Liberalism

[Twistie]

Greetings,



or is it a will that has been captured and lied to that can not discern truth?

Let us remember we have been set free, delivered, quickened and our eyes opened. What and where were we prior to the Grace of God being poured abundantly upon us?

Enemies? Hostile? Darkness? Lost? Deceived? Empty? Poor? Dead in trespass and sin?

Let us give thanks to Him Who gave Himself that we might be free and partake in His Kingdom for eternity....

and be good stewards of His Grace to others

Jesus is the Lord


Bless you ....><>

It's free will.. one can twist up words change up words all one wants.. we are all given it even the angels had it or else they would of neva disobeyed Most Holy.. how is it mans pride got them thinking its ok to take what Most Holy gave us n throw it away...
Not everything born is of YH..Evil does what it is meant to do.. just Like YHs children do what they r meant to do..
Pro Life and pro Birth r two separate issues.. sadly many don't care about the Life they only care of a birth no matter the suffering the child will have to go thru.. people will cut n tube n paddle a baby even if he or she has no chance to even have life for their own selfish feelings n wants..

Perhaps many never had to deal with the situation or watch a 3 pound baby being tubes n stuck n cut opened just to keep the baby for a day.. perhaps they neva seen a baby born that had their brain mostly missing and will never b able able to talk never b able to communicate never b able to breath or their own but many who neva had to deal or see this will rather have a child suffer for a short time instead of have Mercy n compassion..

YH gave us free will n man can b as prideful as satan himself thinking they have the right to take what Most High gave n will b like satan accusing them without knowing the heart..

Js

I've seen to much out here I'm not sheltered like many js

One must take into account of everything n not knowing what is going on n making a judgement is not of YH it's the devil himself n the sin that dwells in man that's leading that man or woman

J.s.

Twistie

 

[Br. Bear]

Greetings Twistie,

It's free will.. one can twist up words change up words all one wants.. we are all given it even the angels had it or else they would of neva disobeyed Most Holy.. how is it mans pride got them thinking its ok to take what Most Holy gave us n throw it away...
Not everything born is of YH..Evil does what it is meant to do.. just Like YHs children do what they r meant to do..
Pro Life and pro Birth r two separate issues.. sadly many don't care about the Life they only care of a birth no matter the suffering the child will have to go thru.. people will cut n tube n paddle a baby even if he or she has no chance to even have life for their own selfish feelings n wants..

Perhaps many never had to deal with the situation or watch a 3 pound baby being tubes n stuck n cut opened just to keep the baby for a day.. perhaps they neva seen a baby born that had their brain mostly missing and will never b able able to talk never b able to communicate never b able to breath or their own but many who neva had to deal or see this will rather have a child suffer for a short time instead of have Mercy n compassion..

YH gave us free will n man can b as prideful as satan himself thinking they have the right to take what Most High gave n will b like satan accusing them without knowing the heart..

Js

I've seen to much out here I'm not sheltered like many js

One must take into account of everything n not knowing what is going on n making a judgement is not of YH it's the devil himself n the sin that dwells in man that's leading that man or woman

J.s.

Twistie

I do not know what Js, js or J.s. means and that totally throws your post into confusion.

Can you please explain gently to me because I am genuinely interested in understanding you.


Bless you ....><>

 

[lentz]

It's free will.. one can twist up words change up words all one wants.. we are all given it even the angels had it or else they would of neva disobeyed Most Holy.. how is it mans pride got them thinking its ok to take what Most Holy gave us n throw it away...
Not everything born is of YH..Evil does what it is meant to do.. just Like YHs children do what they r meant to do..
Pro Life and pro Birth r two separate issues.. sadly many don't care about the Life they only care of a birth no matter the suffering the child will have to go thru.. people will cut n tube n paddle a baby even if he or she has no chance to even have life for their own selfish feelings n wants..

Perhaps many never had to deal with the situation or watch a 3 pound baby being tubes n stuck n cut opened just to keep the baby for a day.. perhaps they neva seen a baby born that had their brain mostly missing and will never b able able to talk never b able to communicate never b able to breath or their own but many who neva had to deal or see this will rather have a child suffer for a short time instead of have Mercy n compassion..

