What is... the "church"?

[B-A-C]

- where the church consists of saved and unsaved souls?

Maybe this is our main difference.

Rev 2:1; "To the angel of the church in Ephesus write: The One who holds the seven stars in His right hand, the One who walks among the seven golden lampstands, says this:
Rev 2:5; 'Therefore remember from where you have fallen, and repent and do the deeds you did at first; or else I am coming to you and will remove your lampstand out of its place—unless you repent.

Rev 2:12; "And to the angel of the church in Pergamum write: The One who has the sharp two-edged sword says this:
Rev 2:16; 'Therefore repent; or else I am coming to you quickly, and I will make war against them with the sword of My mouth.

Rev 2:18; "And to the angel of the church in Thyatira write: The Son of God, who has eyes like a flame of fire, and His feet are like burnished bronze, says this:
Rev 2:21; 'I gave her time to repent, and she does not want to repent of her immorality.
Rev 2:22; 'Behold, I will throw her on a bed of sickness, and those who commit adultery with her into great tribulation, unless they repent of her deeds.

Rev 3:1; "To the angel of the church in Sardis write: He who has the seven Spirits of God and the seven stars, says this: 'I know your deeds, that you have a name that you are alive, but you are dead.
Rev 3:2; 'Wake up, and strengthen the things that remain, which were about to die; for I have not found your deeds completed in the sight of My God.
Rev 3:3; 'So remember what you have received and heard; and keep it, and repent. Therefore if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what hour I will come to you.

Rev 3:14; "To the angel of the church in Laodicea write: The Amen, the faithful and true Witness, the Beginning of the creation of God, says this:
Rev 3:15; 'I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot; I wish that you were cold or hot.
Rev 3:16; 'So because you are lukewarm, and neither hot nor cold, I will spit you out of My mouth.

Would you say everyone (anyone?) in these churches are saved? Yet Jesus addresses them as.. "the church".

1Cor 5:11; But actually, I wrote to you not to associate with any so-called brother if he is an immoral person, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or a swindler—not even to eat with such a one.
1Cor 5:12; For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Do you not judge those who are within the church?

Matt 18:15; "If your brother sins, go and show him his fault in private; if he listens to you, you have won your brother.
Matt 18:16; "But if he does not listen to you, take one or two more with you, so that BY THE MOUTH OF TWO OR THREE WITNESSES EVERY FACT MAY BE CONFIRMED.
Matt 18:17; "If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector.

Was "your brother" in the church? If he isn't a believer, why would he care what the church thinks?

 

[Hekuran]

PS the local church is a "adulterated fellowship" a mixture of idol worshippers and saints of God" that cannot have a Godly fellowship together.

Horrified to read this, and honestly have no idea how you could possibly justify the thought.

Has it not occurred to you that all the New Testament letters were written to the local fellowships that you disparage?

Without the local church, you would not have the Acts of the Apostles, which is the history of communities of people being established in Jerusalem, Judea, Samaira and the ends of the earth. No letter to the Romans, neither the first nor second letter to the Corinthian church, nor Galatians Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians nor Thessalonians. The letters to Timothy and to Titus were addressed to individuals, but the content is firmly centred on leadership of local churches. Philemon is also addressed to the church. Without the local church, there would be noone for Peter to address his first or second letter to. The book of the Hebrews has no named author nor recipient, but clearly addressess the church (see the final greeting). John's epistles were written to churches, and the book of the revelation was addressed to seven local churches.

 

[B-A-C]

Without the local church, you would not have the Acts of the Apostles, which is the history of communities of people being established in Jerusalem, Judea, Samaira and the ends of the earth. No letter to the Romans, neither the first nor second letter to the Corinthian church, nor Galatians Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians nor Thessalonians.

I also am more than a little surprised. It seems some people are dead set against being part of any local community church.

 

[B-A-C]

The church is where heaven touches Earth. The church is God's hands, God's mouth, Jesus's body.
What did Jesus do when He was here? He went around preaching the gospel, healing people, feeding people, ... saving people.

Jesus is still here... in us!! In the church!! WE should be the Jesus that people see. They should see something different in us.
Something different than the world.

Now of course we can't save anyone... I'm not saying we can., Jesus saves. But we we can share the gospel with people.
We can share love with people. WE can heal them, love them, forgive them, feed them if necessary, cloth them if necessary.
Visit them if they are sick or lonely. Where does this happen? In the church!! (Not necessarily the church "building") but in the people who make up the church.
I would go so far as to say if you aren't doing these things... you aren't really part of the church. I'm sure that will offend some here.. so be it.

Now I believe it happens sometimes people get saved in anywhere, in anyway... Maybe they find a Bible... start reading it and get saved. Praise God.
Maybe Jesus visits them in a vision or dream and they get saved... Praise God! I'm not saying these things don't happen.

