Can you be both Liberal and Christian?

[Bill]

There is so much i want to share with all of you, but limitations of faith, and my responcibility to not putting out the flickering flame, nor breaking the bending reed, is so great. That it makes it near impossible to talk beyond superficial.

Many here will say. "I am a meat eater of faith" and in your world, you are. But even though i think of myself fairly open minded, i am also limited in my comprehention.

Once when i was young, and thinking i knew so much, an Angel told me, i knew less than 1%.

Why tell you all this here.

It is like Brad said. The deep state.

Our enemies plan and have been planning for years. And im not trying to set fear in your thoughts of what is to come. But in a way, excitement.

Ya, ya ya, hard times, sure.

In your lifetime, Your faith will far exceed what you presently have. You will see God , the Holy Spirit work greatly through you.

Your faith of that future will blow you away if you only knew it now.

I know, you are all going in the rapture . ... lol .

When the time comes, i will be here for you. You are all my brothers and sisters.

 

[Chad]

Our enemies plan and have been planning for years. And im not trying to set fear in your thoughts of what is to come. But in a way, excitement.

I was thinking about this yesterday on a long drive home. My thoughts were basically this: it is already written. God warned us of the end times signs and what will happen before He returns. There should be no surprise for us believers since it's all there in the Bible, especially book of Revelation. We already know that Satan is the "prince of the air" (Ephesians 2:2) and has great influence in all nations. That's also obvious with the Democrat party nowadays more than anything I've ever witnessed in my lifetime. I think discernment of demonically influenced political leaders is more evident nowadays.

 

[Rad]

Hello Rad,
If you notice I stated I'm an Independent, but usually find myself voting for the Republican candidate. Why? Usually, the ones I vote for are first professing Christians. Rarely do they happen to be Democrat. Now whether the Republican Platform point by point can stand against the Bible Standard. I doubt it. However, I'd have to say that the Democratic Platform is even further removed from the Bible.

I give Kudos, to the Republicans, because they at least acknowledge God, and acknowledge the right to "The Free Exercise Clause is both an individual and a collective liberty protecting a right to worship God according to the dictates of conscience.", so even those I disagree with are accorded the right to do. Democrats do not, except for their mentioning of Religious Minorities and their use of the phrase "God given potential" three times. Since Christianity is not considered a minority religion, this party doesn't accord them like consideration. In fact they do whatever they can to marginalize them. :crying:

Now, platforms are nothing really more than words. So, one must look to actions as you have noted as well. One should look at the voting records, and what exactly they vote for. Now a days with the Democratic Party moving in a more Socialist direction. I have even greater concerns with them. Haven't seen Socialist success stories out there, so those supporting this political system are less likely to receive my vote. The Republican Party has their own issues. Once again the Words of the Platform don't actually line up with how they vote.

With all that being said, I'll stick to voting to an individual and not a Party. I truly hope this explains where I'm coming from when I vote. Hopefully, you will look to the person as well, and not to Party. Understanding that the UK has a bit different situation to go by. You might have to go about it a bit differently.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
<><

P.S. Don't believe everything you read in the papers either. Seems they all have an agenda, so weight what you read concerning the U.S.A. with a grain of salt. It's never as good as they say, nor as bad. The truth of any particular matter probably falls somewhere in between. Unless of course you hold to Scripture, have Holy Spirit guidance, and then what is happening becomes much clearer. Plus, we should really be about our Masters business. Spreading the Gospel, and increasing the Kingdom of God. To His Glory and Praise.

Many thanks for that reasoned reply Nick, you're right here in the UK US politics can seem baffling, as does the support of large sections of professing Christians in the US with a President and Republican Party that appears to be fundamentally Racist, having run what was described as the most racist election campaign on record, been endorsed by the ex head of the KKK David Duke, admitted members of the alt Right into his administration, described Neo nazis and Violent racists in Charlottesville as "containing some fine people" and being increasingly hostile to immigrants and Asylum seekers,..... that appears to be pro Wealthy and anti poor, having passed legislation that hands back hundreds of Billions in Tax cuts to the richest whilst proposing Benefits cuts to the poorest in American Society, by proposing cutting drastically international relief to the poorest countries in the world, in fact ending US aid for Central American Countries and seeking to cut Social security, Medicaid and Medicare for some of the most vulnerable in US Society,..... who appears to be pro war, proposing massive Budget increases to the Military, has implemented a ban on certain Nuclear Weapons control treaties and plans a development of "safer" Nuclear missile programmes, and has vetoed the Congresses proposal to withdraw US Military support for the Saudis in their murderous war on Yemen, which has seen 85,000 young children die from Malnutrition in the last 4 years due to the Saudi onslaught,...... and finally a President who with Republican support has abrogated any responsibilty of "Stewardship" of Gods Earth , he's decried Climate Science, withdrawn the US from the Paris Accord, put forward proposals for a massive increase in Oil and Gas exploration, decimated the EPA, slashed regulations limiting pollution under the Clean Air Act, the Clean water Act and the Clean power Act and is in the process of cutting regulations built up over decades to protect Americans from the worst ravages of Pollution and decimation of their Natural world,...... i understand that in this World, given our inherently sinful nature, the choices we face are the lesser or greater evil, but i would really like to understand why you believe Republicans are the lesser evil, and i would just add, that whilst Socialism has found it hard to take root in a World driven by greed and selfishness, Capitalism has brought the World, Gods World to the state its in today, ravaged by poverty and Suffering, War and destruction and tetering on the edge of Environmental Armageddon, hardly a Success Story by anyone's reckoning.

 

[Bill]

Many thanks for that reasoned reply Nick, you're right here in the UK US politics can seem baffling, as does the support of large sections of professing Christians in the US with a President and Republican Party that appears to be fundamentally Racist, having run what was described as the most racist election campaign on record, been endorsed by the ex head of the KKK David Duke, admitted members of the alt Right into his administration, described Neo nazis and Violent racists in Charlottesville as "containing some fine people" and being increasingly hostile to immigrants and Asylum seekers,..... that appears to be pro Wealthy and anti poor, having passed legislation that hands back hundreds of Billions in Tax cuts to the richest whilst proposing Benefits cuts to the poorest in American Society, by proposing cutting drastically international relief to the poorest countries in the world, in fact ending US aid for Central American Countries and seeking to cut Social security, Medicaid and Medicare for some of the most vulnerable in US Society,..... who appears to be pro war, proposing massive Budget increases to the Military, has implemented a ban on certain Nuclear Weapons control treaties and plans a development of "safer" Nuclear missile programmes, and has vetoed the Congresses proposal to withdraw US Military support for the Saudis in their murderous war on Yemen, which has seen 85,000 young children die from Malnutrition in the last 4 years due to the Saudi onslaught,...... and finally a President who with Republican support has abrogated any responsibilty of "Stewardship" of Gods Earth , he's decried Climate Science, withdrawn the US from the Paris Accord, put forward proposals for a massive increase in Oil and Gas exploration, decimated the EPA, slashed regulations limiting pollution under the Clean Air Act, the Clean water Act and the Clean power Act and is in the process of cutting regulations built up over decades to protect Americans from the worst ravages of Pollution and decimation of their Natural world,...... i understand that in this World, given our inherently sinful nature, the choices we face are the lesser or greater evil, but i would really like to understand why you believe Republicans are the lesser evil, and i would just add, that whilst Socialism has found it hard to take root in a World driven by greed and selfishness, Capitalism has brought the World, Gods World to the state its in today, ravaged by poverty and Suffering, War and destruction and tetering on the edge of Environmental Armageddon, hardly a Success Story by anyone's reckoning.

I remember how ppl around the world touted the farm Act done by the US government some years ago. Even the new media made a big todo. Saying how the US is saving family farms.

But when farmers began recieving loans though that Farm Act. It didnt take long to see the real beast within.

Unannounced to the general public, and the media turned a blind eye to it, saying it was old news. Those who had recieved any governmant loans were now subject to the US government . The government would go to small dairy farms and tell them to dump thier milk in the fields. This would cause prices to go up. Same with pig and cattle farms, to butcher thier livestock, causing prices to soar.

Ontop of all of this, the US government also made it impossible for those same farmers to give away anything. I knew many farmers who felt terrible about the waiste.

If this wasnt bad enough. New crop insurance was another fiasco. It was written in very fine print, that a farm had to have 2 yrs in a row, on the exact same land of drought conditions to collect anything.

So when we want to explore the idea of getting the Government involved with anything. Other that what it is supposed to do. Protecting its citizens, and trade with foreign bodies. Then all you will need to do, is go talk with any US farmer that took a loan. And you will know why the government should not get involved .

All those things we deem precious, should be done though the citizens, and maybe the States

 

[Brad Huber]

The states reluctantly gave up some of their powers to the federal govt, and the govt has keep taking and taking and the states have made a few fuss's here and there but basically are unwilling to take back the power that belongs in their hands. The biggest one is giving back 90% of federally owned lands to the states they reside in.

 

[Christ4Ever]

@Rad
Hello Rad,
Awesome reply. Now let's see how genuine you are. Since the political parties in the U.S.A switch power every 4/8/16 yrs. Do the same research on the Democratic Party when they've been in power and post it here. Only negatives and no positives In so doing you will realize that the Christian, in fact all voters in this country are caught in a conundrum. Regardless of the political party in power at the time, you will find as you research the opposition party that they too have as many issues to document. Some might be more Social will less international consequences, but nonetheless effecting people negatively.

That is why if you read what I wrote, you will see that I self identify as an "Independent", and I'm driven by the individual who is running for office. Seeking and hopefully finding the person who is a Believer in Christ Jesus, and not just talks the talk, but also walks it. In these days, it becomes much more difficult to find them, and takes time, but I find doing this worth it. At the very least to my conscience!

Now after you've done the research, and have done a comparison, can you really say that the results are really that much different?

I suggest that you as an individual should not get caught up in the political strife of not only this country, but any country, at least in such away that it would divert you from what you know to be true by Scripture and that might stifle your walk in following Christ Jesus. We are in the World Brother, but not of it. If seeking leadership, then seek those who you will find at and break bread with at the Great Banquet Feast in the Kingdom of God.

Notice I said brother. Since you mention in your bio that you underwent a change back in 1984, but you don't say whether that "nominal Christian" you were, turned closer or further away from being a Child of the Most High, in Jesus Christ!!

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
<><

 

[Hekuran]

@Rad
Hello Rad,
Awesome reply. Now let's see how genuine you are. Since the political parties in the U.S.A switch power every 4/8/16 yrs. Do the same research on the Democratic Party when they've been in power and post it here. Only negatives and no positives :smile: In so doing you will realize that the Christian, in fact all voters in this country are caught in a conundrum. Regardless of the political party in power at the time, you will find as you research the opposition party that they too have as many issues to document. Some might be more Social will less international consequences, but nonetheless effecting people negatively.

That is why if you read what I wrote, you will see that I self identify as an "Independent", and I'm driven by the individual who is running for office. Seeking and hopefully finding the person who is a Believer in Christ Jesus, and not just talks the talk, but also walks it. In these days, it becomes much more difficult to find them, and takes time, but I find doing this worth it. At the very least to my conscience!

Now after you've done the research, and have done a comparison, can you really say that the results are really that much different?

I suggest that you as an individual should not get caught up in the political strife of not only this country, but any country, at least in such away that it would divert you from what you know to be true by Scripture and that might stifle your walk in following Christ Jesus. We are in the World Brother, but not of it. If seeking leadership, then seek those who you will find at and break bread with at the Great Banquet Feast in the Kingdom of God.

Notice I said brother. Since you mention in your bio that you underwent a change back in 1984, but you don't say whether that "nominal Christian" you were, turned closer or further away from being a Child of the Most High, in Jesus Christ!!

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
<><

The record of achievements of every political party in power is spotty compared to their ideals, promises, and election manifestos. Very few are wholly evil, and those that strive to do good in everything inevitably fall short.

But I don't see in the Bible any mandate for political inactivity or indifference. The records of the Old Testament prophets show that they were deeply involved in the political issues of their day - justice, the care of the poorest and weakest, alliances with foreign nations, and the accumulation of power. God clearly called them to get involved in the political strife of their nation.

In the early days of the church, which had no political power to wield, the small communities of believers challenged the Roman political status quo by living a radically counter-cultural community lifestyle.

 

[Bill]

The states reluctantly gave up some of their powers to the federal govt, and the govt has keep taking and taking and the states have made a few fuss's here and there but basically are unwilling to take back the power that belongs in their hands. The biggest one is giving back 90% of federally owned lands to the states they reside in.

Agreed.

I find it amazing how far reaching the US Congress has become. Just a few examples of things that seem like they are doing good for the environment. But in all honesty Congress had no right to do.

Some years ago, Congress passed a Law for the type of lightbulb consumers were allowed to have in thier houses.

 

[Dave M]

I find it amazing how far reaching the US Congress has become.

you aint seen nothing yet it will get much much worst.

I agree its insane, but our great Father God has given us his word to prepare us for what is to come. Praise the Lord almighty !!

 

[Christ4Ever]

The record of achievements of every political party in power is spotty compared to their ideals, promises, and election manifestos. Very few are wholly evil, and those that strive to do good in everything inevitably fall short.

But I don't see in the Bible any mandate for political inactivity or indifference. The records of the Old Testament prophets show that they were deeply involved in the political issues of their day - justice, the care of the poorest and weakest, alliances with foreign nations, and the accumulation of power. God clearly called them to get involved in the political strife of their nation.

In the early days of the church, which had no political power to wield, the small communities of believers challenged the Roman political status quo by living a radically counter-cultural community lifestyle.

Hello Brother,
No where did I say not to get involved. Notice where I said that I seek to find the Believers who do not just talk the talk, but walk it as well. Can't have believers running for office without being involved

Also, I don't consider what we do, as the early church did, to be "political" in nature. Just living our lives in Christ Jesus. Now the world might portray us as being this or that, as was the case with Pat Robertson's movement. We should not be defined in that fashion, but if we do, we need to understand the inherent difficulties that come with being pigeonholed as Pat Robertson was. Difficult to be both political & stay humbly living a lifestyle that uplifts and is able to give the Glory to God.

I explain myself here, but in life, I only explain my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, and how Scripture with Holy Spirit guidance sets me to walking and talking the way I do. Even when the subject of "politics" comes up, because most people are so entrenched in their political beliefs that they don't understand how or why we as Child of the Most High, can live they way we do. I try not to change them, but show them Jesus! The Holy Spirit is much more capable then I ever will be, in eliciting change in them to what is Righteous and Holy

With the Love of Christ Jesus Brother.
YBIC
Nick
<><

 

[Rad]

I remember how ppl around the world touted the farm Act done by the US government some years ago. Even the new media made a big todo. Saying how the US is saving family farms.

But when farmers began recieving loans though that Farm Act. It didnt take long to see the real beast within.

Unannounced to the general public, and the media turned a blind eye to it, saying it was old news. Those who had recieved any governmant loans were now subject to the US government . The government would go to small dairy farms and tell them to dump thier milk in the fields. This would cause prices to go up. Same with pig and cattle farms, to butcher thier livestock, causing prices to soar.

Ontop of all of this, the US government also made it impossible for those same farmers to give away anything. I knew many farmers who felt terrible about the waiste.

If this wasnt bad enough. New crop insurance was another fiasco. It was written in very fine print, that a farm had to have 2 yrs in a row, on the exact same land of drought conditions to collect anything.

So when we want to explore the idea of getting the Government involved with anything. Other that what it is supposed to do. Protecting its citizens, and trade with foreign bodies. Then all you will need to do, is go talk with any US farmer that took a loan. And you will know why the government should not get involved .

All those things we deem precious, should be done though the citizens, and maybe the States

Hi Bill, many thanks for your reply, without going into the pros and cons of your argument about State and federal Jurisdictions, i would just ask irrespective of whether the policies i listed are implemented by State or Federal government, how can they be reconciled with Christs teachings and why do you think Republican Policies are more "Christian" than Democrats as being from the UK its hard to understand?.

 

[Brad Huber]

Agreed.

I find it amazing how far reaching the US Congress has become. Just a few examples of things that seem like they are doing good for the environment. But in all honesty Congress had no right to do.

Some years ago, Congress passed a Law for the type of lightbulb consumers were allowed to have in thier houses.

Ahhh yes, the boondoggle of the squiggly bulbs, 10x more expensive, 10x more dangerous, and I have found that the life span spoken to be 10x or more of the squiggly to be roughly exactly the same as old fashioned light bulbs. But follow the money and find out who were the winners and losers in the industry change, would be more telling of who was behind it.

 

[Quantrill]

The states reluctantly gave up some of their powers to the federal govt, and the govt has keep taking and taking and the states have made a few fuss's here and there but basically are unwilling to take back the power that belongs in their hands. The biggest one is giving back 90% of federally owned lands to the states they reside in.

Yes, ever since the U.S. was created there has been a movement to put greater power into the Federal govt. and less in the states. And there have always been those who have opposed them. Such as the anti-federalist's. Such as the Southern states.

Quantrill

 

[Rad]

@Rad
Hello Rad,
Awesome reply. Now let's see how genuine you are. Since the political parties in the U.S.A switch power every 4/8/16 yrs. Do the same research on the Democratic Party when they've been in power and post it here. Only negatives and no positives :smile: In so doing you will realize that the Christian, in fact all voters in this country are caught in a conundrum. Regardless of the political party in power at the time, you will find as you research the opposition party that they too have as many issues to document. Some might be more Social will less international consequences, but nonetheless effecting people negatively.

That is why if you read what I wrote, you will see that I self identify as an "Independent", and I'm driven by the individual who is running for office. Seeking and hopefully finding the person who is a Believer in Christ Jesus, and not just talks the talk, but also walks it. In these days, it becomes much more difficult to find them, and takes time, but I find doing this worth it. At the very least to my conscience!

Now after you've done the research, and have done a comparison, can you really say that the results are really that much different?

I suggest that you as an individual should not get caught up in the political strife of not only this country, but any country, at least in such away that it would divert you from what you know to be true by Scripture and that might stifle your walk in following Christ Jesus. We are in the World Brother, but not of it. If seeking leadership, then seek those who you will find at and break bread with at the Great Banquet Feast in the Kingdom of God.

Notice I said brother. Since you mention in your bio that you underwent a change back in 1984, but you don't say whether that "nominal Christian" you were, turned closer or further away from being a Child of the Most High, in Jesus Christ!!

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
<><

Hi Nick, i know you called yourself an Independent, but believe you said that you mainly find yourself voting Republican, as you also say its important to find someone who not only talks the talk, but also walks the walk, what made you vote Republican, what made you vote for Trump, what was it about their "walk" that made you consider they better reflected your Christian Beliefs and Faith more than the opposition, this isn't a trick question but a genuine attempt to understand why so many American Christians vote for a Party and President that i consider the very antithesis of my Christian faith, ....... and i don't think we can avoid being involved in Politics, whether it be by what we do, or just as important, what we don't do, sin can not just be by commission, but also by omission, to walk by those in need, to turn our backs on the suffering and oppressed is not i believe an option for a Christian, Politics is after all just a way of deciding in which direction Society goes, what is perceived as important, Loving our Neighbour as ourself and treating others as we would want to be treated is the moral basis on which all our actions should be made,....... as to your last question Nick, i've turned closer, much closer to Christ, i've spent the last 35 years campaigning on numerous issues in this world and whereas at the start i had faith in myself and others to change the world, i now have faith in God, whilst i still put my heart and Soul into my work i accept this World is heading towards destruction and my Hope is centred on the World to come, but until that time i do what i can to try to alleviate the suffering and destruction caused by Humanitys greed and Selfishness. it breaks my heart, but all those that follow Christ have their Cross to bear, and i guess this is mine.

 

[Dovegiven]

Many thanks for that reasoned reply Nick, you're right here in the UK US politics can seem baffling, as does the support of large sections of professing Christians in the US with a President and Republican Party that appears to be fundamentally Racist, having run what was described as the most racist election campaign on record, been endorsed by the ex head of the KKK David Duke, admitted members of the alt Right into his administration, described Neo nazis and Violent racists in Charlottesville as "containing some fine people" and being increasingly hostile to immigrants and Asylum seekers,..... that appears to be pro Wealthy and anti poor, having passed legislation that hands back hundreds of Billions in Tax cuts to the richest whilst proposing Benefits cuts to the poorest in American Society, by proposing cutting drastically international relief to the poorest countries in the world, in fact ending US aid for Central American Countries and seeking to cut Social security, Medicaid and Medicare for some of the most vulnerable in US Society,..... who appears to be pro war, proposing massive Budget increases to the Military, has implemented a ban on certain Nuclear Weapons control treaties and plans a development of "safer" Nuclear missile programmes, and has vetoed the Congresses proposal to withdraw US Military support for the Saudis in their murderous war on Yemen, which has seen 85,000 young children die from Malnutrition in the last 4 years due to the Saudi onslaught,...... and finally a President who with Republican support has abrogated any responsibilty of "Stewardship" of Gods Earth , he's decried Climate Science, withdrawn the US from the Paris Accord, put forward proposals for a massive increase in Oil and Gas exploration, decimated the EPA, slashed regulations limiting pollution under the Clean Air Act, the Clean water Act and the Clean power Act and is in the process of cutting regulations built up over decades to protect Americans from the worst ravages of Pollution and decimation of their Natural world,...... i understand that in this World, given our inherently sinful nature, the choices we face are the lesser or greater evil, but i would really like to understand why you believe Republicans are the lesser evil, and i would just add, that whilst Socialism has found it hard to take root in a World driven by greed and selfishness, Capitalism has brought the World, Gods World to the state its in today, ravaged by poverty and Suffering, War and destruction and tetering on the edge of Environmental Armageddon, hardly a Success Story by anyone's reckoning.

What BALONEY! Trump has more gravitas than all US Presidents before him. I detect Satan is speaking very loudly, knowing his end is near.

 

[Dovegiven]

Ahhh yes, the boondoggle of the squiggly bulbs, 10x more expensive, 10x more dangerous, and I have found that the life span spoken to be 10x or more of the squiggly to be roughly exactly the same as old fashioned light bulbs. But follow the money and find out who were the winners and losers in the industry change, would be more telling of who was behind it.

We've been that way and returned to the old way our home wiring was set. In our neighborhood watch meeting I found that our electric billl has fallen into the neighboord's 2% range of income by rejecting the Obama way. We rely more on natural gas. Our average daily community temp has fallen 4% the past two years. Those new IED bulbs burned so hot we had to use a towel to replace them. When I replaced the fixture, there remained a dark burn image. Enough of "progressivism" in this household!

 

[Dovegiven]

Hi Nick, i know you called yourself an Independent, but believe you said that you mainly find yourself voting Republican, as you also say its important to find someone who not only talks the talk, but also walks the walk, what made you vote Republican, what made you vote for Trump, what was it about their "walk" that made you consider they better reflected your Christian Beliefs and Faith more than the opposition, this isn't a trick question but a genuine attempt to understand why so many American Christians vote for a Party and President that i consider the very antithesis of my Christian faith, ....... and i don't think we can avoid being involved in Politics, whether it be by what we do, or just as important, what we don't do, sin can not just be by commission, but also by omission, to walk by those in need, to turn our backs on the suffering and oppressed is not i believe an option for a Christian, Politics is after all just a way of deciding in which direction Society goes, what is perceived as important, Loving our Neighbour as ourself and treating others as we would want to be treated is the moral basis on which all our actions should be made,....... as to your last question Nick, i've turned closer, much closer to Christ, i've spent the last 35 years campaigning on numerous issues in this world and whereas at the start i had faith in myself and others to change the world, i now have faith in God, whilst i still put my heart and Soul into my work i accept this World is heading towards destruction and my Hope is centred on the World to come, but until that time i do what i can to try to alleviate the suffering and destruction caused by Humanitys greed and Selfishness. it breaks my heart, but all those that follow Christ have their Cross to bear, and i guess this is mine.

Follow after victory. Jesus supplies that. Ignore the depravity of "society", which in Jesus' time got Him condemned.

 

[Christ4Ever]

Hi Nick, i know you called yourself an Independent, but believe you said that you mainly find yourself voting Republican, as you also say its important to find someone who not only talks the talk, but also walks the walk, what made you vote Republican, what made you vote for Trump, what was it about their "walk" that made you consider they better reflected your Christian Beliefs and Faith more than the opposition, this isn't a trick question but a genuine attempt to understand why so many American Christians vote for a Party and President that i consider the very antithesis of my Christian faith, ....... and i don't think we can avoid being involved in Politics, whether it be by what we do, or just as important, what we don't do, sin can not just be by commission, but also by omission, to walk by those in need, to turn our backs on the suffering and oppressed is not i believe an option for a Christian, Politics is after all just a way of deciding in which direction Society goes, what is perceived as important, Loving our Neighbour as ourself and treating others as we would want to be treated is the moral basis on which all our actions should be made,....... as to your last question Nick, i've turned closer, much closer to Christ, i've spent the last 35 years campaigning on numerous issues in this world and whereas at the start i had faith in myself and others to change the world, i now have faith in God, whilst i still put my heart and Soul into my work i accept this World is heading towards destruction and my Hope is centred on the World to come, but until that time i do what i can to try to alleviate the suffering and destruction caused by Humanitys greed and Selfishness. it breaks my heart, but all those that follow Christ have their Cross to bear, and i guess this is mine.

Hello Rad,
It's okay to ask. I don't mind answering. In my State you can only vote in the Primaries of the Party you belong to. Meaning, as an independent I can't vote in the Democratic or Republican Primaries. I have to wait until the General Election before being able to caste a vote. Sometimes I will see someone in one or both of the Parties Primaries that I hope will win, so I can vote for them in the General Election, but as you can imagine that doesn't happen too often. So, my choices in the General Election are limited to who the two major parties voters have selected to run. Sadly, money drives the running for office, which is the case even in the small state that I happen to live in (Delaware).

The Major National elections that are Presidential are even more difficult to sort out as an independent, since once again. I'm not allowed to vote in the Primaries of either of the Major Parties. So, truth be told, the best I can do is truly seek to place my vote without considering the Party Platform, and History, which is really ugly on both sides, but seek in prayer to place my vote on who adheres closer to Scripture. Which can be a difficult task, when you see both as being reprobates! In that case, the Party Platform, and History might influence me in what direction I should go. No easy task Brother!

In the last Presidential Election's Primaries I actually switched Parties (Republican), so that I could vote for a person that I believed was a Christian who not only talked, but walked the walk as well. When push came to shove, he disappointed me, because he took the bait, and moved away from the Christian principals he spoke of and hoped that he'd adhere to throughout the campaigning.

Anyway, when there are choices to be made on who to vote for, it you include the Party Platform to the equation. It becomes even more taxing on ones ability to choose, but adding the Party Platforms, and History together can help tilt the scales one way or another. An example of this, would be if the U.S.A were engaged in a War. Regardless of how one might feel about the justification of having gotten in the conflict in the first place. Oddly, enough, Historically speaking, the Republican Party Representatives have done a better job of fighting Wars, then the Democrats have. Now, if Social Issues need to come to the front, then in most cases the Democrats have shown themselves to be more sensitive/compassionate to seeking a way of alleviating that issue. In both cases, it doesn't guarantee the result as being successful, but it helps to recognize who appears better able to succeed if given the opportunity to do so. Meaning, I won't hire an electrician, if my plumbing has sprung a leak or a plumber if my car is broken. Takes effort on ones part, but prayer and in truth knowing Scripture helps a lot. One must have a standard to go by, if one is to compare Party Doctrine.

Voting Party Lines, might get an occasional solid person in, but also in many cases, also allows those who shouldn't be voted in. Even if the office were for Dog Catcher. :smile: So, if a person voting is going the Party Lines route, I'd suggest they stop doing so. Instead seek that person whose behavior, words, adhere closer to God's Words. Might require an effort on ones part, because of the amount of data that is available out there that is both pro & con, but being faithful requires at times some hard work. I'm sure you realize this, as you have seen by having compiled the data on the Republicans, and if you haven't started already, on the Democrats as well. I suggest that people don't get too overwhelmed in doing so. It can be a weight upon ones Spirit the amount of information that is available to wade through, and ultimately may not help you decide anyway!

Ultimately, I believe that God will provide the authority that we should have, and probably the one we deserve to have. Be that positive or negative. We forget that the pool from which the officials who are voted into office come from, is the very Society that is Worldly and has no love for the Christian. So, if I know a professing Christian is running, I don't expect perfection, what I desire most of all is honesty. That person, will get my vote, unless I'm moved to not vote.

I hope this explains a bit of where I come from as it pertains to this "Party" discussion and why I suggested you research the Democrats in the same fashion you did the Republicans. Another similarity that might help you, is in the form of a question. Which Christian church is God's Favorite? The best I can come up with is the one that is doing His Will and have not forgotten their first Love.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
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[Bill]

Ahhh yes, the boondoggle of the squiggly bulbs, 10x more expensive, 10x more dangerous, and I have found that the life span spoken to be 10x or more of the squiggly to be roughly exactly the same as old fashioned light bulbs. But follow the money and find out who were the winners and losers in the industry change, would be more telling of who was behind it.

Lol always follow the money trail

 

[Rad]

What BALONEY! Trump has more gravitas than all US Presidents before him. I detect Satan is speaking very loudly, knowing his end is near.

Hi DoveGiven, many thanks for that reasoned and thoughtful reply, would be interested to know just what you regard as "BALONEY", are you disputing that facts i gave, if so which ones, or are you saying that none of that matters for Trump has more "gravitas" than any other President before him, and if you are just how you arrive at that conclusion,..... as for your comment that "Satan is speaking very loudly, knowing his end is near", do you regard everyone that disagrees with your point of view as being guided by Satan, and just what in your opinion was satanic about the points i made, for as far as i know, they're all a matter of record and show Trumps rhetoric and actions as being based on Racism, Xenophobia, Fear, hate and a total disregard for the Stewardship of Gods Earth.