The One Event

[Bill]

May the Lord bless all of us and give us joy during this Christmas season.

So I'm curious as to what one event that will convince people that they have gotten past the the time of the rapture?

I'm not posting this here to prove one way or another that there's going to be a Rapture.

I'm just looking for your opinion of what significant event would take place after the Rapture for the rest of us that are sticking around?

Now personally when I read Revelations, I think the one moment that's going to stand out more than anything else will be the breaking of The Sixth Seal. And I say that because of what the scripture says on the very last line of the six seal.

"Run to the mountains and hide for the great day of the Lord Has Come and who can stand against it."

Now I say this because what this is telling us is that the other five seals have already broken, and no one noticed.

So what do you guys think is the one significant event that will stand out after the pre-tribulation Rapture?

 

[NoHype]

May the Lord bless all of us and give us joy during this Christmas season.

So I'm curious as to what one event that will convince people that they have gotten past the the time of the rapture?

I'm not posting this here to prove one way or another that there's going to be a Rapture.

I'm just looking for your opinion of what significant event would take place after the Rapture for the rest of us that are sticking around?

Now personally when I read Revelations, I think the one moment that's going to stand out more than anything else will be the breaking of The Sixth Seal. And I say that because of what the scripture says on the very last line of the six seal.

"Run to the mountains and hide for the great day of the Lord Has Come and who can stand against it."

Now I say this because what this is telling us is that the other five seals have already broken, and no one noticed.

So what do you guys think is the one significant event that will stand out after the pre-tribulation Rapture?

First thing is, Biblically there is no such thing as 'pre-tribulational rapture'. Jesus revealed that His coming and gathering of His Church is after... the tribulation (Matthew 24:29-31; Mark 13:24-27). So the only ones who entertain a pre-trib rapture are the deceived.

Towards the end of Luke 17, Jesus showed as the time of His coming gets closer, two women grinding at the mill, with one taken and the other left, etc. When His disciples asked Him, "Where, Lord?", He said that 'wheresoever the body is, that's where the fowls ("eagles") will be gathered'. In the Matthew 24:28 version, it uses the word "carcase" instead of "body". That suggests there will be a false gathering of the deceived by the coming false-Messiah/Antichrist, and that will happen first.

At present, I do not know if, or how, the coming false-Messiah to Jerusalem will cause a FAKE-pre-trib rapture. I just know that there's no such thing as a pre-trib rapture by Jesus written of in God's Word. A lot of brethren have the hope there will be, but I do not see it written anywhere in God's Word, but instead just the opposite, that Jesus must come only after... the false-Messiah shows up to play Him and deceive the whole world (except Christ's elect).

So is there an answer in Scripture to your question, of what events will reveal the time of the very end when false-Messiah shows up? Yes, there are events given for that time. God's two witnesses being killed with their dead bodies left laying in the street of Jerusalem is one of the major events at the every end.

Another is what Apostle Paul in 1 Thess.5 about the deceived who will be saying, "Peace and safety" at the very end, then "sudden destruction" comes upon them (i.e., "day of the Lord", last day).

The 6th Seal is in 2 Parts really though. The 1st Part is Revelation 6:12-13, which is actually "great tribulation" timing. And that idea about the "stars of heaven fell unto earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs...", is actually pointing to the Rev.12:7-9 event of Satan and his angels being cast down to this earth in 'our' dimension for the time of "great tribulation". That idea of 'untimely figs' is about the winter fig that grows in the winter but falls off in the spring. It is an early fig. That idea is connected with the coming false-Christ that Satan will play on earth at the end. If one is a like an early fig, it means they didn't wait for the proper time of summer harvest when Jesus symbolically appears. They instead were deceived and went with the false-Christ.

 

[Bill]

First thing is, Biblically there is no such thing as 'pre-tribulational rapture'. Jesus revealed that His coming and gathering of His Church is after... the tribulation (Matthew 24:29-31; Mark 13:24-27). So the only ones who entertain a pre-trib rapture are the deceived.

