JerryfromMass
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Wrong to conflate what Sue said with breaking the laws. Are you Hebrew Roots, too?
What does it mean to be saved?
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B-A-C
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To be saved -- 1 Corinthians 15: 1-3 "Moreover, Brethren, I declare to you the Gospel ......by which you are saved......that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures and that He was buried, and that He rose again the third day according to the Scriptures. "
And then there is Romans 10: 9-10 That is you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation."
Two more verses.
And then there is Romans 10: 9-10 That is you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation."
Two more verses.
You're taking my comment a bit out of it's intended context.
And keeping a bunch of rules / laws will Not save anyone -- but Doing all those things in a person's daily life Will show a Lack Of salvation. A life-style of those things is a lack of the indwelling of the Holy Spirit
So - a person Should be checking their own personal life-style Against what God's Word Is Teaching.
And If a person notices that someone who Has confessed Jesus Christ as Savior Is doing those things -- Then there is reason to be concerned about their salvation And Then to attempt to connect with the person in concern -- privately -- and ask the person about 'it'. Not hitting them over their head with your Bible. But showing real concern about them. Maybe no one has taken time With them to disciple them.
JerryfromMass
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Sue never stated that breaking the moral decalogue was okay, which is what you made it seem like in your response. Just saying.
I would agree we must compare the unseen spiritual understanding to the same. Faith to faith or called face to face
They were told to repent or else they were commiting blasphemy the unforgiveable sin .
It would seem those in Mathew 7 are many who heard the call but were not chosen .Or like those in Hebrew 6 tasted and shared but did not drink in the spirit .
They were not sent or moved from within as true apostles . Jesus in effect said to the many or wide road . "I never knew you by working with you." And called the many workers that work iniquity.(false prophet) .
The Bible does not say the works were not performed. In that way we understand God is not served by human hands as a will .(Acts 17) We can plant the gospel seed and water it with the doctrines but only God can cause an increase of new spirit life. In that way we must decrese as He increases. He reckons us as little faith .
He can use an unbeliever signified as an Ass in ceremonial laws shadows of the unseen in order to perform his eternal good works. It silenced the false prophet Balaam who whipped the Ass three times with three used to denote the end of a matter.
Numbers 22:28 And the Lord opened the mouth of the ass, and she said unto Balaam, What have I done unto thee, that thou hast smitten me these three times?
Twice in Exodus the Holy Spirit demonstrates that he is not served by human hands as a will. Using a unclean animal to represent unredeemed mankind. . made new redeemed by a clean animal lamb. The gospel in the parable as a cerimonial law below.
Exodus 34:20 But the firstling of an ass thou shalt redeem with a lamb: and if thou redeem him not, then shalt thou break his neck. All the firstborn of thy sons thou shalt redeem. And none shall appear before me empty.
The sign of the first born, the Son of man, Jesus the lamb redeeming mankind.
Waggles
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That is not the gospel of salvation - that is a motherhood statement in Romans which comes well after the famous sections on the spiritual meaning of full immersion water baptism and also being baptised in the Spirit (of adoption).
People take the above verse out of context and worse invent a new gospel on one verse.
To be saved one needs to be obedient to the full gospel
Acts 2:
37 Now when they heard this they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, “Brethren, what shall we do?”
38 And Peter said to them, “Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
39 For the promise is to you and to your children and to all that are far off, every one whom the Lord our God calls to him.”
40 And he testified with many other words and exhorted them, saying, “Save yourselves from this crooked generation.”
41 So those who received his word were baptized, and there were added that day about three thousand souls.
42 And they devoted themselves to the apostles’ teaching and fellowship, to the breaking of bread and the prayers.
Acts 5:
29 But Peter and the apostles answered, “We must obey God rather than men.
30 The God of our fathers raised Jesus whom you killed by hanging him on a tree. 31 God exalted him at his right hand as Leader and Saviour, to give repentance to Israel and forgiveness of sins.
32 And we are witnesses to these things, and so is the Holy Spirit whom God has given to those who obey him.”
Greetings Sue,
yes, maybe that is the case, maybe not. However, no matter how long you try to 'disciple' a goat, it will never be a lamb (sheep)
either way, we do have plenty of instruction regarding what you bring up. Brother B-A-C @B-A-C is one of the kindest folk around and i have learnt a lot about how to be gentle with others from him.
