Lazarus and the Rich man...
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Rhema
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Why do you care?
Perhaps it's to help those who are insular in their beliefs and experience.
Most all Baptists I know in this area (of PA) believe that only Baptists have the truth about salvation and will go to heaven. Is this the case in TX?
Rhema
What exactly do you mean by a person being 'insular'.
Well the Bible is God's Word and tells us the one and only way of salvation. Long before I was born my parents had been Presbyterian . They were invited to a Bible study where they learned that the Bible teaches baptism by immersion so they changed to being Baptist.
The emphasis of a church Should be learning / teaching God's Word / Bible. Spiritual growth and supporting both local and foreign missions. In other words , sharing gospel unto salvation with all who will listen both locally and in other countries.
Anyone can learn the truth about salvation in their Bible.
One of the factors in churches now is hymn singing using hymnals compared to 'Praise and Worship" groups. I've been in both kinds of environments and prefer the hymn singing with hymnals.
A person should be able to ask the pastor before or after a church service the why's and wherefores of what he's preaching / teaching.
I'm now in Missouri at a Baptist church. The pastor is strong KJV and I'm strong with NKJ. My daughter and son-in-law are KJV also. I used to be but switched.
And by the way. As I shared in a previous post , it's not the 1611 version that has been used for many years. The one being used is from 1700 something.
I have what is called "The Woman's study Bible.".
It's about lunch time around here so will close for now.
Well the Bible is God's Word and tells us the one and only way of salvation. Long before I was born my parents had been Presbyterian . They were invited to a Bible study where they learned that the Bible teaches baptism by immersion so they changed to being Baptist.
The emphasis of a church Should be learning / teaching God's Word / Bible. Spiritual growth and supporting both local and foreign missions. In other words , sharing gospel unto salvation with all who will listen both locally and in other countries.
Anyone can learn the truth about salvation in their Bible.
One of the factors in churches now is hymn singing using hymnals compared to 'Praise and Worship" groups. I've been in both kinds of environments and prefer the hymn singing with hymnals.
A person should be able to ask the pastor before or after a church service the why's and wherefores of what he's preaching / teaching.
I'm now in Missouri at a Baptist church. The pastor is strong KJV and I'm strong with NKJ. My daughter and son-in-law are KJV also. I used to be but switched.
And by the way. As I shared in a previous post , it's not the 1611 version that has been used for many years. The one being used is from 1700 something.
I have what is called "The Woman's study Bible.".
It's about lunch time around here so will close for now.
How white and American can you be? When shown your systemic racism, you accuse that person of racism.
Sue, I'm more white than you could possibly ever be - my biological father was a Nazi General in the SS and my mother was from Scotland.
People who have learned critical thinking skills know how to adjust for their own personal bias. Do you say "Merry Christmas" to your Jewish friends?
I didn't know I needed your approval.
Rhema
Outward un-redeemed Jewish friend ? Or those that do have the born again Spirit of Christ ?
Remember a Jew is not one outwardly in respect to his corrupted dying flesh nd blood but is one inwardly same applies to the word Christian the new name the father named the bride of Christ the church. If any man has not the Spirt of Christ than neither do they belong to Him Same with the word Israel the name the father previously named the bride prior to Christian. . all Israel is not born again Israel .
Rhema
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insular
1. interested only in your own country or group and not willing to accept…
dictionary.cambridge.org
For example:
The above ^^^ is rather insular. Think "insulated" or "isolated". The idea of a Chinese New Year never even crossed your mind. Or that there are Christians who for valid reasons do not accept your canon of the scriptures.
I have met innumerable Protestants who are shocked to find out that Catholics call themselves Christian. Might you be one of these? (Please consider the question rhetorical.)
Key word - "Should be" - in truth, they don't (though they think they do).
But why? Why should the emphasis of a church be "learning / teaching God's Word / Bible." That viewpoint was not a part of Christianity for more than 1,500 years. It is a very recent idea. Jesus did not say "My house shall be called a house of learning God's Word / Bible."
And said unto them, It is written, My house shall be called the house of prayer;
(Matthew 21:13 KJV)
And he taught, saying unto them, Is it not written, My house shall be called of all nations the house of prayer?
(Mark 11:17 KJV)
Ma'am, I can assure you that what you've learned as the gospel from your Baptist church is not what Jesus preached. But our views of what composes the Gospel are so far apart that I'm not sure you could ever understand what we believe, and were our dialogue to be fruitful, I am concerned that it may lead you to despair. And it's not my purpose to bring you anxiety. That's why I've been trying my best to disengage conversation with you. Again, I am not here for tea and crumpets.