Towards the end of Luke 17, Jesus showed as the time of His coming gets closer, two women grinding at the mill, with one taken and the other left, etc. When His disciples asked Him, "Where, Lord?", He said that 'wheresoever the body is, that's where the fowls ("eagles") will be gathered'. In the Matthew 24:28 version, it uses the word "carcase" instead of "body". That suggests there will be a false gathering of the deceived by the coming false-Messiah/Antichrist, and that will happen first.

At present, I do not know if, or how, the coming false-Messiah to Jerusalem will cause a FAKE-pre-trib rapture. I just know that there's no such thing as a pre-trib rapture by Jesus written of in God's Word. A lot of brethren have the hope there will be, but I do not see it written anywhere in God's Word, but instead just the opposite, that Jesus must come only after... the false-Messiah shows up to play Him and deceive the whole world (except Christ's elect).

So is there an answer in Scripture to your question, of what events will reveal the time of the very end when false-Messiah shows up? Yes, there are events given for that time. God's two witnesses being killed with their dead bodies left laying in the street of Jerusalem is one of the major events at the every end.

Another is what Apostle Paul in 1 Thess.5 about the deceived who will be saying, "Peace and safety" at the very end, then "sudden destruction" comes upon them (i.e., "day of the Lord", last day).

The 6th Seal is in 2 Parts really though. The 1st Part is Revelation 6:12-13, which is actually "great tribulation" timing. And that idea about the "stars of heaven fell unto earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs...", is actually pointing to the Rev.12:7-9 event of Satan and his angels being cast down to this earth in 'our' dimension for the time of "great tribulation". That idea of 'untimely figs' is about the winter fig that grows in the winter but falls off in the spring. It is an early fig. That idea is connected with the coming false-Christ that Satan will play on earth at the end. If one is a like an early fig, it means they didn't wait for the proper time of summer harvest when Jesus symbolically appears. They instead were deceived and went with the false-Christ.

That is all fine. But I want those who believe in the rapture to tell me what one significant moment is going to prove to them that they're beyond the point where they were supposed to leave in the first place.

You have to understand that this teaching has been so ingrained into some Churches it has gone on for Generations. So I have those who believe in the Rapture to pinpoint something that's going to say that guess what you missed it LOL.

Because there's all manner of excuses as to why they are still here when the great day of the Lord comes along. Or when people are required to get the mark of the beast on their hand and forehead. They're going to still be making all sorts of excuses as to why the Rapture hasn't taken place yet.

It would be about the same as having a person say that they are a prophet. And every single day say that today is going to be the great day of the Lord. And during your lifetime when the great day the Lord does come that person can claim you see I prophesied that today is the great day of the Lord.

As you can see, the falsehood abounds.

Shall I post all of the false teachings that are going on at this time. I'm sure that it will get under the collar of a number of people here. And I will hear them saying that I am trying to push my church's teaching which I am not.

People have heard the false teachings for so long, that nobody argues against it. Nobody bothers to use the gift of discernment to determine whether or not the preacher is telling what the Lord says for him to say or not.

 

[Bill]

First thing is, Biblically there is no such thing as 'pre-tribulational rapture'. Jesus revealed that His coming and gathering of His Church is after... the tribulation (Matthew 24:29-31; Mark 13:24-27). So the only ones who entertain a pre-trib rapture are the deceived.

Towards the end of Luke 17, Jesus showed as the time of His coming gets closer, two women grinding at the mill, with one taken and the other left, etc. When His disciples asked Him, "Where, Lord?", He said that 'wheresoever the body is, that's where the fowls ("eagles") will be gathered'. In the Matthew 24:28 version, it uses the word "carcase" instead of "body". That suggests there will be a false gathering of the deceived by the coming false-Messiah/Antichrist, and that will happen first.

At present, I do not know if, or how, the coming false-Messiah to Jerusalem will cause a FAKE-pre-trib rapture. I just know that there's no such thing as a pre-trib rapture by Jesus written of in God's Word. A lot of brethren have the hope there will be, but I do not see it written anywhere in God's Word, but instead just the opposite, that Jesus must come only after... the false-Messiah shows up to play Him and deceive the whole world (except Christ's elect).

