, a resurrected body? If God is Spirit, wouldn't we just remain Spirit as well (formed in His image)? Just trying to picture heaven on earth with way more overcrowding than what we have today, if that makes sense.

If I may:

• Why would we want, or need, a resurrected body? Good question, primarily because God said we would get one just like Jesus! Think of the possibilities in a perfect realm where nothing is impossible! John 20:26 A week later his disciples were in the house again, and Thomas was with them. Though the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them and said, "Peace be with you!".....how is this possible?.... he just appeared through a locked door?...later scriptures say they touched him, ate and drank with them....How? It is a glorious thing, the resurrected body, apparently transcends the spiritual and physical world! What does this mean to us?....other than this incident, the Bible doesn't give a lot of information about having a resurrected body but, God said we would have one just like Jesus and share all of his inheritance...the possibilities seem boundless!
• If God is Spirit, wouldn't we just remain Spirit as well (formed in His image)? We all know that through God all things are possible. Yes spirit but, as promised, spirit combined with a resurrected, spiritual body suitable for existence in God's spiritual realm!....wow, now that's heaven!

 

[Hekuran]

I have no idea about the overcrowding issue - other than to say that surely God has it in hand

The best place to turn for thinking about resurrection body is 1 Corinthians 15. Here, Paul puts our resurrction at the very centre of Christian hope "For if the dead are not raised, then Christ has not been raised either. And if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins. Then those also who have fallen asleep in Christ are lost."

Interesting to note that when the New Testament writers speak of our eternal hope it is nearly always in terms of the resurrection of the dead and not 'going to heaven'.

 

[Brother-Paul]

This is an excellent thread...

Luke 23:43 "And he said to him, "Truly, I say to you, today you will be with me in Paradise."

John 14:2 "In my Father's house are many rooms. If it were not so, would I have told you that I go to prepare a place for you?
14:3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and will take you to myself, that where I am you may be also."

My thinking is that our Father's house is in Paradise. Paradise must be in Heaven, but where? As I've said before, I believe, our Father's house, and Paradise is in the New Jerusalem.

Lets see where the New Jerusalem has always been, prior to the time it comes down to the new Heaven's and Earth....
Revelation 21:9 "Then came one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls full of the seven last plagues and spoke to me, saying, "Come, I will show you the Bride, the wife of the Lamb."
21:10 And he carried me away in the Spirit to a great, high mountain, and showed me the holy city Jerusalem coming down out of heaven from God,"

So, the Holy City, the New Jerusalem was in Heaven with God, or should I say, the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, the Godhead. I maintain that this place called the "Holy City Jerusalem" has always been where the Godhead (YHWH or Elohim) has always operated. It's called the Father's House. In this Holy City, there is a Temple with the Ark of the Covenant. Lets look at....

I'm in total agreement brother

Revelation 21:2 "And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
21:3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, "Behold, the dwelling place of God is with man. He will dwell with them, and they will be his people, and God himself will be with them as their God."

Did you catch that? "THE DWELLING PLACE OF GOD" is with man.

So, where do we go when we die? All saints, Old Testament and New Testament are presently in the New Jerusalem. My Dear Wife who died of cancer in 1993 is in the New Jerusalem. When I die, I'm going there because that's where the Throne of God is and Jesus the Son of God is seated on His right hand.

God has everything in hand, He always has had.

We are just waiting for the final fulfilment of the prophesies, Jesus is just waiting for the command from the Father to Return and defeat the devil.

It is all coming together faster than we probably realise.

O come Lord Jesus. Amen

[Rev 2:7 KJV] 7 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God.

[Rev 22:2, 14 KJV] 2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, [was there] the tree of life, which bare twelve [manner of] fruits, [and] yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree [were] for the healing of the nations. ... 14 Blessed [are] they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

So where will be after we die?

In the flesh? Worm food.

In the spirit?

[Col 2:5 KJV] 5 For though I be absent in the flesh, yet am I with you in the spirit, joying and beholding your order, and the steadfastness of your faith in Christ.

[2Co 5:6, 8-9 KJV] 6 Therefore [we are] always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: ... 8 We are confident, [I say], and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. 9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him.

If we die prior to Jesus' return, we as Born Again believers will be in the spirit, in the New Jerusalem, in Paradise, in Heaven, in the rooms God has prepared for us. It is not until after Jesus' return and defeat of the devil that we will receive our resurrected bodies, resurrected bodies, we will be like Adam and Eve before the Fall.

It will be truly wonderful but, until we are called home we have work to do, preaching the Good News, (not the bad news), making disciples of all nations, caring for those who are hurting, widows, widowers, disabled and those worse off than us. We are to sharing the Love of God with others to bring Glory to God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

 

[Christ4Ever]

It will be truly wonderful but, until we are called home we have work to do, preaching the Good News, (not the bad news), making disciples of all nations, caring for those who are hurting, widows, widowers, disabled and those worse off than us. We are to sharing the Love of God with others to bring Glory to God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Agreed, but that wasn't the question being asked

 

[Brother-Paul]

Honestly/ humbly asking :
Why would we want, or need, a resurrected body? If God is Spirit, wouldn't we just remain Spirit as well (formed in His image)? Just trying to picture heaven on earth with way more overcrowding than what we have today, if that makes sense.

GBU Brother Paul

Revelation 21:9 "Then came one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls full of the seven last plagues and spoke to me, saying, "Come, I will show you the Bride, the wife of the Lamb."
21:10 And he carried me away in the Spirit to a great, high mountain, and showed me the holy city Jerusalem coming down out of heaven from God'

Hebrews 9:11 "But when Christ appeared as a high priest of the good things that have come, then through the greater and more perfect tent (not made with hands, that is, not of this creation)
9:12 he entered once for all into the holy places, not by means of the blood of goats and calves but by means of his own blood, thus securing an eternal redemption."

Revelation 21:2 "And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
21:3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, "Behold, the dwelling place of God is with man. He will dwell with them, and they will be his people, and God himself will be with them as their God."

Hebrews 12:22 (KJV)
22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,

15 times in Revelation 21 and Revelation 22 the place God and His people live together is called a city.

Revelation 21:19-20 (KJV)
19 And the foundations of the wall of the city were garnished with all manner of precious stones. The first foundation was jasper; the second, sapphire; the third, a chalcedony; the fourth, an emerald;
20 The fifth, sardonyx; the sixth, sardius; the seventh, chrysolite; the eighth, beryl; the ninth, a topaz; the tenth, a chrysoprasus; the eleventh, a jacinth; the twelfth, an amethyst.

The Onyx of Eden and on the high priest's shoulders, representing two places where God dwelled with His people, will be displayed in the Holy City, where God will forever live with His people. Hence the Onyx on the high priest and in the Temple simultaneously points us to our past in Eden and our future on the New earth.

We even know how large the City, the New Jerusalem will be. The city's exact dimensions are measured by an angel and reported as being 12,000 stadia, the equivalent of 1400 miles or 2,200 kilometres, in length, width and height.

Revelation 21:15 (KJV)
15 And he that talked with me had a golden reed to measure the city, and the gates thereof, and the wall thereof.

Even thought these proportions may have symbolic importance, this does not mean they cannot be literal. In fact, Scripture emphasizes that the dimensions are given in 'man's measurements'

Revelation 21:17 (KJV)
17 And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, that is, of the angel.

If you were happy to think you would go to Heaven and be a spirit, how excited you must be to find out what Heaven will be like and that you will have a new resurrected body. You will be able to look for Mose, Abraham, Isaac, David, the disciples, your family, you will meet some people you knew that you may have thought was lost, sadly you may not see some you thought was saved.

The New Jerusalem will come down out of Heaven, scripture talks of a new Heaven and a new Earth, they will be resurrected. The earth we live in will be restored, Jesus will have returned to restore all things new, there will be no more sin, no more crying, no more weeping, no more pain.

It will be a beautiful place and we will be there for Eternity

If I may:

• Why would we want, or need, a resurrected body? Good question, primarily because God said we would get one just like Jesus! Think of the possibilities in a perfect realm where nothing is impossible! John 20:26 A week later his disciples were in the house again, and Thomas was with them. Though the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them and said, "Peace be with you!".....how is this possible?.... he just appeared through a locked door?...later scriptures say they touched him, ate and drank with them....How? It is a glorious thing, the resurrected body, apparently transcends the spiritual and physical world! What does this mean to us?....other than this incident, the Bible doesn't give a lot of information about having a resurrected body but, God said we would have one just like Jesus and share all of his inheritance...the possibilities seem boundless!
• If God is Spirit, wouldn't we just remain Spirit as well (formed in His image)? We all know that through God all things are possible. Yes spirit but, as promised, spirit combined with a resurrected, spiritual body suitable for existence in God's spiritual realm!....wow, now that's heaven!

You may RJ anytime, many thanks for your help. Bless you.


Dear sister, to many people think, and are taught, that when you go to Heaven you will be a spirit and will be sat on a cloud strumming a harp. I have spoken with people who think this, one minister said, if that is what Heaven is like, I don't want to go, it must be really boring. How sad that was to hear.

Forget it Ellie, Heaven will be a beautiful place, no sin, no evil, we will be with Jesus, God with us. Just as He walked in the garden with Adam and Eve.

Don't think for a minute earth will be over crowded, God has planned every last detail, He knows who will be there, He knows how many will be there. All we have to do is make sure we know we will be there. That our name will be in the Lambs Book of Life.

Please read my previous post regarding being in the spirit and when we will receive our new resurrected bodies.

Please read all the posts in the thread there is a lot of good information from some wonderful brothers and sisters in Christ. God Bless you Ellie, Jesus loves you we do too.

Thank you Chopper, thank you RJ, thank you Christ4Ever, thank you Lord.