Try it... using ONLY Jesus' words. And again, I can assure you that the outcome is quite different from what you believe.
That an old person prefers the old ways... imagine my shock !
Why do you have only one pastor?
Your own scriptures say that there should be five -
And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
(Ephesians 4:11-12 KJV)
Come to think of it, though, why did you bring this up with me?
Your profile says Texas. Perhaps it should be updated.
I read the Greek text directly - so I can avoid translation bias.
Look again, you'll find your "1700 something" date to be wrong.
bon appétit
Rhema
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Garee, it is my most ardent hope and prayer that one day you'll make sense.
Godspeed,
Rhema
Thanks, Whose sense?
What is the difference between an outward Jew and one inwardly. Do you think those in Revelations had fake ID cards ?
Romans 2:28-29 King James Version For he is not a (born again )Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: But he is a (born again) Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God
It is important to search out the matter till the end .No cherry picking. The spiritual understanding of Christ's must be compared to the spiritual understanding. (faith to faith) Looking to the temporal only shows the work of another teacher master other that Christ alone
The un -redeemed Jew represents the same as all Israel is not born again Israel ..Words like Israel or Jew have meaning that must be sought out in the parables .Literal historical is not the end of the matter .Surely more than one level of meaning .
Rhema -- I'm not even sure where to start in responding back. You seem to think that because you use the original Greek and Hebrew texts that you have all the right answers . That you can void any translation biases. Well -+ you are baised toward the original bible languages.
I'm not against any culture -- you said that a person can't be any more "white" than You are. What difference does that make.
You brought up spiritual gifts. They are given to a person who is a born again believer. They are given by the Holy Spirit to help the local church run smoothly. You were quoting fro Romans 12: 4 - 8. The other passage is 1corinthians 12: 7-11 and vs 27- 31.
In 1 Timothy 3 we have qualifications for overseers, bishops, elders , pastor's -- whatever a person chooses to call that church leader. And the qualifications for deacons is also listed.
Also listed in Titus 1:5 -9.
I'm not against any culture -- you said that a person can't be any more "white" than You are. What difference does that make.
You brought up spiritual gifts. They are given to a person who is a born again believer. They are given by the Holy Spirit to help the local church run smoothly. You were quoting fro Romans 12: 4 - 8. The other passage is 1corinthians 12: 7-11 and vs 27- 31.
In 1 Timothy 3 we have qualifications for overseers, bishops, elders , pastor's -- whatever a person chooses to call that church leader. And the qualifications for deacons is also listed.
Also listed in Titus 1:5 -9.
My phone is not cooperating very well. The 1786 is just fine.
I am curious as to why you are so down on God's Word.
You brought up the RCC. The Vatican is not scriptural / nuns aren't either. Lots of what they believe/ teach is not in Bible.
I would agree -- not much point I continuing with this conversation.
I am curious as to why you are so down on God's Word.
You brought up the RCC. The Vatican is not scriptural / nuns aren't either. Lots of what they believe/ teach is not in Bible.
I would agree -- not much point I continuing with this conversation.
Rhema
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Rhema
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Sue... that doesn't even make sense. How can one be "biased" toward the language in which God saw fit to publish the teachings of Jesus?
bias
1. the action of supporting or opposing a particular person or thing in an…
dictionary.cambridge.org
... the action of supporting or opposing a particular person or thing in an unfair way, because of allowing personal opinions to influence your judgment:
How would learning these languages be "unfair" ?? And just what language do you think the translators used ??
And yet these are the people who created the canon that you follow.
The Canon of the New Testament: Its Origin, Development and Significance
Is the canon still open? Which form of a text is canonical? Is the canon a collection of authoritative books or an authoritative collection? Dr. Bruce Metzger, tackles these questions, discusses the pressures that led to the fixing of the canon, and gives detailed attention to both Western and...
www.christianbook.com
I would suggest you re-read the definition of insular. To be "for" doesn't mean to be "against." I never said nor implied that you were against any culture - just apathetic. Yet I'm sure you are rather against the RCC, no?
Allow me to rephrase - Most all Baptists I know in this area (of PA) believe that only Baptists have the truth about salvation and will go to heaven. Is this the case where you are?