So is there an answer in Scripture to your question, of what events will reveal the time of the very end when false-Messiah shows up? Yes, there are events given for that time. God's two witnesses being killed with their dead bodies left laying in the street of Jerusalem is one of the major events at the every end.

Another is what Apostle Paul in 1 Thess.5 about the deceived who will be saying, "Peace and safety" at the very end, then "sudden destruction" comes upon them (i.e., "day of the Lord", last day).

The 6th Seal is in 2 Parts really though. The 1st Part is Revelation 6:12-13, which is actually "great tribulation" timing. And that idea about the "stars of heaven fell unto earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs...", is actually pointing to the Rev.12:7-9 event of Satan and his angels being cast down to this earth in 'our' dimension for the time of "great tribulation". That idea of 'untimely figs' is about the winter fig that grows in the winter but falls off in the spring. It is an early fig. That idea is connected with the coming false-Christ that Satan will play on earth at the end. If one is a like an early fig, it means they didn't wait for the proper time of summer harvest when Jesus symbolically appears. They instead were deceived and went with the false-Christ.

You're preaching to the choir here my friend. It's to those who claim to be going up in the Rapture that my question is asked

 

[NoHype]

You're preaching to the choir here my friend. It's to those who claim to be going up in the Rapture that my question is asked

Well, friend, you didn't make that clear in your post, because you asked...

"I'm just looking for your opinion of what significant event would take place after the Rapture for the rest of us that are sticking around?"

You really didn't actually specify whose opinion you were looking for.

 

[NoHype]

That is all fine. But I want those who believe in the rapture to tell me what one significant moment is going to prove to them that they're beyond the point where they were supposed to leave in the first place.

You have to understand that this teaching has been so ingrained into some Churches it has gone on for Generations. So I have those who believe in the Rapture to pinpoint something that's going to say that guess what you missed it LOL.

Nevertheless, even though some use the term 'rapture' and don't actually understand what it is, God's Word does declare there will be one, but instead it is translated as "caught up" in the KJV Bible. It's simply the Greek word 'harpazo' which means 'to seize'.

The 'rapture', if one wants to use that term (I prefer "caught up"), is written to happen after... the great tribulation. That is when the events of 1 Thess.4 will happen, with the saints still alive being seized to Christ in the clouds on His way to the Mount of Olives per Zech.14.

Because there's all manner of excuses as to why they are still here when the great day of the Lord comes along. Or when people are required to get the mark of the beast on their hand and forehead. They're going to still be making all sorts of excuses as to why the Rapture hasn't taken place yet.

I do understand what you're getting at, believe me I do. But there's no way someone stuck on the false pre-trib rapture theory is going grasp your question. As far as they are taught, those 'left-behind' are in Satan's camp, still on earth, to go through the great tribulation. They are instead taught Jesus will take them to Heaven prior to the trib and miss the great tribulation.

So the better question should be, what will they think when the 'great tribulation' starts, and they find themselves still here? Even this question doesn't work per God's Word, simply because God's Word actually reveals the future "great tribulation" is going to be a time of world peace, chicken in every pot, and the coming false-Messiah fooling the whole world into believing he is GOD. Those on the false pre-trib theory will believe that is our Lord Jesus, and will bow in worship to him. So they will believe that Jesus has come during the great tribulation, and by what Lord Jesus revealed about the 'carcase' being wheresoever the fowls are gathered, that suggests the devil is going to mimic a rapture to him meant just for them.

 

[Bill]

Nevertheless, even though some use the term 'rapture' and don't actually understand what it is, God's Word does declare there will be one, but instead it is translated as "caught up" in the KJV Bible. It's simply the Greek word 'harpazo' which means 'to seize'.

The 'rapture', if one wants to use that term (I prefer "caught up"), is written to happen after... the great tribulation. That is when the events of 1 Thess.4 will happen, with the saints still alive being seized to Christ in the clouds on His way to the Mount of Olives per Zech.14.


