70 Weeks of Daniel Prophecy - Already Fulfilled or Not?

[Jonathan_Gale]

No, what you said and Rev. 11:5 are 2 different things altogether.

Quoting John the Baptist. "He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire"

You interpreted this as, "baptize you with the Holy Spirit" = rebirth in spirit. And "with fire" = God's Divine judgement on unbelievers.

Both of those are wrong btw.

The Baptism of Water is not the Baptism of the Holy Spirit. And the Fire is God's indwelling Word.

No, that indwelling word is the Spirit - for believers, the fire is for unbelievers. This is talking about separating the wheat from the chaff:

"His winnowing fan is in His hand, and He will thoroughly clean out His threshing floor, and gather His wheat into the barn; but He will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.” - Matt. 3:12

And just to be clear, this is not my interpretation, but the verse comes right next to the quote "baptize you with the Holy Spirit" in Matt. 3:11, and it also alludes to the parable of wheat and tares parable. You spiritualize certain verses by taking them out of context, you're blind to see the whole picture.

 

[Bill]

No, that indwelling word is the Spirit - for believers, the fire is for unbelievers. This is talking about separating the wheat from the chaff:

"His winnowing fan is in His hand, and He will thoroughly clean out His threshing floor, and gather His wheat into the barn; but He will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.” - Matt. 3:12

And just to be clear, this is not my interpretation, but the verse comes right next to the quote "baptize you with the Holy Spirit" in Matt. 3:11, and it also alludes to the parable of wheat and tares parable. You spiritualize certain verses by taking them out of context, you're blind to see the whole picture.

I am not blind, i focus more on the mercy of God. And am not so apt to toss judgement on others.

There will be plenty of that come Jerusalem. ( mostly on hard headed Christians) <<< they have everything, yet yield nothing to the less fortunate. Others are auto doomed in thier view, because they were brought up as Hindus, Muslims, Atheists ( as in Russia) no compassion from the Christians, who are all full of talk, but wont suffer for thier created brothers and sisters

 

[Jonathan_Gale]

I am not blind, i focus more on the mercy of God. And am not so apt to toss judgement on others.

There will be plenty of that come Jerusalem. ( mostly on hard headed Christians) <<< they have everything, yet yield nothing to the less fortunate. Others are auto doomed in thier view, because they were brought up as Hindus, Muslims, Atheists ( as in Russia) no compassion from the Christians, who are all full of talk, but wont suffer for thier created brothers and sisters

Neither am I passing judgement unto anybody, for vengeance is the Lord's, but don't shoot the messenger who told you this.

 

[Bill]

Neither am I passing judgement unto anybody, for vengeance is the Lord's, but don't shoot the messenger who told you this.

Did i shoot you?

It did come to my mind, in this discussion, that perceptions of these versus can mean different things to different people.

When i read Johns words. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.

Then John says, " his winnowing fan is in his hand, he will clear the threshing floor and gather his wheat into the barn, but the chaff he will burn in a fire that will never go out".

These two phrases, to me are not of the same subject. I proceed the first statement speaking of the Holy Spirit and with fire meaning something completely different as with the apostles and the tongues of flame on top of their heads.

This baptism that John speaks of of the Holy Spirit and with fire to me it comes across as a baptism of the holy spirit with an anointing.

And the second sentence representing the judgment

On a side note I think very highly of you and David, even if we don't always agree. Your souls are in a good spot

 

[Jonathan_Gale]

Did i shoot you?

It did come to my mind, in this discussion, that perceptions of these versus can mean different things to different people.

When i read Johns words. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.

Then John says, " his winnowing fan is in his hand, he will clear the threshing floor and gather his wheat into the barn, but the chaff he will burn in a fire that will never go out".

These two phrases, to me are not of the same subject. I proceed the first statement speaking of the Holy Spirit and with fire meaning something completely different as with the apostles and the tongues of flame on top of their heads.

This baptism that John speaks of of the Holy Spirit and with fire to me it comes across as a baptism of the holy spirit with an anointing.

And the second sentence representing the judgment

On a side note I think very highly of you and David, even if we don't always agree. Your souls are in a good spot

Thanks for your kind words, but the truth is, there’s no first and second statements, only one - for the Pharisees and Sadduccees:

“But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to his baptism, he said to them, "Brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the wrath to come?”

John the Baptist had one clear warning for them: their privilege doesn’t grant them a ticket to heaven, they must repent and receive the Messiah who will baptize them with the holy spirit and fire. Then in 3:12 is the outcome of that, unbelievers will receive judgement of fire, not necessarily in this life, but the next.

And no, you didn’t shoot me, but John the Baptist as the messenger was shot - or decapitated, as a messenger, eventually.