Forums have many interpretations on them, and too often we can all mis-read into how and what another is writing or replying with, as you know.
On a note, back to the thread, may i share a little from Harry Ironside?
It's about us doing our part and i think you'll like it....
"I can see that GOD has done His part in the work of my salvation, but must I not do my part if I would avail myself of what He has done?"
Have you ever heard the story of the man who was wonderfully saved and arose in a class meeting to testify to his newfound joy?
His heart was filled with CHRIST and his lips spoke of Him and of Him only, as his Redeemer and Lord.
The class leader was a legalist and said when the other had finished, "Our brother has told us what the Lord did for him, but he has forgotten to tell us what he did in order to be saved. GOD does His part when we do ours. Brother, did you not do your part before GOD saved you?"
The man was on his feet in a moment and exclaimed, "I surely did do my part. I ran away from GOD as fast as my sins could carry me. That was my part. And GOD chased me till He caught me. That was His part."
Yes, you and I have all done our part, and a dreadfully sad part it was. We did all the sinning and He must do all the saving. After we are saved we can labor night and day to show our gratitude to Him for what His grace has wrought.
"I am not told to labor To put away my sin;
So foolish, weak and helpless, I never could begin.
But, blessed truth, I know it, Though ruined by the fall,
CHRIST for my sin has suffered, Yes, CHRIST has done it all."
Bless you ....><>
yes, maybe that is the case, maybe not. However, no matter how long you try to 'disciple' a goat, it will never be a lamb (sheep)
either way, we do have plenty of instruction regarding what you bring up. Brother B-A-C @B-A-C is one of the kindest folk around and i have learnt a lot about how to be gentle with others from him.
Forums have many interpretations on them, and too often we can all mis-read into how and what another is writing or replying with, as you know.
On a note, back to the thread, may i share a little from Harry Ironside?
It's about us doing our part and i think you'll like it....
"I can see that GOD has done His part in the work of my salvation, but must I not do my part if I would avail myself of what He has done?"
Have you ever heard the story of the man who was wonderfully saved and arose in a class meeting to testify to his newfound joy?
His heart was filled with CHRIST and his lips spoke of Him and of Him only, as his Redeemer and Lord.
The class leader was a legalist and said when the other had finished, "Our brother has told us what the Lord did for him, but he has forgotten to tell us what he did in order to be saved. GOD does His part when we do ours. Brother, did you not do your part before GOD saved you?"
The man was on his feet in a moment and exclaimed, "I surely did do my part. I ran away from GOD as fast as my sins could carry me. That was my part. And GOD chased me till He caught me. That was His part."
Yes, you and I have all done our part, and a dreadfully sad part it was. We did all the sinning and He must do all the saving. After we are saved we can labor night and day to show our gratitude to Him for what His grace has wrought.
"I am not told to labor To put away my sin;
So foolish, weak and helpless, I never could begin.
But, blessed truth, I know it, Though ruined by the fall,
CHRIST for my sin has suffered, Yes, CHRIST has done it all."
Bless you ....><>
Water baptism is used to represent inspiration from heaven has it foundation in the Old Testament,(the doctrines that do fall like rain or dew. Used a ceremonial law used when a new priest had a desire to serve the gospel .Aaron's two sons tried to make itself edifying by adding their own person touch of self-righteousness called strange fire .It consumed them and did no damage to the ceremonial clothing. God simply will not share his unseen glory with the temporal corrupted things of this world. A shadow of the eternal
No such thing as self-edifying sign gifts by getting wet with water it evaporates. It is why they are called spiritual gifts. It’s impossible to see the work of the Holy Spirit. We can see what follows. Seeking after signs that cause wonder is not the good news.
It more of the kind of new that the faithless Jews sought after work a miracle then when we see it we will believe .Making Jesus into a circus seal in the end of the matter
John 6:30 They said therefore unto him, What sign shewest thou then, that we may see, and believe thee? what dost thou work?
The gospel as the good news surely is salvation. It’s not called an unknown remnant of good news go get wet or make a noise .
