70 Weeks of Daniel Prophecy - Already Fulfilled or Not?

[Psalm59]

My question to you @complete is ,,,,,,,,,,,,do you NOT consider yourself a disciple of Jesus??

Good question, for all believers.
And if not, why not?

 

[Psalm59]

I suppose to answer your question, if you consider a natural death or maybe death through all these crazy diseases as a form of rapture, then yes.

Agreed

 

[Psalm59]

@Bill -- why do you say that God has already removing those He wants. Do you believe in a partial rapture? Apparently some of us are going through the 7yrs.of tribulation?

professing Christians are

 

[UncleD]

Hello UncleD

The funny thing, in my ministry my nickname is uncle Dave ...ha

Question for you on the wrath of satan versus the wrath of God,,in light of Revelation chapter 6 verses 15-17, we see that clearly, the mention of the wrath of the Lamb has come, wear do you place the timing of the 6th seal in the tribulation or great tribulation?

15 Then the kings of the earth, the nobles, the commanders, the rich, the mighty, and every slave and free man hid in the caves and among the rocks of the mountains.
16 And they said to the mountains and the rocks, “Fall on us and hide us from the face of the One seated on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb.
17 For the great day of Their wrath has come, and who is able to withstand it?”

Hello Uncle Dave, It is great to hear from you. My nickname came from serving in the army. Not the US army though. This nickname was given to me by my peers and subordinates. It was in the army that the Lord taught me leadership and how to serve. All together I served 40 years but only around 24 years in knowing the Lord. I am sorry I have taken a bit long to answer you but I like to get my thoughts in line with Gods thoughts especially when it comes to a subject like the Book of Revelation.

Your answer lies in the following verses of Revelation 5: Rev 5:1 Then I saw in the right hand of him who was seated on the throne a scroll written within and on the back, sealed with seven seals. Rev 5:2 And I saw a mighty angel proclaiming with a loud voice, “Who is worthy to open the scroll and break its seals?” Rev 5:3 And no one in heaven or on earth or under the earth was able to open the scroll or to look into it, Rev 5:4 and I began to weep loudly because no one was found worthy to open the scroll or to look into it. Rev 5:5 And one of the elders said to me, “Weep no more; behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, has conquered, so that he can open the scroll and its seven seals.” Rev 5:6 And between the throne and the four living creatures and among the elders I saw a Lamb standing, as though it had been slain, with seven horns and with seven eyes, which are the seven spirits of God sent out into all the earth.

When we look at Revelation (ending) we must look at it in parallel with Genesis (beginning). Genesis 1:1-5 we must read in parallel with John 1:1-5 & 14.

Gen 1:1 In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth. Gen 1:2 The earth was without form and void, and darkness was over the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters. Gen 1:3 And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. Gen 1:4 And God saw that the light was good. And God separated the light from the darkness. Gen 1:5 God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And there was evening and there was morning, the first day (ESV).

Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. Joh 1:2 He was in the beginning with God. Joh 1:3 All things were made through him, and without him was not any thing made that was made. Joh 1:4 In him was life, and the life was the light of men. Joh 1:5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it. (ESV). Joh 1:14 And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we have seen his glory, glory as of the only Son from the Father, full of grace and truth.

Rev 6:12 When he opened the sixth seal, I looked, and behold, there was a great earthquake, and the sun became black as sackcloth, the full moon became like blood, Rev 6:13 and the stars of the sky fell to the earth as the fig tree sheds its winter fruit when shaken by a gale. Rev 6:14 The sky vanished like a scroll that is being rolled up, and every mountain and island was removed from its place. Isaiah 13:10; Isaiah 34:4; Ezekiel 32:7; Joel 2:10; Joel 2:31; Joel 3:15; Amos:8:9; Matthew 24:29; Mark 13:24-25; Luke 21:25-26; Act 2:20

Right from before the beginning Christ the Word was with God. All things were created by Him and for Him. Being a member of the Godhead we know that He is an exact representation of the Father in heaven. Heb 1:1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, Heb 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds; Heb 1:3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

The world in Genesis was in literal darkness and that Genesis 1:14-19 God created the sun, moon and stars so, the light of Genesis 1:1-5 cannot be these physical things but Christ Himself. So, God the Father works everything through the Son and the earth and everything in it is His. He was the Tree of Life in the Garden of Eden and He is still the Tree of Life in the church (also can be seen as Garden of Eden under the Chief Shepherd). No one can come back to Him in the Garden of Eden unless they come through the Son (Genesis 3:24; John 14:6). Genesis 3:24 shows a flaming sword between the cherubim. This is the ark of the covenant, the mercy seat. The flaming sword is the Word of God and the flame speaks of judgement, so, the Word of God when preached in the power of Gods Spirit must convict the world of sin, righteousness and judgement (John 16:8-11; Hebrews 4:12). Without going into great detail the river flowing from the Garden of Eden (Gen 2:10) breaks into 4 and flows into the seas. The seas in biblical typology are the nations. So right from Genesis we see that missions is God intended manner of bringing people back to Christ, the Tree of Life.

There was darkness in the beginning. There were/are three times this darkness comes about:

Firstly in Genesis 1:1-5,

Secondly, in Matthew 27:45 Now from the sixth hour there was darkness over all the land until the ninth hour. Mat 27:46 And about the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, saying, “Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?” that is, “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?”

