Joel Osteen's "Your Best Life Now"

[In His Grace]

Joel did not answer the questions too well on Larry King Live, but at a later time with someone else, he did step up to the plate and apologize for not making it clear his stand on Christ and salvation.

Just a short reminder:
Riches & gold, money & wealth, fame, good health, a postive life, all the treasures of this world, you can have it all, but without knowing Jesus Christ as your Savior, then it is all meaningless.

 

[Sucat]

Amen In His Grace!

 

[To Christ]

1 Peter 3:18, "But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen." I think this verse is direct to where our spiritual growth begins.
John 17:17, Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth."
John 14:6, "Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."

Many of our large ministries of today have a feel good, always positive, prosperous, yet deceptive ministry. The leaders know how to work on the hearts/emotions of the people and run the ministry like a money making business. They deliver just enough truth to draw many followers and lead them down a deceptive path because they fail to preach true repentance of sin. They offer health, wealth, and prosperity that they cannot deliver, and so many follow as the blind leading the blind and soon they, both, will fall in the ditch. True repentance is a complete turning from sin, and it is then turning, wholeheartedly, to God to lead, guide, and direct our lives through His word and prayer...letting Him be in control.

Jesus is "the Way, the Truth, and the Life." And there is nothing about the ministry of the individual you are criticizing that does not have this as a foundation. Nothing said here about deceptive ministries (which, yes, do exist) applies to the ministry which is apparently being accused. Lakewood Church and the teachings that come from it have nothing to do with pay for and deliver or blind leading the blind. If you are called to be one who tells others to repent before letting them know the Gospel message is about the love of God and the joy to be found in Him, so be it. Yet making claims on the basis of very little acquaintance with the teachings of an anointed man called of God is simply a stone throwing tactic. It is a shame that a Christian cannot mention a blessing of a book by a godly man without other Christians having, with a bare skeleton of information about the overall teaching, unfounded words to say about the author. Love God and love your neighbor are first and foremost to the ability to speak to convict.

"The Spirit of the Lord God is upon Me,
Because the LORD has anointed Me
To preach good tidings to the poor;
He has sent Me to heal the brokenhearted,
To proclaim liberty to the captives,
And the opening of the prison to those who are bound;
To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD,
And the day of vengeance of our God;
To comfort all who mourn,
To console those who mourn in Zion,
To give them beauty for ashes,
The oil of joy for mourning,
The garment of praise for the spirit of heaviness;
That they may be called trees of righteousness,
The planting of the LORD, that He may be glorified." (Isaiah 61:1-3)

This is the anointing of Joel Osteen, and no gossip or opinion will change that.

 

[In His Grace]

Yes,

Jesus is "the Way, the Truth, and the Life". Thank you!

That should be the number one message we should be hearing FIRST, not great words about our self-esteem and a positive life, having Jesus in your life first will bring you better self-esteem and a more postive life.

Most of us here will agree that Joel is an anointed man of God and he has a great ministry, and we praise the Lord for him.

But we also feel that the message of salvation by faith in Jesus Christ is the most important subject. Because, like I have mentioned before, no matter how postive your outlook on life may be, when you someday stand before God, if you had never received Jesus as your Savior, then what good will all your postive life and thoughts have done for you, if it will not let you into heaven because you never received Jesus.

I'm sure that Jesus Christ and his saving grace is the foundation of Lakewood Church, we would just pray that message was the number one priorty along with his encouraging words on how to have a postive life.

 

[Chad]

Jesus is "the Way, the Truth, and the Life." And there is nothing about the ministry of the individual you are criticizing that does not have this as a foundation. Nothing said here about deceptive ministries (which, yes, do exist) applies to the ministry which is apparently being accused. Lakewood Church and the teachings that come from it have nothing to do with pay for and deliver or blind leading the blind. If you are called to be one who tells others to repent before letting them know the Gospel message is about the love of God and the joy to be found in Him, so be it. Yet making claims on the basis of very little acquaintance with the teachings of an anointed man called of God is simply a stone throwing tactic. It is a shame that a Christian cannot mention a blessing of a book by a godly man without other Christians having, with a bare skeleton of information about the overall teaching, unfounded words to say about the author. Love God and love your neighbor are first and foremost to the ability to speak to convict.

