Mother Mary

[Charlie24]

There is indeed, no scripture which says Mary is the mother of God...The doctrine is based on logic, albeit weak logic....Mary is the mother of Jesus physically. no doubt. Jesus as God existed eternally before Mary was ever born...So that same logic would preclude her to being the mother of God. As I said before, a Mary was blessed in that she became the portal by which Jesus could enter the world.

I do understand how many Christians do not understand the legalities involved, the churches do not teach that, among many things the churches do not teach that they should, but legally God could not just enter the world without a body....at the time, as now, Satan is lord in the earth....If you read Genesis you will read how God gave dominion in and of the Earth to Adam, then you will read how Adam gave it over to satan when he bowed his knee to satan....satan has dominion in the Earth then and now, like it or not.....Good news though, Jesus took that dominion from satan and gave it back to us. Now His people have dominion of the Earth and we can send Satan packing....if we will believe the Word

Let it be know though. I have a great admiration for Bill here. He stands alone on this doctrine of Mary being the mother of God. He is standing strong for his beliefs, standing true like a good soldier. I pray that he will learn the truth of the thing, and will see the truth of it. I'm proud of you Bill.

The entire problem with Mary stems from the CC tradition that she ascended into heaven bodily after her death, with some saying she never even died.

There is nothing in Scripture that even hints at this, but yet Catholicism places her as a sort of Mediator for the believer.

 

[Bill]

Bill you have once again avoided showing the scipture that you claim to exist that Jesus called Mary mother, it does not exist, you simply can not produce scripture to support your claim.

Bill the word of God scripture is the final authority on spiritual matters, not the catholic church as they claim, not the pope, not your heart not your mind scripture, if you claim something is in scripture and do not produce or apologize for the mis statement well then it is clear as day what this means. Blessings and peace to you in Jesus name

You said it yourself in your very own words, " the word of God Scripture is the final Authority". I rest my case.

Do you know who it is who spoke to Moses," I am who am"? do you know who it was that told Noah to build the ark? Do you know who it was that Abraham argued with on behalf of those who lived in Sodom and Gomorrah?

It was Jesus.

Do you know how I know this to be a fact?

Jesus stated that he is the Alpha and the Omega. He also stated that he and the Father are One.

And most importantly, he said, no one can go to the father but through me.

The words of Jesus are Eternal words as he is an eternal being. That means what he says while he was on Earth that no one can go to the father but through me, was the same from the beginning of time to the end of time.

It is because of this that I know for a fact that it was Jesus who spoke to Abraham to Moses to Noah and all the rest in the Old Testament. As it says in Scripture that they did not recognize him. And it's only because he wasn't revealed to them at that time.

Now we have Jesus revealed to us. But the problem that Christians are making is they forget that Jesus is not just the physical being that he always was and always will be. And you are forgetting that the scripture that you read is actually Jesus in the word. Even Chad would tell you that.

So everything that you read is already the word of Jesus in his own words. This is my argument with you David that you do not see that the words that you are reading in the scripture is actually the words of Jesus, in his own words.

As I told you before your argument isn't with me nor is it with the Catholic Church. Your argument is against the scripture and with God.

All that you have done here to argue with me is to prove that you're denying the fact that Jesus is the scripture that you read every day. Because you haven't been able to see Jesus in the word.

 

[Bill]

There's a huge problem that you guys are creating for yourselves. This is why in the world are you calling yourself Christians, when you are not even acknowledging that Jesus is actually the very scripture that you're reading. Obviously the book that we called the Bible is not God but it's Jesus that's written within. It's Jesus who is the word, The Living Word. We know that Jesus is eternal, we know that Jesus is God we know that Jesus and God the Father are One.

To sit there and deny anything that is written in the scripture as being not said by Jesus, would be denying that Jesus actually is God.

Regardless of who says what it's still Jesus that is speaking. Don't you say it in your own churches this is the Word of the Lord?

Maybe I should start talking to you with kid gloves on, because I thought we were mature Christians here. But I'm thinking that maybe we're not, and the fundamentals are being completely missed.

 

[Bill]

Okay so let's look at your questions. The one question that everybody keeps complaining about Mary the mother of God.

What can be more clear, where the Holy Spirit inspires Elizabeth.

There are a few things here, first what do you really believe in?

Do you believe that the Holy Spirit the Father and Jesus are One? If you do not believe this why call yourselves Christian

Another thing, do you really believe that Jesus is the one who inspired the authors of the scripture to write the scripture? If you do not believe that why call yourself Christian?

Because these simple things are parts of the fundamentals of what it is to be Christian.

