Emotions

[Sue D.]

Well -- at this point -- we will simply agree to Disagree.

God created all of us With emotions. It helps to define us.

 

[regibassman57]

Sue,
I love you and everybody in Christ, I have no emotional hangups. Am I saying I do not have to practice and continue to exercise the resisting of emotions, no; I have to practice daily; but I know and see who i'm wrestling with, and it's not a human being. When the devil presents anger, lust, fear or greif in my spirit, it's foreign to me because i've been practising for so long and i'm not comfortable with it, so I will not justify anything contrary to peace..

We really cannot agree to disagree because you haven't given me that opportunity; not with you, but with God's word. You have not given me any scriptural references where I can disagree with you based on the question I asked. If God's word says, He created man with emotions, or God put anger, lust, fear and grief in man, or anything in that context, then I have the option to agree to disagree with the references; but you haven't allowed me that. As far as disagreeing with a person; life is what it is.

1Co 1:20 Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?

1Co 1:21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.

1Co 3:19 For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness.

Sue, this is not between me and you to create wisdom; or any other person; but it's what God's view is.

Gal 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shall love thy neighbour as thyself.

Mat 5:43 You have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.
Mat 5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

 

[Sue D.]

Isn't 'love' an emotion? As per your Gal. 5:14 and Matthew 5:43

I've experienced a great deal of emotion during these past weeks. Have done a lot of crying. Tears can help heal. It's part of how God has made us.

 

[regibassman57]

Hello Sue,
No, Godly love is not emotional, but fleshly or worldly love is. (this does not mean that God frown at emotions; He does not) as long as they do not interfere with you loving Him according to His word.

Galatians 5:14 and Matthew 5:43 is Agape Love. This love is not emotional though people act as if it is (that's another story). We are to love our neighbor with agape love as well as God. Our neighbor also becomes our mate, husband or wife with this type of love; which also tuns into Phileo love. There are other types of love scripture talks about, but it's an elementary love. A love of sex, carnal affection. etc. But it is allowed in its place. In Christ we learn to grow from certain types of love into something more stable as agapa love. Phileo love is a love of friendship which can also be emotional, it's in the cagegory of worldly anger, lust, fear and greif. We haven't talked much about the nature of good; only evil. The conversation of good emotions is confusing without understanding the thorough foudation of evil emotions.

G25 (Greek definition of love)
agapaō
Perhaps from ἄγαν agan (much; or compare [H5689]); to love (in a social or moral sense): - (be-) love (-ed).

This definition is for "love" referncing the scriptures you presented above.

 

[Sue D.]

I know you're writing / sharing all of this with really good intentions. But I'm finding it very hard to deal with your view of what you consider to be 'fleshly' emotions that somehow are not God given and good for us.
God created Adam and Eve to live forever and produce many children over their life time. He was pleased with 'our' creation. After all He made us just the way He wanted us. Eating of the fruit of the tree against His will did Not result in mankind getting emotions. We simply learned about good and evil in All areas of living. We all have unique personalities. Some people are very demonstrative in public and some aren't. I'm not.

And, yes, there Are the various kinds of 'love'. Many years ago I gave a devotional to the women in our church on the subject.

People cry in happiness, sorrow, frustrations.

People Laugh at funny , nice, clean jokes, at the cute things little kids do, and people Also laugh At people in meanness.

And we Also get Mad , highly frustrated sometimes. And That's when we need to be careful -- my body does Not touch another person when I'm mad. Righteous indignation.

I just don't agree with your approach to this entire subject.

I'm dealing with this being the third week since my husband's passing. He managed our finances -- very well. My daughter has been helping navigate that part of life. She's wonderful with it.

so -- will simply not continue here.

 

[Gigiloveslife]

Isn't 'love' an emotion? As per your Gal. 5:14 and Matthew 5:43

I've experienced a great deal of emotion during these past weeks. Have done a lot of crying. Tears can help heal. It's part of how God has made us.

Don't really want to resurrect this thread regarding the emotions debate, but Sue, just wanted to say hello and I hope you are doing ok. I know you are just starting your grieving process. I trust that you are experiencing the comfort of God in very tangible ways (He really is so close to the brokenhearted). I just thought of this as I started typing....my sister found a GriefShare group and has really good things to say about it. I went through DivorceCare (same people, I think, that created GriefShare) and was extremely impressed with the program. Just thought I'd mention to you. Love and hugs

 

[JesusIs4Me]

When emotions are troubling you, no matter how uncontrollable they may be or frightening in being so unpredictable, ask Jesus for help in discerning the cause and reflecting on His words to be able to turn them over to Him.

 

[regibassman57]

@JesusIs4Me,
I'm missing your point? Your comment does not apply to me?

 

[Hiswillbedone]

One emotion that is common among all men, yet so easily to deceive ourselves in believing that we don't have it, is pride. There are many aspects of pride within a person, so it is beneficial to look at it case by case, but the worse, IMO, is self-righteous pride. This is the type of pride that Jesus was up against and God has been fighting ever since the fall of mankind. It's this pride that causes wise men to fall, because they didn't consider the possibility that they could trip. They thouroughly convinced themselves that they alone can wield the sword of truth, and if anybody disagrees with them, then they are wrong and we are right. This all goes through someones mind, without, the possibility that they are wrong. It truly is a snare of the devil.

It is crucial as Christians to check our own spirit when we are sharing with others, because through what we say, we leave clues in what's in our heart.

In peace

 

[Sue D.]

I've just been thinking about the various emotions that we have. We all experience love, sadness, happiness, anger. They are what make us human. Oh, ya, and pride. I can be proud of a family member for making straight A's on her report card.
I guess I see pride and happiness as synonymous.

@Hiswillbedone -- why do you say that self-righteous pride is what Jesus was up against and that God has been fighting ever since the fall of mankind. Unless you're referring to the Pharisees when the one man was praying.
Jesus Christ was facing the cross on our behalf -- our sins.

God created us with emotions -- He created us Human. If He'd created us as robot, He'd have made us to love Him and everyone else on earth.

The serpent entered the picture in the garden of Eden -- he successfully deceived Eve -- by eating of the tree of the knowledge of both good and evil -- they Would eventually Die. Otherwise they would have lived forever. And Eve thought it would be neat to have all the knowledge in the world like God did. In her innocence she was curious as to what that would mean. so, yes, a true snare of the deceitfullness of Satan. But it was no surprise to God / Jesus Christ / the Holy Spirit. that's why the cross of Calvary was Also Planned. Ahead of time. And, 'we' still tend to follow satan instead of believing God's Word.

And, yes, 'we' would rather believe that 'we' do have the 'correct' view of Scripture -- but, 'we' do need to be 'teachable'. The basics of salvation is a Must to agree on. Jesus Christ Is the Son of God. It is Only by His Name that a person Is saved. No other name under heaven. No help/ action on our part is needed to help our salvation be complete. Jesus Christ did it all. His virgin birth, death, burial and His bodily Resurrection. And we accept - on a personal level - in order for it to make a difference in our lives. And to be able to spend eternity in the New Jerusalem / Heaven.

And, yes, our outward appearance / words tell everyone what's in our heart.

 

[Bendito]

One emotion that is common among all men, yet so easily to deceive ourselves in believing that we don't have it, is pride. There are many aspects of pride within a person, so it is beneficial to look at it case by case, but the worse, IMO, is self-righteous pride. This is the type of pride that Jesus was up against and God has been fighting ever since the fall of mankind. It's this pride that causes wise men to fall, because they didn't consider the possibility that they could trip. They thouroughly convinced themselves that they alone can wield the sword of truth, and if anybody disagrees with them, then they are wrong and we are right. This all goes through someones mind, without, the possibility that they are wrong. It truly is a snare of the devil.

It is crucial as Christians to check our own spirit when we are sharing with others, because through what we say, we leave clues in what's in our heart.

In peace

Very good. Thank you.

 

[Hiswillbedone]

I've just been thinking about the various emotions that we have. We all experience love, sadness, happiness, anger. They are what make us human. Oh, ya, and pride. I can be proud of a family member for making straight A's on her report card.
I guess I see pride and happiness as synonymous.

