What to expect in hell

[Curtis]

What about the condition of a spiritually dead person (not born again) living in a physically alive body? Are they living in darkness not knowing where they are going, without God and having no hope in this world? Could that be the same as those who are in everlasting chains of darkness like the angels who sinned? Are they being tormented by their own conscience knowing what to do yet refusing to comply to what they know as right. Are they worthy of death In which they are living? Can a subsidiary of hell be on earth while still being physically alive?

 

[Curtis]

Only the power of the Word of God can pierce the powers of darkness to set people free from the rulers of darkness. The light shines into the darkness and the darkness could not grab hold unto the light.

 

[Beetow]

Even after death is abolished, the state of the wicked in the Lake of Fire doesn't
change.

The Bible says that everyone, without exception, is a sinner and fails to measure up
to God's standards. (Rom 3:23) That being the case, then how are Christian folk
any less wicked than those in Hell?
_

 

[Curtis]

2Co 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

 

[B-A-C]

The Bible says that everyone, without exception, is a sinner

More correctly.. "was" a sinner. We "have" sinned in the past, but we can't continue to live in sin.

Rom 3:23; for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

1Cor 6:11; Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.
Heb 10:26; For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins,
Rom 6:6; knowing this, that our old self was crucified with Him, in order that our body of sin might be done away with, so that we would no longer be slaves to sin;

1Pet 4:2; so as to live the rest of the time in the flesh no longer for the lusts of men, but for the will of God.
1Pet 4:3; For the time already past is sufficient for you to have carried out the desire of the Gentiles, having pursued a course of sensuality, lusts, drunkenness, carousing, drinking parties and abominable idolatries.
1Pet 4:4; In all this, they are surprised that you do not run with them into the same excesses of dissipation, and they malign you;
1Pet 4:5; but they will give account to Him who is ready to judge the living and the dead.

2Co 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Exactly.

 

[Beetow]

● 1John 3:9 . .Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed remains in
him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God.

The thing is: 1John 3:9 speaks of God's offspring. Well; born-again Christians are
definitely not His offspring because God has only one: Christ Jesus.

John 1:14
John 1:18
John 3:16
John 3:18
1John 4:9


And for sure; Jesus was 100% sinless.

John 8:29
2Cor 5:21
Heb 4:15
1Pet 2:22


But born-again Christians aren't 100% sinless.

1John 1:8-10

Born-again Christians lack Jesus' sinless perfection because they are God's
handiwork rather than His offspring.

2Cor 5:17
Eph 2:10
Eph 4:24
Col 3:9-10
_

 

[B-A-C]

Born-again Christians lack Jesus' sinless perfection because they are God's
handiwork rather than His offspring.

1Jn 4:7; Beloved, let us love one another, for love is from God; and everyone who loves is born of God and knows God.
1Jn 5:1; Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and whoever loves the Father loves the child born of Him.
1Jn 5:4; For whatever is born of God overcomes the world; and this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.
1Jn 5:18; We know that no one who is born of God sins; but He who was born of God keeps him, and the evil one does not touch him.

But born-again Christians aren't 100% sinless.

1Jn 1:5; This is the message we have heard from Him and announce to you, that God is Light, and in Him there is no darkness at all.
1Jn 1:6; If we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth;
1Jn 1:7; but if we walk in the Light as He Himself is in the Light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin.

Are the verses below about born-again Christians? Or are they simply saying everyone has sinned at some time in their past?

1Jn 1:8; If we say that we have ( never sinned ), we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us.
1Jn 1:9; If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1Jn 1:10; If we say that we have ( never ) sinned, we make Him a liar and His word is not in us.

1Jn 3:10; By this the children of God and the children of the devil are obvious: anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor the one who does not love his brother.

1Jn 3:24; The one who keeps His commandments abides in Christ, and Christ abides in him. We know by this that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.

1Jn 2:4; The one who says, "I have come to know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him;

 

[Curtis]

The thing is: 1John 3:9 speaks of God's offspring. Well; born-again Christians are
definitely not His offspring because God has only one: Christ Jesus.

Act 17:29 Therefore, since we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Divine Nature is like gold or silver or stone, something shaped by art and man's devising.

 

[Beetow]

Act 17:29 . . Therefore, since we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think
that the Divine Nature is like gold or silver or stone, something shaped by art and
man's devising.

The Athenian poets wrote about mankind in general which, if we go back to the
beginning, we see that mankind came into existence by means of creation. In other
words: we should understand mankind's birth as sort of like when Geppetto
constructed Pinocchio. The little wooden boy was the image and likeness of its
father but wasn't the father's direct descendant.