Thirdly, again in Revelation 6:12-14. Right from the beginning Satan has wanted to extinguish the Light. He rebelled together with a third of the angels and they were cast down to the earth. Where else do you read this? In Revelation 12. All through the ages Satan has had access to heaven as we see in the book of Job. He is the accuser of the brethren. In Revelation 12 he no longer gets access to heaven (Rev 12:8) and is cast out and he goes to make war against Israel and the true church. This is the great tribulation. Satan is a counterfeiter. He must bring about a false Christian church in order to deceive. Then he must present himself as Christ their head (Revelation 6:1-2).

Now in Genesis 1:3:5 we read: Gen 1:3 And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. Gen 1:4 And God saw that the light was good. And God separated the light from the darkness. Gen 1:5 God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And there was evening and there was morning, the first day. What do we see here? A picture that supports biblical truths about the evangelism, rapture. When Jesus came into the world in flesh and blood He came as the light and all those who place their trust in Him through the preaching of the Gospel would be separated from the darkness. They are translated from darkness into His light. Also, we read that Jesus separates the sheep from the goats. There is the first and the second resurrections. He sends the angels to reap the harvest of the world (Matt 24:29-31). In 1 Thes 5:3 For you yourselves are fully aware that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night.1Th_5:4 But you are not in darkness, brothers, for that day to surprise you like a thief.1Th_5:5 For you are all children of light, children of the day. We are not of the night or of the darkness.1Th_5:8 But since we belong to the day, let us be sober, having put on the breastplate of faith and love, and for a helmet the hope of salvation (ESV). Note: Like a thief in the night … Like a thief during persecution, great tribulation, He comes and snatches us away.

Now in Matthew 27:51 And behold, the curtain of the temple was torn in two, from top to bottom. And the earth shook, and the rocks were split. Mat 27:52 The tombs also were opened. And many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised, Mat 27:53 and coming out of the tombs after his resurrection they went into the holy city and appeared to many. Mat 27:54 When the centurion and those who were with him, keeping watch over Jesus, saw the earthquake and what took place, they were filled with awe and said, “Truly this was the Son of God!” What followed the death of Jesus on the cross? The tombs were opened and many who were asleep (true Christians do not die they simply fall asleep to wake up again later at the resurrection, their souls already with the Lord). What followed the sun becoming dark in Rev 6, the resurrection and the rapture. Remember Jesus is the first fruits of the resurrection (1 Cor 15:20) and at His ascension the first fruits of the rapture. It also should be noted that it was a gentile centurion who recognised Jesus as the Son of God.

So, going back to your question as to whether the wrath of the Lamb is during the tribulation or the great tribulation … I place this after the resurrection and the rapture which takes place between the 6th and the 7th seal. Why do I say that because scripture interprets scripture. Joel 2:30 “And I will show wonders in the heavens and on the earth, blood and fire and columns of smoke. Joe 2:31 The sun shall be turned to darkness, and the moon to blood, before the great and awesome day of the LORD comes.

Matthew 24:29-30 is together with Revelation 6:12-14.

Revelation 6:12-14 is together with Isaiah 13:10; Isaiah 34:4; Ezekiel 32:7; Joel 2:10; Joel 2:31; Joel 3:15; Amos:8:9; Matthew 24:29; Mark 13:24-25; Luke 21:25-26; Act 2:20.

The wrath of the Lamb therefore is the Day of the Lord where Jesus, the Lamb of God, will go out and destroy Antichrist and establish His millennial reign on earth. This Day of the Lord starts immediately after the resurrection and rapture of the saints with the 7th seal and only He is entrusted to break that seal.

One must really just follow what Jesus said: Just as in the days of Noah …. Always keep in mind that 7 and 8 in biblical typology are completion and new beginnings respectively.

GENESIS 6 AND 7 IN BRIEF

Gen 6:1-2, 4 There were demons having relations with the daughters of men – Read Rev 18:1-3

Gen 6:3 God says that His Spirit will not strive with man forever – Read 2 Thes 2:7.

Gen 6:5 God sees that the wickedness of man was great on the earth and that e very intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually – total spiritual darkness Rev 6:12-14; Isaiah 13:10; Isaiah 34:4; Ezekiel 32:7; Joel 2:10; Joel 2:31; Joel 3:15; Amos:8:9; Matthew 24:29; Mark 13:24-25; Luke 21:25-26; Act 2:20.

Gen 6:6 The Lord was sorry that He had made man on the earth and He was grieved in His heart. The Lord said, “I will blot out man whom I have created from the face of the land … - Rev 6:15-17 and the trumpet, woe and bowl judgements.

Gen 6:8 Noah found grace in the eyes of the Lord – All those in Christ, those chosen (CHOSEN = ELECT) by Him through the presentation of the gospel. 6000 years.

Gen 6:14-16 The building of the ark

• Gopher wood – wood speaks of the humanity of Jesus Christ.
• Pitch – the Blood of Jesus Christ.
• Length of the ark – 300 cubits – faithful remnant.
• Fifty cubits breadth – 50 is the year of jubilee – liberty – Pentecost.
• Height 30 cubits – Jesus was 30 years old when He started on in His ministry. Maturity.
• Window in the ark – we keep our eyes on the Lord.
• Door in the arks side – Jesus is the door – John 10

GENESIS 7

Gen 7:4 – for after seven more days (speaking of the 70th week of Daniel in typology) I will send rain on the earth forty days and forty nights; and I will blot out from the face of the land every living thing that I have made (NASB).

Gen 7:7 – Then Noah and his sons and his wife and his sons wives with him entered the ark because of the water of the flood (NASB). Note that the judgements were starting and all those who are in Christ are taken out of the way. This is a picture in typology of the rapture.