"The Spirit of the Lord God is upon Me,
Because the LORD has anointed Me
To preach good tidings to the poor;
He has sent Me to heal the brokenhearted,
To proclaim liberty to the captives,
And the opening of the prison to those who are bound;
To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD,
And the day of vengeance of our God;
To comfort all who mourn,
To console those who mourn in Zion,
To give them beauty for ashes,
The oil of joy for mourning,
The garment of praise for the spirit of heaviness;
That they may be called trees of righteousness,
The planting of the LORD, that He may be glorified." (Isaiah 61:1-3)

This is the anointing of Joel Osteen, and no gossip or opinion will change that.

Very well said! Also, some here who disagree with Joel are lacking knowledge so clearly true. First of all, Joel ALWAYS consistently and repetively mentions GOD during his sermons. He ALWAYS ends the sermon by asking/welcoming viewers who are watching and not saved yet, to invite JESUS CHRIST into their lives. He tells the "TRUTH" as is from GOD and nothing short of it.

I hate when people mock and judge innocent preachers of Christ Jesus. It makes me sick to my stomach without question. Why? Because (all humility intact here) I am one who faces the same ridiculous junk on a daily basis from blinded and shameful people who judge me, try to mock me, gossip about me and so forth. I face it daily and understand that an imperfect man but innocently serving the Lord (innocent from being a 'fraud' believer) gets stones thrown at him.

People, if you don't like Joel Osteen, something is wrong. This is not a matter of opinion. He is a human being serving GOD and doing a fine job. The best of the best out there as far as I'm concerned and I am certainly not one lacking "clues" to what is out there. I am on the Internet almost 24/7 (seriously) and I keep up with the news.

Nonetheless, we all should and must worship the One and only Living GOD. Our Savior Jesus Christ the only One worthy to be Praised. Still, do not stone His people

 

[Chad]

Proverbs 14:12
There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.

I watched Joel on Larry King Live and by Mr. Osteen's respones to Mr. King's questions I'm not convinced that Mr. Osteen is mature enough in Christ or even the Christian faith to be a leader in the body of Christ. There were some very basic or simple quetions asked that Joel could not or would not answer.

Apparently GOD thinks otherwise. He chooses the leaders not your nor I.
He is human and makes mistakes. Don't you? So Joel, a man, did not answer some questions - what were these questions that you disqualify him in YOUR opinion of his authority and chosen by GOD leadership over countless people (and witnesses) loyal, worldwide?

1 Samuel 16:7
7 But the LORD said to Samuel, "Do not consider his appearance or his height, for I have rejected him. The LORD does not look at the things man looks at. Man looks at the outward appearance, but the LORD looks at the heart."

 

[Chad]

Enjoy the proof (of many):

http://www1.wxyz.com/wxyz/ys_investigations/article/0,2132,WXYZ_15949_3929405,00.html
http://www1.wxyz.com/wxyz/ys_investigations/article/0,2132,WXYZ_15949_3927523,00.html

I warn anyone that insults and attempts to throw a stone at BROTHER Joel to hold your opinions from this site and leave in peace. I won't tolerate bashing of innocent Christians who are faithful and servant like, Christ like to our GOD.

 

[jiggyfly]

Apparently GOD thinks otherwise. He chooses the leaders not your nor I.
He is human and makes mistakes. Don't you? So Joel, a man, did not answer some questions - what were these questions that you disqualify him in YOUR opinion of his authority and chosen by GOD leadership over countless people (and witnesses) loyal, worldwide?

1 Samuel 16:7
7 But the LORD said to Samuel, "Do not consider his appearance or his height, for I have rejected him. The LORD does not look at the things man looks at. Man looks at the outward appearance, but the LORD looks at the heart."

You can go online and read the conversation for yourself and come to your own conclusion. Just because someone leads a group of people doesn't signify to me that they are called of God to do so.