But for 99% of the people... they get saved because they went to a church... they heard the gospel being preached. They met people, they became friends
with them. They became brothers and sisters in Christ with them. They shared life and testimonies with them.

The internet has only been around for one generation really. It may be that some people get saved because of something they heard or saw on the internet.
But there is a lot of junk on the internet, a lot of false teachings, false doctrine... and "fake people".

There is an old saying..."you can fool some of the people, some of the time... but you can't fool all of the people all of the time". It's easy to fool people
on the internet.... There are 18 yr old beauty queens that are really a 42 year old man named Chuck living in a basement on the internet.
There are people claiming to be Christians on the internet... who soon as they get off line go back to looking at pornography, beating their wives,
and cursing everyone who doesn't agree with them. Who we see on-line isn't usually "the real you". We only see what you show us...
We only hear what you tell us. But we don't know "all" about you. Most of us have little avatar pictures of angels and Bibles, many of
us have made up "on-line" names like B-A-C. Some do have real pictures of themselves, and use their real names.. but even then...
we don't really know them.

Almost everyone I know who is a Christian got "saved" in a church. In a building. I'm not saying it can't happen differently.. but for most
people they "go to a church" to find Jesus. If I get to know you... I'll know your testimony. I'll have a testimony of my own.
It's hard for many people to share their problems with strangers... it can takes months or years for someone to trust you enough to share
their weaknesses, failures, and sins with others. But usually you only share these things with people you "really" know.

 

[rhern53]

The "Called Out", "The Body of Christ" as I understand it, is one here 2 there. It is people foreknow by God before time began, the elect.

It is not a church load or a bus load packed and ready for the Lord, It is one here and there; only God knows.

They are all over the world. This is the Body, this is the Church.

Some churches may have an abundant of elect, some may have a few, some none at all.

It doesn't matter whether you're Baptist, Church of Christ, Lutheran, Catholic or Mormon, what ever. Only God knows.

There are those who will be taken into glory who thought they were not worthy But there are those who are confident who will miss the Boat.

Matthew 7:21-23 King James Version (KJV)
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

........Even in this forum, some will be shocked. Lets look at 1 Corinthians

1 Corinthians 3:10-15 King James Version (KJV)
10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.

11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;

13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.

15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

 

[Brother-Paul]

Greetings brother, taking your post details initially, I add...

Rev 2:1; "To the angel of the church <G1577 ekklesia> in Ephesus write: The One who holds the seven stars in His right hand, the One who walks among the seven golden lampstands, says this:
Rev 2:5; 'Therefore remember from where you have fallen, and repent and do the deeds you did at first; or else I am coming to you and will remove your lampstand out of its place—unless you repent.

Rev 2:12; "And to the angel of the church <G1577 ekklesia> in Pergamum write: The One who has the sharp two-edged sword says this:
Rev 2:16; 'Therefore repent; or else I am coming to you quickly, and I will make war against them with the sword of My mouth.

Rev 2:18; "And to the angel of the church in Thyatira write: The Son of God, who has eyes like a flame of fire, and His feet are like burnished bronze, says this:
Rev 2:21; 'I gave her time to repent, and she does not want to repent of her immorality.
Rev 2:22; 'Behold, I will throw her on a bed of sickness, and those who commit adultery with her into great tribulation, unless they repent of her deeds.

Rev 3:1; "To the angel of the church <G1577 ekklesia> in Sardis write: He who has the seven Spirits of God and the seven stars, says this: 'I know your deeds, that you have a name that you are alive, but you are dead.
Rev 3:2; 'Wake up, and strengthen the things that remain, which were about to die; for I have not found your deeds completed in the sight of My God.
Rev 3:3; 'So remember what you have received and heard; and keep it, and repent. Therefore if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what hour I will come to you.

Rev 3:14; "To the angel of the church <G1577 ekklesia> in Laodicea write: The Amen, the faithful and true Witness, the Beginning of the creation of God, says this:
Rev 3:15; 'I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot; I wish that you were cold or hot.
Rev 3:16; 'So because you are lukewarm, and neither hot nor cold, I will spit you out of My mouth.

Would you say everyone (anyone?) in these churches <G1577 ekklesia's> are saved? Yet Jesus addresses them as.. "the church". <G1577 ekklesia>

1Cor 5:11; But actually, I wrote to you (the church of called out souls, the ekklesia) not to associate with any so-called brother if he is an immoral person, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or a swindler—not even to eat with such a one.
1Cor 5:12; For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Do you not judge those who are within the church? <G1577 ekklesia>

Matt 18:15; "If your brother sins, go and show him his fault in private; if he listens to you, you have won your brother.
Matt 18:16; "But if he does not listen to you, take one or two more with you, so that BY THE MOUTH OF TWO OR THREE WITNESSES EVERY FACT MAY BE CONFIRMED.
Matt 18:17; "If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; <G1577 ekklesia> and if he refuses to listen even to the church, <G1577 ekklesia> let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector.

