Elect according to the foreknowledge of God

[God's Truth]

Im against the fact that this man has become God to a lot of people.
What he teaches has become a cult, a crisis, and a harm to the body of Christ.
Last time i checked, he didnt die on the Cross for anyone, and he has Jesus not dying for everyone's Sin.

What a lot of these Calvinist's , hardcore, have not realized........ as their mind is locked into a circular reasoning stronghold, is that JC teaches that only some are saved, and the rest are chosen to NOT BE SAVED, and that means they are chosen to go to hell. Born to BURN.... And are not allowed to Believe in Jesus.
And THAT is Crazy Theology, and certainly Satanic. And these JC obsessed do not realize that his teaching of..>"some are chosen to be saved" means that some of THEIR FAMILY = are not chosen for Heaven.
They dont realize this, because they can't actually THINK, and if they can, they have never taken the time to realize that Calvinism is teaching that some of their Family, is BORN TO GO TO HELL.....according to John Calvin's THEOLOGY.

I know we are told to not sound so rough but glad you didn't hold back but said it straight out like that. When you say it like you did it really makes a point.

 

[God's Truth]

Not to disprove, but to prove.

You just copy/pasted the same thing from earlier. It would be a good discussion if you would look more carefully at the scriptures I give and what I say about them.

So what’s that to me?

You misunderstand those scriptures just like the Calvinists.

Wasn’t trying to.

I gave scriptures that show God chooses His elect, even before the foundation of the world.

The Bible says God chooses and elects those who believe and obey Him.

I guess we will have to agree, that we disagree.

I don't ever agree to disagree as in let it go. Why not discuss it more with me?

 

[God's Truth]

@StewardoftheMystery

This is post #253.
Could you address it since I took my time to carefully explain my beliefs to you?


God chooses those who love Him by their obeying Him.

That is who God loves back and saves.

Hebrews 4:1
[ A Sabbath-Rest for the People of God ] Therefore, since the promise of entering his rest still stands, let us be careful that none of you be found to have fallen short of it.

Hebrews 4:2 For we also have had the good news proclaimed to us, just as they did; but the message they heard was of no value to them, because they did not share the faith of those who obeyed.


Nowhere anywhere do the scriptures say God made some people with the ability to believe and obey Him and some without the ability to believe and obey Him.

 

[God's Truth]

@StewardoftheMystery

Here is something else I was working on today to discuss with you:

This is about how we are saved now as opposed to how one used to get saved before Jesus---

John 1:13 children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband's will, but born of God.


God does not chose someone to become a child of His anymore because they are blood related to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.
God does not let any Jewish husband decide anymore for his wife to become a child of God and have her convert.
God does not let any human decide anymore if they want to convert and become a child of God.

We now of course have to want to be a child of God's, and we do what Jesus says to do.
Jesus tells us how to be saved and who he accepts.

God plainly and clearly tells us that the CULMINATION of the ages had come, and no longer does blood relations matter. It only mattered before because Jesus was going to be a blood relative of Abraham. Now that Jesus has come, only his blood matters.

The only way now to be a child of God is for God to make you one by obeying His Word and receiving His Spirit.

Where in the scriptures are any of the strange teaching you teach? You claim that God made some incapable of believing and obeying Him, and that He elected some before the creation of the world to be capable? Just because God knows who would choose Him it does not mean that strange weird twist that you and many others with your beliefs say.

 

[Gregoryp]

Hello Gregoryp. I like you and still have to ask how do you get that the chosen are not the elect?
Because there are a relatively small group of people who new God/Jesus since they could talk. Very peculiar and unusual people. I am one of them!

 

[God's Truth]

@Gregoryp

God elects those who get His teachings and obeys them.

Note: you mixed up a quote from and a reply from you on that last post you made.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

God elects those who get His teachings and obeys them.

Ephesians 1:4 “According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

So what obedience did you perform to earn election, before the foundation of the world?

 

[God's Truth]

Ephesians 1:4 “According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

That is about the PLAN.
Read it more and consider more carefully.

So what obedience did you perform to earn election, before the foundation of the world?