A preponderance of textual evidence indicates born-again Christians are similar to
Pinocchio, viz: they are children of God by creation rather than direct descendants.

2Cor 5:17
Eph 2:10
Eph 4:24
Col 3:9-10


God has only one child qualified to be known as His direct descendant.

John 1:14
John 1:18
John 3:16
John 3:18
1John 4:9


The thing is: were born-again Christians to be God's direct descendants, they would
be divine beings because like gives birth to like, i.e. were God to reproduce, He
would produce Gods, viz: duplicates of Himself like as we produce duplicates of
ourselves. For example:

● Gen 5:3 . . And Adam lived an hundred and thirty years, and begat a son in his
own likeness, after his image; and called his name Seth.
_

 

[Curtis]

The Athenian poets wrote about mankind in general which, if we go back to the
beginning, we see that mankind came into existence by means of creation. In other
words: we should understand mankind's birth as sort of like when Geppetto
constructed Pinocchio. The little wooden boy was the image and likeness of its
father but wasn't the father's direct descendant.

A preponderance of textual evidence indicates born-again Christians are similar to
Pinocchio, viz: they are children of God by creation rather than direct descendants.

2Cor 5:17
Eph 2:10
Eph 4:24
Col 3:9-10


God has only one child qualified to be known as His direct descendant.

John 1:14
John 1:18
John 3:16
John 3:18
1John 4:9


The thing is: were born-again Christians to be God's direct descendants, they would
be divine beings because like gives birth to like, i.e. were God to reproduce, He
would produce Gods, viz: duplicates of Himself like as we produce duplicates of
ourselves. For example:

● Gen 5:3 . . And Adam lived an hundred and thirty years, and begat a son in his
own likeness, after his image; and called his name Seth.
_

Before a person can be "called a son of God" they must first be a son of God. You can never call God your Father unless he really is your Father.

Jesus said you must be born from above.........

(AMPC) Jesus answered him, I assure you, most solemnly I tell you, that unless a person is born again (anew, from above), he cannot ever see (know, be acquainted with, and experience) the kingdom of God. (Amp)

Being born "again" means.....

ánōthen; adv. from ánō (G507), above, and the suffix -then denoting from. From above.
1Pe 1:23 Because you have had a new birth, not from the seed of man, but from eternal seed, through the word of a living and unchanging God.

Born not of this earth or from this earth, but born from above! By what seed?

1Pe 1:23 You have been regenerated (born again), not from a mortal origin (seed, *****), but from one that is immortal by the ever living and lasting Word of God. (Amp)

You were born on this earth by the "seed" of your physical father, Born again sons are born from above by the "seed" of their eternal Father that came from the inside of God himself.

Act 17:29 Therefore, since we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Divine Nature is like gold or silver or stone, something shaped by art and man's devising.

1Jn 3:1 Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.

The word,"sons" is the Greek word........

τέκνον
téknon; gen. téknou, neut. noun from tíktō (G5088), to bring forth, bear children. A child, male or female, son or daughter.
You can never be called, "a son of God" until you first have. "the Son of God" living in you.

 

[Garee]

Born-again Christians lack Jesus' sinless perfection because they are God's
handiwork rather than His offspring.

Sons of God are God's spiritual unseen offspring. Not one to include our brother in the lord Jesus is considered the offspring of Adam as daughters or sons of mankind .

God is not a man as us never was never could be a creation.

Jesus said affirming what kind of a relationship he has with those born again below .zero

Mark 3:35 For whosoever shall do the will of God, the same is my brother, and my sister, and mother.

He was the first promised example of all who are born again from above . Marvel not that Jesus was born again. . and awaits his new body just as every other son of God . No need to worship dying flesh.that jesus the son of man said of his own profits for zero.

1 John 3:1Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.
Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

Do you think Jesus was ashamed to be called son of God?

 

[Beetow]

The rich man of Luke 16:19-31 was able to recognize the beggar who was at one
time lain at his gate, which suggests that folks retain a measure of their
appearance in the afterlife.

I don't know how the man recognized Abraham because the old gentleman lived
many years prior to Moses and the Prophets: maybe the man just simply asked
Abraham his name. But then too the man was able to hear Abraham speaking over
on the other side of the barrier so he likely heard Lazarus use Abraham's name a
time or two.

I think quite a bit of dialogue went back and forth but Jesus gave us only a
smattering of it. In point of fact, he gave us the precise amount that God had in
mind for everyone to know.