It’s why it’s called good news from faith to faith (The unseen to the unseen) .It’s a work Christ performs in us.
H20 gets a person wet it does not perform any more or less ..
We serve with our new unseen incorruptible born again spirit not with our corrupted flesh. . it has no power. No such thing as sign gift. Sign folow they are not something we seek after.
Roman 1: 9-17 For God is my witness, whom I serve with my spirit in the gospel of his Son, that without ceasing I make mention of you always in my prayers; Making request, if by any means now at length I might have a prosperous journey by the will of God to come unto you. For I long to see you, that I may impart unto you some spiritual gift, to the end ye may be established; That is, that I may be comforted together with you by the mutual faith both of you and me. Now I would not have you ignorant, brethren, that oftentimes I purposed to come unto you, (but was let hitherto,) that I might have some fruit among you also, even as among other Gentiles. I am debtor both to the Greeks, and to the Barbarians; both to the wise, and to the unwise. So, as much as in me is, I am ready to preach the gospel to you that are at Rome also. For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
B-A-C
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The title of this thread... .."to be saved".
I personally don't believe any of us are already saved. I believe we are "being" saved.
Luke 13:23; And someone said to Him, "Lord, are there just a few who are being saved?" And He said to them,
Acts 2:47; praising God and having favor with all the people. And the Lord was adding to their number day by day those who were being saved.
1Cor 1:18; For the word of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.
2Cor 2:15; For we are a fragrance of Christ to God among those who are being saved and among those who are perishing;
Jesus may have completed His work. But He has only "begun" a good work in you. It isn't finished yet.
Php 3:10; that I may know Him and the power of His resurrection and the fellowship of His sufferings, being conformed to His death;
Php 3:11; in order that I may attain to the resurrection from the dead.
Php 3:12; Not that I have already obtained it or have already become perfect, but I press on so that I may lay hold of that for which also I was laid hold of by Christ Jesus.
Php 3:13; Brethren, I do not regard myself as having laid hold of it yet; but one thing I do: forgetting what lies behind and reaching forward to what lies ahead,
Php 3:14; I press on toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus.
It doesn't matter how you start the race, it matters how you finish.
Luke 12:42; And the Lord said, "Who then is the faithful and sensible steward, whom his master will put in charge of his servants, to give them their rations at the proper time?
Luke 12:43; "Blessed is that slave whom his master finds so doing when he comes.
Luke 12:44; "Truly I say to you that he will put him in charge of all his possessions.
Luke 12:45; "But if that slave says in his heart, 'My master will be a long time in coming,' and begins to beat the slaves, both men and women, and to eat and drink and get drunk;
Luke 12:46; the master of that slave will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he does not know, and will cut him in pieces, and assign him a place with the unbelievers.
I personally don't believe any of us are already saved. I believe we are "being" saved.
Luke 13:23; And someone said to Him, "Lord, are there just a few who are being saved?" And He said to them,
Acts 2:47; praising God and having favor with all the people. And the Lord was adding to their number day by day those who were being saved.
1Cor 1:18; For the word of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.
2Cor 2:15; For we are a fragrance of Christ to God among those who are being saved and among those who are perishing;
Jesus may have completed His work. But He has only "begun" a good work in you. It isn't finished yet.
Php 3:10; that I may know Him and the power of His resurrection and the fellowship of His sufferings, being conformed to His death;
Php 3:11; in order that I may attain to the resurrection from the dead.
Php 3:12; Not that I have already obtained it or have already become perfect, but I press on so that I may lay hold of that for which also I was laid hold of by Christ Jesus.
Php 3:13; Brethren, I do not regard myself as having laid hold of it yet; but one thing I do: forgetting what lies behind and reaching forward to what lies ahead,
Php 3:14; I press on toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus.
It doesn't matter how you start the race, it matters how you finish.
Luke 12:42; And the Lord said, "Who then is the faithful and sensible steward, whom his master will put in charge of his servants, to give them their rations at the proper time?
Luke 12:43; "Blessed is that slave whom his master finds so doing when he comes.
Luke 12:44; "Truly I say to you that he will put him in charge of all his possessions.