Gen 7:10 – Now it came about after the seven days, the water of the flood came upon the earth. Note: AFTER THE SEVEN DAYS (capitals for emphasis only). The judgements started immediately they were taken out of the way. The same happened in Lots day with Sodom and Gomorrah. Once the angels had taken Lot out of the way (a picture of the rapture).

Gen 7:16 – And those that entered, male and female of all flesh, entered as God had commanded him; and the Lord closed the door. Matthew 25:1-13 – the five foolish virgins let their lamps run out(the Holy Spirit was not present with them – apostasy). The Holy Spirit had departed from them and when they wanted more they could get no more oil and THE DOOR WAS SHUT (capitals for emphasis only). Isaiah 22:22 And I will place on his shoulder the key of the house of David. He shall open, and none shall shut; and he shall shut, and none shall open.

7 – Completion – we have had 6000 years on earth and the seven thousandth year will everything be complete and Jesus will hand over everything to the Father.

8 entered the ark – they will have a new beginning in the millennial reign of Christ.

I hope that all who have read this now learn from what Jesus said … as in the days of Noah!! Be ready for what is to come.

The Day of the Lord commences after we are removed.

I do not profess to know everything about the Book of Revelation so I ask all those who read this to do so prayerfully.

 

[Dave M]

Thanks @UncleD

for such a well-put-together reply, it will take me some time to absorb and read all this. It is much appreciated !!

 

[Bill]

Hello Uncle Dave, It is great to hear from you. My nickname came from serving in the army. Not the US army though. This nickname was given to me by my peers and subordinates. It was in the army that the Lord taught me leadership and how to serve. All together I served 40 years but only around 24 years in knowing the Lord. I am sorry I have taken a bit long to answer you but I like to get my thoughts in line with Gods thoughts especially when it comes to a subject like the Book of Revelation.

Your answer lies in the following verses of Revelation 5: Rev 5:1 Then I saw in the right hand of him who was seated on the throne a scroll written within and on the back, sealed with seven seals. Rev 5:2 And I saw a mighty angel proclaiming with a loud voice, “Who is worthy to open the scroll and break its seals?” Rev 5:3 And no one in heaven or on earth or under the earth was able to open the scroll or to look into it, Rev 5:4 and I began to weep loudly because no one was found worthy to open the scroll or to look into it. Rev 5:5 And one of the elders said to me, “Weep no more; behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, has conquered, so that he can open the scroll and its seven seals.” Rev 5:6 And between the throne and the four living creatures and among the elders I saw a Lamb standing, as though it had been slain, with seven horns and with seven eyes, which are the seven spirits of God sent out into all the earth.

When we look at Revelation (ending) we must look at it in parallel with Genesis (beginning). Genesis 1:1-5 we must read in parallel with John 1:1-5 & 14.

Gen 1:1 In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth. Gen 1:2 The earth was without form and void, and darkness was over the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters. Gen 1:3 And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. Gen 1:4 And God saw that the light was good. And God separated the light from the darkness. Gen 1:5 God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And there was evening and there was morning, the first day (ESV).

Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. Joh 1:2 He was in the beginning with God. Joh 1:3 All things were made through him, and without him was not any thing made that was made. Joh 1:4 In him was life, and the life was the light of men. Joh 1:5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it. (ESV). Joh 1:14 And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we have seen his glory, glory as of the only Son from the Father, full of grace and truth.

Rev 6:12 When he opened the sixth seal, I looked, and behold, there was a great earthquake, and the sun became black as sackcloth, the full moon became like blood, Rev 6:13 and the stars of the sky fell to the earth as the fig tree sheds its winter fruit when shaken by a gale. Rev 6:14 The sky vanished like a scroll that is being rolled up, and every mountain and island was removed from its place. Isaiah 13:10; Isaiah 34:4; Ezekiel 32:7; Joel 2:10; Joel 2:31; Joel 3:15; Amos:8:9; Matthew 24:29; Mark 13:24-25; Luke 21:25-26; Act 2:20

Right from before the beginning Christ the Word was with God. All things were created by Him and for Him. Being a member of the Godhead we know that He is an exact representation of the Father in heaven. Heb 1:1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, Heb 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds; Heb 1:3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

The world in Genesis was in literal darkness and that Genesis 1:14-19 God created the sun, moon and stars so, the light of Genesis 1:1-5 cannot be these physical things but Christ Himself. So, God the Father works everything through the Son and the earth and everything in it is His. He was the Tree of Life in the Garden of Eden and He is still the Tree of Life in the church (also can be seen as Garden of Eden under the Chief Shepherd). No one can come back to Him in the Garden of Eden unless they come through the Son (Genesis 3:24; John 14:6). Genesis 3:24 shows a flaming sword between the cherubim. This is the ark of the covenant, the mercy seat. The flaming sword is the Word of God and the flame speaks of judgement, so, the Word of God when preached in the power of Gods Spirit must convict the world of sin, righteousness and judgement (John 16:8-11; Hebrews 4:12). Without going into great detail the river flowing from the Garden of Eden (Gen 2:10) breaks into 4 and flows into the seas. The seas in biblical typology are the nations. So right from Genesis we see that missions is God intended manner of bringing people back to Christ, the Tree of Life.

There was darkness in the beginning. There were/are three times this darkness comes about:

Firstly in Genesis 1:1-5,

Secondly, in Matthew 27:45 Now from the sixth hour there was darkness over all the land until the ninth hour. Mat 27:46 And about the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, saying, “Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?” that is, “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?”

