Homosexual Pastors?

[Larry.]

Well, here I am so many months removed from this debate, and still without a home church. I cannot honestly say that I hold no regrets for taking this stand. For one, I feel that I am left on the outside looking in on a Church that no longer seems to have a place for me. My heart grieves daily for the loss of my church family, as I continue to cling to the Word and the Spirit as my sole Teachers. I miss the Church. I miss my
brothers and sisters. I was, and continue to be, accused of holding many positions that I never once proclaimed, but the greatest of all of these accusations, and the most hurtful is this: That I do not love. In truth, loving is all I have ever tried to do. Maybe I'm just not that good at it, but I will never lie to anyone just to make them feel better. That does considerably more harm than good.

 

[revbrad]

Larry.......

I too am without a home church (won't get into the reason) I miss the things that go with being a part of a congregation, but the Lord has given me other "congregations"

I now conduct services in campground. There are regular attendees there who will not go to a "church" Had I stayed where I was who knows if these people would get the Word. I also conduct home meetings and help out some small churches in my area.

God has something for His servants to do. Seek Him about what He has for you.

God has blessed me and others in what I am doing now.

The church is not the denomination or a particular congregation. The church is all born again believers, wherever or however they meet.

Many denominations and congregations have accepted false doctrine and turned on the truth, this is not "THE CHURCH" Christ's church does not follow seducing spirits and doctrines of devils. Christ's church will stand for righteousness

and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. Matthew 16:18b

 

[Larry.]

Thank you very much revbrad for your words, they have been a great encouragement to me today. God bless you brother.

 

[Fragrant Grace]

...Be strong in the Lord, and in the power of His might.
Ephesians 6:10


Larry,

May the Lord bless you richly for standing up for His word and making that stand.
You are not alone brother, the Lord is with you

I read this piece of Spurgeon this morning and feel the words may bless you


God’s people are frequently made lonely through obedience to honest convictions.

It may happen that you live in the midst of professing Christians and you have received light upon a part of God’s Word...
and having received that light, if you are as you should be—
you are at once obedient to it.

It will frequently result, from this action on your part, that you will greatly vex many good people whom you love and respect, but to whose wishes you cannot yield......
You do not wish to be singular, or obstinate, or offensive—
but you must do the Lord’s will even if it should sever every fond connection!

Perhaps, for a time, prejudiced persons may almost deny you Christian fellowship.
Many a baptized Believer has been made to know what it means to be almost tabooed and shut out because he cannot see as others see, but is resolved to follow his conscience at all hazards.

Under such circumstances,even in a godly household, a Christian who fully carries out his convictions may find himself treading a separated path.

Be bold, my dear Brothers and Sisters, and do not flinch!

Your Saviour walked alone and you must do so too.
Perhaps this lone obedience is to be a test of your faith.

Persevere!

Yield not a particle of the Truth of God!

These very friends who now turn their backs on you, if they are good for anything, will respect you all the more for having the
courage to be honest—
and perhaps the day will come when, through your example, they will be led in the same obedient way.

At any rate, do not mar your testimony by hesitancy or wavering, but “follow the Lamb wherever He goes.”
Fallback upon this Truth of God—you may displease and alienate friends and be charged with bigotry, self-will and
obstinacy, but you are not alone when you follow the path of obedience, for the Father is with you!

If what you hold is God’s Truth, God is with you in maintaining it.
If the ordinance to which you submit was ordained by Christ, Jesus iswith you in it.
Care not how either the Church or the world reviles you!
Serve your Master and He will not desert you!

From Spurgeon: Christ's Lonliness and ours


In all thy ways acknowlege Him and He shall direct thy paths
Proverbs 3:6

 

[Larry.]

Wow. Thank you Grace for this very uplifting bit of wisdom.

 

[Rev T.S.Perkins]

I can say that there are many like you that seek Gods word and not mans aprovel as it should be ...I've met a lot of LBGT types and they all say the same thing ...We don't love them enough..! We can't but God can...there need for aprovel is one thing that leads to this life style they chose..my question is this .. If they were born that way as many claim how can they call it an alternative life style...? If you are not for me then you are against me says The Lord ..pretty clear I think..As far as gay pastors I've met a few .you might as well have a drunk in the pulpit they do just as much damage to the body of Christ....Rev

 

[Strangederby]

While I don't think there's anything wrong with homosexuality the church leaders reaction to the OP's question seems unfair. There's no need for rebukes and emergency meetings for simply asking a question. All they had to do was calmly state that they disagreed with the OP.

 

[Larry.]

While I don't think there's anything wrong with homosexuality the church leaders reaction to the OP's question seems unfair. There's no need for rebukes and emergency meetings for simply asking a question. All they had to do was calmly state that they disagreed with the OP.[/QUOTE

That, I think, was the strangest part of this whole ordeal. Doctrinally speaking, the ABC-USA holds the very firm stance that living a homosexual lifestyle is not consistent with Biblical teaching (American Baptist Churches - USA Statement of Faith) . However, they shuffle all contention to their hypocritical practices under the rug of "biblical interpretation". So, basically, their position is this: We are willing to partner with anyone ($cha-ching$) so long as they can explain their biblical position as "interpretive" (wink- wink), and their checks will clear the bank ($$cha-ching$$).

It really doesn't matter what you believe at all. They would affix an ABC banner above any structure that houses an organization that is willing to send them mission dollars. Sad.

As for your position on homosexuality being "ok", I will say this: It makes no difference whatsoever how either you or I feel about. God's Word openly and explicitly condemns homosexual acts as unacceptable to Him. Period. Anyone who is teaching you otherwise is a liar.

 

[Strangederby]

As for your position on homosexuality being "ok", I will say this: It makes no difference whatsoever how either you or I feel about. God's Word openly and explicitly condemns homosexual acts as unacceptable to Him. Period. Anyone who is teaching you otherwise is a liar.

I agree that the bible states that homosexuality is wrong. It also states that a lot of other things modern christians are ok with are wrong and whats more states that a lot of things that we now think are wrong are right. How do you pick which parts to keep and which parts to interpret differently?

 

[Rev T.S.Perkins]

Let me add the bibles instruction to ministers is keep the pulpit clean of sin before God almighty ..we all have our own issues don't get me wrong ..how ever it does say that we should come to pulpit with a repentant and humble heart .! And to apply what we preach to ourselves first ..how can one claim that God created them that way when the word says He didn't create them in the image of perversion! First lie I was born this way . And it seems to me if it were so wouldn't an alternative life style be living in the image of the one that created us all. ? My post is ment in love and not as rebuke but in statement of truth only and I pray no offense is taken ..it is above mine or any other Christians place to sit in that seat of judgement that belongs to God only.. But these things do beg to question. ...Rev

 

[Larry.]

I agree that the bible states that homosexuality is wrong. It also states that a lot of other things modern christians are ok with are wrong and whats more states that a lot of things that we now think are wrong are right. How do you pick which parts to keep and which parts to interpret differently?

After re-reading my earlier post i realize that my tone was probably a bit too coarse, especially at the end. For that I apologize.
As for your reply, all i can say is that I can hardly disagree with you, at least within the context of such a broad statement. Some specific references and/or examples from the Bible that might illustrate your point(s) would be helpful. People, culture, and societal/moral standards change constantly (btw, just because a story is in the Bible does NOT mean that God necessarily approved of the behavior of it's participants, much of the OT is narrative and/or historical in nature), but God does not change. His standards also do not change, although we are quite spoiled by having been born in this current dispensation of grace, where many of the requirements of the OT Law have been fulfilled by Christ. The Moral Law, however, is still undoubtedly in full force. Do you doubt that bestiality is a sin? Or murder? Of course not, because they are a part of the Moral Law that is not only written in the Bible, but upon the hearts of all those who are in a genuine relationship with Christ and allow themselves to be convicted by His Spirit.
"Do not conform to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to test and approve what God's will is -- his good, pleasing and perfect will." - Romans 12:2

 

[jiggyfly]

The religious system is dependent on people and attendance so it has and will continue to make compromises wherever needed to survive. It shouldn't be long before it will be easy for even the youngest believer to identify the difference between the ekklesia and the christian religious system. There are millions of us now who enjoy a growing and thriving relationship with the Godhead without the hindrance of religion. Many gather together in different settings and times enjoying one another's presence much like the first ekklesia. George Barna wrote about us several years ago in his book called "Revolution" and more and more people have stopped participating in religious liturgy meetings and began to enjoy a simple relationship with others and with the Godhead than thought possibly. Larry, seek HolySpirit's guidance and wait till you have it, I promise God won't be mad if you miss a few Sunday meetings.

 

[Christ4Ever]

While I don't think there's anything wrong with homosexuality the church leaders reaction to the OP's question seems unfair. There's no need for rebukes and emergency meetings for simply asking a question. All they had to do was calmly state that they disagreed with the OP.

Hello Strangederby!

Since you state that you've lost your belief in the existence of God; which leads me to see that you probably don't believe in the Holy Bible either, or see it as a book that is only part history/fiction. So dealing with the subject of homosexuality with you is really less important, then the question of; what happened in your life that made you lose what I believe at one time was so precious to you?

Always remember, He doesn't let you go easily or you won't be here :thumbs_up

C4E
Romans 8:35-39 [35] Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? [shall] tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? [36] As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter. [37] Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. [38] For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, [39] Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

 

[dannibear]

I can somewhat relate to you about this, but you got the worst situation.

In my experience, a youth leader my senior year of high school said something that didn't sit well with me, I approached him about it in a personal message but never got a response after his initial rebuttal. Some other minor problems along the way caused me to not attend anymore, and when my pastor heard that I was not attending (months later might I add), confronted me and said that I had caused discord for leaving because the other kids looked up to me as a mature voice in the audience. I was very upset at first from the reaction from my pastor and how he wasn't trying to listen to my side, but I soon got over it with prayer and decided that if the kids learned anything from me leaving, that they learn to stick up for God's Word 100% of the time no matter where you are and who it is your standing up to.

I am inspired by your choice to stick up for God's Word. The 'whoever' part turned out to be your church family, and although I still attend my church, it is only because nothing else has happened since the incident. In your case, the emotional wounds inflicted have been deep and I would not have attended your church anymore either if I were in your position. I hope you don't feel any anguish about your decision because what you did was 100% the right thing to do. The anguish you feel over their hurtful actions though, can only be healed through forgiveness. Trust me, when I say that, I know it isn't easy. I am still forgiving people over something that happened awhile ago. But forgiveness frees you from the pain because from then on, whenever they pop into your mind, you choose to let it go and not wallow in the painful memories. When you remember what happened, you think, because God loves them, I love them too despite what happened. Your search for a church home can be guided by the Holy Spirit and through prayer. I like to think that all churches have a personality. You will eventually find the one that has that special spot that you are meant to fill.

 

[AbbysAunt]

Larry,

To let one lead a life that is harmful is what not loving is, you my brother and friend in Jesus have gone forth and told the truth and that is love...you have the love of Jesus and you by telling His truth have loved. It's easier to blame someone for the wrong things than to acknowledge the truth which is what this world does...it tells us that the reason that many in the homosexual lifestyle are suicidal is that it's because people are treating you like an outcast or that they don't understand you, but the truth of the matter is this...the saddness and depression comes from the darkness of the sin itself and that is what leads to the suicidal thoughts and tendencies. This is the honest truth and the world doesn't want people to know it and certianly doesn't want to acknowledge it.

Love doesn't mean we let someone we care about do things that harm them or can cause harm....we wouldn't let someone we love drive off a cliff without telling them the truth that it will lead it serious injury or even death so then why is it when we tell the truth of God's word we accused of not loving? The fact is this..it's because we love that we go out and proclaim the truth of our Lord Jesus but the world would rather hide it's head and not face this truth than to see it because it's way easier to not see than it is to see and admit any wrong doing. I know im proud of you for standing up for the truth and I know our Lord Jesus is proud of you most of all. Stay strong my friend and brother and know that with Jesus on your side you are more than victorious!

God bless you
AA

 

[bachar]

Even now the anti-christ is lurking around deceiving many into the pits of hell. You did well and the blood is no longer in your hands, these issues need to be addressed. If nothing is done about this then people will begin to believe that it is okay to live in homosexuality and not have any eternal consequence. The Bible clearly states that it is destestable to God and no gay man or woman should be a leader in the Body of Christ.

 

[james1523]

God sometimes gives us these experiences of disappointment with clergy/leaders in his mercy to show us the truth and bring us out from Babylon. Babylon is the mixture of the things of God with the things of the world. God never intended one or two men to lead from the front and control the whole church, that is how satan easily gets control of a whole congregation. God sometimes allows wolves to control the sheep because His hand of blessing is removed, His presence is not there. If God was there this man would be convicted and repenting in tears for his sins before the church (1 Cor 14:24). Does the church prophesy? If not how can people be convicted of sin (1 Cor 14:24). There is no perfect denomination, because denominations themselves are not in the perfect will of God. A house divided cannot stand. God hates the sin of denominational-ism as much as homosexuality. Homosexuality is corruption of God's intended purpose for man and woman. Denomination is corruption of God's intended purpose for Christ and His bride, the church. The two are related. This is why many denominations are allowing or have homosexual leaders. But if we leave spiritual Babylon (the pagan Roman church and her protestant divided children) and meet with the saints in the Spirit and simplicity of heart we will be blessed. You may feel alone at first but seek the Lord for His church and you will find it. 1 Cor 1:10, 1 Cor 1:12-13, Rom 16:17, John 17:20-26, 1 Cor 12:12-31, Rev 18:4.

 

[farout]

james1523: "God hates the sin of denominational-ism as much as homosexuality." .....and "This is why MANY denominations are allowing or have homosexual leaders."

I dare say you have made some statements that go pretty far out there. You fail to give any statistics, or the source of your findings. Please give me your definition of "denomination-ism" Then if you could, please give some data or percentage's instead of using the word "many". You give the misleading impression that the majority of denominations have homosexual pastors / leaders. Do you honestly believe "A Denimonation is corruption of God's intended purpose for Christ and His bride, the church."? I would respect your post more if you aknowledged you bias against most, if not all denomination's.

The fact is there are some (I do not know the percentage) denominations that confirn lesbian and homosexual people into their denomination as pastor's and leader's. These are liberal denimations, and their understanding of Scripture is not conserative, and the culture of today over rides Biblical doctrine. Scripture twisting is nothing new, satan does his best to lead people in the wrong direction.

My deep sincere concern is that we who are born again genuine followers of Jesus Christ who have surrendered their will to be a disciple. How can we attack other christians , or groups of christians. "By this all men will know that you are MY disciples, if you have love for one another." John 13:35 NASB How does this fit into your Theology of love for your brother's and sister's in Christ that believe different than you?

James1523, I personally am offended and beleive you have caused an injustice toward a large number of genuine christian brother's and sister's. Let me say up front, I believe you are a brother in the Lord Jesus Christ as you say in your profile in the "About me". Please allow me to talk to you as a father to a son. I believe being almost 68 may be older than you. I have been a Pastor od four churches in three denominations, , Southern Baptist, and American Baptist, and Conserative Baptist, my wife and me are now retired and we are Southern Baptist. We left the American Baptist Churches of the USA for their liberalism.

I have been in Bolivia when there was a National strike, the whole country just stopps everything! Nothing is open, and this strike lasted a good while, less than 7 days. I was a Southern Baptist. There were several non-denominational missionaries that were in desperate need for gasoline, food, and they could not go to the bank as it was closed as well. There was no help from those who sponsored these folks in the US. These people had desperate. Some talked about using their return air line tickets to go back to the US, but air prots were also closed. I saw the Canadian Baptist and the Southern Baptist help these missionaries. Here is the odd part these independant non-denominational missionaries before had no desire to work with these denominationsal missionaries.

I am a Baptist because in my opinion Baptist Doctrine is clostest to Scriptural doctrine. I love and respect the Assemblies of God, but I believe in eternal security ofthe believer and they do not. That is one reason why we have different denominations. Sone christians believe in speaking in tongues, some sprinkle for baptism, some have closed Lords Supper, some do not allow musical instruments, some believe that vehicles other than horse drawn buggies are wrong, the list goes on and on. Some people like you do not believe that christians coming together and form a larger group to make a bigger impact for Christ by a denomination can support many missionaries and met all their needs so they don't get stranded like what happened in Bolivia. Not all denominations are good, but neither are all denominations bad!

use some Biblical wisdom, and next time you are tempted to group some Brother's and Sister's in christ and make a statement that you think must be true, becausjames1523 e smeone told you so, CHECK IT OUT COMPLETELY AND HAVE ALL YOUR FACTS CONFIRMED. I suggest you pray before slandering the Bride of Christ. Each one of us needs to seek the Lord and ask is there someting that is sinful or thing I am doing that I need to repent of, most of us do 1 John 1:10. Only when we are with the Lord will all these differences be completly gone and the church become the true Bride of Christ.

I hope this gives you something to think about and reconsider what you have posted. My sincere desire is that we woulld do as Jesus said in John 13:35.

 

[james1523]

Regarding the statistics, in wikipedia we may find a list of Christian denominational positions on homosexuality, in a table ranked by denomination. There I count about 18 denominations that ordain homosexuals. 18 to me, is many. And I suspect in many other denominations there are practicing gay clergy as well.

I will ask the same question that Paul asked the Christians in the city of Corinth:
1 Cor 1:13 is Christ divided?

If no, then why do we agree with denominations?

The Corinthian church was a divided church, some following after Paul's teachings, others Apollos.. (just like denominations are) and they also had issues with sexual immorality and other problems in their midst (just as denominations do). There is a link there between disobeying God's will regarding Christian unity, and the growth of lawlessness within the organized divisions (denominations). Well let me say there has been a steady trend over the past decades of increasing lawlessness. In the church of God, there are no paid pastors in leadership as such, but elders appointed by the apostles, and there definitely no homosexual pastors. In fact, there are no practicing open homosexuals in the church of God, because the church would have put out the wicked one from among them...so that the lump is not leavened by the wickedness.

 

[bestrfcplayer]

Now granted, the response of the congregation was not at all acceptable, so too was your judgement of that pastor. Me personally, I have no problem with homosexuality. I mean, its their life, and let them live how they want to live. And besides, isn't God condemning homosexuality hypocritical to Jesus' message? And wouldn't that possibly make Jesus a hypocrite since he is God in flesh? Just thinking out loud here. Besides, as Christians, we are called to love and not to hate. Everybody is welcome to Jesus' table, no matter who or what they are. Maybe there should be a revival among Christians to be more loving and accepting, instead of hateful and judging.