I do understand what you're getting at, believe me I do. But there's no way someone stuck on the false pre-trib rapture theory is going grasp your question. As far as they are taught, those 'left-behind' are in Satan's camp, still on earth, to go through the great tribulation. They are instead taught Jesus will take them to Heaven prior to the trib and miss the great tribulation.

So the better question should be, what will they think when the 'great tribulation' starts, and they find themselves still here? Even this question doesn't work per God's Word, simply because God's Word actually reveals the future "great tribulation" is going to be a time of world peace, chicken in every pot, and the coming false-Messiah fooling the whole world into believing he is GOD. Those on the false pre-trib theory will believe that is our Lord Jesus, and will bow in worship to him. So they will believe that Jesus has come during the great tribulation, and by what Lord Jesus revealed about the 'carcase' being wheresoever the fowls are gathered, that suggests the devil is going to mimic a rapture to him meant just for them.

I find that when a teaching is so ingrained, and so deeply embedded in people through almost Generations of the same teaching being taught over and over. And it is a false teaching. How do you reach a person to teach them that it is not in the Lord.

No I've tried a number of times at this website to explain my case, of why these teachings are not in the Lord. And even though to me it is clear even with all the scripture. They still will not believe it, or will not grasp it. Because it has been taught over the generations to be true.

A good example of this is the once saved always saved philosophy. Which is a false teaching.

But it takes a little bit of teaching, and a little understanding of the scripture to prove the case.

The first thing we have to look at is when Jesus is casting demons out of a person and the Pharisees or Sadducees are telling Jesus that it is only by the devil that he casts out demons. And Jesus tells them that the devil cannot cast out the devil.

We also see in the book of Acts that a human tries to cast a demon out without the power of God. And the demon throttles the person that tries to cast it out.

So these two examples show us that neither the devil nor man can cast a demon out of a person that only God can do that.

Now let us go back to the apostles in Jesus and Jesus sends the apostles out with his authority to cast out demons and to heal people. Jesus sends the apostles out to the towns to preach. And so they go out and they do these things and I find it interesting that if you look at this very scripture, it states in there the names of all the apostles that were sent out and of all the names Judas iscariot's full name is posted.

So we know without a doubt that Judas Iscariot is one of the 12 disciples who was sent out by Jesus to cast out demons and to heal people. And we also know that the only way a person can remove demons is they have to be in the Lord to do it.

Later when the apostles return to Jesus again it is listed all the names of the Apostles and Judas iscariot's full name is posted. And Jesus says to them Rejoice not in your work that you've done but Rejoice rather that your names are written in heaven.

Going back to the once saved always saved, it is clear in Scripture that Judas is scariest name was written in heaven, it's also clear that he also was one of those who went out casting out demons and healing people and we know that you can only cast out demons if you're in the Lord.

Later on we know that Judas betrays Jesus we know that he conspires with the Pharisees we know that he is paid 30 pieces of silver and we know what Jesus says of him it would have been better if you'd never been born. But you just made the choice to betray Jesus and later killed himself.

This understanding of the life of Judas blows out of the water any concept of the one saved always saved and predestination which are both false teachings

 

[NoHype]

I find that when a teaching is so ingrained, and so deeply embedded in people through almost Generations of the same teaching being taught over and over. And it is a false teaching. How do you reach a person to teach them that it is not in the Lord.

When reading and studying God's Word, one must first put any bias they've picked up from men's doctrines away, and let God's Word interpret God's Word. And if something isn't yet understood, one should let it rest until prayed about, and when God determines when it is time to reveal to that servant.

Therefore, just 'saying' something is false, is not good enough. It must be proven with God's Word as the measure. As for man's false Pre-trib Rapture theory which was first preached in 1830's Great Britain, that idea is nowhere written in God's Word, meaning a rapture PRIOR to the time of "great tribulation".

But because the Pre-trib Rapture school has so abused that term 'rapture', they feel they can just throw it out by itself and folks will think it immediately means a 'pre-trib' gathering to Christ, when that is not Biblical. Yet the Greek word harpazo, which means 'to seize', is written in God's Word. The word 'rapture' is simply derived from a Latin translation of Greek harpazo.

