Will The Holy Spirit Ever leave A Believer

[RJ]

Simply put, no, the Holy Spirit will never leave a true believer. You can't "fall away" to apostasy from a God like this!
This is revealed in many different passages in the New Testament. For example, Romans 8:9 tells us, “…if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ.” This verse very clearly states that if someone does not have the indwelling presence of the Holy Spirit, then that person is not saved. Therefore, if the Holy Spirit were to leave a believer, that person would have lost the saving relationship with Christ. Yet this is contrary to what the Bible teaches about the eternal security of Christians. Another verse that speaks to the permanence of the Holy Spirit’s indwelling presence in the life of believers is John 14:16. Here Jesus states that the Father will give another Helper “to be with you forever.”

The fact that the Holy Spirit will never leave a believer is also seen in Ephesians 1: 13-14 where believers are said to be “sealed” with the Holy Spirit, “who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God's possession—to the praise of his glory.” The picture of being sealed with the Spirit is one of ownership and possession. God has promised eternal life to all who believe in Christ, and as a guarantee that He will keep His promise, He has sent the Holy Spirit to indwell the believer until the day of redemption. Similar to making a down payment on a car or a house, God has provided all believers with a down payment on their future relationship with Him by sending the Holy Spirit to indwell them. The fact that all believers are sealed with the Spirit is also seen in 2 Corinthians 1: 22 and Ephesians 4:30 .

Prior to Christ’s death, resurrection, and ascension into heaven, the Holy Spirit had a “come and go” relationship with people. The Holy Spirit indwelt King Saul, but then departed from him 1 Samuel 16: 14. Instead, the Spirit came upon David 1 Samuel 16:13. After his adultery with Bathsheba, David feared that the Holy Spirit would be taken from him Psalm 51: 11. The Holy Spirit filled Bezalel to enable him to produce the items needed for the tabernacle Exodus 31: 2-5, but this is not described as a permanent relationship. All of this changed after Jesus’ ascension into heaven. Beginning on the day of Pentecost, the Holy Spirit began permanently indwelling believers Acts 2. The permanent indwelling of the Holy Spirit is the fulfillment of God’s promise to always be with us and never forsake us.

While the Holy Spirit will never leave a believer, it is possible for our sin to “quench the Holy Spirit” 1 Thessalonians 5: 19 or “grieve the Holy Spirit” Ephesians 4: 30. Sin always has consequences in our relationship with God. While our relationship with God is secure in Christ, unconfessed sin in our lives can hinder our fellowship with God and effectively quench the Holy Spirit’s working in our lives. That is why it is so important to confess our sins because God is “faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness” 1 John 1: 9. So, while the Holy Spirit will never leave us, the benefits and joy of His presence can in fact depart from us.

 

[Esperanza]

I have had this question for a long time because my relationship with God is not at all where I would like it to be. It seems like I just cant get back on track.

 

[RJ]

I have had this question for a long time because my relationship with God is not at all where I would like it to be. It seems like I just cant get back on track.

What is your question?...whether God would leave you or not?

 

[Esperanza]

My question was if God would leave me( a true believer) because it felt like he wasn't there

 

[RJ]

My question was if God would leave me( a true believer) because it felt like he wasn't there

• Is God perfect?
• Can God make mistakes?

 

[RJ]

• Is God perfect?
• Can God make mistakes?

Anyway, welcome to TJ, I hope you enjoy your stay!

 

[B-A-C]

I don't think God ever leaves us. He said He would never leave or forsake us. However we can leave Him if we want to bad enough.
It doesn't have anything to do about whether God is perfect or makes mistakes. We aren't perfect and we make mistakes all the time.
God allows to make mistakes everyday.

Heb 6:4; For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit,
Heb 6:5; and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come,
Heb 6:6; and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame.

The Bible says there are those who have had the Holy Spirit, and then have fallen away.

 

[RJ]

I don't think God ever leaves us. He said He would never leave or forsake us.

So you must believe in OSAS

The Bible says there are those who have had the Holy Spirit, and then have fallen away

No, it says it is impossible for them to fall away once saved. Fall away here would mean all out apostasy or rejection of God, doesn't say anything about someone pulling or drifting away.

 

[B-A-C]

So you must believe in OSAS

No, it says it is impossible for them to fall away once saved. Fall away here would mean all out apostasy or rejection of God, doesn't say anything about someone pulling or drifting away.

Heb 6:4 For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit,
Heb 6:5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come,
Heb 6:6 and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame.