Luke 12:45; "But if that slave says in his heart, 'My master will be a long time in coming,' and begins to beat the slaves, both men and women, and to eat and drink and get drunk;
Luke 12:46; the master of that slave will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he does not know, and will cut him in pieces, and assign him a place with the unbelievers.
JerryfromMass
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I have to disagree, B-A-C. We are presently saved (justification), we are being saved (sanctification), and we will be saved eternally (glorification). There's no other reasonable way to see salvation.
B-A-C
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Jas 2:24; You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone.
JerryfromMass
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"For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them." Ephesians 2:8-10.
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Exactly!
Verses 8 and 9 are how you get saved. Verse 10 is what you should do after you are saved in order to maintain salvation.
JerryfromMass
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"Now if anyone builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw— each one’s work will become manifest, for the Day will disclose it, because it will be revealed by fire, and the fire will test what sort of work each one has done. If the work that anyone has built on the foundation survives, he will receive a reward. If anyone’s work is burned up, he will suffer loss, though he himself will be saved, but only as through fire." 1 Corinthians 3:12-15.
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Matt 7:19; "Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
JerryfromMass
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Amen, and the good fruit Jesus spoke of is the good fruit Paul wrote of, which is "love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law. And those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. If we live by the Spirit, let us also keep in step with the Spirit. Let us not become conceited, provoking one another, envying one another." Galatians 5:22-26.
Waggles
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No one is actually saved until they stand before Jesus and he welcomes them in as good and faithful servants
in the meantime after our obedience to what is commanded of God we have hope and patiently wait for the promised reward
1Peter 1:
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! By his great mercy we have been born anew to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4 and to an inheritance which is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, kept in heaven for you,
5 who by God’s power are guarded through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time. 6 In this you rejoice, though now for a little while you may have to suffer various trials,
7 so that the genuineness of your faith, more precious than gold which though perishable is tested by fire, may redound to praise and glory and honour at the revelation of Jesus Christ.
8 Without having seen him you love him; though you do not now see him you believe in him and rejoice with unutterable and exalted joy.
9 As the outcome of your faith you obtain the salvation of your souls.
in the meantime after our obedience to what is commanded of God we have hope and patiently wait for the promised reward
1Peter 1:
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! By his great mercy we have been born anew to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4 and to an inheritance which is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, kept in heaven for you,
5 who by God’s power are guarded through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time. 6 In this you rejoice, though now for a little while you may have to suffer various trials,
7 so that the genuineness of your faith, more precious than gold which though perishable is tested by fire, may redound to praise and glory and honour at the revelation of Jesus Christ.
8 Without having seen him you love him; though you do not now see him you believe in him and rejoice with unutterable and exalted joy.
9 As the outcome of your faith you obtain the salvation of your souls.
Yes the reward of faith or His labor of love that works in us yoked with him, The greatest reward eternal life. He is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
Hebrews 11: 6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
I would offer believers receive the salvation of thier souls the end of their new born again faith from the beginning .We await our new incorruptible bodies which will come on the last day under the sun. Hebrews 11:39
1 Peter1: 9-11 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls. Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you: Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.
The resurrection gate was opened the old testemnet saints that looked ahead by faith to the cross have the same spirit of faith as all belivers that look back to that same promised demonstration to the world .
We must be careful how we hear or walk by faith (the unseen) The gospel seed could get snatched away if not rooted in the foundation as it is written in the law and prophets some seed fell on the way side (oral traditions of men)
If God would take into account even one sin how could we stand before his throne of mercy and receive grace?
Psalm 130:3-5 King James Version (KJV) If thou, Lord, shouldest mark iniquities, O Lord, who shall stand? But there is forgiveness with thee, that thou mayest be feared. I wait for the Lord, my soul doth wait, and in his word do I hope.
We worship by faith called faith to faith the spiritual unseen to the same. Or called face to face now that we have the whole revelation from heaven and is sealed with 7 seals .
1 Corinthians 13:12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.
In that way Moses in the old testament spoke face to face in the knowledge of our unseen God. We can gain from the understanding given to them as it is written
2 Corinthians 4:6For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.
What a miracle the gospel light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts,
There are no laws missing by which we could know our Father more intimately .The perfect Sealed with 7 seals
