There is no trinity in John 1:1

[Admon Mikha'el]

I don't think it was me that misunderstood anything. Every time the phrase "firstborn" is used in the Bible it is talking about the first of a group, just like it does when it says that Jesus is the "firstborn of many brethren" in Romans 8:29. He is one of the group. When it says in Col1:15 that Jesus is the firstborn of all creation it means that he is one of the creation. So yes, this verse shows clearly that Jesus was a creation/created and if he was created he had a beginning. God had no beginning. If you really believe Jesus then just believe what he said when he said his Father is the only true God and many other place where he said he was inferior the Father.

Strong's gives this meaning to the word translated as creation:
the act of founding, establishing, building etc
the act of creating, creation
creation i.e. thing created
of individual things, beings, a creature, a creation
anything created

Ok Now put your vast intellect aside and see what the Holy Spirit says to you. He is your teacher, not your intellect

My favorite version reads it this way

Colossians 1:14-16
14 It is through his Son that we have redemption — that is, our sins have been forgiven. 15 He is the visible image of the invisible God. He is supreme over all creation, 16 because in connection with him were created all things — in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones, lordships, rulers or authorities — they have all been created through him and for him.

Yes. You probably did misunderstand....No judgement from me though.​

 

[Searchingtoo]

Ok Now put your vast intellect aside and see what the Holy Spirit says to you. He is your teacher, not your intellect

My favorite version reads it this way

Colossians 1:14-16​

14 It is through his Son that we have redemption — that is, our sins have been forgiven. 15 He is the visible image of the invisible God. He is supreme over all creation, 16 because in connection with him were created all things — in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones, lordships, rulers or authorities — they have all been created through him and for him.​

​

Yes. You probably did misunderstand....No judgement from me though.​

I'm sorry you feel you need to use a version that doesn't even resemble what the verse really says. I don't even know where you could have found such a translation. I hope you have a great day but I'm really not interested in discussing this any further.

 

[Searchingtoo]

.

Hey Butch, I was kicked off for a week or two for what they called "promoting JW beliefs", but all I was doing was quoting scriptures. If they were verses that agreed with JW's I can't help that. I think they don't really want an open forum unless you agree with them???

 

[Butch5]

Hey Butch, I was kicked off for a week or two for what they called "promoting JW beliefs", but all I was doing was quoting scriptures. If they were verses that agreed with JW's I can't help that. I think they don't really want an open forum unless you agree with them???

.

 

[Butch5]

Ok Now put your vast intellect aside and see what the Holy Spirit says to you. He is your teacher, not your intellect

My favorite version reads it this way

Colossians 1:14-16​

14 It is through his Son that we have redemption — that is, our sins have been forgiven. 15 He is the visible image of the invisible God. He is supreme over all creation, 16 because in connection with him were created all things — in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones, lordships, rulers or authorities — they have all been created through him and for him.​

​

Yes. You probably did misunderstand....No judgement from me though.​

But you're reading a translation that was written from a man's intellect.

Without our intellect how do we know it's the Holy Spirit and not another Spirit that is speaking?

 

[Christ4Ever]

Hey Butch, I was kicked off for a week or two for what they called "promoting JW beliefs", but all I was doing was quoting scriptures. If they were verses that agreed with JW's I can't help that. I think they don't really want an open forum unless you agree with them???

Dear Member Searchingtoo
Now I could easily say that you are seditious in nature by the question you posed to Brother Butch, because you disagree with being warned and then temporarily banned.
When you are asked not to do something and you do it anyway, are we to let you go about your day with no consequences?

Now to be blunt. Are you a follower/member of the Jehovah's Witness Denomination?
A simple yes or no will suffice.

Regardless, of your answer, take care in the future of how you respond after being given a warning.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
Moderator
Nick
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[Admon Mikha'el]

I'm sorry you feel you need to use a version that doesn't even resemble what the verse really says. I don't even know where you could have found such a translation. I hope you have a great day but I'm really not interested in discussing this any further.