YH gave us free will n man can b as prideful as satan himself thinking they have the right to take what Most High gave n will b like satan accusing them without knowing the heart..

Js

I've seen to much out here I'm not sheltered like many js

One must take into account of everything n not knowing what is going on n making a judgement is not of YH it's the devil himself n the sin that dwells in man that's leading that man or woman

J.s.

Twistie

Even compassion no matter how sincere is not reason for murder

 

[Twistie]

Greetings Twistie,



I do not know what Js, js or J.s. means and that totally throws your post into confusion.

Can you please explain gently to me because I am genuinely interested in understanding you.


Bless you ....><>

Greetings Twistie,



I do not know what Js, js or J.s. means and that totally throws your post into confusion.

Can you please explain gently to me because I am genuinely interested in understanding you.


Bless you ....><>

Good Morning
J.s. just saying my son is teaching me what the abbreviations means lol j s is one of the few I can remember

Twistie

 

[Br. Bear]

Good Morning
J.s. just saying my son is teaching me what the abbreviations means lol j s is one of the few I can remember

Twistie

OK,

thank you ....><>

 

[Twistie]

Even compassion no matter how sincere is not reason for murder

Says u... For Knowledge n Mercy is desired over all else.. torturing one for ones own selfish reasons shows just how selfish n evil man truly is..

But then again some think being able to breathe because of a machine is having life

Twistie

 

[Br. Bear]

Greetings,

It's free will..

'free will' has been discussed a number of times at TalkJesus so while I do not wish to derail the thread, I would like to both ask a question and to submit a couple of bits that would appear to be suitable for this thread.

Question:
Do we find in Scripture any definite word that supports the doctrine of 'free will'?


Couple of bits:

Choosing is often a proof of free will. However, if we look at 'free' (to choose), where and when is one (or all) free?
Making a decision can be 1) doing it my way; 2) doing it God's way.
1) can be from totally self orientated to thinking it is God's way
2) can only be doing it God's way.

How do we choose or decide?

Is how we choose (or decide) different from before we believed to after?

When we use liberty, what instructions have we in the Bible?

Each of these questions need to be answered if we honestly want to make a doctrine of 'free will'.

Disobedience is rebellion against the LORD. IF we have been given complete free will (although I have not seen that doctrine in the New Testament) would that be considered fair and just of God because exercising 'our free will' should not be something that we ought to be judged (by the Lord) for, which means that every sin Jesus suffered and died for could be excused. This, of course, is wrong.

Imagine, if you can, God explains to Adam, you're free to choose...
He would have to add some clauses limiting the use of it. Trouble with that idea is that we do not have account of that in Scripture.
What we do have is God commanding obedience. We might choose to disobey but choosing is the act of disobedience already.
God's command did not come with options. In the Garden, the command was given with understanding of why the command was given.

So, suggesting mothers have free will, as you have done, is not the truth.
Those blind and walking in darkness think they are on the right path if they think so.
Those upon whom the Light has appeared have surrendered their will and flesh to Him Who is to be obeyed.

There are no gray/grey areas.

Therefore, if we begin our proposal in matters like you have, and base it on the wrong foundation, the whole building is dangerous to invite or suggest others to find truth in .... and life.

You may mean well but that can be no basis; if it's okay for you then it's okay for all ..... and when considering matters like the life of others, all killers could justify themselves.

I am sure that you believe that it is always best to trust the Lord. Has He forgotten to let us know His will regarding babies, so we are left to exercise free will and decide for OURselves or can we, in obedience, trust Him with the lives of all?

The world is in darkness. That is why this topic is before us. Much what we might call tragedy and sadness but should that be reason enough to turn the lights out on others, to snuff out their candles.

Let us stop playing god.


Jesus is the Lord


Bless you ....><>

 

[Twistie]

Greetings,



'free will' has been discussed a number of times at TalkJesus so while I do not wish to derail the thread, I would like to both ask a question and to submit a couple of bits that would appear to be suitable for this thread.

Question:
Do we find in Scripture any definite word that supports the doctrine of 'free will'?


Couple of bits:

Choosing is often a proof of free will. However, if we look at 'free' (to choose), where and when is one (or all) free?
Making a decision can be 1) doing it my way; 2) doing it God's way.
1) can be from totally self orientated to thinking it is God's way
2) can only be doing it God's way.