 

[Jesuslovesu]

What I find so distasteful about this thread is how people feel they have the RIGHT to judge someones heart. (does not God do that not us?)
Joel is a man !!!! Nothing more and if people expect perfection and him never to make an error ... well you are going to have problems!
There was only one perfect man who walked on this earth (but He was not JUST a man was He?) ..
Have you never made an error in judgement??? Not said what you should have??? Thought back and realized that you didnt speak as well as you should have?
See you are eating what satan is feeding and that is to tear apart other brothers and sisters for being human and makeing errors..
News flash!!!!!! You can never ever ever make every person happy all the time !!!
1Ch 16:22 Saying, Touch not mine anointed, and do my prophets no harm.

Maybe you dont think he was called to ministry .. Maybe you do... Maybe your right...maybe not..


Does it matter???


I can guarentee that if you went over all my posts here you could find alot of wrong.. Is there LOVE in Christ by pointing every wrong out and bashing me to others??? No its not.
If you have issues with someone pray for them... not talk about how wrong they are...

What would Jesus do??


Oh wait ! Isnt there scripture about that?? MMM... Yes there is...

Luk 9:49 And John answered and said, Master, we saw one casting out devils in thy name; and we forbade him, because he followeth not with us. Luk 9:50 And Jesus said unto him, Forbid him not: for he that is not against us is for us.

Joyfully ~ Jlu

 

[jiggyfly]

Proverbs 14:12
There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.
I watched Joel on Larry King Live and by Mr. Osteen's respones to Mr. King's questions I'm not convinced that Mr. Osteen is mature enough in Christ or even the Christian faith to be a leader in the body of Christ. There were some very basic or simple quetions asked that Joel could not or would not answer.

Just so there's not a misunderstanding here, I will quote myself. I have read some bad comments written here at TJ about Mr. Benny Hinn also. He claims that He is a Brother and minister in Christ too. So who decides who is what?

 

[In His Grace]

Not to be throwing stones at anyone or their ministry,

but I think we need to hold our leaders accountable for what they say and do.

I beleive Joel Osteen is a great man of God and has a great ministry, my main concern is the content of some of the things he says or does not say.

And that's not to say we are all human and make mistakes too, I'm sure if Joel knowingly made a mistake, he would be the first to admit it.

Here is an interesting web site on different ministries and it mentions Joel Osteen in the article section.

[edited by Chad: no links without permission, read forum rules]
[edited by Chad AGAIN: you purposely re-posted the link, ignored forum rules and my pm for the second time. some nerves...banned]

 

[TDS52]

1 Timothy 5:22, "Lay hands suddenly on no man, neither be partaker of other men's sins: keep thyself pure."

In the past, many have put confidence in the large ministries and have been disappointed, heart-broken and many left penniless... and I will refresh memories of Jim Baker and Jimmy Swaggert followers. Lots of money was donated by well-meaning, sincere folks who listened to these men; they would have stepped up to their defense, and would never have thought these ministries/ministers would have failed them, but they did, what went wrong? It can happen to any ministry or person, even here. The humanity of a person gets in the way...it ceases to be GOD'S ministry and/or GOD'S work. The pride, as Lucifer had in Isaiah 14:12-15, takes forefront. What begins/began as something good leaves bad memories when the evil is/was
made public, and then all Christians are judged by the actions/ministries of the ones who fall. Their supporters/followers would never have desired to live so lavishly nor dreamed of commiting adultery, yet they were partakers in the sins of those ministries by their support.

I did not want anyone to get the impression that I was judging anyone in my earlier post, but if that is the impression you got, then so be it; nor am I backing down on what I posted; however, I did not mention any specific ministries or churches in the post, but I did include a comment made by Mr. Osteen, himself, in an interview about how he acquired the ministry.

Chad, anyone can mention the name of GOD...many do so even in profanity, but it doesn't mean they are ministers of HIS. You and I can invite others to accept the LORD JESUS, and we should, but not with just a repeat after me prayer; there has to be conviction of sin and true repentance for salvation to take place in the heart. I am sure there may be some who become true believers from these ministries, but it will be GOD'S doing, not the man.