So when teaching about the time of our gathering to Jesus at His coming, if the word 'rapture' comes into the conversation, we should make sure we reveal that word rapture does not automatically mean a 'pre-trib' gathering to Christ Jesus. The whole phrase, 'pre-trib rapture' is required to point to the false idea of a gathering to Christ prior to the great tribulation.

Those on man's false pre-trib rapture theory will mostly not believe us, as belief in that false doctrine is actually part of Old Testament prophecy in Ezekiel 13. God is using it to prune dead branches.

I have tried to get them to heed when Lord Jesus revealed the time of His coming and gathering of the Church is, per Matthew 24:29-31 and Mark 13:24-27, which He said is after... the tribulation. It is a direct statement, not an allegory or parable that He said there. The deceived simply are told that He was not speaking those things of Matthew 24 and Mark 13 to the Church, but to the Jews of His day only.

So if you cannot get them to heed even Lord Jesus' Own Words about the timing of His future return and gathering of His faithful Church, then that means there must be something deeper going on. Apostle Paul actually did hint to it in 1 Thessalonians 5 when he compared those brethren who already knew about the "times and the seasons" regarding the events leading up to Christ's return, vs. the deceived who Paul said in the spiritual sense, were drunken in the night, and they sleep in the night (meaning in darkness outside the Truth). That's what they are, spiritually drunk on that false pre-trib rapture theory.

 

[Bill]

When reading and studying God's Word, one must first put any bias they've picked up from men's doctrines away, and let God's Word interpret God's Word. And if something isn't yet understood, one should let it rest until prayed about, and when God determines when it is time to reveal to that servant.

Therefore, just 'saying' something is false, is not good enough. It must be proven with God's Word as the measure. As for man's false Pre-trib Rapture theory which was first preached in 1830's Great Britain, that idea is nowhere written in God's Word, meaning a rapture PRIOR to the time of "great tribulation".

But because the Pre-trib Rapture school has so abused that term 'rapture', they feel they can just throw it out by itself and folks will think it immediately means a 'pre-trib' gathering to Christ, when that is not Biblical. Yet the Greek word harpazo, which means 'to seize', is written in God's Word. The word 'rapture' is simply derived from a Latin translation of Greek harpazo.

So when teaching about the time of our gathering to Jesus at His coming, if the word 'rapture' comes into the conversation, we should make sure we reveal that word rapture does not automatically mean a 'pre-trib' gathering to Christ Jesus. The whole phrase, 'pre-trib rapture' is required to point to the false idea of a gathering to Christ prior to the great tribulation.

Those on man's false pre-trib rapture theory will mostly not believe us, as belief in that false doctrine is actually part of Old Testament prophecy in Ezekiel 13. God is using it to prune dead branches.

I have tried to get them to heed when Lord Jesus revealed the time of His coming and gathering of the Church is, per Matthew 24:29-31 and Mark 13:24-27, which He said is after... the tribulation. It is a direct statement, not an allegory or parable that He said there. The deceived simply are told that He was not speaking those things of Matthew 24 and Mark 13 to the Church, but to the Jews of His day only.

So if you cannot get them to heed even Lord Jesus' Own Words about the timing of His future return and gathering of His faithful Church, then that means there must be something deeper going on. Apostle Paul actually did hint to it in 1 Thessalonians 5 when he compared those brethren who already knew about the "times and the seasons" regarding the events leading up to Christ's return, vs. the deceived who Paul said in the spiritual sense, were drunken in the night, and they sleep in the night (meaning in darkness outside the Truth). That's what they are, spiritually drunk on that false pre-trib rapture theory.

Everything i wrote about the osas false teaching is from scripture.

 

[twcstp]

I love how easily someone can say 'to prune dead branches.' I'm joking, I have no love at all for those words and I would not stay in the same room as you for any amount of time, at least, while your heart is stone.

I wonder,

What would you do to save your life?
What would you give in exchange for your life?

Sounds familiar, does it not?