Thirdly, again in Revelation 6:12-14. Right from the beginning Satan has wanted to extinguish the Light. He rebelled together with a third of the angels and they were cast down to the earth. Where else do you read this? In Revelation 12. All through the ages Satan has had access to heaven as we see in the book of Job. He is the accuser of the brethren. In Revelation 12 he no longer gets access to heaven (Rev 12:8) and is cast out and he goes to make war against Israel and the true church. This is the great tribulation. Satan is a counterfeiter. He must bring about a false Christian church in order to deceive. Then he must present himself as Christ their head (Revelation 6:1-2).

Now in Genesis 1:3:5 we read: Gen 1:3 And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. Gen 1:4 And God saw that the light was good. And God separated the light from the darkness. Gen 1:5 God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And there was evening and there was morning, the first day. What do we see here? A picture that supports biblical truths about the evangelism, rapture. When Jesus came into the world in flesh and blood He came as the light and all those who place their trust in Him through the preaching of the Gospel would be separated from the darkness. They are translated from darkness into His light. Also, we read that Jesus separates the sheep from the goats. There is the first and the second resurrections. He sends the angels to reap the harvest of the world (Matt 24:29-31). In 1 Thes 5:3 For you yourselves are fully aware that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night.1Th_5:4 But you are not in darkness, brothers, for that day to surprise you like a thief.1Th_5:5 For you are all children of light, children of the day. We are not of the night or of the darkness.1Th_5:8 But since we belong to the day, let us be sober, having put on the breastplate of faith and love, and for a helmet the hope of salvation (ESV). Note: Like a thief in the night … Like a thief during persecution, great tribulation, He comes and snatches us away.

Now in Matthew 27:51 And behold, the curtain of the temple was torn in two, from top to bottom. And the earth shook, and the rocks were split. Mat 27:52 The tombs also were opened. And many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised, Mat 27:53 and coming out of the tombs after his resurrection they went into the holy city and appeared to many. Mat 27:54 When the centurion and those who were with him, keeping watch over Jesus, saw the earthquake and what took place, they were filled with awe and said, “Truly this was the Son of God!” What followed the death of Jesus on the cross? The tombs were opened and many who were asleep (true Christians do not die they simply fall asleep to wake up again later at the resurrection, their souls already with the Lord). What followed the sun becoming dark in Rev 6, the resurrection and the rapture. Remember Jesus is the first fruits of the resurrection (1 Cor 15:20) and at His ascension the first fruits of the rapture. It also should be noted that it was a gentile centurion who recognised Jesus as the Son of God.

So, going back to your question as to whether the wrath of the Lamb is during the tribulation or the great tribulation … I place this after the resurrection and the rapture which takes place between the 6th and the 7th seal. Why do I say that because scripture interprets scripture. Joel 2:30 “And I will show wonders in the heavens and on the earth, blood and fire and columns of smoke. Joe 2:31 The sun shall be turned to darkness, and the moon to blood, before the great and awesome day of the LORD comes.

Matthew 24:29-30 is together with Revelation 6:12-14.

Revelation 6:12-14 is together with Isaiah 13:10; Isaiah 34:4; Ezekiel 32:7; Joel 2:10; Joel 2:31; Joel 3:15; Amos:8:9; Matthew 24:29; Mark 13:24-25; Luke 21:25-26; Act 2:20.

The wrath of the Lamb therefore is the Day of the Lord where Jesus, the Lamb of God, will go out and destroy Antichrist and establish His millennial reign on earth. This Day of the Lord starts immediately after the resurrection and rapture of the saints with the 7th seal and only He is entrusted to break that seal.

One must really just follow what Jesus said: Just as in the days of Noah …. Always keep in mind that 7 and 8 in biblical typology are completion and new beginnings respectively.

GENESIS 6 AND 7 IN BRIEF

Gen 6:1-2, 4 There were demons having relations with the daughters of men – Read Rev 18:1-3

Gen 6:3 God says that His Spirit will not strive with man forever – Read 2 Thes 2:7.

Gen 6:5 God sees that the wickedness of man was great on the earth and that e very intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually – total spiritual darkness Rev 6:12-14; Isaiah 13:10; Isaiah 34:4; Ezekiel 32:7; Joel 2:10; Joel 2:31; Joel 3:15; Amos:8:9; Matthew 24:29; Mark 13:24-25; Luke 21:25-26; Act 2:20.

Gen 6:6 The Lord was sorry that He had made man on the earth and He was grieved in His heart. The Lord said, “I will blot out man whom I have created from the face of the land … - Rev 6:15-17 and the trumpet, woe and bowl judgements.

Gen 6:8 Noah found grace in the eyes of the Lord – All those in Christ, those chosen (CHOSEN = ELECT) by Him through the presentation of the gospel. 6000 years.

Gen 6:14-16 The building of the ark

• Gopher wood – wood speaks of the humanity of Jesus Christ.
• Pitch – the Blood of Jesus Christ.
• Length of the ark – 300 cubits – faithful remnant.
• Fifty cubits breadth – 50 is the year of jubilee – liberty – Pentecost.
• Height 30 cubits – Jesus was 30 years old when He started on in His ministry. Maturity.
• Window in the ark – we keep our eyes on the Lord.
• Door in the arks side – Jesus is the door – John 10

GENESIS 7

Gen 7:4 – for after seven more days (speaking of the 70th week of Daniel in typology) I will send rain on the earth forty days and forty nights; and I will blot out from the face of the land every living thing that I have made (NASB).