True conviction of sin must be realized and repented of before salvation takes place in the heart of mankind. As In His Grace states, "the message of salvation by faith in Jesus Christ is the most important subject. Because, like I have mentioned before, no matter how postive your outlook on life may be, when you someday stand before God, if you had never received Jesus as your Savior, then what good will all your postive life and thoughts have done for you, if it will not let you into heaven because you never received Jesus."

When we stand before GOD, HE will not stand with HIS HANDS over HIS mouth, as if surprised by what we did or did not do, but some of HIS questions to us may be "what did you believe about MY SON? Did you accept HIS sacrifice? Did you believe and live by MY WORD?" How will we answer these? Will we say, I followed what so and so taught/told me? I went to this/that church and believed the teachings and adhered to its beliefs/doctrines? Matthew 7:22-23, "Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity." Will this not be a sad saying..."I NEVER KNEW YOU: DEPART FROM ME...". Their eternal destiny sealed...in the name of ministry, good works, crowds, and miracles.

We, all, need to be cautious of whom we follow/defend and let the WORD OF GOD be our guideline and be its own defense. James 1:5, If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not: and it shall be given him." We must search the scriptures and let God teach us to TRUTH...we cannot put our confidence in man/ministries.

 

[Chad]

I am starting a new thread now called "GOD Given Gifts" in Study Bible forum. I suggest all go read it there.

God bless

 

[Jesuslovesu]

I want to make clear TDS52 that I completely agree with your first post and actually your second though I have a few questions about... Please understand I am not doing this to make you look bad I hinestly want to know your thoughts and I want to make sur eI am not misunderstanding you.

What begins/began as something good leaves bad memories when the evil is/was
made public, and then all Christians are judged by those actions/ministries. The supporters/followers would never have desired to live so lavishly nor dreamed of commiting adultery, yet they were partakers in the sins of those ministries by their support.

When you say this do you mean we are judged by people or by God for these things? And.. Are you saying by giving support to someone when they sin I would sin?

We, all, need to be cautious of whom we follow/defend and let the WORD OF GOD be our guideline and be its own defense. James 1:5, If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not: and it shall be given him." We must earch the scriptures and let God teach us TRUTH...we cannot put our confidence in man/ministries.

as for this quote here I have to say is Amen!

 

[TDS52]

Jesuslovesu...I will include the edited version here, "What begins/began as something good leaves bad memories when the evil is/was made public, and then all Christians are judged by the actions/ministries of the ones who fall. Their supporters/followers would never have desired to live so lavishly nor dreamed of commiting adultery, yet they were partakers in the sins of those ministries by their support." I think we are judged by people because we give to/support such ministries and in fact, have contributed to their actions and supported their evil deeds, even when done in innocense. I think the leaders will be judged more harshly, but we will judged also because we did not consider what the Word of GOD instructed. We will be judged by our neglect of what GOD told us...HIS word will be what we are judged by and we will be without excuse because it is written for/given to us as our life's guidebook not men nor their ministries. We must search out our instructions and do our best to follow GOD'S leadership in everything.
[partake-have a share in or one taking a share; as Strong's defines: partaker-to share with others--communicate, distribute, be partaker]<==from 1 Timothy 5:22
Luke 6:29, "Woe unto you, when all men shall speak well of you! for so did their fathers to the false prophets." [woe- an exclamation of grief(deep sorrow)]

 

[Singlemom]

You know that even satan knows God's word and he used it speak to adam and eve and deceive them. I didn't say he did not use God's word. You gave me alot of Bible verses. What context did he use them in. OR did he simply recite them randomly or in sequential mode? I don't have one thing against Joel Osteen, what I am saying is that alot of pastors may preach and even use bible verses. But, Is Joel Osteen teaching separation from apostacy, the innerancy of the Word of God, the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ and the command to make believers of all nations?? What is the tone that sets all of his sermons in place. Is it a self help book in a message or Bible (Solid) preaching?