Was "your brother" in the church? If he isn't a believer, why would he care what the church thinks?

Are there no unsaved souls in the place you worship Ray?


In all these quotes brother the same translation applies <G1577 ekklesia> a congregation of 'called out' souls.

What are 'called out' souls, they are as we know, those who are born anew. The born again from above are 'called out', are we not alien's to the world, we no longer belong to sin, the world and the devil, we belong to God, Father, Son and Holy Spirit, we are new creations, that is what the ekklesia is, so knowing the translation '<G1577 ekklesia> a congregation of 'called out' souls', which is repeated so many times in the NT, surely we must apply it where ever 'the church' is mentioned from the Greek translation G1577, the ekklesia.

I am sure you would agree Ray, we must not take scripture and fit it around what we know or accept at this time. We must take scripture, The Word, as Truth, the Truth is in The Word. Now surely this should apply even if we come across some things that maybe do not make sense or go against something we are used to saying.

Looking at all the references I quoted earlier, they all come from the Greek G1577, the ekklesia, the congregation of those called out.

This tells me clearly, to forget what I knew before, it tells me, all these references translate the same, all these references mean the same, Greek G1577, the ekklesia, the congregation of those 'called out'.

Now when we read these verses in Revelation, that you kindly quote, this rings alarm bells, and should with all of us Ray.

The church, the ekklesia is only the born again souls, those 'called out', whether they be in, Texas, New York, Virginia, USA, or whether they be in England, Ireland, Scotland or Wales UK, or any other country. The verses in Revelation is a warning to 'called out ones', not unsaved souls, the warnings are to saved souls, the ekklesia, the called-out church!

When Paul wrote to the Church, the ekklesia, in Ephesus for example, he wrote to the church, the ekklesia, he wrote to the 'called out' ones, no one else, no building, just to the saved souls which are the church as confirmed in the translation <G1577> the ekklesia.

When we read John's letter in Revelation, he has a message for each church type, each church type has the same translation 'ekklesia' - congregation - 'called out' each message, for each church type, carries a warning that this group of saved souls are wrong with God about. To another ekklesia group of 'called out souls' church, his message carries a different warning. Should our question not be, which one is our group of saved souls? Ask any church group and they all think they are right with God, these message point that it is not the case. These messages show clearly the ekklesia is not doing what God intended.

How many church ministers have been tempted to commit adultery, unless you catch them we don't know but God does.

How many church members have been tempted to commit adultery, we do not know we can be sure some have.

How many minister have sexually abused young boys.

How many in the ekklesia have purchased something for them selves for church giving's, money that was not theirs.

The list goes on, I am sure you could list lots more Ray.

Are we really, as called out, saved souls right with God?

Time is short, shortening by the day, Christ will come again in Glory brother, when we least expect it, will we be the 'called out' ones He is returning to.

Will the fellowship of saved souls we are part of, the ekklesia we are part of, the 'called out' ones we fellowship with, will we as the church in our location be ready and right with God?

Christ will return in Glory, for His church, the ekklesia, the born again, called out souls, the Body of Christ, the Bride of Christ, in every country, and part country worldwide.

When Jesus returns will He really say, well done my good and faithful servants?

 

[Brother-Paul]

Horrified to read this, and honestly have no idea how you could possibly justify the thought.

Has it not occurred to you that all the New Testament letters were written to the local fellowships that you disparage?

Without the local church, you would not have the Acts of the Apostles, which is the history of communities of people being established in Jerusalem, Judea, Samaira and the ends of the earth. No letter to the Romans, neither the first nor second letter to the Corinthian church, nor Galatians Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians nor Thessalonians. The letters to Timothy and to Titus were addressed to individuals, but the content is firmly centred on leadership of local churches. Philemon is also addressed to the church. Without the local church, there would be noone for Peter to address his first or second letter to. The book of the Hebrews has no named author nor recipient, but clearly addressess the church (see the final greeting). John's epistles were written to churches, and the book of the revelation was addressed to seven local churches.

What is the church, it is local, it is regional, it is worldwide.

Every reference for Church in the NT translates as follows.

<G1577 ekklesia> a congregation of 'called out' souls'

A congregation of saved souls, they are the church, the ekklesia, individual groups or worldwide.

I have never said otherwise, some think it an attack on the local church, far from it, I would never attack any part of the church, it is the Body of Christ, the Bride of Christ, the ekklesia as detailed from the translation and shown above.