What you have been taught as God's Word isn't God's Word. It's that simple.
Allow me to suggest the following New Testament (I'll buy one for you if need be):
Amazon.com
www.amazon.com
Rhema
I do hope you mean 1769 as there is no 1786 edition of the King James.
King James Version - Wikipedia
I'd suggest a laptop for this kind of interaction.
Thanks I am somewhat aware their are differences . Its not my intention to be misunderstood as a false prophet. In that way there must be division called heresy amongst those called by God to walk by faith (the unseen will of God power )
I would think we should search for the foundation of the doctrines of God David said in Psalm's if the destroy the foundations of the doctrines of God what could those who walk by faith do ?
What is the difference between an outward Jew and one inwardly born of the spirit ? Do you think those in Revelations had fake ID cards ?
Romans 2:28-29 King James Version For he is not a (born again )Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: But he is a (born again) Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God
Same applies to the new name the father named the bride the church in Acts "Christian".
A Christian is not one outwardly according to the flesh but is one inwardly according to the work of the unseen Holy Spirit . A Jew one who does the will of the father .
God puts no difference between the two purifying the hearts of both by a work of His power faith.
Acts 15:8-10King James VersionAnd God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us; And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.
Its simply not about corrupted DNA
Revelation 2:9I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.
Revelation 3:9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.
My phone has google on it. As well as FB. The impression you've given is that since you only read the original Greek and Hebrew texts that you are totally correct on everything you say. That's what I meant by saying that you are biased towards that.
You do realize that before there was a KJV there was the Geneva Bible and the Great Bible
..and maybe you also realize that there were a couple of KJV that had problems with them and since them we've had the new KJV and the ESV.
No need to get me a Bible to read. I've got several here with me.
And would you please respond back regarding your comment a person can't be any whiter than you are. Apparently you feel that being white is special...white is no more special than any other color of people.
Will close for now.
You do realize that before there was a KJV there was the Geneva Bible and the Great Bible
..and maybe you also realize that there were a couple of KJV that had problems with them and since them we've had the new KJV and the ESV.
No need to get me a Bible to read. I've got several here with me.
And would you please respond back regarding your comment a person can't be any whiter than you are. Apparently you feel that being white is special...white is no more special than any other color of people.
Will close for now.
We have no worries . God gives his interpretation and removes others He hid the understanding from those who bragged they knew Hebrew and refused to obey what is says ..They simply had no truth in all things written in the law and prophets in any tongue
Hearing the word and God interpreting it or understanding are two different things
Isaiah 28 11 So God will use this strange way of talking, and he will use other languages to speak to these people.
In the past he spoke to them and said, “Here is a resting place. Let those who are tired come and rest. This is the place of peace.” But they would not listen to him. So the Lord’s words will be senseless sounds to them:
“Saw lasaw saw lasaw.
Qaw laqaw qaw laqaw.
Ze’er sham ze’er sham.”
Therefore taking away the understanding of the gospel from some Hebrews .
Rhema
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In truth, I am certainly more correct ... and I typically don't post on things about which I'm not totally correct. It has been decades since anyone has found a flaw in my work. (It was rather exhilarating.)
You forgot the Bishop's Bible, and we shouldn't disrespect John Wycliffe, now should we - even though he used the Latin Vulgate as his source. Of course the Tyndale, Coverdale, Mathew's (and Taverner's revision of Mathew's), preceded the Great Bible. Sue... this is my wheelhouse - I'm a translator.
I had mentioned this New Testament before, where you can compare three translations and see the mistakes made in both the NIV and the KJV. (Marshall made maybe three or four.)
And yet none whereby you can compare your several translations to the original text. Truly, you would be shocked.
I will not let you bait me. The above quote shows a purposeful twisting of my words, and I'm not the one who is insular.
Rhema
PS: (Again....) Most all Baptists I know in this area (of PA) believe that only Baptists have the truth about salvation and will go to heaven. Is this the case where you are?
Rhema -- but has God's Word gotten into your heart-- that's where it needs to be..
Okay -- so you're a translator -- so is my sister and her husband. And many years ago, I worked with the literacy council in Texas. I helped people learn English from a Spanish background.
As you know, each language has it's own alphabet. And in order to translate from one language to another , ya have to "adjust" as needed to get the desired understanding expressed in the other language. And a person gets into local figures of speech.
When my brother in-law was in seminary prepping for missions in Brazil, one of his courses was to translate 1st John from Greek to English.