 

[jiggyfly]

I want to make clear TDS52 that I completely agree with your first post and actually your second though I have a few questions about... Please understand I am not doing this to make you look bad I hinestly want to know your thoughts and I want to make sur eI am not misunderstanding you.
When you say this do you mean we are judged by people or by God for these things? And.. Are you saying by giving support to someone when they sin I would sin?
as for this quote here I have to say is Amen!

1Corithians 5:9-13

9*When I wrote to you before, I told you not to associate with people who indulge in sexual sin. 10*But I wasn’t talking about unbelievers who indulge in sexual sin, or who are greedy or are swindlers or idol worshipers. You would have to leave this world to avoid people like that. 11*What I meant was that you are not to associate with anyone who claims to be a Christian* yet indulges in sexual sin, or is greedy, or worships idols, or is abusive, or a drunkard, or a swindler. Don’t even eat with such people.
12*It isn’t my responsibility to judge outsiders, but it certainly is your job to judge those inside the church who are sinning in these ways. 13*God will judge those on the outside; but as the Scriptures say, “You must remove the evil person from among you.”*

 

[To Christ]

Timothy 5:22, "Lay hands suddenly on no man, neither be partaker of other men's sins: keep thyself pure."

In the past, many have put confidence in the large ministries and have been disappointed, heart-broken and many left penniless... and I will refresh memories of Jim Baker and Jimmy Swaggert followers. Lots of money was donated by well-meaning, sincere folks who listened to these men; they would have stepped up to their defense, and would never have thought these ministries/ministers would have failed them, but they did, what went wrong? It can happen to any ministry or person, even here. The humanity of a person gets in the way...it ceases to be GOD'S ministry and/or GOD'S work. The pride, as Lucifer had in Isaiah 14:12-15, takes forefront. What begins/began as something good leaves bad memories when the evil is/was
made public, and then all Christians are judged by the actions/ministries of the ones who fall. Their supporters/followers would never have desired to live so lavishly nor dreamed of commiting adultery, yet they were partakers in the sins of those ministries by their support.

I did not want anyone to get the impression that I was judging anyone in my earlier post, but if that is the impression you got, then so be it; nor am I backing down on what I posted; however, I did not mention any specific ministries or churches in the post, but I did include a comment made by Mr. Osteen, himself, in an interview about how he acquired the ministry.

TDS52, you are comparing those who were soliciting money and lost in the sins of this world with a man of God who is simply very successful. Joel Osteen's ministry is a giving ministry. His church does not publicize how much they give to the poor, the unlovely, the grieved, and generally to those in need. He is someone living according to God's commandments, and why you compare it to fallen ministries is something that comes from your own heart. If you wanted to uncover every flaw possible in Lakewood Church, you would only find that the cup runs over because, "'Give, and it will be given to you: good measure, pressed down, shaken together, and running over will be put into you bosom. For with the same measure that you use, it will be measured back to you.'"(Luke 6:38)

You surely did not perceive Joel Osteen's testimony, which I too have heard, about his receipt of the ministry anything like the spirit in which I heard it. It sounded like a God-ordained appointment for which only the Holy Spirit could have provided the readiness, leadership, and unique building of messages to bring into God's kingdom so many who would not otherwise come to know Christ. Most of us could not hope to be used as so effective an instrument to bring as many to salvation in one lifetime as Osteen's ministering does in any given hour.

But, Is Joel Osteen teaching separation from apostacy, the innerancy of the Word of God, the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ and the command to make believers of all nations?? What is the tone that sets all of his sermons in place. Is it a self help book in a message or Bible (Solid) preaching?

Singlemom, none of us here at Talk Jesus would be defending Joel Osteen if we were not certain that the death and resurrection of Christ and the true salvation message are the foundation of his message. The Holy Spirit is the only One that can convict anyone. We are to let others know the Word of God and the Truth of Christ. God has given to Joel Osteen a gift for drawing people into the Kingdom. Take a year and start listening to the Lakewood Church broadcasts regularly. Christians who want to be steeped in the joy of the Lord will only be blessed. And non-Christians who like the ministry and continue with it cannot miss the complete salvation message from it.