Yeah I know you are taught wrong about the obeying when you say 'earn'.
That is from a false teaching from Calvin and Lutherans.
It is life to obey Jesus words.

God chooses those according to their hearts.


Acts 1:24 Then they prayed, "Lord, you know everyone's heart. Show us which of these two you have chosen

God tells us how to make our hearts right in order for Him to choose us.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

This is about how we are saved now as opposed to how one used to get saved before Jesus---

There is no difference, we are all saved by God’s grace = God’s favor by faith.
Acts 15:9
And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.
Romans 3:22
Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

Romans 10:12
For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.

John 1:13 children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband's will, but born of God.

That verse confirms, it is not man’s will, but God’s will.

God does not chose someone to become a child of His anymore because they are blood related to Abraham,

That is the same error in thinking as many of the Jews.

Matthew 3:9
And think not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, that God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.”

If God could make sons of Abraham out of stones, what works did the stones perform to earn this honor?

God does not let any human decide anymore if they want to convert and become a child of God.

So now you are saying you have no choice, which is it?

God plainly and clearly tells us that the CULMINATION of the ages had come, and no longer does blood relations matter.

The children of the flesh were never the children of God, it is the children of promise that are counted for the seed.
Romans 9
“Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:

7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.

8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.”

Where in the scriptures are any of the strange teaching you teach? You claim that God made some incapable of believing and obeying Him, and that He elected some before the creation of the world to be capable?

Romans 9:9-24
King James Version
​

9 For this is the word of promise, At this time will I come, and Sarah shall have a son.
10 And not only this; but when Rebecca also had conceived by one, even by our father Isaac;
11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth
12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.
14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.
15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.
18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.
19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?
20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?
21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?

 

[God's Truth]

Ephesians 1:4 “According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

So what obedience did you perform to earn election, before the foundation of the world?

Read this scripture:

Matthew 11:27 “All things have been committed to me by my Father. No one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal him.


So who does Jesus CHOOSE to REVEAL himself?

John 14:21 The one who has My commands and keeps them is the one who loves Me. And the one who loves Me will be loved by My Father. I also will love him and will reveal Myself to him.”

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

God tells us how to make our hearts right in order for Him to choose us.

So you think you can “earn” being chosen before the foundation of the world. And you think “you can make” your own heart right in order to be chosen before the foundation of the world.

Good luck with that.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

So who does Jesus CHOOSE to REVEAL himself?

Those who the Father gave to the Son= God’s elect, chosen, predestined.

John 6:44
No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 6:37
All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

John 6:39
And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

John 6:65
And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.

 

[God's Truth]

There is no difference, we are all saved by God’s grace = God’s favor by faith.

God's grace is that we don't have to purify ourselves anymore to belong to Him.
We only have to have faith now that Jesus' blood purifies us and the the sacrifice of animals for their blood, and for a special diet and a circumcision, etc.

We still have to obey God and repent of our sins, we just don't have to purify ourselves anymore.

That verse confirms, it is not man’s will, but God’s will.

God's will is to save those now whose hearts are right by obeying Him.

That is the same error in thinking as many of the Jews.

No.
The Jews didn't want to stop purifying themselves by the works that Moses told God to tell the people.

If God could make sons of Abraham out of stones, what works did the stones perform to earn this honor?

John the baptizer said that to show that God could make people obey Him, but God does NOT want to make people obey, God wants people to chose to obey Him and that is who He chooses to save and love.

So now you are saying you have no choice, which is it?

I am saying that it doesn't matter anymore who is blood related to Abraham or to someone who says they are going to be saved today.
Jesus saves those who get his teachings and obeys.

The children of the flesh were never the children of God,

Of course they were.
God promised Abraham that a BLOOD DESCENDANT would be the Savior of the world.

it is the children of promise that are counted for the seed.

...and BLOOD RELATED TO ABRHAMAM.

 

[God's Truth]

So you think you can “earn” being chosen before the foundation of the world. And you think “you can make” your own heart right in order to be chosen before the foundation of the world.

Good luck with that.

It isn't luck it is God, the Word of God, and His words are life and Spirit.
Jesus came to show us the way.
He tells us how to be the one he saves.

 

[God's Truth]

Those who the Father gave to the Son= God’s elect, chosen, predestined.

No.
You are being confused by Calvin and or Luther.

John 6:44
No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

That is something I want to help you with.

It is a scripture you were taught wrong about.

John 6:37
All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

John 6:39
And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

John 6:65
And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.

I can show you what scriptures Calvin and Luther taught wrong about.
I will show you if you let me.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

God's grace is that we don't have to purify ourselves anymore to belong to Him.

Salvation has always been by God’s grace and mercy. Man cannot purify himself.
Exodus 33:19
And he said, I will make all my goodness pass before thee, and I will proclaim the name of the Lord before thee; and will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and will shew mercy on whom I will shew mercy.

we just don't have to purify ourselves anymore.

Again, man cannot purify himself .
Hebrews 9:9
Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;

Hebrews 10:1
For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.”

The Jews didn't want to stop purifying themselves by the works that Moses told God to tell the people.

The problem was, they did not seek the Lord by faith, but by their own works.

Romans 9:30-32

King James Version

​

30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

No.
You are being confused by Calvin and or Luther.

I have told you several times now I do not read Calvin or Luther. I quote the words of God.

It is a scripture you were taught wrong about.

I was taught by Christ, I know His testimony is true.

I can show you what scriptures Calvin and Luther taught wrong about.

What is that to me? I don’t follow the doctrines of men. If you want to start another thread about Calvin and Luther, then go ahead.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

John 6:44
No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 6:37
All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

John 6:39
And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

John 6:65
And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.

Same in OT……

Numbers 16:3-5​

​

King James Version​

​

​

3 And they gathered themselves together against Moses and against Aaron, and said unto them, Ye take too much upon you, seeing all the congregation are holy, every one of them, and the Lord is among them: wherefore then lift ye up yourselves above the congregation of the Lord?
4 And when Moses heard it, he fell upon his face:
5 And he spake unto Korah and unto all his company, saying, Even to morrow the Lord will shew who are his, and who is holy; and will cause him to come near unto him: even him whom he hath chosen will he cause to come near unto him.”

 

[God's Truth]

Salvation has always been by God’s grace and mercy. Man cannot purify himself.

God gave Moses the purification works for the people to do.

Exodus 33:19
And he said, I will make all my goodness pass before thee, and I will proclaim the name of the Lord before thee; and will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and will shew mercy on whom I will shew mercy.

How do you ever get that scripture disproves the purification works?

Again, man cannot purify himself .

Of course man could, just not like Jesus can.

Hebrews 9:9
Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;

The people still had to do the purification works.

Hebrews 10:1
For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.”

No kidding, but the people still had to do the purification works until Jesus came and fulfilled the scriptures.

The purification works made the people OUTWARDLY CLEAN.
It was COMMANDED BY GOD.

Hebrews 9:13
The blood of goats and bulls and the ashes of a heifer sprinkled on those who are ceremonially unclean sanctify them so that they are outwardly clean.

The problem was, they did not seek the Lord by faith, but by their own works.

The Jews didn't want to believe that Jesus does the purifying now. THAT DOES NOT MEAN THEY DIDN'T USE TO HAVE TO DO THE PURIFICATION WORKS.

Romans 9:30-32​

​

King James Version​

​

​

30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;

That scripture is about Paul explaining how the GENTILES who were ENEMIES because they did not do the purification works could not be saved just as easily as the Jews who had obeyed by doing the purification works.

Jesus saves the Gentiles and didn't make them get circumcised first before he would save them.

 

[God's Truth]

I have told you several times now I do not read Calvin or Luther. I quote the words of God.

I was taught by Christ, I know His testimony is true.

What is that to me? I don’t follow the doctrines of men. If you want to start another thread about Calvin and Luther, then go ahead.

You have false doctrines like the kind from Calvin and Luther. God's Word says false doctrines come from demons who put them in man's mind.
If you never read or heard what the Calvinists or Lutherans said, then I don't believe you and I don't have to believe you. If though you didn't ever read or hear anything from them, then that would be strange! Even if you were from another country, Calvinism and Lutheran beliefs were taught because Europe had missionaries and so does America.