@Hiswillbedone -- why do you say that self-righteous pride is what Jesus was up against and that God has been fighting ever since the fall of mankind. Unless you're referring to the Pharisees when the one man was praying.
Jesus Christ was facing the cross on our behalf -- our sins.

God created us with emotions -- He created us Human. If He'd created us as robot, He'd have made us to love Him and everyone else on earth.

The serpent entered the picture in the garden of Eden -- he successfully deceived Eve -- by eating of the tree of the knowledge of both good and evil -- they Would eventually Die. Otherwise they would have lived forever. And Eve thought it would be neat to have all the knowledge in the world like God did. In her innocence she was curious as to what that would mean. so, yes, a true snare of the deceitfullness of Satan. But it was no surprise to God / Jesus Christ / the Holy Spirit. that's why the cross of Calvary was Also Planned. Ahead of time. And, 'we' still tend to follow satan instead of believing God's Word.

And, yes, 'we' would rather believe that 'we' do have the 'correct' view of Scripture -- but, 'we' do need to be 'teachable'. The basics of salvation is a Must to agree on. Jesus Christ Is the Son of God. It is Only by His Name that a person Is saved. No other name under heaven. No help/ action on our part is needed to help our salvation be complete. Jesus Christ did it all. His virgin birth, death, burial and His bodily Resurrection. And we accept - on a personal level - in order for it to make a difference in our lives. And to be able to spend eternity in the New Jerusalem / Heaven.

And, yes, our outward appearance / words tell everyone what's in our heart.

What you shared is true. Jesus did come and fight against all sins. At the same time, some seem to be more prominent in people then others, and the world has thourougly deceived people in thinking that pride is a good thing. This, however, is a trick of the devil that is propagated by the media to make Pride a virtue, rather than the vice that God thinks it is.

As Jesus taught, we must always examine teachers by their 'fruit'. I am not only talking about religious leaders, rather anybody that is put in a teaching role. If what someone teaches lead to good fruit (good actions), then the teachings is good. If it does not, then the teaching is bad. If we have an honest look at what pride in general has done to people, groups, countries, as a whole, then we can see the fruit of what pride produces.

Let's take national pride for example. This sort of pride gets people to believe that anybody that was born in a different part of this world are somehow inferior to those that weren't born in the country of your origin. This is one of the reasons that people feel justified in 'defending their country' and disobeying Jesus' teaching of loving our enemy, and blessing those that curse us. If we look at this fruit, then it is clear that pride in this scenario is bad, because the fruit is bad.

I know you mentioned the idea that you can be proud of your child getting straight A's on his report card as a 'happy' experience, but I don't think pride and happiness are the same thing at all. Again, judge the fruit.

Anyways, I can agree that we need to focus on the similarities rather than the differences between us, but, when something is obviously a lie yet it shared as truth, then we must to as Jesus and divide households with the sword of truth. Either someone will conform to the new truth that was shown to them by God, or they reject it and in tern reject the person that sent the messenger out.

I would ask you to question whether or not your message of salvation is the same one that Jesus taught to His followers. It is strange what is happening today, but people seem to think that what Jesus says is somehow inferior to other Bible writers (eg. Paul, Moses, Solomon), so when Jesus says one thing, and another Bible writer seems to contradict it, then people tend to side with the other Bible writer. It truly is strange, but seems to be popular. No wonder since we are living in the end times where deception will be at the most high in all of human history.

All this is to say that your method of salvation isn't compatible to what Jesus taught in the four gospels. Please, show me where Jesus taught all we have to do is accept Him into our hearts and we are saved, then I will believe you.

Before you go to John 3:16, I want you to question what the word 'believe' means, and ask yourself if it only needs to be a belief that a person existed? or if it needs to be in a belief in what said person said and did.

In peace

 

[Sue D.]

@Hiswillbedone -- look at Romans 10:9-10 -- a person believes in his/ her heart first and then confesses with his/ her mouth the Lord Jesus.

1 Corinthians 15:1-4 "..... the Gospel unto salvation...... that Jesus Christ died on the cross , according to Scripture, that He was buried and that He rose again the 3rd day, according to Scripture. --- vs 2 "By this Gospel you are saved."

