Does Anybody Believe in Hell?

[Sue D.]

Logic is a great head knowledge -- all of that needs to reach a person's Heart.

You seem to 'thrive' on logical argumentation. But that Isn't the purpose Of Scripture. God is showing us what people / us / are like and why we Do need salvation.

A person Can get so deeply involved in a subject that they get lost in it.

 

[Brother-Paul]

My current set up has the KJV, NKJV, ESV, NIV, YLT, ASV, The Greek NA 28 text, Murdock's translation of the Peshitta, Brenton's translation of the Septuagint, For the Masoretic text the WTT which is based on the Lennengrad text, Rahlf's Septuagint text. These are the resources open on my current desktop.

Interesting which translations you have open at all times brother, I have the following...
KJV, NKJV, NIV, CJB, NJB, NLT2, ASV, I have Youngs and many others but rarely use them.
I have Strong's always available and Vine's Dictionary use as needed.
I do have a number of Greek NT's but not much Hebrew.

Do you use a software package brother?

@Sue I am not confused either. It is good to compare translations and to go back to the original meaning of The Word.

The Truth is in The Word, translation do not always show the full Truth.

Each should study to a depth that suits their searching heart, we start at the shallow end, learn to swim then go into the deep, from milk to meat, but we each go to the level right for us, providing we have salvation. We thirst but never get thirsty, we eat but never get hungry, it is wonderful to abide in The Word.

 

[Brother-Paul]

That's what I said -- the physical body dies and the spirit / soul of the person goes to be with Jesus Christ // the Lord in the current heaven.

The Bible says, death is the separation of body and soul.
- The body returns to the ground to await the resurrection
- “the spirit returns to God who gave it” (Ecclesiastes 12:7).

Ecclesiastes 12:6-8 (NKJV)
6 Remember your Creator before the silver cord is loosed, Or the golden bowl is broken, Or the pitcher shattered at the fountain, Or the wheel broken at the well.
7 Then the dust will return to the earth as it was, And the spirit will return to God who gave it.
8 "Vanity of vanities," says the Preacher, "All is vanity."

To include both situations together...

Born again believer
- the physical body dies and the spirit / soul of the person goes to be with Jesus Christ // the Lord in the current heaven.

Not Born again person
- the physical body dies and the spirit / soul of the person goes to a place of waiting for judgement. Hades.

The not born again person can be anyone, from atheist to church goer, even ministers of The Word, in any denomination.

John 3:1-21

 

[Butch5]

Interesting which translations you have open at all times brother, I have the following...
KJV, NKJV, NIV, CJB, NJB, NLT2, ASV, I have Youngs and many others but rarely use them.
I have Strong's always available and Vine's Dictionary use as needed.
I do have a number of Greek NT's but not much Hebrew.

Do you use a software package brother?

@Sue I am not confused either. It is good to compare translations and to go back to the original meaning of The Word.

The Truth is in The Word, translation do not always show the full Truth.

Each should study to a depth that suits their searching heart, we start at the shallow end, learn to swim then go into the deep, from milk to meat, but we each go to the level right for us, providing we have salvation. We thirst but never get thirsty, we eat but never get hungry, it is wonderful to abide in The Word.

Hi Brother Paul,

I do, I use BibleWorks 10. I actually use YLT quite a bit. I like the literal translations even though they aren't as easy to read. I also use WordSearch 11. I mainly use it for the English translation of the Ante-Nicene Fathers. I also use it for several of the lexicons. I use Kittle's Theological Dictionary of the New Testament and the Complete Word Study Dictionary.

 

[Butch5]

Logic is a great head knowledge -- all of that needs to reach a person's Heart.

You seem to 'thrive' on logical argumentation. But that Isn't the purpose Of Scripture. God is showing us what people / us / are like and why we Do need salvation.

A person Can get so deeply involved in a subject that they get lost in it.

Logic is how we determine if our understanding of something is correct. If it's not logical it's not correct.

 

[Sue D.]

At Butch5 -- I do believe you made that comment previously -- if it's not logical is't not correct == and I Did bring up three events that are Not logical that did happen in Scripture and asked if you believed that they did actually happen. That conversation is back on the previous page. In particular the virgin birth. Biologically it isn't possible for a woman who has never had sex, to become pregnant and give birth to a baby. So it's Not logical that That could have happened. So , do you believe that it did? Do you stand by your previous response? Just curious.

 

[Sue D.]

Interesting which translations you have open at all times brother, I have the following...
KJV, NKJV, NIV, CJB, NJB, NLT2, ASV, I have Youngs and many others but rarely use them.
I have Strong's always available and Vine's Dictionary use as needed.
I do have a number of Greek NT's but not much Hebrew.

Do you use a software package brother?

@Sue I am not confused either. It is good to compare translations and to go back to the original meaning of The Word.

The Truth is in The Word, translation do not always show the full Truth.