The misunderstanding I think is because

- firstly people think it is an attack on the local church
--- it is not is is sharing the Truth from the translation from NT scriptures

- secondly they think the church is the building
--- kuriakon is the word for church buildings, introduced by RCC 300-500AD, it is NOT in scripture

- thirdly they think the congregation is the church even if it includes saved and unsaved souls.
--- Church, ekklesia, is ONLY the called-out souls, saved souls in the congregation.

 

[Brother-Paul]

I also am more than a little surprised. It seems some people are dead set against being part of any local community church.

I repeat my reply just made.

What is the church, it is local, it is regional, it is worldwide.

Every reference for Church in the NT translates as follows.

<G1577 ekklesia> a congregation of 'called out' souls'

A congregation of saved souls, they are the church, the ekklesia, individual groups or worldwide.

I have never said otherwise, some think it an attack on the local church, far from it, I would never attack any part of the church, it is the Body of Christ, the Bride of Christ, the ekklesia as detailed from the translation and shown above.

The misunderstanding I think is because

- firstly people think it is an attack on the local church
--- it is not is is sharing the Truth from the translation from NT scriptures

- secondly they think the church is the building
--- kuriakon is the word for church buildings, introduced by RCC 300-500AD, it is NOT in scripture

- thirdly they think the congregation is the church even if it includes saved and unsaved souls.
--- Church, ekklesia, is ONLY the called-out souls, saved souls in the congregation.

The local church is just as important as a national and worldwide one, as you and others have said Ray, face to face meetings cannot be replaced, I said the other day, talking face to face we are not giving a sentence and waiting a reply, I speak, you say something, we interchange one with the other, we can lip read, we can pick up vibes, a smile or lack of one can explain part of a story, eye contact, etc. These are irreplaceable, they are important.

The only issue I see is none of the things you are thinking, it is calling a building a church, RCC introduction not in scripture, it is not accepting that the ekklesia is ONLY 'called out' saved souls, not a place of worship with both saved and unsaved souls.

I feel people are looking from their church (they don't have one, they are part of one) upwards, instead of looking from our Lord on the throne downwards. He sees the bigger picture, he sees His picture, He sees the only picture, the one he has explained when he gave us The Word, church, ekklesia in scripture,

THE CHURCH, Scripture calls the Ekklesia.

NKJV - Church - 74 occurrences in 73 sections (NT Only)
Gospels - 2 mentions (Matthew)
Revelation - 7 mentions
Other NT books/letter - 65 mentions

KJV - Church - 77 occurrences in 76 sections (NT Only)
Gospels - 2 mentions (Matthew)
Revelation - 7 mentions
Other NT books/letter - 68 mentions

Each have the Strongs reference <G1577> ekklesia, a congregation, an assembly

Vines gives the same definition

Looking further, <G1577> is a derivative of <G2564> (kaleo).....
ekklesia - 'a calling out' 'a community of members on earth or Saints in Heaven, or both

ekklesia - A calling out is the born again souls
ekklesia - A community of called out members on earth, or Saints in Heaven or both

Each show us clearly that ekklesia, the only word for Church in the Bible and only in the NT, is a congregation or assembly (locally, nationally, worldwide) who are saved, born again from above, new creatures, new creations.

Only saved souls.

 

[PloughBoy]

Greetings brother, taking your post details initially, I add...

Rev 2:1; "To the angel of the church <G1577 ekklesia> in Ephesus write: The One who holds the seven stars in His right hand, the One who walks among the seven golden lampstands, says this:
Rev 2:5; 'Therefore remember from where you have fallen, and repent and do the deeds you did at first; or else I am coming to you and will remove your lampstand out of its place—unless you repent.

Rev 2:12; "And to the angel of the church <G1577 ekklesia> in Pergamum write: The One who has the sharp two-edged sword says this:
Rev 2:16; 'Therefore repent; or else I am coming to you quickly, and I will make war against them with the sword of My mouth.

Rev 2:18; "And to the angel of the church in Thyatira write: The Son of God, who has eyes like a flame of fire, and His feet are like burnished bronze, says this:
Rev 2:21; 'I gave her time to repent, and she does not want to repent of her immorality.
Rev 2:22; 'Behold, I will throw her on a bed of sickness, and those who commit adultery with her into great tribulation, unless they repent of her deeds.

Rev 3:1; "To the angel of the church <G1577 ekklesia> in Sardis write: He who has the seven Spirits of God and the seven stars, says this: 'I know your deeds, that you have a name that you are alive, but you are dead.
Rev 3:2; 'Wake up, and strengthen the things that remain, which were about to die; for I have not found your deeds completed in the sight of My God.
Rev 3:3; 'So remember what you have received and heard; and keep it, and repent. Therefore if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what hour I will come to you.