● John 8:26 . .He that sent me is true; and I speak to the world those things which
I have heard of Him.

● John 8:28 . . I do nothing on my own initiative, but I speak these things as the
Father taught me.

● John 14:24 . .The word which you hear is not mine, but the Father's who sent
me.
_

 

[B-A-C]

Matt 17:2; And He was transfigured before them; and His face shone like the sun, and His garments became as white as light.
Matt 17:3; And behold, Moses and Elijah appeared to them, talking with Him.
Matt 17:4; Peter said to Jesus, "Lord, it is good for us to be here; if You wish, I will make three tabernacles here, one for You, and one for Moses, and one for Elijah."

Matt 27:51; And behold, the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom; and the earth shook and the rocks were split.
Matt 27:52; The tombs were opened, and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised;
Matt 27:53; and coming out of the tombs after His resurrection they entered the holy city and appeared to many.

1Sam 28:13; The king said to her, "Do not be afraid; but what do you see?" And the woman said to Saul, "I see a divine being coming up out of the earth."
1Sam 28:14; He said to her, "What is his form?" And she said, "An old man is coming up, and he is wrapped with a robe." And Saul knew that it was Samuel, and he bowed with his face to the ground and did homage.
1Sam 28:15; Then Samuel said to Saul, "Why have you disturbed me by bringing me up?" And Saul answered, "I am greatly distressed; for the Philistines are waging war against me, and God has departed from me and no longer answers me, either through prophets or by dreams; therefore I have called you, that you may make known to me what I should do."
1Sam 28:16; Samuel said, "Why then do you ask me, since the LORD has departed from you and has become your adversary?

Matt 8:10; Now when Jesus heard this, He marveled and said to those who were following, "Truly I say to you, I have not found such great faith with anyone in Israel.
Matt 8:11; "I say to you that many will come from east and west, and recline at the table with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven;

Matt 22:32; 'I AM THE GOD OF ABRAHAM, AND THE GOD OF ISAAC, AND THE GOD OF JACOB'? He is not the God of the dead but of the living."

Mark 12:26; "But regarding the fact that the dead rise again, have you not read in the book of Moses, in the passage about the burning bush, how God spoke to him, saying, 'I AM THE GOD OF ABRAHAM, AND THE GOD OF ISAAC, and the God of Jacob'?
Mark 12:27; "He is not the God of the dead, but of the living; you are greatly mistaken."

Luke 20:35; but those who are considered worthy to attain to that age and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry nor are given in marriage;
Luke 20:36; for they cannot even die anymore, because they are like angels, and are sons of God, being sons of the resurrection.
Luke 20:37; "But that the dead are raised, even Moses showed, in the passage about the burning bush, where he calls the Lord THE GOD OF ABRAHAM, AND THE GOD OF ISAAC, AND THE GOD OF JACOB.
Luke 20:38; "Now He is not the God of the dead but of the living; for all live to Him."

----------------------------

To deny the resurrection is to deny the entire Christian faith.

1Cor 15:13; But if there is no resurrection of the dead, not even Christ has been raised;
1Cor 15:14; and if Christ has not been raised, then our preaching is vain, your faith also is vain.
1Cor 15:15; Moreover we are even found to be false witnesses of God, because we testified against God that He raised Christ, whom He did not raise, if in fact the dead are not raised.
1Cor 15:16; For if the dead are not raised, not even Christ has been raised;
1Cor 15:17; and if Christ has not been raised, your faith is worthless; you are still in your sins.
1Cor 15:18; Then those also who have fallen asleep in Christ have perished.
1Cor 15:19; If we have hoped in Christ in this life only, we are of all men most to be pitied.
1Cor 15:20; But now Christ has been raised from the dead, the first fruits of those who are asleep.
1Cor 15:21; For since by a man came death, by a man also came the resurrection of the dead.

 

[Garee]

The rich man of Luke 16:19-31 was able to recognize the beggar who was at one
time lain at his gate, which suggests that folks retain a measure of their
appearance in the afterlife.

I don't know how the man recognized Abraham because the old gentleman lived
many years prior to Moses and the Prophets: maybe the man just simply asked
Abraham his name. But then too the man was able to hear Abraham speaking over
on the other side of the barrier so he likely heard Lazarus use Abraham's name a
time or two.

I think quite a bit of dialogue went back and forth but Jesus gave us only a
smattering of it. In point of fact, he gave us the precise amount that God had in
mind for everyone to know.

● John 8:26 . .He that sent me is true; and I speak to the world those things which
I have heard of Him.