Each should study to a depth that suits their searching heart, we start at the shallow end, learn to swim then go into the deep, from milk to meat, but we each go to the level right for us, providing we have salvation. We thirst but never get thirsty, we eat but never get hungry, it is wonderful to abide in The Word.

I , myself, go between a couple of versions -- and I also have a Strong's Concordance as well as a Bible Dictionary. But most of my time is used in simply reading God's Word.

Can't imagine how you guys have the Time to go to all those different translations / versions and get any Bible reading actually Done. And be on the Forum as well.

Are you both pastors ? I can understand a pastor doing that much studying cause he would be preparing sermons to present. He would be guiding a group of people.

I guess that since we Do have God's Word in English, that that would be adequate. Well - at least for the average Bible reader. And, yes, digging deeper into Scripture to learn more and more is what we do as we have the interest in doing that.

I guess I'm Also wondering how a person has time to interact with other believers when doing all that studying Every Day?

 

[Butch5]

At Butch5 -- I do believe you made that comment previously -- if it's not logical is't not correct == and I Did bring up three events that are Not logical that did happen in Scripture and asked if you believed that they did actually happen. That conversation is back on the previous page. In particular the virgin birth. Biologically it isn't possible for a woman who has never had sex, to become pregnant and give birth to a baby. So it's Not logical that That could have happened. So , do you believe that it did? Do you stand by your previous response? Just curious.

I already addressed that. If God can create a man from dust, then it's not illogical that God can do so in a womb.

 

[Butch5]

I , myself, go between a couple of versions -- and I also have a Strong's Concordance as well as a Bible Dictionary. But most of my time is used in simply reading God's Word.

Can't imagine how you guys have the Time to go to all those different translations / versions and get any Bible reading actually Done. And be on the Forum as well.

Are you both pastors ? I can understand a pastor doing that much studying cause he would be preparing sermons to present. He would be guiding a group of people.

I guess that since we Do have God's Word in English, that that would be adequate. Well - at least for the average Bible reader. And, yes, digging deeper into Scripture to learn more and more is what we do as we have the interest in doing that.

I guess I'm Also wondering how a person has time to interact with other believers when doing all that studying Every Day?

My drive to work is at least 1 1/2 hours each way. That's three hours a day that I have to listen to the Bible on audio, to listen to sermons, and to listen to the different study materials I have in audio format. In addition to that I have the time I spend replying to posts and writing articles. We make time for the things we want to do.

 

[Sue D.]

That's a Lot of time commuting. And a good time to be listening to tapes / sermons, and such. Thanks for sharing that.

Curious -- what is your occupation?

 

[Sue D.]

I already addressed that. If God can create a man from dust, then it's not illogical that God can do so in a womb.

Okay -- so you Do believe that God Did create man, Adam , from dust. So you Do believe that He did create Jesus Christ in the womb of a virgin woman through the Holy Spirit.

 

[Butch5]

Okay -- so you Do believe that God Did create man, Adam , from dust. So you Do believe that He did create Jesus Christ in the womb of a virgin woman through the Holy Spirit.

Yeah

 

[Sue D.]

I'm having you qualify your comment because you started out saying "If" rather that "Since." Because an "If" comment would suggest that maybe you don't actually believe that He Did.

 

[Butch5]

That's a Lot of time commuting. And a good time to be listening to tapes / sermons, and such. Thanks for sharing that.

Curious -- what is your occupation?

You're welcome! I do interior trim in new homes. I live pretty far out in the country and most of my work is in the suburbs so I have a good drive to most of the subdivisions I go to. I have a older ipod with about 80 gigs of audios on different subjects. It has the Bible, teachings on the early church, sermons, debates between Christians on different subjects, etc.

 

[Butch5]

I'm having you qualify your comment because you started out saying "If" rather that "Since." Because an "If" comment would suggest that maybe you don't actually believe that He Did.

I just used it as an equation.

 

[Butch5]

Okay -- so you Do believe that God Did create man, Adam , from dust. So you Do believe that He did create Jesus Christ in the womb of a virgin woman through the Holy Spirit.

When you say create, I assume you mean that Jesus was born, correct?

 

[Sue D.]

Interior trims in new homes -- That's neat. Over the years, my late husband and I built three homes ourselves. And we've done lots of remodeling on our own homes. Two of the houses are on my property that I'm trying to get sold.

 

[Sue D.]

Yes, Jesus Christ was born and Adam was created.

What did you mean by 'using it as an equation'. Because biologically a virgin birth would be impossible. So you might not necessarily Believe it. There's an important difference between "If" and "Since".

 

[Butch5]

Yes, Jesus Christ was born and Adam was created.

What did you mean by 'using it as an equation'. Because biologically a virgin birth would be impossible. So you might not necessarily Believe it. There's an important difference between "If" and "Since".

A logical equation, If a then b. If not b then not a.

There is a big difference. If implies possibility, Since implies something definite.

 

[Sue D.]

A logical equation, If a then b. If not b then not a.

There is a big difference. If implies possibility, Since implies something definite.

Hey -- we Agree -- on This at least