Rev 3:14; "To the angel of the church <G1577 ekklesia> in Laodicea write: The Amen, the faithful and true Witness, the Beginning of the creation of God, says this:
Rev 3:15; 'I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot; I wish that you were cold or hot.
Rev 3:16; 'So because you are lukewarm, and neither hot nor cold, I will spit you out of My mouth.

Would you say everyone (anyone?) in these churches <G1577 ekklesia's> are saved? Yet Jesus addresses them as.. "the church". <G1577 ekklesia>

1Cor 5:11; But actually, I wrote to you (the church of called out souls, the ekklesia) not to associate with any so-called brother if he is an immoral person, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or a swindler—not even to eat with such a one.
1Cor 5:12; For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Do you not judge those who are within the church? <G1577 ekklesia>

Matt 18:15; "If your brother sins, go and show him his fault in private; if he listens to you, you have won your brother.
Matt 18:16; "But if he does not listen to you, take one or two more with you, so that BY THE MOUTH OF TWO OR THREE WITNESSES EVERY FACT MAY BE CONFIRMED.
Matt 18:17; "If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; <G1577 ekklesia> and if he refuses to listen even to the church, <G1577 ekklesia> let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector.

Was "your brother" in the church? If he isn't a believer, why would he care what the church thinks?

Are there no unsaved souls in the place you worship Ray?


In all these quotes brother the same translation applies <G1577 ekklesia> a congregation of 'called out' souls.

What are 'called out' souls, they are as we know, those who are born anew. The born again from above are 'called out', are we not alien's to the world, we no longer belong to sin, the world and the devil, we belong to God, Father, Son and Holy Spirit, we are new creations, that is what the ekklesia is, so knowing the translation '<G1577 ekklesia> a congregation of 'called out' souls', which is repeated so many times in the NT, surely we must apply it where ever 'the church' is mentioned from the Greek translation G1577, the ekklesia.

I am sure you would agree Ray, we must not take scripture and fit it around what we know or accept at this time. We must take scripture, The Word, as Truth, the Truth is in The Word. Now surely this should apply even if we come across some things that maybe do not make sense or go against something we are used to saying.

Looking at all the references I quoted earlier, they all come from the Greek G1577, the ekklesia, the congregation of those called out.

This tells me clearly, to forget what I knew before, it tells me, all these references translate the same, all these references mean the same, Greek G1577, the ekklesia, the congregation of those 'called out'.

Now when we read these verses in Revelation, that you kindly quote, this rings alarm bells, and should with all of us Ray.

The church, the ekklesia is only the born again souls, those 'called out', whether they be in, Texas, New York, Virginia, USA, or whether they be in England, Ireland, Scotland or Wales UK, or any other country. The verses in Revelation is a warning to 'called out ones', not unsaved souls, the warnings are to saved souls, the ekklesia, the called-out church!

When Paul wrote to the Church, the ekklesia, in Ephesus for example, he wrote to the church, the ekklesia, he wrote to the 'called out' ones, no one else, no building, just to the saved souls which are the church as confirmed in the translation <G1577> the ekklesia.

When we read John's letter in Revelation, he has a message for each church type, each church type has the same translation 'ekklesia' - congregation - 'called out' each message, for each church type, carries a warning that this group of saved souls are wrong with God about. To another ekklesia group of 'called out souls' church, his message carries a different warning. Should our question not be, which one is our group of saved souls? Ask any church group and they all think they are right with God, these message point that it is not the case. These messages show clearly the ekklesia is not doing what God intended.

How many church ministers have been tempted to commit adultery, unless you catch them we don't know but God does.

How many church members have been tempted to commit adultery, we do not know we can be sure some have.

How many minister have sexually abused young boys.

How many in the ekklesia have purchased something for them selves for church giving's, money that was not theirs.

The list goes on, I am sure you could list lots more Ray.

Are we really, as called out, saved souls right with God?

Time is short, shortening by the day, Christ will come again in Glory brother, when we least expect it, will we be the 'called out' ones He is returning to.

Will the fellowship of saved souls we are part of, the ekklesia we are part of, the 'called out' ones we fellowship with, will we as the church in our location be ready and right with God?

Christ will return in Glory, for His church, the ekklesia, the born again, called out souls, the Body of Christ, the Bride of Christ, in every country, and part country worldwide.

When Jesus returns will He really say, well done my good and faithful servants?