● John 8:28 . . I do nothing on my own initiative, but I speak these things as the
Father taught me.

● John 14:24 . .The word which you hear is not mine, but the Father's who sent
me.
_

The rich man represented by mammon through that series of parables as the wisdom of the world challenged the wisdom of God .all things writen in the law and the prophet .Three time men sought after the father of lies , three time The Holy Father in heaven offered sola scriptura all that is writen in the law and prophets or Moses and the testimony .let it be and it was good .Natural man bought the lie . The chasm remains .

 

[Beetow]

Jesus spoke of worms at Mark 9:43-48. Well if his worms are figures of speech,
then in order to remain consistent, we'd have to assign the worms at Isa 66:23-24
the same designation because it appears to me that Jesus' warning reiterates
Isaiah's prediction.
_

 

[Garee]

Jesus spoke of worms at Mark 9:43-48. Well if his worms are figures of speech,
then in order to remain consistent, we'd have to assign the worms at Isa 66:23-24
the same designation because it appears to me that Jesus' warning reiterates
Isaiah's prediction.
_

The worms that will never die is the judgment fire of God. The letter of the law death .


Neither literal fire or literal worms .

A place with no oxygen needed to literally breath

 

[Beetow]

You keep saying you've got something for me.
Something you call love, but confess;
You've been a-messin' where you shouldn'ta been a-messin',
And now someone else is gettin' all your best.

These boots are made for walkin'
And that's just what they'll do.
One of these days these boots are gonna walk all over you.
Yeah!
These Boots Are Made For Walkin'
By Lee Hazlewood
Performed by Nancy Sinatra, 1966

Lee Hazelwood was the singer originally intended to record the song but was
persuaded not to because it's harsh, and abusive to women. They suspected it
would do poorly on the charts if a man sang it and so recruited Nancy. It was a hit
and did very well.

This double standard is rampant in American literature and entertainment where
abuse of men by women is considered by many to be normal, whereas abuse of
women by men is an outrage

Well; this double standard is doomed to eradication because God doesn't judge on a
curve nor is He influenced by one's age, rank, or gender preference, i.e. within the
sphere of God; misandry is just as punishable as misogyny.

● Deut 10:17 . . Jehovah shows no partiality

● Acts 10:34 . .Then Peter began to speak: I now realize how true it is that God is
impartial.

● Rom 2:5-11 . . For there is coming a day of judgment when God, the just judge
of all the world, will judge all people according to what they have done. He will give
eternal life to those who persist in doing what is good, seeking after the glory and
honor and immortality that God offers.

. . . But he will pour out his anger and wrath on those who live for themselves, who
refuse to obey the truth; and practice evil deeds. There will be anguish and
calamity for everyone who practices evil-- for the Jew first and also for the Gentile.
But there will be glory and honor and peace from God for all practice good --for the
Jew first and also for the Gentile. For God does not show favoritism.

* Too many girls are growing up in my country having no clue what it means to be
soft and feminine, and instead learning to be cruel, insensitive, self absorbed
little man-hating piranhas.
_

 

[Beetow]

● Rev 20:13 . .The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave
up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he
had done.

I suspect the "sea" pertains to all that meet their end on water instead of on land.

This number in the aggregate will be great if we include all who were swept away
by Noah's Flood, and all who have perished by shipwreck, and all who have been
killed in naval battles and laid to rest at sea, and all who have been swept away by
tidal waves and tsunamis, and all who die at sea as travelers and/or in the pursuit
of commerce, e.g. fishing vessels, passenger ships, and cargo haulers.
_

 

[Beetow]

A co-worker once remarked that he wasn't too worried about Hell seeing as he'd
have lots of friends down there to keep him company. But I'm curious as to how he
expects to find his friends.

That place must be an ocean of humanity by now if it has been accumulating folks
ever since the days of Cain. I have enough difficulty finding my wife in a
department store even with a cell phone, but doubt anybody has a cell where that
co-worker expected to end up.
_

 

[KingJ]

What about the condition of a spiritually dead person (not born again) living in a physically alive body? Are they living in darkness not knowing where they are going, without God and having no hope in this world? Could that be the same as those who are in everlasting chains of darkness like the angels who sinned? Are they being tormented by their own conscience knowing what to do yet refusing to comply to what they know as right. Are they worthy of death In which they are living? Can a subsidiary of hell be on earth while still being physically alive?

I would argue that all the unsaved on earth are in their paradise. Pedophiles for example have innocent children all around them. Earth is a hell for Christians and all good people.