What do you believe?

[MedicBravo]

You are not in the wrong. But BW did initially post that he had recently lost his faith, and it would seem that he's found some measure of solace in the local Catholic Church that lets him participate in their music.

Yet, he has also posted rather extreme emotional reactions against the Trinity, and I fear he will once again "get the boot" from yet another church when his Catholic Priest finds out how entrenched his views are.

Humans have a very deep seated need to belong, a thing that seems to stem from the Fall of Adam. Very few can live a life where they have no place to lay their head.


A thing I myself do, with regards to many ill informed beliefs about Jesus. I provide posts that are well written, with source links and even direct translations of verses so others can see the lies. There are many beliefs and traditions found within the Protestant Evangelical church that are not backed by the Bible, ... where no one can back them.


Forget the lies of the pastors. How is one to deal with the lies of the translators?

At this point, it may be best for BW to be banned, in that I believe he is here primarily to look for a friend, not engage in theological discourse. On the other hand, maybe he just needs an outlet to vent, having been deeply hurt by many non-Catholic churches.

It's obvious, though, that he sees your posts as emotional polemic rather than well presented dissertations on Catholic theology.

Kindly,
Rhema


How true do you wish your Truth to be?

1. There are core beliefs that all Christians have or they're not Christian. Simple. Aside from that the differences in the groups exist and there shouldn't be.
2. The Trinity is a core part despite someone's inability to understand it or reject it. The latter is impossible in being a Christian and why Jews are not Christian or saved.
3. What "lies of the translators"?
4. Fact is, most Catholics get angry at any of those I mentioned. Kind of weird to have that reaction but could any of them back those "traditions" with scripture? No and that is another topic but the emotional reaction every single time should be noted.

5. I don't want that person banned. When the topic is brought up, they need to see that no mortal person/man can forgive sins nor "works/traditions". Christ himself said what one is to do to be saved and no "list" exists otherwise.

6. Back to the topic, "What do you believe?" Is a very broad question. There's going to be a wide variety of reponses.

 

[MedicBravo]

This is not true for most of the items on your list.



Is it every time? If I was Catholic, it would be annoying for me to have to always deal with some random Protestant who made a meal of immaterial matters. It happens so often; people just don't study the scriptural support for Catholic beliefs.

Yeah? Why haven't you given the verses to back them?
It's not immaterial. Theirs is a works-based religion.

"It happens so often; people just don't study the scriptural support for Catholic beliefs." - How do you know? You don't.
In fact, generally pastors in training do study what the other Christian groups believe. That's essential. They are eventually going to lead a church so they must know and explain why their church believes what they do and why NOT others.

People study what other groups believe to see if they believe the same and choose that as their "church". Wanna know what to believe? Look to what GOD says and pretty sure "Worship and venerate Jesus' earthly mother who was a sinner." is NOWHERE in any God inspired Bible.

Here's another for you. Show us "Thou shalt miss work and school for all the Holy Days and Festivals."

 

[KingJ]

Yeah? Why haven't you given the verses to back them?

Happy to discuss their support. Come discuss on link below, see my post #120 in response to your post #169 here.

Thread 'So tired of all the ignorant bashing of Catholics'

Oct 17, 2024

It seems that every once in a while, someone takes a bash at Catholics on this site.

I am so tired of ignorant people typing ignorant statements on topics they are completely clueless on. Every person and every belief deserve a proper and sound judgment.

Properly judging matters is evidence of being a Christian.

1 Cor 6:1 Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the saints.
1 Cor 6:3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?
1 Cor 2:15 The spiritual person...

• KingJ
• Replies: 143
• Forum: Questions about Christianity

It's not immaterial. Theirs is a works-based religion.

Incorrect. What makes you say it is works based?

We have had this discussion before on this site, or at least I have. If they are work's based so too are all Protestants who do not believe in OSAS.

"It happens so often; people just don't study the scriptural support for Catholic beliefs." - How do you know? You don't.

I have studied Catholicism quite a bit. Come discuss on link above.

As Christians we must properly study a topic before judging it. Scripture is clear that we must judge righteously. You are currently coming across like a Google junky. '"Dear Google, what are the errors in Catholicism?''

In fact, generally pastors in training do study what the other Christian groups believe. That's essential. They are eventually going to lead a church so they must know and explain why their church believes what they do and why NOT others.

That is a good thing. Are you a pastor who has studied Catholicism?

People study what other groups believe to see if they believe the same and choose that as their "church".

Yes of course, that is very good. Our beliefs should be able to survive the extremist of interrogation.

Wanna know what to believe? Look to what GOD says and pretty sure "Worship and venerate Jesus' earthly mother who was a sinner." is NOWHERE in any God inspired Bible.

They do not worship Mary. That is total naivety. Please stop these false and extremely naive accusations.

Here's another for you. Show us "Thou shalt miss work and school for all the Holy Days and Festivals."

What's your point here?

 

[MedicBravo]

I have studied Catholicism quite a bit. Come discuss on link above.