Brother-Paul, I sure like your style! You have hit the "mark" time after time, On The "ekklesia" of God". It is so sad, that many of our brothers and sisters in Christ have been so branded by the enemy of deception, by a great "imposter". a "copy" of what that is "True". Satan greatest goal on earth is to be "Worship" and copy everything that God has made. Always, appearing as a "Angel of Light" and a beacon of hope. It has been so inspiring of your declaration of "The Ekklesia of God". and the flow of that presentation , so calm with every detail in its proper place, The "Holy Spirit" had to give you those words of placement. "Hallelujah' The reading was so pleasant. I said to myself as I was reading your "report", "how could this be", I enjoyed it, as a "true Child of God". My heart Rejoices when one recognizes "The True Body of JESUS" by being, and not by simple words.

 

[Brother-Paul]

The "Called Out", "The Body of Christ" as I understand it, is one here 2 there. It is people foreknow by God before time began, the elect.

It is not a church load or a bus load packed and ready for the Lord, It is one here and there; only God knows.

They are all over the world. This is the Body, this is the Church.

Some churches may have an abundant of elect, some may have a few, some none at all.

It doesn't matter whether you're Baptist, Church of Christ, Lutheran, Catholic or Mormon, what ever. Only God knows.

There are those who will be taken into glory who thought they were not worthy But there are those who are confident who will miss the Boat.

Matthew 7:21-23 King James Version (KJV)
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

........Even in this forum, some will be shocked. Lets look at 1 Corinthians

1 Corinthians 3:10-15 King James Version (KJV)
10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.

11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;

13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.

15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

Greeting brother

I struggle to read your post my friend, many of us use the dark screen, black on dark grey isn't easy to read, hope you don't mind me mentioning this.

I agree with most of what you say brother, except

Some churches may have an abundant of elect, some may have a few, some none at all.

The church is the ekklesia, congregation of saved souls, not saved and unsaved, they cannot be the church because ekklesia is the 'called out' ones only.

So a church can only consist of saved souls, never a mixture of saved and unsaved, though in practice because people call their building a church this happens. But as far as scripture is concerned only the saved are the church, that is the born again from above ones.

A place of worship has 200 congregation of which 50 are unsaved, only 150 are the ekklesia, the church, only 150 are called out of this world

Another place of worship has a congregation of 500, of which 200 are unsaved, only 300 are the ekklesia, the church.

Denomination has nothing to do with a church, a denomination is not and does not have a church. The called out born anew souls are the church, these can be numerous in this town, that town, this city, that city, this country, that country, all across the world.

The true churches are the 'called out' souls across the world, they are the Body of Christ, they are all part of the Bride of Christ, the saved in every small group, or larger group, size doesn't matter it is ONLY the called out that our Lord will Return in Glory for.

Bless you brother.

 

[Brother-Paul]

Brother-Paul, I sure like your style! You have hit the "mark" time after time, On The "ekklesia" of God". It is so sad, that many of our brothers and sisters in Christ have been so branded by the enemy of deception, by a great "imposter". a "copy" of what that is "True". Satan greatest goal on earth is to be "Worship" and copy everything that God has made. Always, appearing as a "Angel of Light" and a beacon of hope. It has been so inspiring of your declaration of "The Ekklesia of God". and the flow of that presentation , so calm with every detail in its proper place, The "Holy Spirit" had to give you those words of placement. "Hallelujah' The reading was so pleasant. I said to myself as I was reading your "report", "how could this be", I enjoyed it, as a "true Child of God". My heart Rejoices when one recognizes "The True Body of JESUS" by being, and not by simple words.

Dear brother,

Boy haven't I cried, Lord give me the words to explain, I felt my head on a wall, but again cried Lord help, it is hard when things are given to you and are so clear but you cannot get the message to others, thank God for the Holy Spirit my friend.

May the spirit guide the hearts and mind and reveal the Truth in Your Word Lord, yet not our will but thine Lord.

I feel it is so clear, so thank you for your confirmation. It is hard my friend because you really want to make it clear and not have it appear you are bashing the church, that must never be, not the true church, the ekklesia, the called out one's.

Credit also to our dear brother @rhern53 as he also sees what we discuss, I thank him also for explaining very similar but in a slightly different way, we must all get right with God and if we are not right with something so important as our Lord's Church, repeat, our Lord's Church.

You and me do things differently, yet we do go deeper and in a similar way, your manner is more like John the Baptist (meant in fun and love), I am more gentle, (I think) but I can be persuasive, maybe it is this that has prevented the Truth coming through, if it is, Lord forgive me.

Thank you again for your message of encouragement, just one more question my friend, do you eat locust and wild honey ;o)

All meant in love, hope it is received as meant.

Bless you.