When they retired after 40yrs , they got with Horizons . They were translating college/ seminary-level material into Brazilian Portuguese for new pastor's. My sister did the grammar and Terry did the graphics.
When a person is translating a passage about the birth of Jesus Christ --, a young woman is Probably a virgin , but the question Could come up, do we know for sure that Mary was a real virgin?. Because if she had had sex with simply a man, the birth of Jesus would not have been special and Joseph Could have had her put away or even stoned. And then he could not have been our Savior. So the word 'virgin' is best as it conveys the truth.
And excuse me but I wasn't twisting any of your comments -- ys might want to re-read your own comments. Not baiting you -- you made the comment " a person can't get any whiter than you are." And commented about your Dad's occupation and your mother's nationality. And I'd shared about my background. An Eisenhower and Nelson got together. So I'm half and half. That makes both us Caucasian.
And I'm very aware of Tyndale and Wycliffe and all that you commented about them.
Right now I'm also listening to Dr. David Jeremiah on my radio. He was commenting previously about people who read their Bible but it doesn't make any difference in their lives / attitudes. He's going through the book of Nehemiah.
Is a man / person / wise in their own own eyes or do they want to be learning what God's Word says for "them'.
Okay -- so you're a translator -- so is my sister and her husband. And many years ago, I worked with the literacy council in Texas. I helped people learn English from a Spanish background.
As you know, each language has it's own alphabet. And in order to translate from one language to another , ya have to "adjust" as needed to get the desired understanding expressed in the other language. And a person gets into local figures of speech.
When my brother in-law was in seminary prepping for missions in Brazil, one of his courses was to translate 1st John from Greek to English.
When they retired after 40yrs , they got with Horizons . They were translating college/ seminary-level material into Brazilian Portuguese for new pastor's. My sister did the grammar and Terry did the graphics.
When a person is translating a passage about the birth of Jesus Christ --, a young woman is Probably a virgin , but the question Could come up, do we know for sure that Mary was a real virgin?. Because if she had had sex with simply a man, the birth of Jesus would not have been special and Joseph Could have had her put away or even stoned. And then he could not have been our Savior. So the word 'virgin' is best as it conveys the truth.
And excuse me but I wasn't twisting any of your comments -- ys might want to re-read your own comments. Not baiting you -- you made the comment " a person can't get any whiter than you are." And commented about your Dad's occupation and your mother's nationality. And I'd shared about my background. An Eisenhower and Nelson got together. So I'm half and half. That makes both us Caucasian.
And I'm very aware of Tyndale and Wycliffe and all that you commented about them.
Right now I'm also listening to Dr. David Jeremiah on my radio. He was commenting previously about people who read their Bible but it doesn't make any difference in their lives / attitudes. He's going through the book of Nehemiah.
Is a man / person / wise in their own own eyes or do they want to be learning what God's Word says for "them'.
Rhema
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I already responded to that. Had shared that my parents had been Presbyterian at one time. And then they were invited to a Bible study and found that baptism was by immersion rather than sprinkling. So they changed to be Baptist because the Baptist churches teaches closest to what the Bible teaches. So whatever group teaches Bible as the authoritative Word of God is where I would go and would encourage anyone to go to also.
Look at 1.corinthians 15: 1-4 and Romans 10: 9-10. To be saved -- that Jesus Christ is the Son of God and that He died on the cross was buried and rise again on the 3rd day. Belief in your heart and confession made into salvation. Thanking God for His gift of salvation.
Look at 1.corinthians 15: 1-4 and Romans 10: 9-10. To be saved -- that Jesus Christ is the Son of God and that He died on the cross was buried and rise again on the 3rd day. Belief in your heart and confession made into salvation. Thanking God for His gift of salvation.
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Thank you for clarifying. However, your stated views on how one is saved doesn't include baptism. So if Presbyterians can be saved, then wouldn't you think Baptism a moot point?
Rhema
Because salvation dies not include sprinkling or baptism... You keep changing your 'qualifiers'. Well - since infant sprinkling is part of some denominational beliefs which is lpaer of their salvation for infants then they are teaching unscriptural activities that would be thought of as good works. Very well-intentioned but still wrong
False sense of what salvation is about.
The passages I previously shared tells what is needed 'to be saved' it is God's Word to everyone.
False sense of what salvation is about.
The passages I previously shared tells what is needed 'to be saved' it is God's Word to everyone.