Oh Good!!! You are rather stubborn with your opinions. Have a good day

 

[Searchingtoo]

Dear Member Searchingtoo
Now I could easily say that you are seditious in nature by the question you posed to Brother Butch, because you disagree with being warned and then temporarily banned.
When you are asked not to do something and you do it anyway, are we to let you go about your day with no consequences?

Now to be blunt. Are you a follower/member of the Jehovah's Witness Denomination?
A simple yes or no will suffice.

Regardless, of your answer, take care in the future of how you respond after being given a warning.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
Moderator
Nick
\o/
<><

No to your question, but I don't understand why you allow other's to discuss the trinity but you object to my doing so. If it's because it goes against what you believe that seems to shut down bible discussions unless everyone believes in the trinity, which I and some others do not. My life doesn't revolve around the message board but I do enjoy discussing my and others beliefs because there are different beliefs. By the way, what do you have against JW?

 

[Christ4Ever]

No to your question, but I don't understand why you allow other's to discuss the trinity but you object to my doing so. If it's because it goes against what you believe that seems to shut down bible discussions unless everyone believes in the trinity, which I and some others do not. My life doesn't revolve around the message board but I do enjoy discussing my and others beliefs because there are different beliefs. By the way, what do you have against JW?

Dear Searchingtoo,
You and the others are not the first and I fear not the last to come to Talk Jesus, that have anti-trinitarian leanings. It is only when they actively seek to bring down this doctrine of belief on a site that they have voluntarily joined and do so, in spite of the fact that they know it believes otherwise is the reason for the attention given them. It takes time to clean out the nest, but eventually it gets done. I do appreciate your concern but that is why I believe that you will eventually be banned, because like most who adhere to certain doctrines, they will not be able to help themselves from replying to something that even has the whiff of being contrary to their own belief as it pertains in this case to the Trinity.

Thank-you for answering my question. As far as the JW Cult. That is sufficient in itself.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
Moderator
Nick
\o/
<><

 

[Searchingtoo]

Dear Searchingtoo,
You and the others are not the first and I fear not the last to come to Talk Jesus, that have anti-trinitarian leanings. It is only when they actively seek to bring down this doctrine of belief on a site that they have voluntarily joined and do so, in spite of the fact that they know it believes otherwise is the reason for the attention given them. It takes time to clean out the nest, but eventually it gets done. I do appreciate your concern but that is why I believe that you will eventually be banned, because like most who adhere to certain doctrines, they will not be able to help themselves from replying to something that even has the whiff of being contrary to their own belief as it pertains in this case to the Trinity.

Thank-you for answering my question. As far as the JW Cult. That is sufficient in itself.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
Moderator
Nick
\o/
<><

You tell me, is the glass half full or half empty or does it just depend on if you look at it from above or below. I was on another site. I don't think it was this one?? A church pastor and a group of his parishioners open-mindedly took a whole year to study the trinity and concluded it was a false doctrine. Most people are not open minded when it comes to scriptures but rather prefer to believe what they were taught to believe. I on the other hand was a died in the wool born again Christian when I came to the same conclusion as the group I just mentioned. As Popeye once said. you bets your money you takes your chances.

 

[Searchingtoo]

Oh Good!!! You are rather stubborn with your opinions. Have a good day

And you're not.

 

[Christ4Ever]

You tell me, is the glass half full or half empty or does it just depend on if you look at it from above or below. I was on another site. I don't think it was this one?? A church pastor and a group of his parishioners open-mindedly took a whole year to study the trinity and concluded it was a false doctrine. Most people are not open minded when it comes to scriptures but rather prefer to believe what they were taught to believe. I on the other hand was a died in the wool born again Christian when I came to the same conclusion as the group I just mentioned. As Popeye once said. you bets your money you takes your chances.