Gen 7:7 – Then Noah and his sons and his wife and his sons wives with him entered the ark because of the water of the flood (NASB). Note that the judgements were starting and all those who are in Christ are taken out of the way. This is a picture in typology of the rapture.

Gen 7:10 – Now it came about after the seven days, the water of the flood came upon the earth. Note: AFTER THE SEVEN DAYS (capitals for emphasis only). The judgements started immediately they were taken out of the way. The same happened in Lots day with Sodom and Gomorrah. Once the angels had taken Lot out of the way (a picture of the rapture).

Gen 7:16 – And those that entered, male and female of all flesh, entered as God had commanded him; and the Lord closed the door. Matthew 25:1-13 – the five foolish virgins let their lamps run out(the Holy Spirit was not present with them – apostasy). The Holy Spirit had departed from them and when they wanted more they could get no more oil and THE DOOR WAS SHUT (capitals for emphasis only). Isaiah 22:22 And I will place on his shoulder the key of the house of David. He shall open, and none shall shut; and he shall shut, and none shall open.

7 – Completion – we have had 6000 years on earth and the seven thousandth year will everything be complete and Jesus will hand over everything to the Father.

8 entered the ark – they will have a new beginning in the millennial reign of Christ.

I hope that all who have read this now learn from what Jesus said … as in the days of Noah!! Be ready for what is to come.

The Day of the Lord commences after we are removed.

I do not profess to know everything about the Book of Revelation so I ask all those who read this to do so prayerfully.

I thought you were doing really well until you started bringing the rapture theory into it. You refered to the rapture as a biblical truth . Sorry, your interpretation is wrong. The only time anyone will be going to meet Jesus is when he returns.
Or if you die, like many are doing now.

You would be right to say, God is removing people off the planet in larger numbers these past few years. Through death.

But there is no Great Escape from the tribulation that is comming. It is nearly upon us even now .

The Great Day of the Lord Comes, and who can stand against it.

Not only will hardened Christians fall away from the church, but they will flock to the One World Church. And do you know why? It is because of todays preachers, teaching a false teaching of false hope. Christians are forgetting what true faith is. Having faith in God. Trusting that God will take care of you in any adversity.

Instead your faith is focused in the Rapture.

 

[B-A-C]

Dan 9:24 "Seventy weeks have been decreed for your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to make an end of sin, to make atonement for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the most holy place.
Dan 9:25 "So you are to know and discern that from the issuing of a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until Messiah the Prince there will be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks; it will be built again, with plaza and moat, even in times of distress.
Dan 9:26 "Then after the sixty-two weeks the Messiah will be cut off and have nothing, and the people of the prince who is to come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. And its end will come with a flood; even to the end there will be war; desolations are determined.
Dan 9:27 "And he will make a firm covenant with the many for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering; and on the wing of abominations will come one who makes desolate, even until a complete destruction, one that is decreed, is poured out on the one who makes desolate."

Dan 11:31; "Forces from him will arise, desecrate the sanctuary fortress, and do away with the regular sacrifice. And they will set up the abomination of desolation.
Dan 12:11; "From the time that the regular sacrifice is abolished and the abomination of desolation is set up, there will be 1,290 days.

1,290 days is not 70 weeks however, It's a little over 184 weeks.

Some questions... "it's end will come with a flood". When did this happen?
"it will be built again, with plaza and moat". When did this happen?
Again I say, I abomination of desolation happened in 470bc, and it will happen again in the future, but it did not happen in 70ad.

For who think Emperor Nero was "the prince who is to come". Remember he died in 68ad - Nero - Wikipedia
Two years before Jerusalem fell.

 

[Jonathan_Gale]

I don't know why you guys are so convinced that there has to be a 2000+ year gap, and why the messiah/christ in the previous verses suddenly became the antichrist.

 

[B-A-C]

Daniel 9:26
(AMPC) And after the sixty-two weeks [of years] shall the Anointed One be cut off or killed and shall have nothing [and no one] belonging to [and defending] Him. And the people of the [other] prince who will come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. Its end shall come with a flood; and even to the end there shall be war, and desolations are decreed. [Isa_53:7-9; Nah_1:8; Mat_24:6-14]
(ASV) And after the threescore and two weeks shall the anointed one be cut off, and shall have nothing: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and even unto the end shall be war; desolations are determined.
(BSB) Then after the sixty-two weeks the Messiah will be cut off and will have nothing. Then the people of the prince who is to come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come like a flood, and until the end there will be war; desolations have been decreed.
(CSB) After those sixty-two weeks the Anointed One will be cut off and will have nothing. The people of the coming ruler will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come with a flood, and until the end there will be war; desolations are decreed.
(ESV) And after the sixty-two weeks, an anointed one shall be cut off and shall have nothing. And the people of the prince who is to come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary. Its end shall come with a flood, and to the end there shall be war. Desolations are decreed.
(GNB) And at the end of that time God's chosen leader will be killed unjustly. The city and the Temple will be destroyed by the invading army of a powerful ruler. The end will come like a flood, bringing the war and destruction which God has prepared.
(GW) But after the sixty-two sets of seven time periods, the Anointed One  will be cut off and have nothing. The city and the holy place will be destroyed with the prince who is to come. His end will come with a flood until the end of the destructive war that has been determined.
(HCSB) After those 62 weeks the Messiah will be cut off and will have nothing. The people of the coming prince will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come with a flood, and until the end there will be war; desolations are decreed.
(KJV) And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
(MKJV) And after sixty-two weeks Messiah shall be cut off, but not for Himself. And the people of the ruler who shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary. And the end of it shall be with the flood, and ruins are determined, until the end shall be war.
(NAS77) "Then after the sixty-two weeks the Messiah will be cut off and have nothing, and the people of the prince who is to come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. And its end will come with a flood; even to the end there will be war; desolations are determined.
(NAS95) "Then after the sixty-two weeks the Messiah will be cut off and have nothing, and the people of the prince who is to come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. And its end will come with a flood; even to the end there will be war; desolations are determined.
(NIrV) After the 62 'weeks,' the Anointed King will be cut off. His followers will desert him. And everything he has will be taken away from him. The army of the ruler who will come will destroy the city and the temple. The end will come like a flood. War will continue until the end. The LORD has ordered that many places be destroyed.
(NIV) After the sixty-two 'sevens,' the Anointed One will be put to death and will have nothing. The people of the ruler who will come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come like a flood: War will continue until the end, and desolations have been decreed.
(NKJV) "And after the sixty-two weeks Messiah shall be cut off, but not for Himself; And the people of the prince who is to come Shall destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end of it shall be with a flood, And till the end of the war desolations are determined.
(NLT) “After this period of sixty-two sets of seven, the Anointed One will be killed, appearing to have accomplished nothing, and a ruler will arise whose armies will destroy the city and the Temple. The end will come with a flood, and war and its miseries are decreed from that time to the very end.

