Elect according to the foreknowledge of God

[Luminary]

'A man that flattereth his neighbour
spreadeth a net for his feet.'
(Pro 29:5)

Hello @Luminary,

Re: Reply#35

Yes, I am. Forgive me if I have caused you offence: but I have experienced the truth of this verse in discussion. It is not intentional, but the moment personal comment enters a discussion it becomes more difficult to be objective.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

Thank your for your Honesty!

The thing is, is I was not flattering him, but expressing my appreciation, gratitude and recognition. This was a jumping to conclusions on your part, assuming, not paying attention to my other words too him, and using scripture against me to warn(?) him?
This upsets me more than anything.

It was a show of my appreciation and recognition of him doing what we were asked too do. So Excited!!! Which was to follow the Lead of the Spirit into all Gods Truth. It is also a recognition and honoring of Hearing and seeing my God >in< him. That indeed deserves Praise!

I have spent many years searching for those who can speak** according to scripture**, and what you see is my excitement (as a 10year old in Christ) that I have finally found one. A pure Faithful one…

It was also to show him that *according to scripture*, we are glorified also. And that he IS (Has Shown! to be) a Son of God; co-heir with Christ. I gave the scripture! And this Should be recognized and Celebrated. And it’s not, nearly enough. There should be Joy and excitement! Celebration! For we are lifted up with him, by him. Not a lifting up by us ourself. It was already done. For the Sons of God *are* being revealed, and not many recognize it.

So I would appreciate moving forward, that you would know all the details before making a judgment against a person or situation,(especially from past experiences with others) and using Scripture to rule on it. For you use my Gods words carelessly. And this I don’t tend to deal well with. I have 0 patients for it, and will not tolerate it. It tends to bring out the worst in me. As being that child, have not yet been completely tempered. But I do appreciate your honesty. Thank you!

 

[complete]

Hey, Complete was not all The Apostles “Jews”

Was Not All Those That Received The Holy Ghost during The Pentecost Celebration where Jews that Came from everywhere. That Had Been scattered across many nations.

If So , then Salvation was of The Jews. They are The 1st. To spread the Salvation message. By Taking it Back to their home nations.

Correct?

Hello @PloughBoy,

Yes, the Apostles were Jews.
Yes, those who were at Jerusalem for the feast of Pentecost were Jews from many nations.
Yes, as our Lord said in John 4:22, to the woman of Samaria, 'salvation is of the Jews'.
Yes, they did take the message of salvation back to their home nations.

Correct

 

[complete]

Sorry, I disagree with dispensationlism, it preaches division not unity. There is no mention of 2 seperate Churches or 2 seperate bodies of Christ, only One.

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Ephesians 4:4
There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;

Hello @StewardoftheMystery,

Yes, the Church which is the Body of Christ is blessedly ONE Body.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[complete]

Thank your for your Honesty!

The thing is, is I was not flattering him, but expressing my appreciation, gratitude and recognition. This was a jumping to conclusions on your part, assuming, not paying attention to my other words too him, and using scripture against me to warn(?) him?
This upsets me more than anything.

It was a show of my appreciation and recognition of him doing what we were asked too do. So Excited!!! Which was to follow the Lead of the Spirit into all Gods Truth. It is also a recognition and honoring of Hearing and seeing my God >in< him. That indeed deserves Praise!

I have spent many years searching for those who can speak** according to scripture**, and what you see is my excitement (as a 10year old in Christ) that I have finally found one. A pure Faithful one…

It was also to show him that *according to scripture*, we are glorified also. And that he IS (Has Shown! to be) a Son of God; co-heir with Christ. I gave the scripture! And this Should be recognized and Celebrated. And it’s not, nearly enough. There should be Joy and excitement! Celebration! For we are lifted up with him, by him. Not a lifting up by us ourself. It was already done. For the Sons of God *are* being revealed, and not many recognize it.

So I would appreciate moving forward, that you would know all the details before making a judgment against a person or situation,(especially from past experiences with others) and using Scripture to rule on it. For you use my Gods words carelessly. And this I don’t tend to deal well with. I have 0 patients for it, and will not tolerate it. It tends to bring out the worst in me. As being that child, have not yet been completely tempered. But I do appreciate your honesty. Thank you!

Hello @Luminary,

Yes, I know you spoke to StewardoftheMystery out of appreciation for his OP. I am sorry that you have been so hurt by this. It was not intended personally. I ask your forgiveness.

Sincerely
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[complete]

Hello @PloughBoy,

Yes, the Apostles were Jews.
Yes, those who were at Jerusalem for the feast of Pentecost were Jews from many nations.
Yes, as our Lord said in John 4:22, to the woman of Samaria, 'salvation is of the Jews'.
Yes, they did take the message of salvation back to their home nations.