That is straight forward.

John 3:16 -- ".....that who so ever believeth on Him will not perish but have eternal / everlasting life". "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son......" That means that it's more than a knowledge of God and His Son -- it means a heart-belief. And that Jesus Christ Is the Son of God. Not just another religious leader / teacher of that time. LOTS of people acknowledge the existence of God and that Jesus Christ Did exist. And that He died. But won't accept His bodily resurrection. And That is what Proves He was - in reality -- God's Son.

There Are those who put Jesus Christ on the same level As Paul, Moses, Solomon -- those men you mentioned. I've not encountered those who put Jesus in a Lower position of authority. Actually, these days, it's more common to disregard Bible completely. Or as simply a lot of good , moral stories. Lots of people want to live by their own set of moral / ethical standards. Or lack, there of.

Lately on Facebook -- I've been taking a stand For Biblical standards, morals and been getting 'laughed at' to put it nicely. It's been my reaction to news items that are included on FB. We All need to be taking a Positive Stand For God's Word.

Salvation being the most important.

Being baptized after salvation -- showing by baptism by immersion to other people -- in church or at a lake -- that we believe that Jesus Did die and Did rise again. For 'me' Personally.

And, yes, there probably is a difference between 'pride' and 'happiness'. But I have no problem with being proud / happy for things my kids have accomplished. It's not me 'puffing up my chest' in pride.

And, yes, teaching Bible to others in S. S. Is serious business. Scripture Also tells 'us' to not put new believers in any leadership/ teaching position until we can see by their lives what they profess with their mouths. By their fruits we shall know them. Very true. And if there are No fruits in their lives -- Then there is cause for Concern. Approach that person by themselves in a loving, concerned way. Not fault-finding, but loving concern.

 

[regibassman57]

@Hiswillbedone,

One emotion that is common among all men, yet so easily to deceive ourselves in believing that we don't have it, is pride. There are many aspects of pride within a person, so it is beneficial to look at it case by case, but the worse, IMO, is self-righteous pride. This is the type of pride that Jesus was up against and God has been fighting ever since the fall of mankind. It's this pride that causes wise men to fall, because they didn't consider the possibility that they could trip. They thouroughly convinced themselves that they alone can wield the sword of truth, and if anybody disagrees with them, then they are wrong and we are right. This all goes through someones mind, without, the possibility that they are wrong. It truly is a snare of the devil.

It is crucial as Christians to check our own spirit when we are sharing with others, because through what we say, we leave clues in what's in our heart.

In peace

This tells me everyone on this forum has some type of pride. If a person has read God's word from a youth and that's all they know, and someone tells them a different understanding , are they prideful if they hold on to all they know? It appears there's always two sides; and only one is right. Deception will happen. I don't think people hold on to what they believe because of "direct pride" (at least not in all cases), but they do out of fear of losing their foundation (which also is link to pride). The "straight out" pride happens when truth is presented and a person refuses to reason with what scripture teaches after someone else has shown them factual information that cannot be refuted.

Example: believers are "Good Trees;"

Matthew 7:18
A good tree "CANNOT" bring forth "EVIL" fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

The prideful person will say, "I'm a good tree, but I develop "evil" fruit." What is the fruit of evil (Rom. 7:5).

The pride in this is their refusal to walk by faith, as Jesus teaches, instead of their carnal sense of understanding.

Romans 8:5
For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.

They reason and judge themselves "evil" according to their actions instead of saying what Jesus said about them. If we see errors in our walk, we confess what Christ said about ourselves - repent - and turn from our wrong actions while believing we are righteous; regardless of what we do. We are learning to walk in righteousness; but we are righteous in position.

 

[regibassman57]

When emotions are troubling you, no matter how uncontrollable they may be or frightening in being so unpredictable, ask Jesus for help in discerning the cause and reflecting on His words to be able to turn them over to Him.

Question: did Jesus create man with these unpredictable emotions?

 

[Sue D.]

Of course God created everyone /human/ and with emotions.

The Godhead created man -- not simply Jesus Christ the Son of God.

 

[regibassman57]

@Sue,
Did God create man with an agitated and troubled mind?