The Messiah isn't the one who destroys the city.

 

[Sue D.]

I thought you were doing really well until you started bringing the rapture theory into it. You refered to the rapture as a biblical truth . Sorry, your interpretation is wrong. The only time anyone will be going to meet Jesus is when he returns.
Or if you die, like many are doing now.

You would be right to say, God is removing people off the planet in larger numbers these past few years. Through death.

But there is no Great Escape from the tribulation that is comming. It is nearly upon us even now .

The Great Day of the Lord Comes, and who can stand against it.

Not only will hardened Christians fall away from the church, but they will flock to the One World Church. And do you know why? It is because of todays preachers, teaching a false teaching of false hope. Christians are forgetting what true faith is. Having faith in God. Trusting that God will take care of you in any adversity.

Instead your faith is focused in the Rapture.

The rapture is described in 1 Thessalonians 4: 15-18. But the term 'rapture' is not found. We all need to focus on our personal salvation.
The first coming of Jesus Christ was as the baby in the Manger. His 2nd coming is described in Zechariah 14: 4. He comes to earth and reigns for 1000 yrs.
And people have been dying since the beginning of time. And continue to do so from drugs and old age and lots of other reasons.

And there will be many times of tribulation for everyone.

But why should born-again believers experience the wrath of God during those 7 yrs. But those who have heard and reject Will experience His wrath.

So the rapture is no myth and it's Jesus Christ coming in the air and catching all born-again believers up to meet Him in the air.

 

[Jonathan_Gale]

The Messiah isn't the one who destroys the city.

Even if that’s the case, this simply declares that the destruction is determined, it is bound to take place, sometime afterward, NOT necessarily within the 70 weeks timeframe.

 

[Bill]

The rapture is described in 1 Thessalonians 4: 15-18. But the term 'rapture' is not found. We all need to focus on our personal salvation.
The first coming of Jesus Christ was as the baby in the Manger. His 2nd coming is described in Zechariah 14: 4. He comes to earth and reigns for 1000 yrs.
And people have been dying since the beginning of time. And continue to do so from drugs and old age and lots of other reasons.

And there will be many times of tribulation for everyone.

But why should born-again believers experience the wrath of God during those 7 yrs. But those who have heard and reject Will experience His wrath.

So the rapture is no myth and it's Jesus Christ coming in the air and catching all born-again believers up to meet Him in the air.

Focusing on yourself is not the key. The truth is is focusing on everyone else. It Is by helping others that we help ourselves.

We are to follow in the footsteps of Jesus, and in doing that we should be all about serving everyone else and not worrying about ourselves.

Jesus never told the apostles to sit there and worry about their own Souls what he did tell the apostles is to go out heal the sick cast out the demons and preached the good news. We also need to do the very same thing that Jesus told his Apostles to do and not worry about our own salvation. Because if we do what the Lord asks of us our own salvation is already secure. If we go out and preach the word to others we are also preaching the word to ourselves in the process of doing it. If we are reaching out from our hearts to other people for the sick, the needy, the hungry, the naked, etc, Etc. Then we are doing what we also need.

Love your neighbor as yourself.

Are we not our brother's keepers, and if we are not our brothers Keepers then who are we.

We need to pray, pray, pray. And this is not just praying for ourselves but praying for everyone else.

 

[Bill]

The rapture is described in 1 Thessalonians 4: 15-18. But the term 'rapture' is not found. We all need to focus on our personal salvation.
The first coming of Jesus Christ was as the baby in the Manger. His 2nd coming is described in Zechariah 14: 4. He comes to earth and reigns for 1000 yrs.
And people have been dying since the beginning of time. And continue to do so from drugs and old age and lots of other reasons.

And there will be many times of tribulation for everyone.

But why should born-again believers experience the wrath of God during those 7 yrs. But those who have heard and reject Will experience His wrath.

So the rapture is no myth and it's Jesus Christ coming in the air and catching all born-again believers up to meet Him in the air.