How do we choose or decide?

Is how we choose (or decide) different from before we believed to after?

When we use liberty, what instructions have we in the Bible?

Each of these questions need to be answered if we honestly want to make a doctrine of 'free will'.

Disobedience is rebellion against the LORD. IF we have been given complete free will (although I have not seen that doctrine in the New Testament) would that be considered fair and just of God because exercising 'our free will' should not be something that we ought to be judged (by the Lord) for, which means that every sin Jesus suffered and died for could be excused. This, of course, is wrong.

Imagine, if you can, God explains to Adam, you're free to choose...
He would have to add some clauses limiting the use of it. Trouble with that idea is that we do not have account of that in Scripture.
What we do have is God commanding obedience. We might choose to disobey but choosing is the act of disobedience already.
God's command did not come with options. In the Garden, the command was given with understanding of why the command was given.

So, suggesting mothers have free will, as you have done, is not the truth.
Those blind and walking in darkness think they are on the right path if they think so.
Those upon whom the Light has appeared have surrendered their will and flesh to Him Who is to be obeyed.

There are no gray/grey areas.

Therefore, if we begin our proposal in matters like you have, and base it on the wrong foundation, the whole building is dangerous to invite or suggest others to find truth in .... and life.

You may mean well but that can be no basis; if it's okay for you then it's okay for all ..... and when considering matters like the life of others, all killers could justify themselves.

I am sure that you believe that it is always best to trust the Lord. Has He forgotten to let us know His will regarding babies, so we are left to exercise free will and decide for OURselves or can we, in obedience, trust Him with the lives of all?

The world is in darkness. That is why this topic is before us. Much what we might call tragedy and sadness but should that be reason enough to turn the lights out on others, to snuff out their candles.

Let us stop playing god.


Jesus is the Lord


Bless you ....><>

Some Hear some wanna debate I hear.. if free will was non existent then you would of neva been able to do evil n neither would the angels..

The Truth blinds some. Sure hope ya ain't one of them..

I gotta run hubby had emergency surgery for a blocked n perferated bowl sepsis and failing kidneys . Surely hope ya able to see the Truth tho


Twistie

 

[B-A-C]

Question:
Do we find in Scripture any definite word that supports the doctrine of 'free will'?

I'm pretty sure I could find a few, but the alternative to no free will is... when we sin, God makes us sin. After all we had no free-will in the matter.
When people reject God and refuse to believe in Jesus, they can stand before God on the judgment day, and say "I had no choice in the matter, you made me choose this way".

Imagine, if you can, God explains to Adam, you're free to choose...
He would have to add some clauses limiting the use of it. Trouble with that idea is that we do not have account of that in Scripture.

But we do...

Gen 2:17; but from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat from it you will surely die."
Gen 3:3; but from the fruit of the tree which is in the middle of the garden, God has said, 'You shall not eat from it or touch it, or you will die.'"

 

[Br. Bear]

Greetings,

I gotta run hubby had emergency surgery for a blocked n perferated bowl sepsis and failing kidneys .


Twistie

be praying ....><>

 

[Br. Bear]

Greetings,

I'm pretty sure I could find a few,

Can you please do that?


Bless you ....><>

 

[B-A-C]

(although I have not seen that doctrine in the New Testament)

Jas 1:13; Let no one say when he is tempted, "I am being tempted by God"; for God cannot be tempted by evil, and He Himself does not tempt anyone.
Jas 1:14; But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust.

Matt 11:14; "And if you are willing to accept it, John himself is Elijah who was to come.

Mark 14:38; "Keep watching and praying that you may not come into temptation; the spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak."

Luke 15:28; "But he became angry and was not willing to go in; and his father came out and began pleading with him.
Luke 22:42; saying, "Father, if You are willing, remove this cup from Me; yet not My will, but Yours be done."
John 5:35; "He was the lamp that was burning and was shining and you were willing to rejoice for a while in his light.

John 7:17; "If anyone is willing to do His will, he will know of the teaching, whether it is of God or whether I speak from Myself.

1Thes 4:8; So, he who rejects this is not rejecting man but the God who gives His Holy Spirit to you.