So? You're not the authority on anything especially the Catholic "church"
We are to judge and by what The Judge has said.
It's the Catholic's responsibility to defend their stance and denomination not yours or mine.

They do not worship Mary. That is total naivety. Please stop these false and extremely naive accusations. - Oh they do. Official church stances and if they don't that's on them. Many pictures and videos of them doing it and more can easily be found.

Yet again, you have not provided God given commandments/instructions for much of what they do.
The worse one is doing Mass over and over again.

 

[KingJ]

So? You're not the authority on anything especially the Catholic "church"
We are to judge and by what The Judge has said.
It's the Catholic's responsibility to defend their stance and denomination not yours or mine.

I use to be Catholic. It's our job to properly study a belief before we call them heretical. As explained in the opening paragraph here: So tired of all the ignorant bashing of Catholics.

They do not worship Mary. That is total naivety. Please stop these false and extremely naive accusations. - Oh they do. Official church stances and if they don't that's on them. Many pictures and videos of them doing it and more can easily be found.

They don't. We can do this all day.

Perhaps instead of typing in Google ''Catholics worship Mary'', try typing ''why does it appear as though Catholics worship Mary''.

Yet again, you have not provided God given commandments/instructions for much of what they do.
The worse one is doing Mass over and over again.

I gave you a link to a Catholic specific thread. Come discuss there.

 

[MedicBravo]

I use to be Catholic. It's our job to properly study a belief before we call them heretical. As explained in the opening paragraph here: So tired of all the ignorant bashing of Catholics.



They don't. We can do this all day.

Perhaps instead of typing in Google ''Catholics worship Mary'', try typing ''why does it appear as though Catholics worship Mary''.



I gave you a link to a Catholic specific thread. Come discuss there.

I will focus on God and the Bible not what mortal men in that group have made up and inserted into their book and beliefs. You seem to be real keen on defending those traditions.
They do. One fo many reasons why many of us are NOT and never will be Catholic.

I don't use Google and haven't for years. You assume too much in thinking you know where I get my info.

 

[Rhema]

1. There are core beliefs that all Christians have or they're not Christian.

Yes, a view that is believed by every Catholic, and according to them, you're not a Christian.

2. The Trinity is a core part despite someone's inability to understand it or reject it.

Were you to be a Trinitarian scholar, you wouldn't say that. A core proposition of the Doctrine of the Trinity, according to Trinitarian scholars, is that NOBODY understands it.

That being said, I understand you're merely following the teaching you've received from others, along with their misinterpretations of scripture. An honest scholar would admit that the text of the Bible does not support the Doctrine of the Trinity. While I am neither Trinitarian, Modalist, nor Arian, the position held by Arius is the closest to what scripture espouses.

3. What "lies of the translators"?

Trinitarian translators cannot help but provide English translations that support the Trinity where the Greek text does not. We would need to go into each and every instance of scripture used to support Trinitarian beliefs, but this is not a topic that I'm willing to discuss because of the rules set forth for this forum by the moderators.

4. Fact is, most Catholics get angry at any of those I mentioned. Kind of weird to have that reaction but could any of them back those "traditions" with scripture? No and that is another topic but the emotional reaction every single time should be noted.

The lack of anger cannot be a gauge for truth. Do you not post angry messages on occasion? (Yes, you do.) Now you ask if certain Catholic "traditions" can be supported with Scripture, then answer with a declarative No. As I mentioned in your thread on Catholics, both they and Protestant are wrong, but they, like you, are only parroting the doctrines and traditions they learned from others.

5. I don't want that person banned.

Neither do I. As I've mentioned, he seems to be going through a rough patch.

When the topic is brought up, they need to see that no mortal person/man can forgive sins

I can forgive sins.

Christ DEMANDED that we forgive sins.

What the heck are you talking about?

You know, I wonder how you understand this verse...

And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost: Whose soever sins ye remit (forgive), they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained.​

(John 20:22-23 KJV)

Christ himself said what one is to do to be saved and no "list" exists otherwise.

Indeed. Repent and be baptized, asking the Father for the forgiveness (not payment) of your sins, while you do likewise - forgiving others.

6. Back to the topic, "What do you believe?" Is a very broad question.

It's not my thread.

Blessings,
Rhema

 

[Rhema]

Perhaps instead of typing in Google ''Catholics worship Mary'', try typing ''why does it appear as though Catholics worship Mary''.

How about, "Why do Catholics pray to Mary?"

Why Pray to Mary? | Catholic Answers

Non-Catholic Christians often ask why we pray to Mary when we can go directly to Jesus. Click here to see how Catholics can respond.

www.catholic.com

"Why Pray to Mary? Because Jesus has given us his Blessed Mother as our great spiritual mother (Rev.12:17), a heavenly advocate who intercedes for us."​

Rhema
(I told you @Christ4Ever, nothing good comes from that book.)

 

[Christ4Ever]

(I told you @Christ4Ever, nothing good comes from that book.)