Correct

Hello again, Ploughboy,

Yes, salvation was 'of the Jews' right up until the end of the Acts period, but in Acts 28:28, after quoting Isaiah 6:9-10, to the leaders of the Jews of the diaspora, Paul pronounced:-

'Be it known therefore unto you,
that the salvation of God is sent unto the Gentiles,
and that they will hear it.'
(Act 28:28)

Salvation was no longer of the Jew only, it was sent unto the Gentiles, Christ was now among them, their hope of glory (Colossians 1:27) independent of Israel: for Israel (as a nation) had rejected Christ as their Messiah and King, and had departed into unbelief. This, as we know is a temporary condition, for they will yet come to repentance, and fulfil God's purposes for them as a nation.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[Luminary]

Hello @Luminary,

Yes, I know you spoke to StewardoftheMystery out of appreciation for his OP. I am sorry that you have been so hurt by this. It was not intended personally. I ask your forgiveness.

Sincerely
In Christ Jesus
Chris

All is forgiven

I get more hurt behind the misuse of Scripture than anything else. I have already died to myself. So you can say anything about or too my flesh and it won’t bother me But when it comes to scripture, and the application of it, especially when it is being fulfilled today or used against His own….oh Boy…do my flames tend to burn as an Inferno….

It’s been a rough couple of years with those who call themselves by His name. And still pretty raw in me. So was more of a warning before it comes out again and I get banned…lol

But thank you for the apologies. It is appreciated Water under the bridge

 

[AnneOminous]

I was being serious, search it out.

I was being serious as well.

The twins are not exactly representative of the two seeds, but I like the direction you are headed in thinking that. Those two- Jacob and Esau were both 'born of the flesh' as you say and though one was hairy and red and the other smooth-skinned, both were of the earth-- earthy, born of woman and they were not two seeds as if only one was of the earth and the other heavenly, but two nations. The firstborn, an heir apparent, the second, a supplanter.

The LORD said to her,
“Two nations are in your womb;
And two peoples will be separated from your body;
And one people shall be stronger than the other;
And the older shall serve the younger.”


They were two seeds in the way all fraternal twins are 'two seeds' - Fraternal twins (also called dizygotic twins) result from the fertilization of two separate eggs with two different ***** during the same pregnancy. Fraternal twins may not have the same sex or appearance. They share half their genomes, just like any other siblings. In contrast, identical twins (or monozygotic twins) result from the fertilization of a single egg by a single *****, with the fertilized egg then splitting into two. As a result, identical twins share the same genomes and are always the same sex.

But not in the way you are advocating. They were two 'houses' - one favored, which ultimately became what we call 'the house of Israel' -a nation, the other dispersed, diluted and diminished to the point where it becomes indistinguishable from all it's neighbors- what we would call a melting pot, or 'stew.' And that is what that red one traded his birthright for, a bad trade, but that one remained of the earth, while the other twin, a deceiver- stole their father's blessing and earned his brother's hatred. And this was the beginning of a particular chapter of the book and what we now know as history.

-The mystery of the color red. When you stop trying to diminish 'the Mystery' as if it's something you have all figured out, then maybe we can talk about it. Those who know, don't say. Those who say, don't know.

The color red is always connected with conflict. "Seeing red" is not just another way of saying you are angry- it's a depiction of that spirit granted the power to take peace from the earth, that men would slay one another.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

I was being serious as well.

The twins are not exactly representative of the two seeds, but I like the direction you are headed in thinking that. Those two- Jacob and Esau were both 'born of the flesh' as you say and though one was hairy and red and the other smooth-skinned, both were of the earth-- earthy, born of woman and they were not two seeds as if only one was of the earth and the other heavenly, but two nations. The firstborn, an heir apparent, the second, a supplanter.

The LORD said to her,
“Two nations are in your womb;
And two peoples will be separated from your body;
And one people shall be stronger than the other;
And the older shall serve the younger.”


They were two seeds in the way all fraternal twins are 'two seeds' - Fraternal twins (also called dizygotic twins) result from the fertilization of two separate eggs with two different ***** during the same pregnancy. Fraternal twins may not have the same sex or appearance. They share half their genomes, just like any other siblings. In contrast, identical twins (or monozygotic twins) result from the fertilization of a single egg by a single *****, with the fertilized egg then splitting into two. As a result, identical twins share the same genomes and are always the same sex.

But not in the way you are advocating. They were two 'houses' - one favored, which ultimately became what we call 'the house of Israel' -a nation, the other dispersed, diluted and diminished to the point where it becomes indistinguishable from all it's neighbors- what we would call a melting pot, or 'stew.' And that is what that red one traded his birthright for, a bad trade, but that one remained of the earth, while the other twin, a deceiver- stole their father's blessing and earned his brother's hatred. And this was the beginning of a particular chapter of the book and what we now know as history.