I ask you Sue, why not. Why not experience the tribulation of those 7 years. What are you afraid of. If your faith is so secure in God what is there to be afraid of.

All the prayers, all of scripture leads us to this moment. To stand with God through all of the adversity of the devil. Show me in the scripture where God tells you to run. Show me in the scripture where God takes his people out of adversity that does not take you into another type of adversity.

The scripture, Jesus tells us to pick up our cross and carry it. What is any different about this, what Jesus has asked of us.

Jesus in The Garden of Gethsemane sweat blood from what was coming. And he States that no servant is greater than the master. Why should we then be greater than Jesus when it is time for our tribulation.

We are secure with where we are with God. He is the treasure that's in our hearts. And there's no earthly conflict that we cannot walk through. So long as we have faith in Jesus

 

[Bill]

The rapture is described in 1 Thessalonians 4: 15-18. But the term 'rapture' is not found. We all need to focus on our personal salvation.
The first coming of Jesus Christ was as the baby in the Manger. His 2nd coming is described in Zechariah 14: 4. He comes to earth and reigns for 1000 yrs.
And people have been dying since the beginning of time. And continue to do so from drugs and old age and lots of other reasons.

And there will be many times of tribulation for everyone.

But why should born-again believers experience the wrath of God during those 7 yrs. But those who have heard and reject Will experience His wrath.

So the rapture is no myth and it's Jesus Christ coming in the air and catching all born-again believers up to meet Him in the air.

"So the rapture is no myth and it's Jesus Christ coming in the air and catching all born-again believers up to meet Him in the air." <<<<< what you wrote Sue.

Jesus coming down from heaven, and all of us going to Jesus to meet him is correct

It is the time frame that I argue with. Because the pre-tribulation rapture is a myth, a false teaching.

You will indeed meet Jesus in the air, but it won't be till after everything is done. The tribulation, the Antichrist, the two witnesses, will all have come and gone before the return of Jesus

 

[I believe 777]

hi this scripture is so comforting and im looking and cant wait to meet the Lord Jesus Christ in the air

1 Thessalonians 4:15-18

For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

I was post trip 20 years ago because all of the christians i knew were but when i started studying and the holy spirit guided me to the pre trib, why because the 2 events mentioned in scripture are very different so read below and i will leave a link to a revelation study by a pastor who teaches line by line scripture and really opened my eyes to things i did not get when i read revelations before this study and i cant remember how many times i read it but i can tell you its alot.

so take the study brothers and sisters open your bibles and let the holy spirit guide you to the truth and i will say this no matter what are greatest desire should be to be with him Jesus no matter if we are here or we are going through tribulation.

PRETRIB Rapture VS MID VS POST TRIB

Contrasts Between Comings

The Rapture is characterized in the New Testament as a “translation or

resurrection coming” (1 Cor. 15:51-52; 1 Thess. 4:15-17) in which the Lord

comes for His church, taking her to His Father’s house (John 14:3).

On the other hand, Christ’s Second Advent with His saints (the Church=Rev. 19)

descends from heaven and arrives on earth to stay and set up His

Messianic Kingdom (Zech. 14:4-5; Matt. 24:27-31). The differences

between these two events are harmonized naturally by the pre-trib position,

while other views are not able to comfortably account for such differences.


Paul speaks of the Rapture as a “mystery” (1 Cor. 15:51-54), that is, a

truth not revealed until it was disclosed by the apostles (Col. 1:26). Thus

the Rapture is said to be a newly revealed mystery, making it a separate

event. The Second Coming, on the other hand, was predicted in the Old

Testament (Dan. 12:1-3; Zech. 12:10; 14:4).


The New Testament teaches about the Rapture of the church and yet

also speaks of the Second Coming of Christ. These two events are

different in a number of ways. Note the following contrasts between the

translation at the Rapture and Christ's Second Coming to establish the

kingdom.



Rapture/Translation

1 Translation of all believers

2 Translated saints go to heaven

3 Earth not judged

4 Imminent, any-moment, signless

5 Not in the Old Testament

6 Believers only

7 Before the day of wrath

8 No reference to Satan

9 Christ comes for His own

10 He comes in the air

11 He claims His bride

12 Only His own see Him

13 Tribulation begins


Different event

2nd Coming/ Estab. Kingdom

1 No translation at all

2 Translated saints return to earth

3 Earth judged & righteousness

established

4 Follows definite predicted signs

including tribulation

5 Predicted often in Old Testament

6 Affects all men

7 Concluding the day of wrath

8 Satan bound

9 Christ comes with His own

10 He comes to the earth

11 He comes with His bride

12 Every eye shall see Him

13 Millennial Kingdom begins

Scripture concludes that these “contrasts should make it

evident that the translation of the church is an event quite different in

character and time from the return of the Lord to establish His kingdom,

and confirms the conclusion that the translation takes place before the

tribulation.”5

Both events mention clouds symbolizing a heavenly role in both, but

other differences demonstrate that these are two distinct events. At the

Rapture, the Lord comes for His saints (1 Thes. 4:16); at the Second

Coming the Lord comes with His saints (1 Thes. 3:13). At the Rapture, the

Lord comes only for believers, but His return to the earth will impact all

people.