But aren't you the one who is using it to make your point or are you just playing "devil's advocate" here? lol

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
\o/
<><

 

[Rhema]

But aren't you the one who is using it to make your point or are you just playing "devil's advocate" here? lol

???

Neither. I quoted a Catholic source to show why Catholics pray to Mary, and BANG, right off the bat they use Revelation to support their ... heresy .

Kindly,
Rhema

 

[Rhema]

I use to be Catholic.

I have studied Catholicism quite a bit.

You went through Catechism?

(Just wondering...)

Rhema

 

[KingJ]

How about, "Why do Catholics pray to Mary?"

Why Pray to Mary? | Catholic Answers

Non-Catholic Christians often ask why we pray to Mary when we can go directly to Jesus. Click here to see how Catholics can respond.

www.catholic.com

"Why Pray to Mary? Because Jesus has given us his Blessed Mother as our great spiritual mother (Rev.12:17), a heavenly advocate who intercedes for us."​

Rhema
(I told you @Christ4Ever, nothing good comes from that book.)

Well, why stop at Mary, Catholics pray to all saints too.

What is evil about praying to a saint or Mary? Zero, zippo, nudda. They do not worship and praise Mary or saints. They feel unworthy to pray directly to Jesus many times. Most people sin daily, so this should come as no surprise.

We do not win Catholics over by harping on immaterial matters. Please try understanding that.

 

[KingJ]

I will focus on God and the Bible not what mortal men in that group have made up and inserted into their book and beliefs. You seem to be real keen on defending those traditions. They do. One fo many reasons why many of us are NOT and never will be Catholic.

I don't use Google and haven't for years. You assume too much in thinking you know where I get my info.

Medic, your Catholic bashing posts are weak and as though you are looking for click bait on the net.

Imagine someone judged you as you do Catholics.

Your points are being interrogated here So tired of all the ignorant bashing of Catholics, but it seems you only wanted to troll Catholics here, not actually discuss the facts.

 

[Christ4Ever]

???

Neither. I quoted a Catholic source to show why Catholics pray to Mary, and BANG, right off the bat they use Revelation to support their ... heresy .

Kindly,
Rhema

So, devil's advocate.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
\o/
<><

 

[Rhema]

What is evil about praying to a saint or Mary? Zero, zippo, nudda.

Prayers are made to a god. (Do the math Mr. nudda.)

Would a Jew pray to Moses? Would a Jew pray to Isaiah? Elijah? Abraham? Of course not, because they know that prayers are made to the gods (albeit just one).

Now I noticed that you completely ignored my question about having gone through Catechism, so I'm going to take that as a no. (But feel free to set the record straight.)

Imagine someone judged you as you do Catholics.

No need to imagine. I've received both your judgment and condemnation numerous times. Pick a member, here, any member. Chances are that's already happened.

it seems you only wanted to troll Catholics here, not actually discuss the facts.

No thanks. Your insults won't have the desired effect. I no longer walk into the traps of the control freaks.

 

[Rhema]

So, devil's advocate.

Not at all. I think you and I have very different understandings of the role of devil's advocate.

 

[KingJ]

Prayers are made to a god. (Do the math Mr. nudda.)
Would a Jew pray to Moses? Would a Jew pray to Isaiah? Elijah? Abraham? Of course not, because they know that prayers are made to the gods (albeit just one).

Relevance? Please re-read.

Now I noticed that you completely ignored my question about having gone through Catechism, so I'm going to take that as a no. (But feel free to set the record straight.)

No.

No need to imagine. I've received both your judgment and condemnation numerous times. Pick a member, here, any member. Chances are that's already happened. No thanks. Your insults won't have the desired effect. I no longer walk into the traps of the control freaks.

Not addressed to you.

 

[Rhema]

Not addressed to you.

KJ... you're truly losing it.

 

[Still Learning]

It doesn't surprise me that you would reject the verses that prove you wrong. Admit it, you're unable to admit when you're wrong. (Oh, right, you can't. Look deep in your heart. You're always right, aren't you.)


The truth is that Jesus taught you to pray to the Father in Jesus' name, and you preach a doctrine that rejects the VERY TEACHINGS of Jesus, NOT doing what He says.

How perverted.

But maybe I'm wrong, so SHOW ME ONE VERSE where Jesus teaches you to pray to him. (Go ahead, prove me wrong.)

Rhema

Does this count?

“Lord, save me!” ~Peter (Matthew 14:30)

 

[Rhema]

Does this count?

“Lord, save me!” ~Peter (Matthew 14:30)

As a prayer? I wouldn't think so. Not anymore than if you were in a fire and called out to a fireman to save you. Within context, there isn't any element within Peter's cry of doubt that would constitute a prayer.

It's conversation when the person to whom you are talking is in the room and isn't a god. While on Earth, Jesus was 100% human, working miracles by the power of the Holy Spirit - as is directly stated by Peter:

Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:​

(Acts 2:22 KJV)

Since you are new here, I would add that I am not a Trinitarian, nor were Christians Trinitarian during the first 200 years before Tertullian.

Welcome,
Rhema