Remember what you are saying and how those words play out in the real world where people go through all kinds of tribulations. You've taken the lives of how many exactly, when you call living souls 'dead branches.'

I swear, how could you be so blind? It's time to wake up from your slumber, starting with the two commandments immediately broken by those words:

1.
And you shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind, and with all your strength.’ This is the first commandment.
2.
And the second, like it, is this: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no other commandment greater than these.”


Now then, let us continue to the lesson, shall we?


Here IS the LOVE of God:

Isaiah 65:8 King James Version (KJV)Thus saith the LORD, As the new wine is found in the cluster, and one saith, Destroy it not; for a blessing is in it: so will I do for my servants' sakes, that I may not destroy them all.


Here is the lesson for you this night, about our Lord Jesus Christ:

“For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:”

Now...

Jesus Christ said THIS on the cross: FORGIVE THEM FATHER, FOR THEY KNOW NOT WHAT THEY DO.


Are you eyes opened now?

Those 'dead branches,' they are those whom the Lord Jesus died for, that the arm of the salvation of His Father might be made manifest to them, thereby destroying sin, and quickening their spirits to life through repentance, faith, and finally, reconciliation.

While the scriptures have many interpretations, it is that which is discerned of God through the gift of the Holy Spirit which is the Spirit of God with you that teaches you and reveals the things of heaven to you, that is, the heart, which is God's throne, and a heart without love is both sick and in need of a physician.

You have to learn with your heart, otherwise you are just reading the words but not getting the lessons.

May God bless you and keep you, and shine His face upon you.

 

[Bill]

I love how easily someone can say 'to prune dead branches.' I'm joking, I have no love at all for those words and I would not stay in the same room as you for any amount of time, at least, while your heart is stone.

I wonder,

What would you do to save your life?
What would you give in exchange for your life?

Sounds familiar, does it not?

Remember what you are saying and how those words play out in the real world where people go through all kinds of tribulations. You've taken the lives of how many exactly, when you call living souls 'dead branches.'

I swear, how could you be so blind? It's time to wake up from your slumber, starting with the two commandments immediately broken by those words:

1.
And you shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind, and with all your strength.’ This is the first commandment.
2.
And the second, like it, is this: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no other commandment greater than these.”


Now then, let us continue to the lesson, shall we?


Here IS the LOVE of God:

Isaiah 65:8 King James Version (KJV)Thus saith the LORD, As the new wine is found in the cluster, and one saith, Destroy it not; for a blessing is in it: so will I do for my servants' sakes, that I may not destroy them all.


Here is the lesson for you this night, about our Lord Jesus Christ:

“For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:”

Now...

Jesus Christ said THIS on the cross: FORGIVE THEM FATHER, FOR THEY KNOW NOT WHAT THEY DO.


Are you eyes opened now?

Those 'dead branches,' they are those whom the Lord Jesus died for, that the arm of the salvation of His Father might be made manifest to them, thereby destroying sin, and quickening their spirits to life through repentance, faith, and finally, reconciliation.

While the scriptures have many interpretations, it is that which is discerned of God through the gift of the Holy Spirit which is the Spirit of God with you that teaches you and reveals the things of heaven to you, that is, the heart, which is God's throne, and a heart without love is both sick and in need of a physician.

You have to learn with your heart, otherwise you are just reading the words but not getting the lessons.

May God bless you and keep you, and shine His face upon you.

I fully agree " love God with your whole heart and love your neighbor as yourself" but I'm trying to figure out who you're addressing your letter to?

 

[NoHype]

Everything i wrote about the osas false teaching is from scripture.

Oh I strongly agree that God's Word does not teach the OSAS doctrine.

And I also strongly agree that God's Word does not teach a Pre-trib Rapture either, if that is what you are saying.

But I am saying that God's Word does... teach a 'rapture' though, which is what 1 Thessalonians 4:17 is about, but in the KJV simply called being "caught up", and it does not say it will be a Pre-trib Rapture.

1 Thess 4:17
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
KJV

So where do you stand on that above Scripture?