Dear Member Searchingtoo,
Your option was clear if what you say is true. You could have stayed on that site that was so open to you and the doctrine you believe to be true instead of coming here and insisting that whatever you decide to post is acceptable, in spite of being warned to the contrary.

Now your options are to go back to the site that was so accommodating to you and your beliefs, adhere to the warning you have been given and not post anti-trinitarian content and enjoy your stay, or continue to disregard the warning given, and be banned.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
Moderator
Nick
\o/
<><

 

[Searchingtoo]

Dear Member Searchingtoo,
Your option was clear if what you say is true. You could have stayed on that site that was so open to you and the doctrine you believe to be true instead of coming here and insisting that whatever you decide to post is acceptable, in spite of being warned to the contrary.

Now your options are to go back to the site that was so accommodating to you and your beliefs, adhere to the warning you have been given and not post anti-trinitarian content and enjoy your stay, or continue to disregard the warning given, and be banned.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
Moderator
Nick
\o/
<><

There are 50 such sites according to google but I haven't checked. I have spoken personally with a couple Baptist preachers, two Assembly of God, one Church of Christ and one independent Pentecostal and a couple Methodist and one missionary to Africa and they all either agreed with me after an hour or so or just refused to talk about it. This will be my last comment here because you don't really want to hear the truth, only what you want to hear. I guess that's you prerogative but you're only kidding yourself.

 

[Christ4Ever]

There are 50 such sites according to google but I haven't checked. I have spoken personally with a couple Baptist preachers, two Assembly of God, one Church of Christ and one independent Pentecostal and a couple Methodist and one missionary to Africa and they all either agreed with me after an hour or so or just refused to talk about it. This will be my last comment here because you don't really want to hear the truth, only what you want to hear. I guess that's you prerogative but you're only kidding yourself.

Dear Member Searchingtoo,
So, you clearly have a wide selection of different sites you can go to that will gladly welcome the doctrine you believe to be true and may even have Statement of Faith that are agreeable to that same belief. That is not the case here and is something you fail to recognize in all that you have said.

You do not go into another's house and make it your own, unless you happen to be a squatter or a thief. You are believing that this is your house, and that all queries are acceptable to be entertained, even when told that they are not, does not speak well of you regardless of how many you are able to convert to what you believe to be true. For ultimately that is the point of your disenchantment, and why you will leave, voluntarily, I hope. For I take no pleasure in banning anyone and is the reason I have given you plenty opportunity to accept the limits of what you are to discuss and thereby stay.

So, with your permission I will request of our Administrator to have your account closed. May you fare well in your travels.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
Moderator
Nick
\o/
<><

 

[Admon Mikha'el]

I'm sorry you feel you need to use a version that doesn't even resemble what the verse really says. I don't even know where you could have found such a translation. I hope you have a great day but I'm really not interested in discussing this any further.

I'm sorry you don't believe the Bible...Its Gods own Word so you do not believe Him

 

[Searchingtoo]

Dear Member Searchingtoo,
So, you clearly have a wide selection of different sites you can go to that will gladly welcome the doctrine you believe to be true and may even have Statement of Faith that are agreeable to that same belief. That is not the case here and is something you fail to recognize in all that you have said.

You do not go into another's house and make it your own, unless you happen to be a squatter or a thief. You are believing that this is your house, and that all queries are acceptable to be entertained, even when told that they are not, does not speak well of you regardless of how many you are able to convert to what you believe to be true. For ultimately that is the point of your disenchantment, and why you will leave, voluntarily, I hope. For I take no pleasure in banning anyone and is the reason I have given you plenty opportunity to accept the limits of what you are to discuss and thereby stay.

So, with your permission I will request of our Administrator to have your account closed. May you fare well in your travels.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
Moderator
Nick
\o/
<><

This site seems to be your baby, but it's not mine. I've enjoyed my visit and hold no ill feelings towards you or anyone else. I knew it was just a short visit when I first joined and it served my purpose. I don't spend much time on any of these sites but do enjoy the discourse, but it usually ends with everyone stuck in their theology. Reminds me of the Democrat/Republican debates. The twain shall never meet, and so it is. Too bad.