There are other things that I know you do not follow that would really beg other people outside of Christianity to wonder why you consider yourself Christian. Because they are the very things that Jesus tells us to do.

And the excuse has always been it's because the Catholics do it. Which is a little bit crazy when you think of the timeline, that all of these things that took place in the scripture are well before the Roman Catholic Church ever existed. Yet the Catholics do all these things that Jesus tells us to do. Whether it's in Scripture, or tradition, or the spoken word of Jesus himself. And you condemn us for following the scripture.

You claim to be Christians, but you run from following the words of Jesus, the Traditions that Paul talks about, and the Very words of Jesus himself. You run from all this and blame it on the Catholics. There is one word for that, hypocrites.

But I forgive you, because I see you as my brothers and sisters. And may the love of God fill you always

 

[rstrats]

It was in Jesus's own words that he referred to her as mother.

As another poster touched on, I'm not aware of any scripture which has the Messiah doing that. What do you have in mind?

 

[Bill]

As another poster touched on, I'm not aware of any scripture which has the Messiah doing that. What do you have in mind?

Who's words does the scripture belong to?

 

[Bill]

As another poster touched on, I'm not aware of any scripture which has the Messiah doing that. What do you have in mind?

Who's words does the scripture belong to?

 

[rstrats]

Who's words does the scripture belong to?

To what scripture are you referring? What scripture do you have where the Messiah refers to Mary as His mother?

 

[Brad Huber]

To what scripture are you referring? What scripture do you have where the Messiah refers to Mary as His mother?

John 19:25-27 How is it that you know so many things about scripture and are clueless about this?

 

[rstrats]

John 19:25-27 How is it that you know so many things about scripture and are clueless about this?

Not clueless at all. No where in John 19:25-27 does the Messiah refer to Mary as His mother. And He knows the word, because He tells the disciple to look at his (the disciple's) mother.

 

[Brad Huber]

Not clueless at all. No where in John 19:25-27 does the Messiah refer to Mary as His mother. And He knows the word, because He tells the disciple to look at his (the disciple's) mother.

Jesus IS the word of God!!!!!!! So even though He doesnt call her mother there, she is called His mother by the words printed there. Are you so blind to this?

 

[Hekuran]

I'm struggling to see what's at stake here. Even if – for some bizzare reason – Jesus never called his own mother "Mother", so what? Is there some obscure doctrine or theological point that hangs on this?

 

[rstrats]

I'm struggling to see what's at stake here. Even if – for some bizzare reason – Jesus never called his own mother "Mother", so what? Is there some obscure doctrine or theological point that hangs on this?

Bill made the statements that the Messiah called Mary His mother, and that It was in the Messiah's own words that He referred to her as mother. I was merely questioning that since I am not of aware of any scripture where the Messiah does that. That's all. For the purpose of this topic don't try to read anything else into it.

 

[rstrats]

Jesus IS the word of God!!!!!!! So even though He doesnt call her mother there, she is called His mother by the words printed there. Are you so blind to this?

Of course not. Where have I said that others haven't called her the Messiah's mother?

 

[Hekuran]

Bill made the statements that the Messiah called Mary His mother, and that It was in the Messiah's own words that He referred to her as mother. I was merely questioning that since I am not of aware of any scripture where the Messiah does that. That's all. For the purpose of this topic don't try to read anything else into it.

So a discussion with no purpose or object at all? Surely the time could be spent better?

 

[rstrats]

So a discussion with no purpose or object at all? Surely the time could be spent better?

If a specific purpose is necessary in order to comment on a poster's statement, I suppose it could be to inform the poster of his error so that he doesn't make it again in the future.

 

[Bill]

If a specific purpose is necessary in order to comment on a poster's statement, I suppose it could be to inform the poster of his error so that he doesn't make it again in the future.

I'm trying to point out, that the very words that you read, the Bible, is the words of Jesus. Now we all claim that, but who really believes that? Do you believe that Jesus is the one who is the Word? The word of God?

Gospel of John chapter 1- 1 In the beginning was the word the Word was with God and the Word was God.
Gospel of John chapter 1- 14 the Word was made flesh and He lived among us.

Now if you don't believe those passages, you have no business calling yourself a Christian

 

[Bill]

The scripture is the Word of God, and it is the Word of God that told us that he had to leave so that the Holy Spirit could come and teach us.

 

[rstrats]

I'm trying to point out, that the very words that you read, the Bible, is the words of Jesus.

I guess you're going to have to try harder because I have no idea what you're saying with regard to any verses where the Messiah personally addresses Mary as His mother. How about an example where you think that He does.

 

[Bill]

They read and read, but fail to see