Matt 23:37; "Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, the way a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were unwilling.

Acts 7:51; "You men who are stiff-necked and uncircumcised in heart and ears are always resisting the Holy Spirit; you are doing just as your fathers did.

Rev 2:21; 'I gave her time to repent, and she does not want to repent of her immorality.

Matt 7:21; "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter.

1Tim 2:3; This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior,
1Tim 2:4; who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

If it's God's will that all men be saved, then why aren't they?

2Pet 3:9; The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.

Finally, I ask again.. if you believe there is no free-will, then do you believe God makes people sin?

 

[MedicBravo]

It's free will.. one can twist up words change up words all one wants.. we are all given it even the angels had it or else they would of neva disobeyed Most Holy.. how is it mans pride got them thinking its ok to take what Most Holy gave us n throw it away...
Not everything born is of YH..Evil does what it is meant to do.. just Like YHs children do what they r meant to do..
Pro Life and pro Birth r two separate issues.. sadly many don't care about the Life they only care of a birth no matter the suffering the child will have to go thru.. people will cut n tube n paddle a baby even if he or she has no chance to even have life for their own selfish feelings n wants..

Perhaps many never had to deal with the situation or watch a 3 pound baby being tubes n stuck n cut opened just to keep the baby for a day.. perhaps they neva seen a baby born that had their brain mostly missing and will never b able able to talk never b able to communicate never b able to breath or their own but many who neva had to deal or see this will rather have a child suffer for a short time instead of have Mercy n compassion..

YH gave us free will n man can b as prideful as satan himself thinking they have the right to take what Most High gave n will b like satan accusing them without knowing the heart..

Js

I've seen to much out here I'm not sheltered like many js

One must take into account of everything n not knowing what is going on n making a judgement is not of YH it's the devil himself n the sin that dwells in man that's leading that man or woman

J.s.

Twistie

He created all things. Evil was not the intention or goal. It is the absence of good. Dark isn't evil it is the absence of light. Some things simply "are" without His or our involvement.
Evil can never create only ruin and destroy.
Disagreement is not hate but humanity while we are an awesome species/people are very stubborn, prone to accidents, clumsy, ignorant, selfish, among other things. Humans are easily swayed by pride and narcissism.

 

[lentz]

He created all things. Evil was not the intention or goal. It is the absence of good. Dark isn't evil it is the absence of light. Some things simply "are" without His or our involvement.
Evil can never create only ruin and destroy.
Disagreement is not hate but humanity while we are an awesome species/people are very stubborn, prone to accidents, clumsy, ignorant, selfish, among other things. Humans are easily swayed by pride and narcissism.

God says in brother Isaiah’s book that he created evil,he created good,he created light and he created dark.
Explain what he meant there.

 

[lentz]

I don’t see how anyone can read Romans and not see freewill,

 

[B-A-C]

Rom 9:9; For this is the word of promise: "AT THIS TIME I WILL COME, AND SARAH SHALL HAVE A SON."
Rom 9:10; And not only this, but there was Rebekah also, when she had conceived twins by one man, our father Isaac;
Rom 9:11; for though the twins were not yet born and had not done anything good or bad, so that God's purpose according to His choice would stand, not because of works but because of Him who calls,
Rom 9:12; it was said to her, "THE OLDER WILL SERVE THE YOUNGER."
Rom 9:13; Just as it is written, "JACOB I LOVED, BUT ESAU I HATED."
Rom 9:14; What shall we say then? There is no injustice with God, is there? May it never be!
Rom 9:15; For He says to Moses, "I WILL HAVE MERCY ON WHOM I HAVE MERCY, AND I WILL HAVE COMPASSION ON WHOM I HAVE COMPASSION."
Rom 9:16; So then it does not depend on the man who wills or the man who runs, but on God who has mercy.
Rom 9:17; For the Scripture says to Pharaoh, "FOR THIS VERY PURPOSE I RAISED YOU UP, TO DEMONSTRATE MY POWER IN YOU, AND THAT MY NAME MIGHT BE PROCLAIMED THROUGHOUT THE WHOLE EARTH."
Rom 9:18; So then He has mercy on whom He desires, and He hardens whom He desires.
Rom 9:19; You will say to me then, "Why does He still find fault? For who resists His will?"
Rom 9:20; On the contrary, who are you, O man, who answers back to God? The thing molded will not say to the molder, "Why did you make me like this," will it?
Rom 9:21; Or does not the potter have a right over the clay, to make from the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for common use?