I never considered this "my house" and could care less. I've been on a few other sites like this but none of them ever restricted what you could discuss as Lon as you were civil, which I think I was. Anyway, don't give me a second thought because I'm of no importance.

Thanks for the fare well, but my travels are about over and now I just enjoy one day at a time.

 

[Christ4Ever]

Dear Searchingtoo,
If by your remark in saying "baby" is meant to reflect how much I love, and care for those who have not just put the site together years ago, but those who have maintained it, and the faithful who have come here over the years to break bread and grow in His Word, then I take it as a compliment! For I do love them dearly and cherish the back and forth in iron sharpening iron that has gone on here through its many modifications.

For the site itself is but a platform for what I have always considered it to be and call it descriptive wise as an Oasis. A place of respite against the ever-darkening content that one comes across on the Webb where believers, and those who are truly searching can find the joy that is in the Lord Jesus Christ, my Savior.

As for the rest of your comments. In truth they are just more of a reflection that you clearly did not understand what was being communicated to you by me as a Moderator.

I do hope that your travels fare well for you. Be they a day, a week, month, or until our Lord Returns or calls you home.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
Moderator
Nick
\o/
<><

 

[Searchingtoo]

I'm sorry you don't believe the Bible...Its Gods own Word so you do not believe Him

Dear Searchingtoo,
If by your remark in saying "baby" is meant to reflect how much I love, and care for those who have not just put the site together years ago, but those who have maintained it, and the faithful who have come here over the years to break bread and grow in His Word, then I take it as a compliment! For I do love them dearly and cherish the back and forth in iron sharpening iron that has gone on here through its many modifications.

For the site itself is but a platform for what I have always considered it to be and call it descriptive wise as an Oasis. A place of respite against the ever-darkening content that one comes across on the Webb where believers, and those who are truly searching can find the joy that is in the Lord Jesus Christ, my Savior.

As for the rest of your comments. In truth they are just more of a reflection that you clearly did not understand what was being communicated to you by me as a Moderator.

I do hope that your travels fare well for you. Be they a day, a week, month, or until our Lord Returns or calls you home.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
Moderator
Nick
\o/
<><

I thought I had made my last comment here, but ok. You are trying to read too much into what I said, but I get it. It's your baby as it was for those that came before you. I have no problem with that. It was just a comment on what it seems to me. I'm sure everyone that has a blog/message board feels like their's is an Oasis. Ok, it's fine with me, but as I said you shouldn't worry about what I think, just like I don't worry about what you think. I'm just another grain of sand, same as you.

I wish you nothing but the best.
Ed from Tennessee

 

[Christ4Ever]

I thought I had made my last comment here, but ok. You are trying to read too much into what I said, but I get it. It's your baby as it was for those that came before you. I have no problem with that. It was just a comment on what it seems to me. I'm sure everyone that has a blog/message board feels like their's is an Oasis. Ok, it's fine with me, but as I said you shouldn't worry about what I think, just like I don't worry about what you think. I'm just another grain of sand, same as you.

I wish you nothing but the best.
Ed from Tennessee

Dear Ed,
I'm starting to wonder if I keep replying whether you won't be able to help yourself and will continue to respond as well!

I read into what you wrote, because at face value whether you meant it that way or not, it was communicating pride on my part for the Talk Jesus site. Which I only see as a vehicle by which we pray God's will is done, and for which He may be Glorified in and of by both the poster, and Staff.

Loved the 2 years I spend in Tennessee! Beautiful country. Could have stayed there, but joined my wife up North, and continued with my other stays in Europe. However, it was a time most enjoyable to me.

Well you take care of you & yours. Maybe, one day we'll meet in Gloryland!

God bless.
With the Love of Christ Jesus.
Moderator
Nick
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<><