Just so ther's not a misunderstanding here, I will quote myself. I have read some bad comments written here at TJ about Mr. Benny Hinn also. He claims that He is a Brother and minister in Christ too. So who decides who is what?
1Corithians 5:9-13
9*When I wrote to you before, I told you not to associate with people who indulge in sexual sin. 10*But I wasn’t talking about unbelievers who indulge in sexual sin, or who are greedy or are swindlers or idol worshipers. You would have to leave this world to avoid people like that. 11*What I meant was that you are not to associate with anyone who claims to be a Christian* yet indulges in sexual sin, or is greedy, or worships idols, or is abusive, or a drunkard, or a swindler. Don’t even eat with such people.
12*It isn’t my responsibility to judge outsiders, but it certainly is your job to judge those inside the church who are sinning in these ways. 13*God will judge those on the outside; but as the Scriptures say, “You must remove the evil person from among you.”*

jiggyfly, clearly only God decides. Yet again, you are speaking of someone who solicits money at every turn, and makes up things about angels that do not exist in the Bible. Joel Osteen neither solicits money or changes the Word of God. And read what I stated above to TDS52. Your judgment and comparisons here are unfounded. You are speaking not only without basis, but your implication is both libel and slander. By whatever measure you are judging Joel Osteen, it has nothing to do with any reality.

Jesus said, "'Judge not, and you shall not be judged. Condemn not, and you shall not be condemned. Forgive and you will be forgiven. Give, and it will be givent to you: good measure, pressed down, shaken together, and running over will be put into your bosom. For with the same measure that you use, it will be measured back to you.'" (Luke 6:37-38)

And do not forget that the previously mentioned scripture about the blind leading the blind is followed by Jesus' statement, "'And why do you look at the speck in your brother's eye, but do not perceive the plank in your own eye?'"
(Luke 6:41)

Peace.


_

 

[jiggyfly]

Luke 6:39-42

39*Then Jesus gave the following illustration: “What good is it for one blind person to lead another? The first one will fall into a ditch and pull the other down also. 40*A student is not greater than the teacher. But the student who works hard will become like the teacher.
41*“And why worry about a speck in your friend’s eye* when you have a log in your own? 42*How can you think of saying, ‘Friend,* let me help you get rid of that speck in your eye,’ when you can’t see past the log in your own eye? Hypocrite! First get rid of the log from your own eye; then perhaps you will see well enough to deal with the speck in your friend’s eye.

good scripture, To Christ but you left out part of the text.

 

[Singlemom]

I will listen to Joel Osteen and I listened to his parents before he was on. But since then, I have turned to other proved Bible preaching pastors like Dr. Charles Stanley, Chuck Swindoll, Dr. McArthur of the Master's Seminary, and others in the same category. I don't want to make it seem as if I was challenging what you all believed about Mr. Osteen, if you'll go to my first message about him, I said that I heard someone say he preached a social message (not exact quote). I don't know Mr.Osteen and don't find it appealing to listen to him. I will not back down from everything that I said, because God's word is firm, it tells us to watch out and stay away from any one who preaches heresies.
To be more exact, let's look at the book of Romans 16:

17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.
18 For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple. 19 For your obedience is come abroad unto all men. I am glad therefore on your behalf: but yet I would have you wise unto that which is good, and simple concerning evil.
I never said that he was a bad preacher, I simply added a word of caution. I wish that we all listened to solid Bible teaching. But the Word of God also says that in the last days many will have itching ears and even fall away (my own paraphrase).
If Joel Osteen brings you one step closer to becoming more Christ like, then so be it. If it turns your faith in to wishy washy faith, that's what I have a problem with. I trust that you all have the Spirit who will and is able to lead you into all truth, whether if be Benny Hinn or Joel Osteen, or Chuck Swindoll, or any other person who preaches God's word,we all need to discern whether what is being taught is in correlation with what God said.
But I simply caution everybody, for the believers of the TBN pastors who fell, also felt that they were being taught the truth.
I am sure (almost) that we are saying the same thing.????
God Bless you all my friends.:shade: