Hi Paul, I can pull scripture also, but we go on and on,
But I'd like you to consider. NO MAN CAN COME TO ME EXCEPT THE FATHER WHICH HAS SENT ME DRAW HIM OR HER AND I WILL RAISE THEM UP AT THE LAST DAY. JOHN 6:44
YOU HAVE NOT CHOSEN ME BUT I HAVE CHOSEN YOU, JOHN 15:16
Can you see Paul that we don't have a choice as you say it's Gods choice
GOD IS LOVE, 1Jonh 4:8 How many believe it? Do you believe it?
Not if you also believe that God will torture the majority of mankind unmercifully in real fire for all eternity. One cannot hate ones enemies while claiming to love them.
One cannot torture someone while at the same time insisting that this is showing love.
God said LOVE your enemies.
I believe that this clip should be taken off this site, I think he had a bad dream.
To conclude, so all the innocent people that God didn't choose are condemned I think not, With Love, Wnl
Greeting brother,
It is not a case of 'pulling scripture' as you put it, but it is important, for us all, to quote scripture that relates to the discussion/topic.
Thank you for the scripture you kindly included.
What I stated in Post #50 above, was not what I think, what I think is not important, it is what God says, what The Word says.
As I included above
God does not want any soul to perish, He allowed His One and Only Son to die for OUR Sins, so that through Him we can be saved.
John 3:16-17 (NKJV)
16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.
17 For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved.
God does not condemn us either, we condemn ourselves, it is God saying this not me.
God does not condemn us, we condemn our self.
John 3:18-21 (NKJV)
18 He who believes in Him is not condemned;
but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
19
And this is the condemnation, that the light has come into the world, and
men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
20
For everyone practicing evil hates the light and
does not come to the light,
lest his deeds should be exposed.
21 But he who does the truth comes to the light, that his deeds may be clearly seen, that they have been done in God."
We all have a choice, but those who are condemned are so due to their own decision.
God gives us the Good News, His Word tells us how to be saved, but also tells us if we choose to reject Him and His Commands, the choice is ours.
John 3:36 (NKJV)
He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and
he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.
Jesus tells us the Way
John 14:6 (NKJV)
Jesus said to him, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me."
I concluded with scripture, what God says...
People in the world often pigeon hole others into groups, the homeless, the lower class, the middle class, the upper class, the rich.
But is all these died tonight there would only we two types of people. The Saved and the Lost.
The Saved have come to God through Jesus, repented and taken up their cross daily, that was 'their choice'
The Lost rejected God, Jesus, the Bible and chose to live worldly ways, they chose to live in sin, the wages of sin is death, but that was 'their choice'
God doesn't want any of us to go to hell, each of us has a choice, each has a decision in life, no one can blame God, though many will no doubt try.
Scripture is very clear.
God sets the rules
- we choose whether to accept them through Jesus and be Saved, Jesus having paid the price we should pay for our sins, or
- we choose to ignore His Good News and His warmings, remaining in sin and pay the price our self.
The choice is down to each individual.
I'd like you to consider. NO MAN CAN COME TO ME EXCEPT THE FATHER WHICH HAS SENT ME DRAW HIM OR HER AND I WILL RAISE THEM UP AT THE LAST DAY.
JOHN 6:44
YOU HAVE NOT CHOSEN ME BUT I HAVE CHOSEN YOU,
JOHN 15:16
Can you see Paul that we don't have a choice as you say it's Gods choice
GOD IS LOVE, 1Jonh 4:8 How many believe it? Do you believe it?
Not if you also believe that God will torture the majority of mankind unmercifully in real fire for all eternity. One cannot hate ones enemies while claiming to love them.
One cannot torture someone while at the same time insisting that this is showing love.
God said LOVE your enemies.
I believe that this clip should be taken off this site, I think he had a bad dream.
To conclude, so all the innocent people that God didn't choose are condemned I think not, With Love, Wnl
I agree with what scripture says here my friend God draws us to Himself
John 6:44 (NKJV)
44 No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me
draws him; and I will raise him up at the last day.
John 6:44 (NIV2011)
44 “No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me
draws them, and I will raise them up at the last day.
John 6:44 (CJB)
44 No one can come to me unless the Father — the One who sent me —
draws him. And I will raise him up on the Last Day.
But, it is important not to add single verses that could be out of context with the message in the passage or chapter.
You quote v44
No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up at the last day.
Vs 37 says
the one who comes to Jesus He will by no means cast out.
Vs 39 says i
t is the will of the Father, that Jesus should lose none, but if people do not come to Jesus they will not be raised up on the last day
Then vs 40 clarifies that everyone who sees and believes in Jesus will have everlasting life and be raised up on the last day.
Vs 47 concluded with the words
Most Assuredly. We have to believe in Jesus, we have to be born again, or we will not be raised to eternal life on the last day, those who do not accept Jesus, according the God's Word, will be raised to Judgement, the Great White Throne judgement, and they will pay the price for rejecting Jesus, they will pay the price for their sin.
John 6:37-48 (NKJV)
37 All that the Father gives Me will come to Me,
and the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out.
38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me.
39
This is the will of the Father who sent Me, that of all He has given Me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the last day.
40
And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him may have everlasting life; and I will raise him up at the last day."
41 The Jews then complained about Him, because He said, "I am the bread which came down from heaven."
42 And they said, "Is not this Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? How is it then that He says, 'I have come down from heaven'?"
43 Jesus therefore answered and said to them, "Do not murmur among yourselves.
44
No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up at the last day.
45 It is written in the prophets,
'And they shall all be taught by God.' Therefore everyone who has heard and learned from the Father comes to Me.
46 Not that anyone has seen the Father, except He who is from God; He has seen the Father.
47
Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me has everlasting life.
48 I am the bread of life.
Lets look at the other verse you quoted
1 John 4:8 only include the scriptures to keep it in context.
1 John 4:7-21 (NKJV)
7 Beloved, let us love one another, for love is of God; and everyone who loves is born of God and knows God.
8
He who does not love does not know God, for God is love.
(God is Love, we all agree, God is a Loving Father who will reprimand His children, He is also a jealous God we must see all sides of Him)
9
In this the love of God was manifested toward us, that God has sent His only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through Him.
10
In this is love, not that we loved God, but that He loved us and sent His Son to be the propitiation for our sins.
(He also let His one and only Son die for the sins of the world, that is the type of love He shows us, agape, hesed love)
11 Beloved, if God so loved us, we also ought to love one another.
12 No one has seen God at any time. If we love one another, God abides in us, and His love has been perfected in us.
13
By this we know that we abide in Him, and He in us, because He has given us of His Spirit.
(The moment we are born again, and become a new creation)
14 And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent the Son
as Savior of the world.
15
Whoever confesses that Jesus is the Son of God, God abides in him, and he in God.
(This verse brings the words in this section together and keeps things in context)
16 And we have known and believed the love that God has for us. God is love, and he who abides in love abides in God, and God in him.
17
Love has been perfected among us in this: that we may have boldness in the day of judgment; because as He is, so are we in this world.
18
There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves torment. But he who fears has not been made perfect in love.
19
We love Him because He first loved us.
20 If someone says, "I love God," and hates his brother, he is a liar; for he who does not love his brother whom he has seen, how can he love God whom he has not seen?
21
And this commandment we have from Him: that he who loves God must love his brother also.
God is Love, it is through His love He punishes sin, it is through His Love that He let His One and Only Son die for our sins, He draws us all, but we do not all accept Him, only those who repent, who are baptised, who have accepting Jesus into their hearts and taking up their cross daily are saved. Those who are saved
God doesn't want any of us to go to hell, each of us has a choice, each has a decision in life, no one can blame God, though many will no doubt try.
Scripture is very clear.