Shalom

 

[PloughBoy]

I like this one, Satan trying to deceive, "HIS God" you know the one who Created Satan! And Jesus is so smooth, check Him out! pay attention "yellow highlight" and "english syntax". do not let it slip by you, like they do to you in "the Institutionalizes church" This is "The Bread of Life" for some people and not all" chew your "meat" slowly, because if you chew it to fast, it will choke you>
The Temptation of Jesus
…8Again, the devil took Him to a very high mountain and showed Him all the kingdoms of the world and their glory. 9“All this I will give You,” he said, “if You will fall down and worship me.” 10“Away from Me, Satan!” Jesus declared. “For it is written: ‘Worship the Lord YOUR God and serve Him only.’”…

Jesus was TELLING Satan you got it backwards "I DON"T WORSHIP YOU, YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO WORSHIP ME, WHO IS YOUR GOD" the one that created all things including you! For Jesus made that "Declaration" so says the "Holy Scripture" Then Jesus, commanded, Satan to leave, when he seem to not understand His declaration. Language "syntax". could you imagine, Satan quoting "The Word" to "The Word" and trying to deceived, "The WORD"! I fell out laughing at that, and could not believe, what i was reading. I told you sometimes the word of God will make you laugh. when "The Holy Spirit" blows the breath of life on you and opened up your understanding.

Jesus Unveils the Scriptures
44Jesus said to them, “These are the words I spoke to you while I was still with you: Everything must be fulfilled that is written about Me in the Law of Moses, the Prophets, and the Psalms.” 45Then He opened their minds to understand the Scriptures.

 

[Brother-Paul]

Brother-Paul, I sure like your style! You have hit the "mark" time after time, On The "ekklesia" of God". It is so sad, that many of our brothers and sisters in Christ have been so branded by the enemy of deception, by a great "imposter". a "copy" of what that is "True". Satan greatest goal on earth is to be "Worship" and copy everything that God has made. Always, appearing as a "Angel of Light" and a beacon of hope. It has been so inspiring of your declaration of "The Ekklesia of God". and the flow of that presentation , so calm with every detail in its proper place, The "Holy Spirit" had to give you those words of placement. "Hallelujah' The reading was so pleasant. I said to myself as I was reading your "report", "how could this be", I enjoyed it, as a "true Child of God". My heart Rejoices when one recognizes "The True Body of JESUS" by being, and not by simple words.

The church as it is considered today, the building, the people saved and unsaved is all wrong. That is not the ekklesia, the Body of Christ is pure, the church today is impure.

By that I am saying, firstly to accept a building as a church is wrong, scripture does not say once the building is the church. Only the RCC word kuriakon describes the church building, it IS NOT a word in the scripture so should stop now. Not easy some say, we have always called the building a church.

Then there it the topic you hit on the head with a hammer, 'satan loves to be worshipped'. He is worshipped in what are called churches every service.

A congregation of unsaved souls with called out souls is NOT a church, so when saved and unsaved come together to worship, who are the unsaved worshipping, their father the devil. They may think they are quoting Jesus following what is said on the service sheets but they are in actual fact worshipping the devil.

Jesus tells us the church, the ekklesia, is the called out, saved souls.

Jesus tells us if God is not your father, satan is.

They are inviting satan to their places of worship, satan sits at the front laughing his head off. It is that real.

I am going to write a letter to the church near you brother, just like Paul did, to the church in this place or that. Who am I writing to? Am I writing to the Church of St someone, this address this zip code, this country. Or am I writing to the brethren, the church, the ekklesia, in your area? The latter of course, this was what Paul did, it was what John did. He wrote to the believers, the born again from above, the saved souls, the called out. they are the spiritual stones of the one true church.

Am I right here?

Bless you all

Jesus loves you I do too.

 

[Brother-Paul]

I like this one, Satan trying to deceive, "HIS God" you know the one who Created Satan! And Jesus is so smooth, check Him out! pay attention "yellow highlight" and "english syntax". do not let it slip by you, like they do to you in "the Institutionalizes church" This is "The Bread of Life" for some people and not all" chew your "meat" slowly, because if you chew it to fast, it will choke you>
The Temptation of Jesus
…8Again, the devil took Him to a very high mountain and showed Him all the kingdoms of the world and their glory. 9“All this I will give You,” he said, “if You will fall down and worship me.” 10“Away from Me, Satan!” Jesus declared. “For it is written: ‘Worship the Lord YOUR God and serve Him only.’”…

Jesus was TELLING Satan you got it backwards "I DON"T WORSHIP YOU, YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO WORSHIP ME, WHO IS YOUR GOD" the one that created all things including you! For Jesus made that "Declaration" so says the "Holy Scripture" Then Jesus, commanded, Satan to leave, when he seem to not understand His declaration. Language "syntax". could you imagine, Satan quoting "The Word" to "The Word" and trying to deceived, "The WORD"! I fell out laughing at that, and could not believe, what i was reading. I told you sometimes the word of God will make you laugh. when "The Holy Spirit" blows the breath of life on you and opened up your understanding.