-The mystery of the color red. When you stop trying to diminish 'the Mystery' as if it's something you have all figured out, then maybe we can talk about it. Those who know, don't say. Those who say, don't know.

The color red is always connected with conflict. "Seeing red" is not just another way of saying you are angry- it's a depiction of that spirit granted the power to take peace from the earth, that men would slay one another.

Actually they are representative of the 2 seeds, if you understand what the 2 seeds are. The serpents seed are those who are born of the “flesh” and the woman’s seed are those who are born of “the promise”of the Holy Spirit.

Paul even says as much concerning Jacob and Esau….

Romans 9:8
That is, They which are the children of “the flesh,” these are not the children of God: but the children of “the promise” are counted for “the seed.”

The word “flesh” denotes the “sin nature” in man, as sin is symbolized by the color red in scripture.

Isaiah 1:18
Come now, and let us reason together, saith the Lord: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.”

These 2 natures and 2 seeds are also shown in Ishmael and Isaac…

Galatians 4:23
But he who was of the bondwoman was born after “the flesh;” but he of the freewoman was “by promise.”

Paul goes on to say….

28 Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of “promise.”

29 But as then he that was born after “the flesh” persecuted him that was born after “the Spirit,” even so it is now.

That is the “enmity” between the 2 seeds ( flesh nature vs. Spirit nature)

 

[AnneOminous]

Actually they are representative of the 2 seeds, if you understand what the 2 seeds are. The serpents seed are those who are born of the “flesh” and the woman’s seed are those who are born of “the promise”of the Holy Spirit.

Paul even says as much concerning Jacob and Esau….

Romans 9:8
That is, They which are the children of “the flesh,” these are not the children of God: but the children of “the promise” are counted for “the seed.”

The word “flesh” denotes the “sin nature” in man, as sin is symbolized by the color red in scripture.

Isaiah 1:18
Come now, and let us reason together, saith the Lord: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.”

These 2 natures and 2 seeds are also shown in Ishmael and Isaac…

Galatians 4:23
But he who was of the bondwoman was born after “the flesh;” but he of the freewoman was “by promise.”

Paul goes on to say….

28 Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of “promise.”

29 But as then he that was born after “the flesh” persecuted him that was born after “the Spirit,” even so it is now.

That is the “enmity” between the 2 seeds ( flesh nature vs. Spirit nature)

Start a thread on it and I'll explore it with you. You are conflating several ideas in your pot and calling it one thing. That's how Stew comes to be, but it's a mishmash.

The seeds are one thing. the twins something else. The 'serpent's seed' is not physical, but spiritual. The flesh is one thing, the spirit another. You can't think of them in the same terms and use the ideas interchangeably whenever it suits you. There is a parable to consider-- Jesus called it the key to understanding all parables. Do you understand it? Start there.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

Start a thread on it and I'll explore it with you. You are conflating several ideas in your pot and calling it one thing. That's how Stew comes to be, but it's a mishmash.

The seeds are one thing. the twins something else. The 'serpent's seed' is not physical, but spiritual. The flesh is one thing, the spirit another. You can't think of them in the same terms and use the ideas interchangeably whenever it suits you. There is a parable to consider-- Jesus called it the key to understanding all parables. Do you understand it? Start there.

I just started a thread on it, and explained the mystery of the 2seeds; for those who can “ receive” it.

 

[AnneOminous]

I just started a thread on it, and explained the mystery of the 2seeds; for those who can “ receive” it.

I'll hold my breath.

 

[God's Truth]

'But ye are come unto mount Sion,
and unto the city of The Living God,
the Heavenly Jerusalem,
and to an innumerable company of angels,
To the general assembly and church of the firstborn,
which are written in heaven,
and to God the Judge of all,
and to the spirits of just men made perfect,
And to Jesus the Mediator of the new covenant,
and to the blood of sprinkling,
that speaketh better things than that of Abel.'
(Hebrews 12:22-24)

Hello God's Truth,

No, the Church of the first born is not the Body of Christ. A comparison of the book of Hebrews with that of the prison epistles, in which the truth concerning the Church which is the Body of Christ was revealed (Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians, 1 & 2 Timothy, Titus and Philemon) will make that clear.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

You are really confusing me. You say the Church is not the Body of Christ, but then you say the Church which is the Body of Christ.

 

[AnneOminous]

You are really confusing me. You say the Church is not the Body of Christ, but then you say the Church which is the Body of Christ.

I asked her to clarify her understanding and whatever distinction she was trying to make also.... see post # 37. She clarified her position in post # 43.

It became confusing because of her post # 63 which seems to contradict what she explained previously.

 

[God's Truth]

Hello @God's Truth,

Perhaps you would give Scriptural evidence to prove that.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

Jesus’ body is the church.


Colossians 1:24 Now I rejoice in my sufferings for you, and I fill up in my flesh what is lacking in regard to Christ's afflictions for the sake of His body, which is the church.

Ephesians 1:22 And God put everything under His feet and made Him head over everything for the church, 23 which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills all in all.

Ephesians 5:30 For we are members of His body.

 

[God's Truth]

'But ye are come unto mount Sion,
and unto the city of The Living God,
the Heavenly Jerusalem,
and to an innumerable company of angels,
To the general assembly and church of the firstborn,
which are written in heaven,
and to God the Judge of all,
and to the spirits of just men made perfect,
And to Jesus the Mediator of the new covenant,
and to the blood of sprinkling,
that speaketh better things than that of Abel.'
(Hebrews 12:22-24)

Hello @AnneOminous,

Forgive me for not referring to you directly, but to the OP's originator, I meant you no offence.

The Church which is the Body of Christ is not revealed in the epistles of Paul written prior to the letters written by him from prison at Rome. ( Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians , 2 Timothy, Titus and Philemon). God does not use words without reason, and a comparison of the letter to the Hebrews, with the prison epistles, will reveal the differences. The letters written from Paul's imprisonment contain the truth revealed to Paul by the risen Lord (Acts 26:16) concerning the Church which is His Body (Ephesians 1:22-23), following the failure of Israel, both in the land and among the dispersion, to repent and acknowledge their Messiah and King, at the end of the Acts period. This resulted in their departure into the darkness of unbelief and the destruction of the temple in AD70.

The general assembly and church of the firstborn are those who have the privilege of reigning with Christ, renowned for their faith, being Overcomers within their generation (see Hebrews 11).

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

Israel didn't fail as in God didn't know that they would.
God CUT OFF and HARDENED many of the Jews.
He bound them to the place of the disobedient Gentiles.

 

[God's Truth]

Actually Esau and Jacob represent the 2 seeds, and the enmity between the 2 natures. (Flesh/Spirit) Paul said that in verse 8

The Bible says nations.

8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed. ( promise of the Holy Spirit)

The first coming out red represents the sin nature in the first man Adam, Adam also means “earthy , red”

We don't need to add our own meanings that the Bible doesn't say.

This is why we must be born again of the Spirit.

John 3:6-7​

​

King James Version​

​

​

6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.”

God knew who would choose Him, and He choose Jacob because He knew Jacob wanted the inheritance more than Esau who was godless and traded his inheritance for a bowl of soup.

 

[God's Truth]

Learn the mystery of the color “red” and why the firstborn Esau and the first man Adam mean “earthy, red”. And why the Dragon is red and the beast is scarlet colored.

Those who have ears to hear, let them “hear” what the Spirit is saying.

What is this type of teaching?I think Garee has this same type of over symbolic beliefs. I do know that many things are symbolic, but we can't just make it for everything. Do you and Garee know each other are you both from the same church or something?

 

[God's Truth]

The Great Master had a golden saxophone. He could make his saxophone sing a melody with the most beautiful, rich tones that would captivate every audience and people would gather in every town and travel from far and wide to hear him play.

One day he played an absolutely mesmerizing concert after which he simply set the golden saxophone down in the shade of a tree and he disappeared from their sight.

A monkey quickly climbed down and seized the saxophone, running off with it and he then declared himself to be the Steward of the Saxophone! He tried to imitate by blowing air into the thing and he found he could make sounds come out.

But never again while the Master was away did anyone ever hear the kind of music that once was played.

AnneOminous, you sure like music. Do you play any instruments? That video was funny. lol

 

[God's Truth]

Edom is Esau= land of the red man (spiritually speaking)

Isaiah 63:1-6​

​

King James Version​

​

​

63 Who is this that cometh from Edom, with dyed garments from Bozrah? this that is glorious in his apparel, travelling in the greatness of his strength? I that speak in righteousness, mighty to save.
2 Wherefore art thou red in thine apparel, and thy garments like him that treadeth in the winefat?
3 I have trodden the winepress alone; and of the people there was none with me: for I will tread them in mine anger, and trample them in my fury; and their blood shall be sprinkled upon my garments, and I will stain all my raiment.
4 For the day of vengeance is in mine heart, and the year of my redeemed is come.
5 And I looked, and there was none to help; and I wondered that there was none to uphold: therefore mine own arm brought salvation unto me; and my fury, it upheld me.
6 And I will tread down the people in mine anger, and make them drunk in my fury, and I will bring down their strength to the earth.

Why did you change the word nations in the scripture to seeds?

 

[God's Truth]

If you are red then you are dead, but if you are white then you are alright.
(Spiritually speaking)

Sad that people with red in their hair get a bad name because of old wives tales.