 

[Sue D.]

Of course not. But we bring on some of our own problems with the choices we make. And by how other people treat us.

How about the other emotions love, joy, etc. did we get those from God?

Negative events in a person's life Can contribute to an agitated / troubled mind. Scripture Does tell us to bring all our worries, anxieties to Him because He cares for us.

Satan would rather we lived with agitated minds, hearts so we won't be effective for God. Satan does Not want people follow happy, content believers and be led to salvation.

 

[Hiswillbedone]

@Hiswillbedone,


This tells me everyone on this forum has some type of pride. If a person has read God's word from a youth and that's all they know, and someone tells them a different understanding , are they prideful if they hold on to all they know? It appears there's always two sides; and only one is right. Deception will happen. I don't think people hold on to what they believe because of "direct pride" (at least not in all cases), but they do out of fear of losing their foundation (which also is link to pride). The "straight out" pride happens when truth is presented and a person refuses to reason with what scripture teaches after someone else has shown them factual information that cannot be refuted.

Example: believers are "Good Trees;"

Matthew 7:18
A good tree "CANNOT" bring forth "EVIL" fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

The prideful person will say, "I'm a good tree, but I develop "evil" fruit." What is the fruit of evil (Rom. 7:5).

The pride in this is their refusal to walk by faith, as Jesus teaches, instead of their carnal sense of understanding.

Romans 8:5
For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.

They reason and judge themselves "evil" according to their actions instead of saying what Jesus said about them. If we see errors in our walk, we confess what Christ said about ourselves - repent - and turn from our wrong actions while believing we are righteous; regardless of what we do. We are learning to walk in righteousness; but we are righteous in position.

Agreed. Though it seems you tried to justify a bit of pride on some people's parts (maybe as a hint to something you are holding yourself?) but then changed your mind and shared that it was "linked" with pride. It was good you were able to see that.

I agree with your example of a prideful person thinking He is good when His fruit proves to be evil.

I also agree that we ALL struggle with pride on this forum, and in the world. It is a part of sin that we are trying to change (repent) from, but we will fall back into it. As you hinted at, it is the progress God is looking for, not justification for sinning on the basis of "we won't be able to attain perfection."

In peace

 

[regibassman57]

@Hiswillbedine,

Agreed. Though it seems you tried to justify a bit of pride on some people's parts (maybe as a hint to something you are holding yourself?) but then changed your mind and shared that it was "linked" with pride. It was good you were able to see that.

I agree with your example of a prideful person thinking He is good when His fruit proves to be evil.

I also agree that we ALL struggle with pride on this forum, and in the world. It is a part of sin that we are trying to change (repent) from, but we will fall back into it. As you hinted at, it is the progress God is looking for, not justification for sinning on the basis of "we won't be able to attain perfection."

In peace

No... I'm not hiding anything, I'm as open as Christ sees me, not hiding anything. Thanks for your agreement. It's of course a positive thing to be on the same page, this is what Christ desires from us, but it takes reasoning His word.

But, the scripture I used in my last post - Matthews 7:18, you agreed with, but then you said - "I also agree that we ALL struggle with pride on this forum, and in the world. It is a part of sin'"

This to me presents a contradiction on your part. You agreed with Matthew 7:18, but then spoke contrary to it?

This scripture tells me - evil fruit is "sin" good fruit is "righteousness." A good tree "CANNOT" bring forth evil (sin) fruit, and a corrupt tree, cannot bring forth good fruit. When you were a sinner you could not do "anything" righteous. Now that you are righteous, you cannot sin. You are "free" from something on either side your on. You cannot be on both sides. You cannot serve two masters.

Romans 6:18
Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

Romans 6:20
For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness.

Matthew 7:18
A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

If you give to the poor because they don't have, Jesus said you did it unto Him.
When you visited a person in jail, you did it unto Jesus etc. All that you did is considered righteosness in God's eyes. Does God see the sinner/unbeliever as doing righteous acts when they do the same? No... We know that unbeliever do the exact same things; are their acts righteous? So why would you say you sin if God is not saying you sin? God is not imputing sin unto you.

2 Corinthians 5:19
To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.