Jesus Unveils the Scriptures
44Jesus said to them, “These are the words I spoke to you while I was still with you: Everything must be fulfilled that is written about Me in the Law of Moses, the Prophets, and the Psalms.” 45Then He opened their minds to understand the Scriptures.

Brother PB

What is a syntax, is it a payment for committing adultery, not accepting God, not accepting His Son, coveting etc?

 

[Hekuran]

The Greek word ekklesia is not an exclusively religious term. It means 'called out'. When a community had a important decision to make - elect a leader, plan buildings, go to war - they would call out the citizens from everyday activities to an assembly to discuss and decide.

The first followers of Jesus took on the term and made it their own.

Everybody who assembled in the fellowship in, say Philippi, was part of the ekklesia.

 

[PloughBoy]

Dear brother,

Boy haven't I cried, Lord give me the words to explain, I felt my head on a wall, but again cried Lord help, it is hard when things are given to you and are so clear but you cannot get the message to others, thank God for the Holy Spirit my friend.

May the spirit guide the hearts and mind and reveal the Truth in Your Word Lord, yet not our will but thine Lord.

I feel it is so clear, so thank you for your confirmation. It is hard my friend because you really want to make it clear and not have it appear you are bashing the church, that must never be, not the true church, the ekklesia, the called out one's.

Credit also to our dear brother @rhern53 as he also sees what we discuss, I thank him also for explaining very similar but in a slightly different way, we must all get right with God and if we are not right with something so important as our Lord's Church, repeat, our Lord's Church.

You and me do things differently, yet we do go deeper and in a similar way, your manner is more like John the Baptist (meant in fun and love), I am more gentle, (I think) but I can be persuasive, maybe it is this that has prevented the Truth coming through, if it is, Lord forgive me.

Thank you again for your message of encouragement, just one more question my friend, do you eat locust and wild honey ;o)

All meant in love, hope it is received as meant.

Bless you.

Shalom

LOL! I do like Honey, and always thought fried Locust might just be nice Yes i do believe, i got some of "John Hus", John Knox", Luther, a taste of Calvin", and Paul, and a lot of Jeremiah flowing through my "spiritual" DNA, i cry a lot too and would like to not say a "word" but then The "FIRE" starts to burn, my soul catches on fire! And I cannot hold my peace, "like fire, shut up in my bones" Yes, "John the Baptist" too! "one body in Christ' all are members. How could you not see "John the Baptist"

 

[Brother-Paul]

The Greek word ekklesia is not an exclusively religious term. It means 'called out'. When a community had a important decision to make - elect a leader, plan buildings, go to war - they would call out the citizens from everyday activities to an assembly to discuss and decide.

The first followers of Jesus took on the term and made it their own.

Everybody who assembled in the fellowship in, say Philippi, was part of the ekklesia.

Called out means 'Called by God' brother.

He calls us we do not call him.

You cannot put Christ's Body, Christ's Church and mix it with unsaved souls who belong to the devil.

Christ is pure, He is Holy, His bride is to be spotless, we the 'called out' saved souls are to practicing righteousness. Unsaved souls do not practice righteousness, they are sinners, the devil is their father.

The translation for the word Church in the NT, it is only in the NT because the church is Christ's Body.
The Church, Strongs Ref <G1577> is clear for every quote, it is the ekklesia, the congregation of called out souls.

 

[PloughBoy]

Brother PB

What is a syntax, is it a payment for committing adultery, not accepting God, not accepting His Son, coveting etc?

It is the way the sentence is structure, and punctuations, and look how the words are place. In other words you might think it is saying one thing but it is saying something else, so pay attention to the words placement. And The Bible in a lot of place use a "compound complex" syntax. Just like i used explaining "Jesus in the wilderness. Jesus was telling Satan you are to serve "YOUR" God. that word "your" was place in a position that Jesus was referring to Satan and you are to worship me.

 

[Hekuran]

Called out means 'Called by God' brother.

He calls us we do not call him.

You cannot put Christ's Body, Christ's Church and mix it with unsaved souls who belong to the devil.

Christ is pure, He is Holy, His bride is to be spotless, we the 'called out' saved souls are to practicing righteousness. Unsaved souls do not practice righteousness, they are sinners, the devil is their father.

The translation for the word Church in the NT, it is only in the NT because the church is Christ's Body.
The Church, Strongs Ref <G1577> is clear for every quote, it is the ekklesia, the congregation of called out souls.

It just means assembly. It takes on a religious meaning when in a religious context, but there's no religious meaning inherent in the word.

 

[B-A-C]

I notice Jesus wasn't above getting a little bit dirty. I notice He hung out with the prostitutes and tax collectors.
I see where He took our sins upon Himself.

Jesus Himself never sinned... but he wasn't above putting His body in with the sinners.