 

[twcstp]

Is not heaven in your hands when you hold the bible? Does it not call you up, saying, come up hither?

The story of Moses and the 10 commandments should suffice to give you more knowledge of God's heaven.

 

[Bill]

Oh I strongly agree that God's Word does not teach the OSAS doctrine.

And I also strongly agree that God's Word does not teach a Pre-trib Rapture either, if that is what you are saying.

But I am saying that God's Word does... teach a 'rapture' though, which is what 1 Thessalonians 4:17 is about, but in the KJV simply called being "caught up", and it does not say it will be a Pre-trib Rapture.

1 Thess 4:17
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
KJV

So where do you stand on that above Scripture?

We are on the same page.

The only time that we will be brought up, caught up, ascend from the Earth to meet Jesus in the clouds, is at the end of it all. That is if we're still alive. LOL

You might think this is a little weird. But I do understand it personally. I understand Revelations fairly well all the way up to the point of the death of the two witnesses. After that my understanding of revelation with some exceptions fails me. As if it's not for me to know.

 

[Bill]

Is not heaven in your hands when you hold the bible? Does it not call you up, saying, come up hither?

The story of Moses and the 10 commandments should suffice to give you more knowledge of God's heaven.

Something the Lord revealed to my mind and understanding about the two stone tablets and the Commandments written on them.

The two stone tablets are representative of the two witnesses of Revelation. Because the two witnesses of Revelation have Jesus written on their hearts just as the two the two Stone tablets have Jesus written in Word

Remember the Gospel of John the first chapter it states in the beginning was the word, the word was with God and the word was God

 

[NoHype]

We are on the same page.

The only time that we will be brought up, caught up, ascend from the Earth to meet Jesus in the clouds, is at the end of it all. That is if we're still alive. LOL

You might think this is a little weird. But I do understand it personally. I understand Revelations fairly well all the way up to the point of the death of the two witnesses. After that my understanding of revelation with some exceptions fails me. As if it's not for me to know.

I might... be able to help with that, maybe, regarding Revelation.

One of the biggest key's to Revelation is understanding that Jesus was giving the same 7 Signs of His Olivet discourse, just expanded into 21 events. Thus Matthew 24 and Mark 13 parallel the Seals of Rev.6.

 

[Charlie24]

May the Lord bless all of us and give us joy during this Christmas season.

So I'm curious as to what one event that will convince people that they have gotten past the the time of the rapture?

I'm not posting this here to prove one way or another that there's going to be a Rapture.

I'm just looking for your opinion of what significant event would take place after the Rapture for the rest of us that are sticking around?

Now personally when I read Revelations, I think the one moment that's going to stand out more than anything else will be the breaking of The Sixth Seal. And I say that because of what the scripture says on the very last line of the six seal.

"Run to the mountains and hide for the great day of the Lord Has Come and who can stand against it."

Now I say this because what this is telling us is that the other five seals have already broken, and no one noticed.

So what do you guys think is the one significant event that will stand out after the pre-tribulation Rapture?

I'm a Pre-Trib believer, but that certainly doesn't mean it will take place exactly as we believe.

I base this belief on Rev. 3:10-11,

"Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown."

If I'm not mistaken, I read that you don't believe in Dispensations, whereas I do. This places us on a different path of understanding when we study the book of Revelations.

If one believes in the Pre-Trib theory the first significant event to place after the "Rapture" is the appearing of the Anti-Christ.

There will be many, probably millions on earth at this time who believed they were saved but were not and they are not taken in the Rapture, but are left on earth and will know what has happened. This is when some will now truly accept Christ as their Saviour, which accounts for the believing on earth immediately after the Rapture.

 

[Samson2020]

Have to agree with Bill and No-Hype. Plainly written in Matthew 24:29-31 It will happen AFTER the GREAT Tribulation. A gathering of the elect.

If one were to study a bit in the last few chapters of Daniel they would see a timeline for the event as it nears. Given in days.

Some would ask why would God allow His elect to go through such a horrible thing?