This passage in Romans, is probably the hardest to reconcile free-will with. At this point I can only say, in some things, what God has predestined to happen, will happen, no matter what.
But in other things, we have the capacity to make our own decisions. I don't think it's an all or none thing.

 

[Twistie]

Greetings,



be praying ....><>

Thanks! May YHs will be done n not ours

Twistie

 

[Twistie]

He created all things. Evil was not the intention or goal. It is the absence of good. Dark isn't evil it is the absence of light. Some things simply "are" without His or our involvement.
Evil can never create only ruin and destroy.
Disagreement is not hate but humanity while we are an awesome species/people are very stubborn, prone to accidents, clumsy, ignorant, selfish, among other things. Humans are easily swayed by pride and narcissism.

Selfishness causes much unnecessary suffering

Twistie

 

[Twistie]

Greetings,



'free will' has been discussed a number of times at TalkJesus so while I do not wish to derail the thread, I would like to both ask a question and to submit a couple of bits that would appear to be suitable for this thread.

Question:
Do we find in Scripture any definite word that supports the doctrine of 'free will'?


Couple of bits:

Choosing is often a proof of free will. However, if we look at 'free' (to choose), where and when is one (or all) free?
Making a decision can be 1) doing it my way; 2) doing it God's way.
1) can be from totally self orientated to thinking it is God's way
2) can only be doing it God's way.

How do we choose or decide?

Is how we choose (or decide) different from before we believed to after?

When we use liberty, what instructions have we in the Bible?

Each of these questions need to be answered if we honestly want to make a doctrine of 'free will'.

Disobedience is rebellion against the LORD. IF we have been given complete free will (although I have not seen that doctrine in the New Testament) would that be considered fair and just of God because exercising 'our free will' should not be something that we ought to be judged (by the Lord) for, which means that every sin Jesus suffered and died for could be excused. This, of course, is wrong.

Imagine, if you can, God explains to Adam, you're free to choose...
He would have to add some clauses limiting the use of it. Trouble with that idea is that we do not have account of that in Scripture.
What we do have is God commanding obedience. We might choose to disobey but choosing is the act of disobedience already.
God's command did not come with options. In the Garden, the command was given with understanding of why the command was given.

So, suggesting mothers have free will, as you have done, is not the truth.
Those blind and walking in darkness think they are on the right path if they think so.
Those upon whom the Light has appeared have surrendered their will and flesh to Him Who is to be obeyed.

There are no gray/grey areas.

Therefore, if we begin our proposal in matters like you have, and base it on the wrong foundation, the whole building is dangerous to invite or suggest others to find truth in .... and life.

You may mean well but that can be no basis; if it's okay for you then it's okay for all ..... and when considering matters like the life of others, all killers could justify themselves.

I am sure that you believe that it is always best to trust the Lord. Has He forgotten to let us know His will regarding babies, so we are left to exercise free will and decide for OURselves or can we, in obedience, trust Him with the lives of all?

The world is in darkness. That is why this topic is before us. Much what we might call tragedy and sadness but should that be reason enough to turn the lights out on others, to snuff out their candles.

Let us stop playing god.


Jesus is the Lord


Bless you ....><>

I highly doubt also YH would state

Do not swerve to the right or to the left; turn your foot away from evil..
N
If my people which are called by My name should humble themselves and pray n seek My Face and Turn from their wicked ways then will I hear them

He don't say when He says if n He don't say You won't swerve He warns us not to..

We have free will to do what we want.. Do u think YH wants to force Love?? If that was the case He wouldn't of had to deal with the downfall of the angels [/FONT]


Twistie

 

[Brad Huber]

Thanks! May YHs will be done n not ours

Twistie

So few can see this, they feel they need a certain person alive and well in the body or their world will fall apart. We only truly need the Lord, for He see's to our needs, and our body is only temporary and wanting people to hang around for our own sake is sort of selfish. That being said, I am a bit selfish and I want my wife to hang around longer, but its His will that should prevail, not my own.