It doesn't say it is impossible for them fall away, it says if they do fall away it is impossible to renew them to repentance.

 

[Travis]

Heb 6:4 For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit,
Heb 6:5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come,
Heb 6:6 and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame.

It doesn't say it is impossible for them fall away, it says if they do fall away it is impossible to renew them to repentance.

I can't help myself,

Impossible for whom? Impossible for God to renew them again to repentance? Don't the scriptures say:

Mark 10
27 And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men [it is] impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.​

How can anything be impossible for God?

Travis

 

[Stickz]

God cannot lie either. How is it possible for God to not be able to do something?

 

[Stickz]

God could just save everybody that has ever lived and take everyone to Heaven. God could have not allowed people to be born into the earth, and made them perfect, so that no one ever became a sinner that needed to be punished, but He didn't. He done it all for a reason. Many of you seem to believe that your perfection will only take place after this life, so why doesn't God just take everyone: Charles Manson, Jeffrey Dahmer, Ted Bundy, Hitler, and perfect them and put them into Heaven when He does you? Oh, wait, He can't right? Why? Can't God do whatever He wants? Would that be something impossible for God?

 

[Travis]

Many of you seem to believe that your perfection will only take place after this life

Well, you are right in that I do believe this.

What do you believe?

 

[Stickz]

Why should I answer anymore questions? You people have taken classes, or something, on dodging questions. I've been on this site on and off for a few years now and you can never really get a straight answer out of many of you, especially those of you that believe in OSAS, but you want straight answers. I don't owe you anything, Travis.

 

[Travis]

Why should I answer anymore questions? You people have taken classes, or something, on dodging questions. I've been on this site on and off for a few years now and you can never really get a straight answer out of many of you, especially those of you that believe in OSAS, but you want straight answers. I don't owe you anything, Travis.

Hey, uh I don't really have any hard feelings toward you. I'm not interested in fighting. What you said about perfection did leave me puzzled though. I would at least be interested to hear what you have to say.

Glad that you have stuck around the forum Stickz. We may not always agree on everything, but it is good to be around brothers and sisters in Christ.

Blessings,

Travis

 

[Chad]

Why should I answer anymore questions? You people have taken classes, or something, on dodging questions. I've been on this site on and off for a few years now and you can never really get a straight answer out of many of you, especially those of you that believe in OSAS, but you want straight answers. I don't owe you anything, Travis.

There's a better way to reply to people. Here's an idea, talk to them as if you were both speaking to each other in person and remembering that GOD knows your hearts, your thoughts and hears everything. No one said you "owe" them anything, nor is it polite to sarcastically say they've taken classes in dodging questions.

My question was if God would leave me( a true believer) because it felt like he wasn't there

Please check this out. They may bless you and help you.

Scared, Confused and angry | Talk Jesus

God could just save everybody that has ever lived and take everyone to Heaven. God could have not allowed people to be born into the earth, and made them perfect, so that no one ever became a sinner that needed to be punished, but He didn't. He done it all for a reason. Many of you seem to believe that your perfection will only take place after this life, so why doesn't God just take everyone: Charles Manson, Jeffrey Dahmer, Ted Bundy, Hitler, and perfect them and put them into Heaven when He does you? Oh, wait, He can't right? Why? Can't God do whatever He wants? Would that be something impossible for God?

This is all over the place and mostly incorrect. GOD cannot contradict His Word. He will not allow sin in Heaven and no one who is not born-again will enter Heaven. This "GOD can do anything" has boundaries.

1. God cannot tempt nor be tempted : James 1:13
2. God cannot sin : Habakkuk 1:13
3. God cannot lie : Heb.6:18
4. God cannot contradict His word.
5. He cannot deny Himself : 2 Tim. 2:13

Where's your verse to show that we'll be made perfect on earth in a sinful, flesh body? No where does the Bible state that. If you're going to make any biblical claims, back it up with Scripture.

The Attributes of God | Talk Jesus

 

[RJ]

It doesn't say it is impossible for them fall away, it says if they do fall away it is impossible to renew them to repentance.

Brother, I know how you feel because we have gone over this point on many an occasion.
They are essentially the same thing!
It is impossible to fall away because it is impossible to renew them to repentance:

• Jesus died once and for all
• If they were truly saved what sacrifice is their to bring them back to salvation if they fall away to apostasy again.
• Apostasy is the key.
• You are saved right? Christ is in you right? Not to mention that God said he would never leave you, would you ever go back to Apostasy?..Yes, Yes, and No!
• it is impossible to renew them to repentance This is another thing you keep bringing up! But does it really fit into the way of God. Please stop and think about this for a minute. Is God really saying that people can't come to repentance? No, of course not, Christ died for all But what he is saying is that it is impossible to renew a person to repentance. True repentance at the time of salvation is a one time thing.
• There is no such thing as true first time repentance / salvation turn back to apostasy, then repent and repeat and repeat.
• Once you are saved that is it! That is why Hebrews says it is impossible to renew them to repentance because that would require Christ to be crucified again and we know that is not happening!

 

[Travis]

Brother, I know how you fell because we have gone over this point on many an occasion.
They are essentially the same thing!
It is impossible to fall away because it is impossible to renew them to repentance:

• Jesus died once and for all
• If they were truly saved what sacrifice is their to bring them back to salvation if they fall away to apostasy again.
• Apostasy is the key.
• You are saved right? Christ is in you right? Not to mention that God said he would never leave you, would you ever go back to Apostasy?..Yes, Yes, and No!
• it is impossible to renew them to repentance This is another thing you keep bringing up! But does it really fit into the way of God. Please stop and think about this for a minute. Is God really saying that people can't come to repentance? No, of course not, Christ died for all But what he is saying is that it is impossible to renew a person to repentance. True repentance at the time of salvation is a one time thing.
• There is no such thing as true first time repentance / salvation turn back to apostasy, then repent and repeat and repeat.
• Once you are saved that is it! That is why Hebrews says it is impossible to renew them to repentance because that would require Christ to be crucified again and we know that is not happening!

Hey RJ,

You might consider rethinking that interpretation of these verses. I'm not so sure that a plain reading of this text is saying exactly that. I mean, I've never been to seminary or anything, but idk.... I'm just not so sure that's what it is getting at exactly.

Any who, blessings to you,

Travis

 

[B-A-C]

Hey RJ,

You might consider rethinking that interpretation of these verses. I'm not so sure that a plain reading of this text is saying exactly that. I mean, I've never been to seminary or anything, but idk.... I'm just not so sure that's what it is getting at exactly.

Any who, blessings to you,

Travis

This is similar to a few other verses as well.

Heb 10:29; How much severer punishment do you think he will deserve who has trampled under foot the Son of God, and has regarded as unclean the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has insulted the Spirit of grace?
Heb 10:30; For we know Him who said, "VENGEANCE IS MINE, I WILL REPAY." And again, "THE LORD WILL JUDGE HIS PEOPLE."

It seems people can trample the blood of the covenant after they have been sanctified by it.
ἁγιάζω
hagiazō
hag-ee-ad'-zo
From G40; to make holy, that is, (ceremonially) purify or consecrate; (mentally) to venerate: - hallow, be holy, sanctify.

Sanctified can mean set apart, but the word used Heb 10:29; is "hagiazo" as in been made Holy, cleansed or purified. Also in this case they are particularly sanctified by the blood.
Can a non-believer made Holy "by the blood". Can they be purified without the blood?

2 Pet 2:20; For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world by the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and are overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first.
2 Pet 2:21; For it would be better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn away from the holy commandment handed on to them.
2 Pet 2:22; It has happened to them according to the true proverb, "A DOG RETURNS TO ITS OWN VOMIT," and, "A sow, after washing, returns to wallowing in the mire."

People can return to the defilement of the word after they have escaped it by the knowledge of Jesus.

Rev 3:5; 'He who overcomes will thus be clothed in white garments; and I will not erase his name from the book of life, and I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels.

It seems some names can be erased from the BOL.

Luke 8:13; "Those on the rocky soil are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no firm root; they believe for a while, and in time of temptation fall away.

Some believe "for a while" and then fall away. Notice it doesn't say they have no root at all. It says no "firm" root.

1 Tim 4:1; But the Spirit explicitly says that in later times some will fall away from the faith, paying attention to deceitful spirits and doctrines of demons,

It takes quite a bit of word wrangling to make these verses mean anything other than what they plainly say.

 

[Travis]

It takes quite a bit of word wrangling to make these verses mean anything other than what they plainly say.

Mmmm, I'm too tired to argue right now.

Question for you though. If one of your children, who you knew was most definitely a believer, came up to you and was struggling with some things, and was distraught and worried about whether they were going to really be saved and taken in by Jesus, what verses would you use to console and comfort them?

Just curious,

Travis