Daniel 11:35 And some of THEM OF UNDERSTANDING shall fall, to try them, to purge, and to make them white, EVEN UNTO THE TIME OF THE END:
because it is yet for a time appointed.
Perfecting faith, after all, those who are with the Lord at His coming are called, chosen, faithful, and they loved not their lives unto death.
We can't call, choose or kill ourselves and still be called elect but God can send those who would kill us to try us. Who among us would be able
to withstand "Though He slay me, yet still will I trust in Him"? Jesus did, can you? Same cup in this situation. How awesome would that be? Go out like
Stephen, Paul, Peter and numerous others for our faith. The most precious thing we must never let go of.

Rev 3:10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world,
TO TRY THEM that dwell upon the earth.

Two thoughts here. One does not need to be Raptured out to avoid this hour of temptation, they could be simply allowed to peacefully die, or placed in
the wilderness and hidden from the face of the dragon as mentioned in Rev 12:14 Notice here it says for a time, and times, and half a time. 3&1/2 yrs.
Same timing as the Tribulation period.
As far as dead is concerned refer to Isa 57:1 Taken away from the evil to come through death.

Just 2 cents worth.

 

[lentz]

Have to agree with Bill and No-Hype. Plainly written in Matthew 24:29-31 It will happen AFTER the GREAT Tribulation. A gathering of the elect.

If one were to study a bit in the last few chapters of Daniel they would see a timeline for the event as it nears. Given in days.

Some would ask why would God allow His elect to go through such a horrible thing?

Daniel 11:35 And some of THEM OF UNDERSTANDING shall fall, to try them, to purge, and to make them white, EVEN UNTO THE TIME OF THE END:
because it is yet for a time appointed.
Perfecting faith, after all, those who are with the Lord at His coming are called, chosen, faithful, and they loved not their lives unto death.
We can't call, choose or kill ourselves and still be called elect but God can send those who would kill us to try us. Who among us would be able
to withstand "Though He slay me, yet still will I trust in Him"? Jesus did, can you? Same cup in this situation. How awesome would that be? Go out like
Stephen, Paul, Peter and numerous others for our faith. The most precious thing we must never let go of.

Rev 3:10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world,
TO TRY THEM that dwell upon the earth.

Two thoughts here. One does not need to be Raptured out to avoid this hour of temptation, they could be simply allowed to peacefully die, or placed in
the wilderness and hidden from the face of the dragon as mentioned in Rev 12:14 Notice here it says for a time, and times, and half a time. 3&1/2 yrs.
Same timing as the Tribulation period.
As far as dead is concerned refer to Isa 57:1 Taken away from the evil to come through death.

Just 2 cents worth.

 

[Bill]

I'm a Pre-Trib believer, but that certainly doesn't mean it will take place exactly as we believe.

I base this belief on Rev. 3:10-11,

"Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown."

If I'm not mistaken, I read that you don't believe in Dispensations, whereas I do. This places us on a different path of understanding when we study the book of Revelations.

If one believes in the Pre-Trib theory the first significant event to place after the "Rapture" is the appearing of the Anti-Christ.

There will be many, probably millions on earth at this time who believed they were saved but were not and they are not taken in the Rapture, but are left on earth and will know what has happened. This is when some will now truly accept Christ as their Saviour, which accounts for the believing on earth immediately after the Rapture.

May the Lord bless us with his wisdom.

"Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth."

If this is all you're using to show yourself the concept of the rapture, then may I give you a different View.

Using the same words, you can also look at it as staying on the planet, and being protected by the Lord. While the rest of the world is going through heck.

As an example in Scripture, let us look at the Israelites when they are in Egypt. As slaves of the Egyptians. When Moses was doing the plagues, the last plague the killing of the firstborn of the Egyptians. The angel of death killed all of the Egyptian first born, and spared all of the Israelite children. And how was this made possible, that the Israelites would use the blood of the Lamb and put it on their door posts.

Isn't it written in Revelations, that the Seal of God would be first placed on the children of God, before striking the enemies of God.

This is exactly the same thing that is written in that Passage that you have posted as your witness of the rapture.