Revelation | Verse By Verse Ministry International

Many Christians consider Revelation to be a mysterious and even frightening book of scripture. Some avoid studying it, and among those who do try, many find it confusing. Why does the book confound so many and give rise to so many conflicting interpretations? The answer: because it's the final...

versebyverseministry.org

 

[Bill]

hi this scripture is so comforting and im looking and cant wait to meet the Lord Jesus Christ in the air

1 Thessalonians 4:15-18

For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

I was post trip 20 years ago because all of the christians i knew were but when i started studying and the holy spirit guided me to the pre trib, why because the 2 events mentioned in scripture are very different so read below and i will leave a link to a revelation study by a pastor who teaches line by line scripture and really opened my eyes to things i did not get when i read revelations before this study and i cant remember how many times i read it but i can tell you its alot.

so take the study brothers and sisters open your bibles and let the holy spirit guide you to the truth and i will say this no matter what are greatest desire should be to be with him Jesus no matter if we are here or we are going through tribulation.

PRETRIB Rapture VS MID VS POST TRIB

Contrasts Between Comings

The Rapture is characterized in the New Testament as a “translation or

resurrection coming” (1 Cor. 15:51-52; 1 Thess. 4:15-17) in which the Lord

comes for His church, taking her to His Father’s house (John 14:3).

On the other hand, Christ’s Second Advent with His saints (the Church=Rev. 19)

descends from heaven and arrives on earth to stay and set up His

Messianic Kingdom (Zech. 14:4-5; Matt. 24:27-31). The differences

between these two events are harmonized naturally by the pre-trib position,

while other views are not able to comfortably account for such differences.


Paul speaks of the Rapture as a “mystery” (1 Cor. 15:51-54), that is, a

truth not revealed until it was disclosed by the apostles (Col. 1:26). Thus

the Rapture is said to be a newly revealed mystery, making it a separate

event. The Second Coming, on the other hand, was predicted in the Old

Testament (Dan. 12:1-3; Zech. 12:10; 14:4).


The New Testament teaches about the Rapture of the church and yet

also speaks of the Second Coming of Christ. These two events are

different in a number of ways. Note the following contrasts between the

translation at the Rapture and Christ's Second Coming to establish the

kingdom.



Rapture/Translation

1 Translation of all believers

2 Translated saints go to heaven

3 Earth not judged

4 Imminent, any-moment, signless

5 Not in the Old Testament

6 Believers only

7 Before the day of wrath

8 No reference to Satan

9 Christ comes for His own

10 He comes in the air

11 He claims His bride

12 Only His own see Him

13 Tribulation begins


Different event

2nd Coming/ Estab. Kingdom

1 No translation at all

2 Translated saints return to earth

3 Earth judged & righteousness

established

4 Follows definite predicted signs

including tribulation

5 Predicted often in Old Testament

6 Affects all men

7 Concluding the day of wrath

8 Satan bound

9 Christ comes with His own

10 He comes to the earth

11 He comes with His bride

12 Every eye shall see Him

13 Millennial Kingdom begins

Scripture concludes that these “contrasts should make it

evident that the translation of the church is an event quite different in

character and time from the return of the Lord to establish His kingdom,

and confirms the conclusion that the translation takes place before the

tribulation.”5

Both events mention clouds symbolizing a heavenly role in both, but

other differences demonstrate that these are two distinct events. At the

Rapture, the Lord comes for His saints (1 Thes. 4:16); at the Second

Coming the Lord comes with His saints (1 Thes. 3:13). At the Rapture, the

Lord comes only for believers, but His return to the earth will impact all

people.

Revelation | Verse By Verse Ministry International

Many Christians consider Revelation to be a mysterious and even frightening book of scripture. Some avoid studying it, and among those who do try, many find it confusing. Why does the book confound so many and give rise to so many conflicting interpretations? The answer: because it's the final...

versebyverseministry.org

Basically , the pretrib rapture is what people make up for truth , and believe in falsehood , the devils lies.

John the Baptist was asked , " are you Elijah?" And instead of answering, he responded "i am the one who is to make straight the path of the Lord"

Now who really listened to that. Not many.

The same is with you, jumping to some conclusion, as if your are so worthy, when you dont even follow scripture. You only follow what you want to follow. You listen to false preachers, who continually teach falsehood ( and you preachers who blindly teach these falsehoods, be warned. Hell is full of false teachers) (remember, just because the Lord may use you to cast out demons, is not a guarantee you make heaven.) LORD Lord, i cast demons out in your name, i healed people in your name. And the King responded, " away from me, i never knew you."

Lying vipers, you preachers that teach. 'Once saved always saved'. The excuses you teach when it comes to scripture teaching.

We know, only a person can be in the Lord when casting out demons. Jesus tells us this Himself.

Yet Jesus also shows us, tells us, that just because you can do these things (cast out demons) that your continuing salvation is determined on your daily life. So if you betray Jesus, like Judas did, or become proud and walk your own path, not God's path. That the King will say to you, "I never knew you.

 

[Dave M]

the day of the lord and the coming of the lord are exactly the same things, ask anyone who has not been indoctrinated into this false hope of a pre-trib, and they will tell you of course it is the same thing. To think they are different is mind-boggling to me.

 

[Sue D.]

A pre-trib rapture has not been made up by anyone. It's been in Scripture from the beginning. No one is asking Jesus to rescue us from 7 yrs of tribulation that is meant solely for non-believers.
And no one is running away from anything.

 

[Sue D.]

@ Dave M. -- not sure what you're saying here.

 

[Sue D.]

@ bill --- your post 193. Those 7 yrs of tribulation which the last 3.5 yrs.are the great tribulation.

A question. When and where is the marriage super of the lamb going to take place. Because Jesus Christ is going to be taking born-again believers which are also the church / His BRide up to be with Him for the marriage super of the Lamb.